I've looked into it a bit and can't decide between muliclassing into monk or just taking the unarmed fighting style. I'd mainly want this character to be a tank which is why I feel like the fighting style would probably be better, not to mention it's much more simple than multiclassing. but multiclassing into monk would lean more heavily into the unarmed fighting style at the expense of having to try and find the right balance between the two classes. I find the idea of a barbarian who uses their fists to be pretty fun but I also don't wanna end up feeling useless to the rest of the party because I refuse to pick up an axe.
The problem with unarmed fighting is that if you're not a monk, it's really not competitive.
If you're not playing a monk, you're never going to be actually good at fighting unarmed- by the time you hit fifth level you're going to be losing out too much compared to what you could do with a weapon, especially given the difficulty of trying to make your unarmed strikes count as magical.
At best, I'd suggest going with the Path of the Beast to get the natural attacks while raging and resign yourself to using a sword or axe when you're not.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Pick up the Fighting Initiate feat for the Unarmed Fighting fighting style, and you've at least got a d8 there. It's like two less damage per hit than a d12, but you'll get to benefit from your barbarian features which will hopefully keep you from dragging behind the "standard" barbarian too much. Won't get Great Weapon Master though, which really shines with barbarians.
I think what will really hold you back is when you start running into enemies with resists to non magical weapons. You’ll never go the damage of a greataxe/gwm, but still could have fun with it. Until you’re only doing half damage. So see if your DM is willing to homebrew you an item to deal with that.
Does it need to be Barbarian? If you just want to play a strength-based unarmed grappler/brawler, it's hard to beat the Rune Knight Fighter. I love Rune Knight Figher + a few levels in Lore Bard, you can grapple Gargantuan creatures with the Athletics + Cutting Words to back it up, while also being useful outside combat
So, here's the thing. You don't have to be unarmed to make an unarmed attack. You can just kick or headbutt your enemies while holding weapons. So even if you had a way to get your unarmed damage up to where it was better than the damage of a weapon, you'd still have to ask yourself why you're not using, say, a spear, which you can throw for additional range, or a magic weapon, which can cut through monster resistances. Or a normal weapon that can be affected by Magic Weapon, even.
The only reason not to use a weapon is if you need both your hands free. So what can you do with two free hands?
Use a shield and grapple. Unless you're going to attempt some kind of spellcasting Barbarian, that's really all. I guess you could also carry a torch and grapple, or carry a torch and use a shield. Light is important, but usually you wanna make the Wizard handle it imo. So I'm not thinking the torch is a great idea.
Grappling has its limitations, but it's also a low investment. Barbarians are pretty good at it regardless. But even if you max it out, it's just not as universally useful as dealing damage. Not by a long shot. Shoving shores up some of its weaknesses but you can shove with your hands full. So. Just do that.
But you know how the PHB suggests that nunchaku could be clubs and katanas could be shortswords or whatever? Brass knuckles could be light hammers. Just a thought.
Since you want to tank, you want to use the Unarmed Fighting Style over monk levels. You will also want to get the Eldritch Claw Tattoo since it makes your unarmed strikes +1 magical. You can also empower (once a long rest) it for one minute and that will give you a 15' reach and an extra d6 of Force damage.
The Unarmed Fighting Style will give you a d6 damage die while allowing you to use a shield. You can not use any monk abilities while wielding a shield or wearing armor. And that includes using the Martial Arts die for damage, which starts at a d4. Since you want to tank, you want that extra AC from the shield. And unless your Dexterity and Constitution are high enough, you're going to want to be wearing Medium Armor.
With every level you put in monk you're gaining a d8 hit dice instead of a d12, lowering your maximum Health. You're also slowing down your acquisition of the higher level barbarian abilities. And the unarmed damage you get will start out as a d4 and you will need five levels in monk to reach the d6 the Fighting Style grants you. But you will gain access to Stunning Strike which will only be dependable if you have a high Wisdom. And, again, everything Monk related will require you to not be wearing armor or a shield. And without those, the Unarmed Fighting Style grants you a d8 damage die, which would require eleven levels in Monk to match.
A Barbarian/Monk combo isn't mechanically as good of a tank as a straight Barbarian.
A barbarian/monk combo isn't mechanically good at all, since barbarians abilities all depend on strength and constitution while monk abilities all depend on dexterity and wisdom. That results in a very MAD build that isn't going to be good at anything in particular since you have four stats you need to be high in order to be effective.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I'd also point out that you could select a race that has a natural weapon like minotaurs, centaurs, or tabaxi. This would free you from the need to spend a feat to get the Unarmed fighting style. Wouldn't be very efficient but an unarmed build is already not a high-optimization option.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
You'd have to hope your GM grants you something like Insignia of Claws or allow any kind of magical glove or gauntlet to count for overcoming magical resistance.
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
If you want you can be aarakocra for 1d4+str modifier unarmed attack.
You would also get a flying speed. The thing is tho, plus 2 DEX and plus 1 WIS isn’t very useful for a barbarian. Instead I would make it a tortle for a base AC of 17, the ability scores would be plus 2 STR and plus 1 CON. You can get some nice proficiencies and a claw attack that does 1d6+ your strength modifier slashing damage.
I've looked into it a bit and can't decide between muliclassing into monk or just taking the unarmed fighting style. I'd mainly want this character to be a tank which is why I feel like the fighting style would probably be better, not to mention it's much more simple than multiclassing. but multiclassing into monk would lean more heavily into the unarmed fighting style at the expense of having to try and find the right balance between the two classes. I find the idea of a barbarian who uses their fists to be pretty fun but I also don't wanna end up feeling useless to the rest of the party because I refuse to pick up an axe.
Multiclassing into monk is weak for a barbarian as you now need a 13 in DEX, STR, CON, and WIS, so it is expensive to manufacture. Unarmed fighting style could take away one of the tortle’s benefits. Instead you should take the great weapon fighting style, as you will have a (if built correctly) base AC of 22, possibly 27. This will allow you to keep both hands free, for using a Greataxe or Greatsword. Does this help?
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DM: “Who’s your patron?”
Warlock: “Ummm”
DM: “Hurry Up”
Warlock: “yOu”
*All other players look at each other with utter fear*
__________________________________________________________________________________ Check out my homebrew: My Homebrew
You would also get a flying speed. The thing is tho, plus 2 DEX and plus 1 WIS isn’t very useful for a barbarian. Instead I would make it a tortle for a base AC of 17, the ability scores would be plus 2 STR and plus 1 CON. You can get some nice proficiencies and a claw attack that does 1d6+ your strength modifier slashing damage.
Does anyone ever use the original stat bonuses from races? Just use the Tasha's rules and pick +2 and +1 in whatever you want
You would also get a flying speed. The thing is tho, plus 2 DEX and plus 1 WIS isn’t very useful for a barbarian. Instead I would make it a tortle for a base AC of 17, the ability scores would be plus 2 STR and plus 1 CON. You can get some nice proficiencies and a claw attack that does 1d6+ your strength modifier slashing damage.
Does anyone ever use the original stat bonuses from races? Just use the Tasha's rules and pick +2 and +1 in whatever you .
People do. That’s why you almost never see a leonin wizard. The point of the racial bonuses is for less ASI investment needed. Also the point of the tortle was the AC and the claw attacks. The Racial Bonuses are a plus, but not the main reason I suggested the tortle
Beast seems like the best option for the OP but assuming they don't want that, I would either dip Fighter or pick up Fighting Initiate for Unarmed style, or go for Tavern Brawler, and be a Totem or Zealot.
You'd have to hope your GM grants you something like Insignia of Claws or allow any kind of magical glove or gauntlet to count for overcoming magical resistance.
As an FYI, we got a much more generic version of this kind of item in the latest Book of Many Things: Wraps of Unarmed Prowess
Instead you should take the great weapon fighting style, as you will have a (if built correctly) base AC of 22, possibly 27.
You mind showing your work here? I don't see how you'd get above 20 without having magic items.
Barbarian’s unarmoured defence. 17 base AC from Tortle. +5 from constitution score (assuming you have max constitution), makes 22. Ok I got the 27 wrong but you could get that with shield +3 :)
Beast seems like the best option for the OP but assuming they don't want that, I would either dip Fighter or pick up Fighting Initiate for Unarmed style, or go for Tavern Brawler, and be a Totem or Zealot.
You'd have to hope your GM grants you something like Insignia of Claws or allow any kind of magical glove or gauntlet to count for overcoming magical resistance.
As an FYI, we got a much more generic version of this kind of item in the latest Book of Many Things: Wraps of Unarmed Prowess
While it is true that customise your origin would any bonuses you want, outside of the boosts to DEX and WIS, arakocra have nothing outside of this except for flight (which a barbarian wouldn’t need because they are melee), and talons, in which other races have better. I will say it again. The point of the tortle was the base AC of 17, which is nice for a barbarian. Their unarmed strikes are a d6 instead of an arakocra’s d4, and they get some other nice utility features.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
DM: “Who’s your patron?”
Warlock: “Ummm”
DM: “Hurry Up”
Warlock: “yOu”
*All other players look at each other with utter fear*
__________________________________________________________________________________ Check out my homebrew: My Homebrew
Instead you should take the great weapon fighting style, as you will have a (if built correctly) base AC of 22, possibly 27.
You mind showing your work here? I don't see how you'd get above 20 without having magic items.
Barbarian’s unarmoured defence. 17 base AC from Tortle. +5 from constitution score (assuming you have max constitution), makes 22. Ok I got the 27 wrong but you could get that with shield +3 :)
Except that the tortles natural AC does not combine with the unarmored defense. You must pick which AC calculation you are using. So it is either 19 (17+2 for shield) or whatever 10+Dex+Con gives you.
As long as you are comfortable not dealing damage, this is worth pursuing. You can knock-down, grapple, throw people around, etc. But you wont be doing much damage. Tossing one person into another at best would require both of them to make DC15 DEX saves to avoid being prone. But no damage. And they can spend 1/2 their movement just to get up. YOu could grapple, but that doesn't stop anything. The enemy can still attack you or anyone without disadvantage, and can move (dragging you along) at double movement. At best, you can help another melee character- which you could do equally well by simply standing there and saying "I give the help action". If your DM is smart, he will just have the enemy ignore you. You simply are not a threat. Which defeats the whole purpose of tanking to start with.
If you want you can be aarakocra for 1d4+str modifier unarmed attack.
You would also get a flying speed. The thing is tho, plus 2 DEX and plus 1 WIS isn’t very useful for a barbarian. Instead I would make it a tortle for a base AC of 17, the ability scores would be plus 2 STR and plus 1 CON. You can get some nice proficiencies and a claw attack that does 1d6+ your strength modifier slashing damage.
I've looked into it a bit and can't decide between muliclassing into monk or just taking the unarmed fighting style. I'd mainly want this character to be a tank which is why I feel like the fighting style would probably be better, not to mention it's much more simple than multiclassing. but multiclassing into monk would lean more heavily into the unarmed fighting style at the expense of having to try and find the right balance between the two classes. I find the idea of a barbarian who uses their fists to be pretty fun but I also don't wanna end up feeling useless to the rest of the party because I refuse to pick up an axe.
Multiclassing into monk is weak for a barbarian as you now need a 13 in DEX, STR, CON, and WIS, so it is expensive to manufacture. Unarmed fighting style could take away one of the tortle’s benefits. Instead you should take the great weapon fighting style, as you will have a (if built correctly) base AC of 22, possibly 27. This will allow you to keep both hands free, for using a Greataxe or Greatsword. Does this help?
Tortle ac makes unarmored defence useless and the claws are 1d4 like the aarakocra. The ability scores you can just change if need be and you also have a nice flying speed with aarakocra.
I've looked into it a bit and can't decide between muliclassing into monk or just taking the unarmed fighting style. I'd mainly want this character to be a tank which is why I feel like the fighting style would probably be better, not to mention it's much more simple than multiclassing. but multiclassing into monk would lean more heavily into the unarmed fighting style at the expense of having to try and find the right balance between the two classes. I find the idea of a barbarian who uses their fists to be pretty fun but I also don't wanna end up feeling useless to the rest of the party because I refuse to pick up an axe.
The problem with unarmed fighting is that if you're not a monk, it's really not competitive.
If you're not playing a monk, you're never going to be actually good at fighting unarmed- by the time you hit fifth level you're going to be losing out too much compared to what you could do with a weapon, especially given the difficulty of trying to make your unarmed strikes count as magical.
At best, I'd suggest going with the Path of the Beast to get the natural attacks while raging and resign yourself to using a sword or axe when you're not.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Pick up the Fighting Initiate feat for the Unarmed Fighting fighting style, and you've at least got a d8 there. It's like two less damage per hit than a d12, but you'll get to benefit from your barbarian features which will hopefully keep you from dragging behind the "standard" barbarian too much. Won't get Great Weapon Master though, which really shines with barbarians.
I think what will really hold you back is when you start running into enemies with resists to non magical weapons. You’ll never go the damage of a greataxe/gwm, but still could have fun with it. Until you’re only doing half damage. So see if your DM is willing to homebrew you an item to deal with that.
Does it need to be Barbarian? If you just want to play a strength-based unarmed grappler/brawler, it's hard to beat the Rune Knight Fighter. I love Rune Knight Figher + a few levels in Lore Bard, you can grapple Gargantuan creatures with the Athletics + Cutting Words to back it up, while also being useful outside combat
So, here's the thing. You don't have to be unarmed to make an unarmed attack. You can just kick or headbutt your enemies while holding weapons. So even if you had a way to get your unarmed damage up to where it was better than the damage of a weapon, you'd still have to ask yourself why you're not using, say, a spear, which you can throw for additional range, or a magic weapon, which can cut through monster resistances. Or a normal weapon that can be affected by Magic Weapon, even.
The only reason not to use a weapon is if you need both your hands free. So what can you do with two free hands?
Use a shield and grapple. Unless you're going to attempt some kind of spellcasting Barbarian, that's really all. I guess you could also carry a torch and grapple, or carry a torch and use a shield. Light is important, but usually you wanna make the Wizard handle it imo. So I'm not thinking the torch is a great idea.
Grappling has its limitations, but it's also a low investment. Barbarians are pretty good at it regardless. But even if you max it out, it's just not as universally useful as dealing damage. Not by a long shot. Shoving shores up some of its weaknesses but you can shove with your hands full. So. Just do that.
But you know how the PHB suggests that nunchaku could be clubs and katanas could be shortswords or whatever? Brass knuckles could be light hammers. Just a thought.
Since you want to tank, you want to use the Unarmed Fighting Style over monk levels. You will also want to get the Eldritch Claw Tattoo since it makes your unarmed strikes +1 magical. You can also empower (once a long rest) it for one minute and that will give you a 15' reach and an extra d6 of Force damage.
The Unarmed Fighting Style will give you a d6 damage die while allowing you to use a shield. You can not use any monk abilities while wielding a shield or wearing armor. And that includes using the Martial Arts die for damage, which starts at a d4. Since you want to tank, you want that extra AC from the shield. And unless your Dexterity and Constitution are high enough, you're going to want to be wearing Medium Armor.
With every level you put in monk you're gaining a d8 hit dice instead of a d12, lowering your maximum Health. You're also slowing down your acquisition of the higher level barbarian abilities. And the unarmed damage you get will start out as a d4 and you will need five levels in monk to reach the d6 the Fighting Style grants you. But you will gain access to Stunning Strike which will only be dependable if you have a high Wisdom. And, again, everything Monk related will require you to not be wearing armor or a shield. And without those, the Unarmed Fighting Style grants you a d8 damage die, which would require eleven levels in Monk to match.
A Barbarian/Monk combo isn't mechanically as good of a tank as a straight Barbarian.
A barbarian/monk combo isn't mechanically good at all, since barbarians abilities all depend on strength and constitution while monk abilities all depend on dexterity and wisdom. That results in a very MAD build that isn't going to be good at anything in particular since you have four stats you need to be high in order to be effective.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I'd also point out that you could select a race that has a natural weapon like minotaurs, centaurs, or tabaxi. This would free you from the need to spend a feat to get the Unarmed fighting style. Wouldn't be very efficient but an unarmed build is already not a high-optimization option.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
You'd have to hope your GM grants you something like Insignia of Claws or allow any kind of magical glove or gauntlet to count for overcoming magical resistance.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
If you want you can be aarakocra for 1d4+str modifier unarmed attack.
Characters (Links!):
Faelin Nighthollow - 7th Sojourn
You would also get a flying speed. The thing is tho, plus 2 DEX and plus 1 WIS isn’t very useful for a barbarian. Instead I would make it a tortle for a base AC of 17, the ability scores would be plus 2 STR and plus 1 CON. You can get some nice proficiencies and a claw attack that does 1d6+ your strength modifier slashing damage.
Multiclassing into monk is weak for a barbarian as you now need a 13 in DEX, STR, CON, and WIS, so it is expensive to manufacture. Unarmed fighting style could take away one of the tortle’s benefits. Instead you should take the great weapon fighting style, as you will have a (if built correctly) base AC of 22, possibly 27. This will allow you to keep both hands free, for using a Greataxe or Greatsword. Does this help?
DM: “Who’s your patron?”
Warlock: “Ummm”
DM: “Hurry Up”
Warlock: “yOu”
*All other players look at each other with utter fear*
__________________________________________________________________________________
Check out my homebrew: My Homebrew
Does anyone ever use the original stat bonuses from races? Just use the Tasha's rules and pick +2 and +1 in whatever you want
People do. That’s why you almost never see a leonin wizard. The point of the racial bonuses is for less ASI investment needed. Also the point of the tortle was the AC and the claw attacks. The Racial Bonuses are a plus, but not the main reason I suggested the tortle
DM: “Who’s your patron?”
Warlock: “Ummm”
DM: “Hurry Up”
Warlock: “yOu”
*All other players look at each other with utter fear*
__________________________________________________________________________________
Check out my homebrew: My Homebrew
You mind showing your work here? I don't see how you'd get above 20 without having magic items.
Note however that Customize Your Origin from TCoE would let them put the +2/+1 anywhere they want.
As an FYI, we got a much more generic version of this kind of item in the latest Book of Many Things: Wraps of Unarmed Prowess
Barbarian’s unarmoured defence. 17 base AC from Tortle. +5 from constitution score (assuming you have max constitution), makes 22. Ok I got the 27 wrong but you could get that with shield +3 :)
DM: “Who’s your patron?”
Warlock: “Ummm”
DM: “Hurry Up”
Warlock: “yOu”
*All other players look at each other with utter fear*
__________________________________________________________________________________
Check out my homebrew: My Homebrew
While it is true that customise your origin would any bonuses you want, outside of the boosts to DEX and WIS, arakocra have nothing outside of this except for flight (which a barbarian wouldn’t need because they are melee), and talons, in which other races have better. I will say it again. The point of the tortle was the base AC of 17, which is nice for a barbarian. Their unarmed strikes are a d6 instead of an arakocra’s d4, and they get some other nice utility features.
DM: “Who’s your patron?”
Warlock: “Ummm”
DM: “Hurry Up”
Warlock: “yOu”
*All other players look at each other with utter fear*
__________________________________________________________________________________
Check out my homebrew: My Homebrew
Except that the tortles natural AC does not combine with the unarmored defense. You must pick which AC calculation you are using. So it is either 19 (17+2 for shield) or whatever 10+Dex+Con gives you.
As long as you are comfortable not dealing damage, this is worth pursuing. You can knock-down, grapple, throw people around, etc. But you wont be doing much damage. Tossing one person into another at best would require both of them to make DC15 DEX saves to avoid being prone. But no damage. And they can spend 1/2 their movement just to get up. YOu could grapple, but that doesn't stop anything. The enemy can still attack you or anyone without disadvantage, and can move (dragging you along) at double movement. At best, you can help another melee character- which you could do equally well by simply standing there and saying "I give the help action".
If your DM is smart, he will just have the enemy ignore you. You simply are not a threat. Which defeats the whole purpose of tanking to start with.
Tortle ac makes unarmored defence useless and the claws are 1d4 like the aarakocra. The ability scores you can just change if need be and you also have a nice flying speed with aarakocra.
Characters (Links!):
Faelin Nighthollow - 7th Sojourn