I've been trying to prioritize homebrew projects and came to a subclass idea I shelved a while back in anticipation of the Artificer class. Now that the Artificer is almost finished, I'm taking another look.
The idea of the subclass is that there are some artificers (or maybe rogues) that can't actually use magic on their own, but are accomplished frauds who use smoke-and-mirror illusions, alchemy, hired help, and sophisticated mechanical devices to convince others that they are powerful magic users. Think the Wizard of Oz. Spells they cast look and feel like magic, but can't be detected (with detect magic), dispelled (with dispel magic), countered (with counterspell), and are not inhibited by an antimagic field. Additionally, creatures resistant or immune to magic wouldn't be able to apply these abilities to the fraud's spells.
My question is, how powerful is this ability? Also, given my explanation, what other mechanical considerations should be made for non-magical magic?
There's only a small handful of (high-level) spells in the game that are immune to being dispelled, and they can all be countered or suppressed by antimagic field. The only exceptions are spells casted by deities.
So if you're proposing that certain "spellcasters" in your game can effectively cast arbitrary spells on demand without being subject to any countermeasures, it's incredibly strong. But if they're really using smoke and mirrors to fake it, they shouldn't be able to cast arbitrary spells on demand. It's impossible to say how "powerful" the ability is if you don't give any parameters for how it can or can't be used.
At the very least, regardless of the exact nature of the feature, an insight check or a zone of truth should be able to reveal the deception (taking the place of dispel magic or antimagic field). I would also try to avoid giving any spell that deals damage or effect other spells.
"The relevant equation is: Knowledge = power = energy = matter = mass; a good bookshop is just a genteel Black Hole that knows how to read." - Terry Pratchett
I feel like this really would only work if you have a small pool of very specific spells that this character could replicate. Like... You couldn't do a fake version of "Find Familiar", because at that point it's just buying and training a pet and there's no way to replicate the specific effects of the spell. So you could maybe convince other people that you have a familiar, but couldn't actually use it.
Something like Fireball would just be a grenade, and the only magic part would be somehow throwing it in a way that looks like you're casting a spell. With that in mind if you gave this subclass an extremely limited selection of spells (limited to ones that could conceivably be faked), and maybe give the player a cost in resources that they have to maintain in order to cast the spells I think it could work, although it seems like it would be a lot of work to design and balance.
If it's fake magic, it's you're pretty much only going to be using spells that don't actually affect anything other than the caster or objects used for casting. This lower power is a huge trade-off for the ability to circumvent antimagic field. There are only really antimagic fields at higher levels, so this class or subclass would be relatively weak at lower levels, with a very limited increase at higher levels.
Also, any character with a high enough deception score could do this with just the actor feat, or even without even a feat.
There's only a small handful of (high-level) spells in the game that are immune to being dispelled, and they can all be countered or suppressed by antimagic field. The only exceptions are spells casted by deities.
So if you're proposing that certain "spellcasters" in your game can effectively cast arbitrary spells on demand without being subject to any countermeasures, it's incredibly strong. But if they're really using smoke and mirrors to fake it, they shouldn't be able to cast arbitrary spells on demand. It's impossible to say how "powerful" the ability is if you don't give any parameters for how it can or can't be used.
Arbitrary spells from the artificer list, which is very limited, and caps out at level 5. Ideally it wouldn't impose any other restrictions, aside from the requirement that the artificer has its tool focus. I also don't mean to imply that these spells would operate without the expenditure of a spell slot, if that's what you mean. Only that the spell slots would represent non-magical resources.
If you are casting a fraud Fireball and it has the same effect, what exactly is powering the effect?
Job Bluth's wrist flamethrower comes to mind. Or a rocket with some explosive chemical inside. Plenty of spells could be recast as non-magical if you have the right tools.
I feel like this really would only work if you have a small pool of very specific spells that this character could replicate. Like... You couldn't do a fake version of "Find Familiar", because at that point it's just buying and training a pet and there's no way to replicate the specific effects of the spell. So you could maybe convince other people that you have a familiar, but couldn't actually use it.
Something like Fireball would just be a grenade, and the only magic part would be somehow throwing it in a way that looks like you're casting a spell. With that in mind if you gave this subclass an extremely limited selection of spells (limited to ones that could conceivably be faked), and maybe give the player a cost in resources that they have to maintain in order to cast the spells I think it could work, although it seems like it would be a lot of work to design and balance.
Right. The artificer spell list is already very limited, and doesn't extend past 5th level. A cost in resources is interesting. I'll consider adding a monetary cost based on the level of the spell.
If it's fake magic, it's you're pretty much only going to be using spells that don't actually affect anything other than the caster or objects used for casting. This lower power is a huge trade-off for the ability to circumvent antimagic field. There are only really antimagic fields at higher levels, so this class or subclass would be relatively weak at lower levels, with a very limited increase at higher levels.
Also, any character with a high enough deception score could do this with just the actor feat, or even without even a feat.
That's not necessarily true. One could certainly replicate illusions with smoke and mirror sorts of setups. Plenty of evocations are already easy to replicate. The hardest spells to fake would probably be enchantments and teleportation effects. And I'd certainly incorporate deception as part of an ability, either to fool spellcasters or to spoof magic items. I'm still in the earliest stages of even considering whether to invest the time to sketch the subclass.
Just scanning the artificer list, the only spells I see that are really difficult to realistically fake are those that create or interact with extradimensional spaces (blink, private sanctum, secure chest) and maybe gaseous form.
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Hi all,
I've been trying to prioritize homebrew projects and came to a subclass idea I shelved a while back in anticipation of the Artificer class. Now that the Artificer is almost finished, I'm taking another look.
The idea of the subclass is that there are some artificers (or maybe rogues) that can't actually use magic on their own, but are accomplished frauds who use smoke-and-mirror illusions, alchemy, hired help, and sophisticated mechanical devices to convince others that they are powerful magic users. Think the Wizard of Oz. Spells they cast look and feel like magic, but can't be detected (with detect magic), dispelled (with dispel magic), countered (with counterspell), and are not inhibited by an antimagic field. Additionally, creatures resistant or immune to magic wouldn't be able to apply these abilities to the fraud's spells.
My question is, how powerful is this ability? Also, given my explanation, what other mechanical considerations should be made for non-magical magic?
There's only a small handful of (high-level) spells in the game that are immune to being dispelled, and they can all be countered or suppressed by antimagic field. The only exceptions are spells casted by deities.
So if you're proposing that certain "spellcasters" in your game can effectively cast arbitrary spells on demand without being subject to any countermeasures, it's incredibly strong. But if they're really using smoke and mirrors to fake it, they shouldn't be able to cast arbitrary spells on demand. It's impossible to say how "powerful" the ability is if you don't give any parameters for how it can or can't be used.
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If you are casting a fraud Fireball and it has the same effect, what exactly is powering the effect?
At the very least, regardless of the exact nature of the feature, an insight check or a zone of truth should be able to reveal the deception (taking the place of dispel magic or antimagic field). I would also try to avoid giving any spell that deals damage or effect other spells.
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"The relevant equation is: Knowledge = power = energy = matter = mass; a good bookshop is just a genteel Black Hole that knows how to read." - Terry Pratchett
I feel like this really would only work if you have a small pool of very specific spells that this character could replicate. Like... You couldn't do a fake version of "Find Familiar", because at that point it's just buying and training a pet and there's no way to replicate the specific effects of the spell. So you could maybe convince other people that you have a familiar, but couldn't actually use it.
Something like Fireball would just be a grenade, and the only magic part would be somehow throwing it in a way that looks like you're casting a spell. With that in mind if you gave this subclass an extremely limited selection of spells (limited to ones that could conceivably be faked), and maybe give the player a cost in resources that they have to maintain in order to cast the spells I think it could work, although it seems like it would be a lot of work to design and balance.
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If it's fake magic, it's you're pretty much only going to be using spells that don't actually affect anything other than the caster or objects used for casting. This lower power is a huge trade-off for the ability to circumvent antimagic field. There are only really antimagic fields at higher levels, so this class or subclass would be relatively weak at lower levels, with a very limited increase at higher levels.
Also, any character with a high enough deception score could do this with just the actor feat, or even without even a feat.
"Now that you mention it..." - One of my DMs
Arbitrary spells from the artificer list, which is very limited, and caps out at level 5. Ideally it wouldn't impose any other restrictions, aside from the requirement that the artificer has its tool focus. I also don't mean to imply that these spells would operate without the expenditure of a spell slot, if that's what you mean. Only that the spell slots would represent non-magical resources.
Job Bluth's wrist flamethrower comes to mind. Or a rocket with some explosive chemical inside. Plenty of spells could be recast as non-magical if you have the right tools.
Right. The artificer spell list is already very limited, and doesn't extend past 5th level. A cost in resources is interesting. I'll consider adding a monetary cost based on the level of the spell.
That's not necessarily true. One could certainly replicate illusions with smoke and mirror sorts of setups. Plenty of evocations are already easy to replicate. The hardest spells to fake would probably be enchantments and teleportation effects. And I'd certainly incorporate deception as part of an ability, either to fool spellcasters or to spoof magic items. I'm still in the earliest stages of even considering whether to invest the time to sketch the subclass.
Just scanning the artificer list, the only spells I see that are really difficult to realistically fake are those that create or interact with extradimensional spaces (blink, private sanctum, secure chest) and maybe gaseous form.