I was going over an idea I had for a campaign if I ever actually can DM and I ran into an issue with the lore of the Afterlife in DnD.
The concept: An individual was goin from village to village, town to town, passing out treats to children. While seemingly nice, this had an effect of makin every child deathly ill with fevors and body trimmers until they eventually died. However, 1/10 (or less) would survive and instead would gain magical abilities, becoming Sorcerors of vairing degree of power.
The one doing this was enraptured by the old stories of an ancient civilization were every person was connected with Magic, the Weave, to the point that Tenth and even Eleventh Level spells were possible. To remake thatold state of being, he was helping to awaken individuals to their magical abilites. Eventually saturating the world with them. When the heroes obviously confront him with the death left behind, he replies: "Why does that concern you? They simply pass through the Shadowfell, on to the City of the Dead. There, they will be taken in by a diety and spend their lives in happiness. I am sending those cured to not weld magic to a better place while turning this realm into a paradise."
And there's where the issue is. The actual cost of death in Faerun and other similar settings where plenty of folks may know exactly where they will be going after they die.
While the players could argue that just creating a bunch of random Sorcerors from children won't make a Utopa appear, I find it harder to challenge him on the actual deaths of the children. If these were impovershed, sickly, frail or oppressed children, seending them to a Plane where they would be completely well and taken care of would seem to be a blessing. While those left behind might grieve, it would only be out of loneliness. They know that their child has passed on to a happier place.
So too for Adventurers. Why grieve over the death of a party member when you know they were a follower of "Such and Such Diety" and therefore would be picked up from the City of the Dead fairly quickly. What reason would they have to return with Resurrection if the party is workin well without them, he could be replaced, or if he is truely happy after moving on? For that matter, so long as it doesn't violate the tenients of their faith, why fear death at all?
Perhaps I missed something with the lore of the Shadowfell or the City of the Dead. What would you expand on when it comes to death in DnD Settings as a lore creator. How would you counter what the Sorceror Creator said as a character?
Also, feel free to use the idea in a Campaign, just let me know how it goes.
Those who did not make a firm commitment to any god in their life time are numbered among the Faithless, and their souls are placed in the wall that surrounds the City of the Dead.
What deity has a five year old child served?
You could argue that there must certainly be some sort of provision made for the souls of children, but where does it say so? Is it something that people in the Realms know for certain?
The Material Plane is a proving ground for souls, and someone who dies before having proved themselves will not have as good a position in the afterlife as someone who lived long enough to affirm his faith and serve his deity.
Christians also believe that the saved will go to Heaven when they die, but what about the not-yet-saved? To kill someone before they have had a chance to make themselves right with god is to condemn them to Hell (or at least Purgatory, for those who believe in that).
So, yeah... I don't think he gets to make that argument.
Not to mention that all the good gods have rules against taking another life. Regardless of whether the person is destined for paradise or not, their life isn't yours to take (except in self-defense or in defense of the life of another).
Those who did not make a firm commitment to any god in their life time are numbered among the Faithless, and their souls are placed in the wall that surrounds the City of the Dead.
What deity has a five year old child served?
You could argue that there must certainly be some sort of provision made for the souls of children, but where does it say so? Is it something that people in the Realms know for certain?
The Material Plane is a proving ground for souls, and someone who dies before having proved themselves will not have as good a position in the afterlife as someone who lived long enough to affirm his faith and serve his deity.
Christians also believe that the saved will go to Heaven when they die, but what about the not-yet-saved? To kill someone before they have had a chance to make themselves right with god is to condemn them to Hell (or at least Purgatory, for those who believe in that).
So, yeah... I don't think he gets to make that argument.
Not to mention that all the good gods have rules against taking another life. Regardless of whether the person is destined for paradise or not, their life isn't yours to take (except in self-defense or in defense of the life of another).
For the children, it is written that the God of Death Kelemvor himself judges those who are not taken up by any other diety, depending on how early or late in the timeline your setting is. Although Kelemvor might have thrown away most of his humanity to better serve as the God of Death, I greatly doubt that he would throw a child to the Wall of Faithless when they arrived to his court. Perhaps the absence of it being discussed in any offical capacity should be taken as a sign not of Kelemvor's dismissal of them, but of WotC not being very eager to write about dead children.
And fair points across the board for the rest of it.
Edit: Just remembered that, at the very least, Yondalla is a diety that favors children. Though she is a Halfling diety, children are about the same size.
I was going over an idea I had for a campaign if I ever actually can DM and I ran into an issue with the lore of the Afterlife in DnD.
The concept: An individual was goin from village to village, town to town, passing out treats to children. While seemingly nice, this had an effect of makin every child deathly ill with fevors and body trimmers until they eventually died. However, 1/10 (or less) would survive and instead would gain magical abilities, becoming Sorcerors of vairing degree of power.
The one doing this was enraptured by the old stories of an ancient civilization were every person was connected with Magic, the Weave, to the point that Tenth and even Eleventh Level spells were possible. To remake thatold state of being, he was helping to awaken individuals to their magical abilites. Eventually saturating the world with them. When the heroes obviously confront him with the death left behind, he replies: "Why does that concern you? They simply pass through the Shadowfell, on to the City of the Dead. There, they will be taken in by a diety and spend their lives in happiness. I am sending those cured to not weld magic to a better place while turning this realm into a paradise."
And there's where the issue is. The actual cost of death in Faerun and other similar settings where plenty of folks may know exactly where they will be going after they die.
While the players could argue that just creating a bunch of random Sorcerors from children won't make a Utopa appear, I find it harder to challenge him on the actual deaths of the children. If these were impovershed, sickly, frail or oppressed children, seending them to a Plane where they would be completely well and taken care of would seem to be a blessing. While those left behind might grieve, it would only be out of loneliness. They know that their child has passed on to a happier place.
So too for Adventurers. Why grieve over the death of a party member when you know they were a follower of "Such and Such Diety" and therefore would be picked up from the City of the Dead fairly quickly. What reason would they have to return with Resurrection if the party is workin well without them, he could be replaced, or if he is truely happy after moving on? For that matter, so long as it doesn't violate the tenients of their faith, why fear death at all?
Perhaps I missed something with the lore of the Shadowfell or the City of the Dead. What would you expand on when it comes to death in DnD Settings as a lore creator. How would you counter what the Sorceror Creator said as a character?
Also, feel free to use the idea in a Campaign, just let me know how it goes.
Those who did not make a firm commitment to any god in their life time are numbered among the Faithless, and their souls are placed in the wall that surrounds the City of the Dead.
What deity has a five year old child served?
You could argue that there must certainly be some sort of provision made for the souls of children, but where does it say so? Is it something that people in the Realms know for certain?
The Material Plane is a proving ground for souls, and someone who dies before having proved themselves will not have as good a position in the afterlife as someone who lived long enough to affirm his faith and serve his deity.
Christians also believe that the saved will go to Heaven when they die, but what about the not-yet-saved? To kill someone before they have had a chance to make themselves right with god is to condemn them to Hell (or at least Purgatory, for those who believe in that).
So, yeah... I don't think he gets to make that argument.
Not to mention that all the good gods have rules against taking another life. Regardless of whether the person is destined for paradise or not, their life isn't yours to take (except in self-defense or in defense of the life of another).
The noble soul has reverence for itself. -- Nietzsche
http://forgotten-realms.wandering-dwarf.com/
For the children, it is written that the God of Death Kelemvor himself judges those who are not taken up by any other diety, depending on how early or late in the timeline your setting is. Although Kelemvor might have thrown away most of his humanity to better serve as the God of Death, I greatly doubt that he would throw a child to the Wall of Faithless when they arrived to his court. Perhaps the absence of it being discussed in any offical capacity should be taken as a sign not of Kelemvor's dismissal of them, but of WotC not being very eager to write about dead children.
And fair points across the board for the rest of it.
Edit: Just remembered that, at the very least, Yondalla is a diety that favors children. Though she is a Halfling diety, children are about the same size.