Inspired by a recent online thread discussing the value of Versatile weapons, I came up with an idea to make those weapons more appealing. The fundamental change is to allow Versatile weapons to have a second mastery property, which can be used when the weapon is wielded with two hands. The rules and some weapon examples are outlined below, with my changes to the base rules marked in red.
Versatile
A Versatile weapon can be used with one or two hands. A damage value in parentheses appears with the property. The weapon deals that damage when used with two hands to make a melee attack. Listed alongside the damage value in parentheses is a mastery property. If the character has unlocked the mastery property of that weapon, the weapon uses the mastery property listed in parentheses when used with two hands to make a melee attack.
For example, a character using one hand to make a melee attack with a Battleaxe would deal 1d8 Slashing damage and could potentially use the Topple mastery property. If the character used two hands to make the same attack, it would deal 1d10 Slashing damage and use the Cleave property.
Weapons
Name
Damage
Properties
Mastery
Weight
Cost
Quarterstaff
1d6 Bludgeoning
Versatile (1d8,Topple)
Push
4 lb
2 SP
Battleaxe
1d8 Slashing
Versatile (1d10, Cleave)
Topple
4 lb
10 GP
Longsword
1d8 Slashing
Versatile (1d10, Graze)
Sap
3 lb
15 GP
Warhammer
1d8 Bludgeoning
Versatile (1d10, Slow)
Push
5 lb
15 GP
War Pick
1d8 Piercing
Versatile (1d10, Vex)
Sap
2 lb
5 GP
--------
For martial characters, this allows the opportunity to switch up your play style or combo attacks without switching weapons. For example, a Fighter with Warhammer mastery could use their extra attack feature to first use two hands to deal 1d10 damage to a target and Slow them and then switch to one hand for the second attack, dealing 1d8 damage and Pushing the target. At the end of the turn, the target of the attack is 10 feet away and has had its speed reduced by 10 feet, making it hard to close the distance or flee from the Fighter. In a similar way, a martial with Extra Attack and War Pick mastery could punish a single target by both imparting Dis on their next attack by Sap and giving themself Adv on their own attack using Vex.
Let me know what you think of this revision or if there are other Mastery properties you would propose. Also, a feat to help boost Versatile weapons is outlined in the spoiler tag below
Protean Fighter
General Feat (Prerequisite: Level 4+)
Ability Score Increase. Increase your Strength or Dexterity by 1, to a maximum of 20
Additional Weapon Properties. When you make a melee attack using a weapon with the Versatile property using one hand, the weapon is treated as having the Light property. When you make a melee attack using a weapon with the Versatile property using two hands, the weapon is treated as having the Reach property.
Whirlwind Attack. While wielding a weapon with the Versatile property, if you are able to use the weapon with two hands you can take an Action to make melee attacks against any number of creatures within 5 feet of you, with a separate attack roll for each target. Each melee attack is treated as if made using one hand, and you do not add your ability modifier to the damage of the attack.
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TBH, I think the extra masteries are good enough to be locked behind the feat.
I think having everything be Light and Reach is too good for even a feat, and doesn't really make sense for all the weapons..the Light thing can especially be abused. Whirlwind is fine, but I don't think it will be that useful in actual play since it will often be a worse option than multi-attacking.
Maybe just have the feat have the ASI, open up the extra masteries, and add some kind of ability that offsets the downside of the play style (lower damage and no shield) and rewards having that free hand, for example:
Freehand Training. You switch between a one and two-handed grip with ease, throwing off your opponent's attacks with your free hand
Free-hand defense: When wielding a weapon with the versatile feature, you gain a +2* bonus to your AC as long as you don't wield a weapon or shield in your off-hand.
Free-hand offense: When wielding a weapon with the versatile feature, you gain a +2 bonus to the DC of your unarmed Shove and Grapple effects as long as you don't wield a weapon or shield in your off-hand.
(*I don't think the +2 here would actually be game breaking, it is equal to having a shield, but it can't be enhanced or have bonus properties like a regular shield...if it feels too strong, knock it down to +1...or have it go up to +2 at a higher level?)
Hope that helps, it still might not be as optimal as sword-and-board or the omnipresent great sword, but this feels like a swashbuckling fun and dynamic play style you don't see much that focuses on messing with opponents more than pure damage or defense.
I appreciate the feedback. The ideas for Freehand Training are really interesting. I had also played around with a +2 AC while using a versatile weapon, but it didn't feel very good to me. Like "you gain a +2 to AC so long as you aren't wielding a shield" feels like wielding a shield with extra steps. Of course there is the boon of being able to benefit from the two hand damage while maintaining a higher AC, but I wonder if there is a more unique solution.
I really like the idea of a +2 bonus to an unarmed shove, although depending on the chosen Verstaile weapon this may not be too beneficial if you have Weapon Masteries, since 3 out of 5 of them have either the Push or Topple mastery property by default.
I dont think that having the possibility of a Light or Reach add on is too overpowered. With Light, a longsword in one hand is just a slightly more powerful Shortsword without the benefit of Finesse. With Reach, the longsword in two hands is just a slightly less powerful Halberd without the Heavy property. By taking the feat, you basically double down on the versatility of your your Versatile weapon and are able to play with more varied attack types and approaches without needing to switch between other weapons. Also, in case my feat's language was not clear, there should not be a situation where a weapon has both the Light and Reach property. It should be one or the other depending on whether you use one hand or two.
I also disagree about locking the extra masteries behind a feat. Firstly, because the goal of this exercise was to try and make Versatile weapons feel more interesting by default. You already need to have access to the Weapon Mastery feature to benefit from it, so adding a feat requirement on top of it seems a bit much. Secondly, part of the fun of it is giving each Versatile weapon two unique combinations. Trying to add all of that information into a feat would make the descriptive text too lengthy for a feat compared to just integrating the info into the weapon table by default.
I think one issue that should be addressed with Versatile weapons in general, which I tried to accomplish with the additional masteries, is that it should encourage a play style where you are routinely switching between one handed and two handed attacks. I feel that most players will just commit to one style over another, at least over the course of a fight, without really playing with the weapon's versatility.
Hmm. I really like the idea of a secondary Mastery on Versatile weapons a lot... and I don't like Weapon Masteries in general. I think locking them behind the feat is a good idea though -- if you want to create a unique Versatile-focused way of fighting for martials, then requiring that sort of investment makes sense
As far as the Feat itself goes... giving more weapons the Light property is a non-starter for me. (Reach doesn't have the same mechanical headaches associated with it). The Whirlwind Attack also seems OP compared to the extra attacks feats like PAM or GWM grant
Trying the match the 'shifting and unpredictable' vibe you seems to be going for with the concept, I'd suggest something like this instead:
General Feat (Prerequisite: Level 4+, Strength 13+)
You gain the following benefits.
Ability Score Increase.Increase your Strength score by 1, to a maximum of 20.
Versatile Weapon Mastery. You gain access to the secondary Weapon Masteries of Versatile weapons. When you hit a creature with a weapon that has the Versatile property as part of the Attack action on your turn, you can cause the weapon to deal extra damage to the target. The extra damage equals your Proficiency Bonus.
Counterstrike. If you’re holding a Versatile weapon and another creature hits you or an ally within 5 feet of you with a melee attack, you can use your Reaction to make one melee attack with that weapon against the creature. If the creature is not within your melee attack range, you may move to within 5 feet of the creature as part of the Reaction, up to a maximum of half your Speed. This movement does not trigger Opportunity Attacks.
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Active characters:
Edoumiaond Willegume "Eddie" Podslee, Vegetanian scholar (College of Spirits bard) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator (Assassin rogue) Peter "the Pied Piper" Hausler, human con artist/remover of vermin (Circle of the Shepherd druid) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
The consensus thus far seems to be that a secondary weapon mastery should be locked behind a feat. That being said, I think I would prefer to make that a Fighting Style feat option, and keep the General feat as something that further expands on Verstaile weapons in a separate way. This would be similar to how Dueling (Fighting Style) and Defensive Duelist (General Feat) or Two-Weapon Fighting (Fighting Style) and Dual Wielder (General Feat) complement each other well, while not having one being reliant on the other.
I am not a huge fan of the suggested Counterstrike ability because it feels like there is overlap with the Sentinel feat. As for the Whirlwind Attack, this is based on the original Hunter ranger subclass ability that did not make it into the 2024 iteration of the subclass. Granted, this was an 11th level feature so I tried to nerf it a bit by limiting it to the one-handed damage of the weapon while still requiring the ability to hold it in both hands and removing your ability modifier from the damage. In this way, the damage would be comparable to something like the Thunderclap or Word of Radiance cantrips. In fact, those cantrips would outpace this version of Whirlwind Attack in base damage by the time characters reach level 5 (2d6 to each target as opposed to potentially 1d8 or 1d6). Granted, other features that modify your weapon attacks could make Whirlwind more potent, but I am not sure it is overpowered in that regard.
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Four-time Judge of the Competition of the Finest Brews! Come join us in making fun, unique homebrew and voting for your favorite entries!
When you use two hands to make a melee attack using a Versatile weapon, you can use the mastery property listed in parentheses alongside its damage value. As normal, you can only use this mastery property if the weapon is one chosen for the Weapon Mastery feature.
Protean Fighter
General Feat (Prerequisite: Level 4+, Strength 13+)
Ability Score Increase. Increase your Strength by 1, to a maximum of 20
Twirling Defense. While wielding a weapon with the Versatile property, you gain a +1 bonus to your AC. If you take the Dodge action, this bonus increases to +2 until the start of your next turn.
Whirlwind Attack. While wielding a weapon with the Versatile property, if you are able to use the weapon with two hands you can take an Action to sweep the weapon around yourself. Each creature within 5 feet of you must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw is 8+your proficiency bonus+your Strength modifier. Roll a number of d4 equal to your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, a target takes damage equal to the total value rolled, with the damage type being the same as that dealt by the weapon.
(so here, comparing Whirlwind Attack to Thunderclap, at level 4 the first deals 2d4 damage while the other deals 1d6. At level 5 its 3d4 versus 2d6. At level 11 its 4d4 versus 3d6. And so on to a maximum of 6d4 versus 4d6. Which one is better damage varies between levels, but their maximum output stays roughly in line)
I have always thought that the difference in damage between using a versatile weapon one-handed and two-handed, was never enough to make it a viable option. Dual wielding two weapons, or using an off-hand to carry a shield (+2 to AC (or more)), or upgrading to a larger two-handed weapon all seem to be better options than using a versatile weapon, two-handed.
If I were one of the game devs, I would simply have increased the damage a bit more. I would have made the Greataxe 2d6 (just like Greatsword), and I would have made the longsword and battle axe be d12 if used two-handed, and spear/staff d10 if used two-handed.
That way Greataxe and Greatsword still do slightly more damage on average, but it would become much more enticing to use a versatile weapon - because as it stands, there's better things to do with that off-hand than grip the versatile weapon.
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Playing D&D since 1982
Have played every version of the game since Basic (original Red Box Set), except that abomination sometimes called 4e.
I have always thought that the difference in damage between using a versatile weapon one-handed and two-handed, was never enough to make it a viable option. Dual wielding two weapons, or using an off-hand to carry a shield (+2 to AC (or more)), or upgrading to a larger two-handed weapon all seem to be better options than using a versatile weapon, two-handed.
One of the UAs prior to the 2024 release had a weapon mastery property called Flex that some Versatile weapons had, and what it did was let you use the larger two-handed damage die when wielding the weapon one-handed. I think it was intended as an attempt to fix that issue. I was surprised it didn't make the cut in the final release.
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pronouns: he/she/they
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Inspired by a recent online thread discussing the value of Versatile weapons, I came up with an idea to make those weapons more appealing. The fundamental change is to allow Versatile weapons to have a second mastery property, which can be used when the weapon is wielded with two hands. The rules and some weapon examples are outlined below, with my changes to the base rules marked in red.
Versatile
A Versatile weapon can be used with one or two hands. A damage value in parentheses appears with the property. The weapon deals that damage when used with two hands to make a melee attack. Listed alongside the damage value in parentheses is a mastery property. If the character has unlocked the mastery property of that weapon, the weapon uses the mastery property listed in parentheses when used with two hands to make a melee attack.
For example, a character using one hand to make a melee attack with a Battleaxe would deal 1d8 Slashing damage and could potentially use the Topple mastery property. If the character used two hands to make the same attack, it would deal 1d10 Slashing damage and use the Cleave property.
Weapons
Name
Damage
Properties
Mastery
Weight
Cost
Quarterstaff
1d6 Bludgeoning
Versatile (1d8,Topple)
Push
4 lb
2 SP
Battleaxe
1d8 Slashing
Versatile (1d10, Cleave)
Topple
4 lb
10 GP
Longsword
1d8 Slashing
Versatile (1d10, Graze)
Sap
3 lb
15 GP
Warhammer
1d8 Bludgeoning
Versatile (1d10, Slow)
Push
5 lb
15 GP
War Pick
1d8 Piercing
Versatile (1d10, Vex)
Sap
2 lb
5 GP
--------
For martial characters, this allows the opportunity to switch up your play style or combo attacks without switching weapons. For example, a Fighter with Warhammer mastery could use their extra attack feature to first use two hands to deal 1d10 damage to a target and Slow them and then switch to one hand for the second attack, dealing 1d8 damage and Pushing the target. At the end of the turn, the target of the attack is 10 feet away and has had its speed reduced by 10 feet, making it hard to close the distance or flee from the Fighter. In a similar way, a martial with Extra Attack and War Pick mastery could punish a single target by both imparting Dis on their next attack by Sap and giving themself Adv on their own attack using Vex.
Let me know what you think of this revision or if there are other Mastery properties you would propose. Also, a feat to help boost Versatile weapons is outlined in the spoiler tag below
Protean Fighter
General Feat (Prerequisite: Level 4+)
Ability Score Increase. Increase your Strength or Dexterity by 1, to a maximum of 20
Additional Weapon Properties. When you make a melee attack using a weapon with the Versatile property using one hand, the weapon is treated as having the Light property. When you make a melee attack using a weapon with the Versatile property using two hands, the weapon is treated as having the Reach property.
Whirlwind Attack. While wielding a weapon with the Versatile property, if you are able to use the weapon with two hands you can take an Action to make melee attacks against any number of creatures within 5 feet of you, with a separate attack roll for each target. Each melee attack is treated as if made using one hand, and you do not add your ability modifier to the damage of the attack.
Four-time Judge of the Competition of the Finest Brews! Come join us in making fun, unique homebrew and voting for your favorite entries!
TBH, I think the extra masteries are good enough to be locked behind the feat.
I think having everything be Light and Reach is too good for even a feat, and doesn't really make sense for all the weapons..the Light thing can especially be abused. Whirlwind is fine, but I don't think it will be that useful in actual play since it will often be a worse option than multi-attacking.
Maybe just have the feat have the ASI, open up the extra masteries, and add some kind of ability that offsets the downside of the play style (lower damage and no shield) and rewards having that free hand, for example:
Freehand Training. You switch between a one and two-handed grip with ease, throwing off your opponent's attacks with your free hand
(*I don't think the +2 here would actually be game breaking, it is equal to having a shield, but it can't be enhanced or have bonus properties like a regular shield...if it feels too strong, knock it down to +1...or have it go up to +2 at a higher level?)
Hope that helps, it still might not be as optimal as sword-and-board or the omnipresent great sword, but this feels like a swashbuckling fun and dynamic play style you don't see much that focuses on messing with opponents more than pure damage or defense.
I appreciate the feedback. The ideas for Freehand Training are really interesting. I had also played around with a +2 AC while using a versatile weapon, but it didn't feel very good to me. Like "you gain a +2 to AC so long as you aren't wielding a shield" feels like wielding a shield with extra steps. Of course there is the boon of being able to benefit from the two hand damage while maintaining a higher AC, but I wonder if there is a more unique solution.
I really like the idea of a +2 bonus to an unarmed shove, although depending on the chosen Verstaile weapon this may not be too beneficial if you have Weapon Masteries, since 3 out of 5 of them have either the Push or Topple mastery property by default.
I dont think that having the possibility of a Light or Reach add on is too overpowered. With Light, a longsword in one hand is just a slightly more powerful Shortsword without the benefit of Finesse. With Reach, the longsword in two hands is just a slightly less powerful Halberd without the Heavy property. By taking the feat, you basically double down on the versatility of your your Versatile weapon and are able to play with more varied attack types and approaches without needing to switch between other weapons. Also, in case my feat's language was not clear, there should not be a situation where a weapon has both the Light and Reach property. It should be one or the other depending on whether you use one hand or two.
I also disagree about locking the extra masteries behind a feat. Firstly, because the goal of this exercise was to try and make Versatile weapons feel more interesting by default. You already need to have access to the Weapon Mastery feature to benefit from it, so adding a feat requirement on top of it seems a bit much. Secondly, part of the fun of it is giving each Versatile weapon two unique combinations. Trying to add all of that information into a feat would make the descriptive text too lengthy for a feat compared to just integrating the info into the weapon table by default.
I think one issue that should be addressed with Versatile weapons in general, which I tried to accomplish with the additional masteries, is that it should encourage a play style where you are routinely switching between one handed and two handed attacks. I feel that most players will just commit to one style over another, at least over the course of a fight, without really playing with the weapon's versatility.
Four-time Judge of the Competition of the Finest Brews! Come join us in making fun, unique homebrew and voting for your favorite entries!
Hmm. I really like the idea of a secondary Mastery on Versatile weapons a lot... and I don't like Weapon Masteries in general. I think locking them behind the feat is a good idea though -- if you want to create a unique Versatile-focused way of fighting for martials, then requiring that sort of investment makes sense
As far as the Feat itself goes... giving more weapons the Light property is a non-starter for me. (Reach doesn't have the same mechanical headaches associated with it). The Whirlwind Attack also seems OP compared to the extra attacks feats like PAM or GWM grant
Trying the match the 'shifting and unpredictable' vibe you seems to be going for with the concept, I'd suggest something like this instead:
Active characters:
Edoumiaond Willegume "Eddie" Podslee, Vegetanian scholar (College of Spirits bard)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator (Assassin rogue)
Peter "the Pied Piper" Hausler, human con artist/remover of vermin (Circle of the Shepherd druid)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
The consensus thus far seems to be that a secondary weapon mastery should be locked behind a feat. That being said, I think I would prefer to make that a Fighting Style feat option, and keep the General feat as something that further expands on Verstaile weapons in a separate way. This would be similar to how Dueling (Fighting Style) and Defensive Duelist (General Feat) or Two-Weapon Fighting (Fighting Style) and Dual Wielder (General Feat) complement each other well, while not having one being reliant on the other.
I am not a huge fan of the suggested Counterstrike ability because it feels like there is overlap with the Sentinel feat. As for the Whirlwind Attack, this is based on the original Hunter ranger subclass ability that did not make it into the 2024 iteration of the subclass. Granted, this was an 11th level feature so I tried to nerf it a bit by limiting it to the one-handed damage of the weapon while still requiring the ability to hold it in both hands and removing your ability modifier from the damage. In this way, the damage would be comparable to something like the Thunderclap or Word of Radiance cantrips. In fact, those cantrips would outpace this version of Whirlwind Attack in base damage by the time characters reach level 5 (2d6 to each target as opposed to potentially 1d8 or 1d6). Granted, other features that modify your weapon attacks could make Whirlwind more potent, but I am not sure it is overpowered in that regard.
Four-time Judge of the Competition of the Finest Brews! Come join us in making fun, unique homebrew and voting for your favorite entries!
How about something like this?
Versatile Mastery
Fighting Style feat (Prerequsite: Fighting Style Feature)
When you use two hands to make a melee attack using a Versatile weapon, you can use the mastery property listed in parentheses alongside its damage value. As normal, you can only use this mastery property if the weapon is one chosen for the Weapon Mastery feature.
Protean Fighter
General Feat (Prerequisite: Level 4+, Strength 13+)
Ability Score Increase. Increase your Strength by 1, to a maximum of 20
Twirling Defense. While wielding a weapon with the Versatile property, you gain a +1 bonus to your AC. If you take the Dodge action, this bonus increases to +2 until the start of your next turn.
Whirlwind Attack. While wielding a weapon with the Versatile property, if you are able to use the weapon with two hands you can take an Action to sweep the weapon around yourself. Each creature within 5 feet of you must make a Dexterity saving throw. The DC for this saving throw is 8+your proficiency bonus+your Strength modifier. Roll a number of d4 equal to your proficiency bonus. On a failed save, a target takes damage equal to the total value rolled, with the damage type being the same as that dealt by the weapon.
(so here, comparing Whirlwind Attack to Thunderclap, at level 4 the first deals 2d4 damage while the other deals 1d6. At level 5 its 3d4 versus 2d6. At level 11 its 4d4 versus 3d6. And so on to a maximum of 6d4 versus 4d6. Which one is better damage varies between levels, but their maximum output stays roughly in line)
Four-time Judge of the Competition of the Finest Brews! Come join us in making fun, unique homebrew and voting for your favorite entries!
I have always thought that the difference in damage between using a versatile weapon one-handed and two-handed, was never enough to make it a viable option. Dual wielding two weapons, or using an off-hand to carry a shield (+2 to AC (or more)), or upgrading to a larger two-handed weapon all seem to be better options than using a versatile weapon, two-handed.
If I were one of the game devs, I would simply have increased the damage a bit more. I would have made the Greataxe 2d6 (just like Greatsword), and I would have made the longsword and battle axe be d12 if used two-handed, and spear/staff d10 if used two-handed.
That way Greataxe and Greatsword still do slightly more damage on average, but it would become much more enticing to use a versatile weapon - because as it stands, there's better things to do with that off-hand than grip the versatile weapon.
Playing D&D since 1982
Have played every version of the game since Basic (original Red Box Set), except that abomination sometimes called 4e.
One of the UAs prior to the 2024 release had a weapon mastery property called Flex that some Versatile weapons had, and what it did was let you use the larger two-handed damage die when wielding the weapon one-handed. I think it was intended as an attempt to fix that issue. I was surprised it didn't make the cut in the final release.
pronouns: he/she/they