I’m the kind of person that likes picking out the best combinations of things, as if it were a puzzle. Unfortunately, I have found in this search that old-school picks for race/species don’t seem as popular. Are the new ones really that good?
in addition, I’ve made a list of what i feel personally yet based on data/other opinions are the best combinations of race/species and classes. I would be interested in your own opinions and feedback.
I think the idea about best used to be a species that had a +2 in the class’s primary stat. I agree that has really gone by the wayside, and personally I’m a big fan of that shift. Of course now, it seems like that’s moved to background.
For me, I don’t know about a best option. I just make a character that fits my idea and species is just part of that. I’m sure there are mechanically advantageous combinations, it’s just not something I look at, really. (Disclaimer that I’m not trying to criticize people that focus on mechanical optimization, it’s a perfectly valid way to play.)
Personally, I doubt the power of races has much impact on which classes they get paired with. I, as well as everyone else in my D&D group, would never play a bugbear just because they pair well with a certain class. This is a roleplaying game, not an optimizing game.
When you say 'Best', I will assume you are talking from a damage output optimization standpoint for my initial response.
As D&D is not a video game, the primary focus isn't the typical 'Tank', 'DPS' & 'Heals' roles, and being 'good' in something can be very open to interpretation.
The majority of people build their characters to achieve what they think will be a 'Fun' character to play.
This is not to say, that people that like to optimize certain stats don't have fun playing their characters, as the optimization part is what makes it 'fun' for them.
So if you want to play a smooth-talking character that has a very high Charisma and associated bonuses (Persuasion, Deception, Etc.), then a 'good' Species/Class/Subclass combo would look VERY different than one that is focused on brutal combat.
So 'Good' is relative to what you are trying to build for your character and what you think will be 'Fun' to play.
I hope that makes sense :)
So, when you say 'Good' what specifically do you want your character to be good at?
Let us know and we can help answer your question for you.
Cheers!
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Breathe, dragons; sing of the First World, forged out of chaos and painted with beauty. Sing of Bahamut, the Platinum, molding the shape of the mountains and rivers; Sing too of Chromatic Tiamat, painting all over the infinite canvas. Partnered, they woke in the darkness; partnered, they labored in acts of creation.
This is a roleplaying game, not an optimizing game.
I would say it’s not one or the other, and they shouldn’t be set up in opposition. It’s sometimes one, sometimes the other, most often a bit of both. It’s really a playstyle difference. And I find even people who say they are against optimizing do it at least a little. I’ve yet to see the barbarian put their asi into a charisma increase because it better “fits what the character has gone through” for example.
I don’t necessarily mean roles or best damage. I think the best example I can give is certain characters already have high speed and are meant to go fast (walking), so you would want to make it go even faster. A similar example is I believe Tabaxi have a climbing speed equal to their movement speed, and “Winged” Tieflings have a flying speed equal to their movement speed, so to get the most out of it, one would want a class that moves as fast as possible to maximize their other forms of movement too.
I think the word I’m looking for is synergy, or what races/species best synergies with what class. Does that make more sense?
I too tend to so far play what I want… kind of. My table uses miniatures a lot, so I want to use what that figure looks like. What I am doing here is almost more of a thought process than anything, although it could influence what future game pieces I make/buy.
Similarly, I kind of do what Xalthu does backwards: i take the efficient build stats and base my character around those rather than trying different stats solely for the purpose of telling a different story. The only close thing to an exception to this is in my campaign now we roll for our stats, and I didn’t really roll any low numbers, so my Barbarian was smarter than the average one or more well-rounded.
This is my personal opinion so it may not be the best, and I'll give an explanation for each. Just what I think would be the most optimal/synergize the best. I'm also not including any elf races here because bonus action teleport is good on everyone. Also this is keeping 2014 rules in mind, I don't know much about 2024.
Artificer: Warforged - Extra AC is really nice especially since artificers are already tanky. Barbarian: Orc - A lot of races are pretty good for barb, but orc gives them a free revive on themselves if they drop, plus more carrying capacity, plus dashing to engage and disengage from combat more quickly. Bard: Changeling - Bards are best out of combat and changeling is one of the best out of combat races out there, plus you get free skill proficiencies. Cleric: Aarakocra - Flying is good, don't know what else to say. Anything that works for the other casters also works for cleric except for maybe aasimar which is only slightly less optimal. Druid: Plasmoid - In a pinch, you can disenegage from combat by just condensing yourself into a little slime in a crack, which is good for druids that usually frontline. Plus, they don't need a lot of gear so they aren't suffering as much from the penalty of wearing and carrying things. Fighter: Bugbear - That extra reach lets you pull off really good combos and lockdown, plus the extra damage is always really really good. Monk: Centaur - You get unarmed strikes that do more damage than base monk, plus 40 ft movement which is really good. Paladin: Satyr - Advantage on magical saving throws makes your aura even more effective on yourself, plus with 35 ft of movement. You also get some charisma skills for free, and some leaping movement. Ranger: Harengon - The bonus action leap lets you disengage and the initiative bonus gives you an upper hand for pulling off gloomstalker shenanigans, but harengon is good on pretty much every class. Rogue: Dhampir - Spiderclimb lets you hide in hard to reach places, plus you get a speed bonus. Sorcerer: Aasimar (Protector) - The legacy version allows you to add damage equal to your level while in your angellic state once per turn, which is really really good with blaster casters like sorcerer to rack up high damage with an AOE. It's also got healing which is always nice when you're more squishy, and resistances to round it out. Warlock: Thri Kreen - You get secondary arms you can use to cast while still holding a weapon or shield or both in your main hands, plus telepathy which is always nice. And you get unarmored defense too, meaning you don't have to wear armor. This is also really good on wizard and sorcerer, casters in general. Wizard: Hill Dwarf - Extra health to pad out your wizard HP plus a lot of survivability. You get really good proficiencies too, which wizard needs, I think you get shield prof?
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— δ cyno • he/him • number one paladin fanδ — making a smoothie for meta ——————| EXTENDED SIG |—————— Φ • happily married to my lovely redpelt, minmaxer, microbiology undergrad, and lover of anything colored red • Φ
Hm... the subclasses can change the choice quite a bit.
Artificer - Giff would be my choice for a ranged Battlesmith. Aasimar would be best for an Artillerist or Alchemist to stack as much damage on their one attack as they can. Dragonborn or Warforged would be best for a melee-Armourer or Battlesmith.
Barbarian - Shifter-Wildhunt is by far the best choice overall, being able to go Reckless with no penalty is borderline broken. For 2024 though, many more monsters have charm/fear effects so for non-Beserkers you want something to help you avoid getting frightened/charmed, so Gnome, Vedalken, or Kalashtar.
Bard - Changeling if you want to double-down on the social/deception aspects, otherwise Infernal Tiefling or a Githzerai to get access to a reaction-spell either for defence or for some retribution damage. Firbolg is also a solid choice for a support-focused Bard. Tortle is a good choice for a Swords Bard.
Cleric - Similar to Bard, the main weakness is lack of reaction spells so Infernal Tiefling of Githzerai are great for caster-focused clerics. Goliath is also solid choice if you want to be more of a melee-focused Cleric. Firbolg is the best option for a squishy support cleric, whereas Hobgoblin is excellent for a tanky support cleric.
Druid - Goblin all the way, the new druid has tons of distance spells that can be moved around and deal damage turn after turn, being able to then go duck and Hide as an BA is borderline broken.
Fighter - Bugbear is again at the top of the list for a dual-wielding Fighter, but Hexblood for that free Hex spell is your best option for an archer. Kobold would be my choice for a two-handed weapon melee Fighter, though Leonin or Orc are pretty good as well. For maximum damage for a two-hander then Shifter Longtooth is the way to go.
Monk - Bugbear for sure, nothing like comboing that 2d6 extra damage on 4 attacks at level 5. Both also do best with many short combats with SRs in between. Another good choice for Monk is Centaur if your DM allows other PCs to ride you since it lets you get double the benefits of Monk's awesome movement, and the flavour of trampling enemies with your ninja-hooves is very very fun. However, for Shadow Monk I'd go for Dhampir so you can keep your Darkness aura out of the way of your allies and there is something awesome about teleporting onto the ceiling and just hanging there. Though if you go for a Grapple build e.g. Elements monk then Goliath is the way to go for their Large size so you can grapple even Huge enemies.
Paladin - Infernal Tiefling, now that Smite is a BA, it's way better to use your Smite-slots as Hellish Rebukes. Fairy or Elf are excellent choices if you want to be a CHA-focused paladin. Hexblood is also a great option for low-medium campaigns when Smite eats your spell slots too quickly.
Ranger - Dwarf is a good pick now that the melee-ranger is so much better than the ranged-ranger, since rangers are quite lacking in the defense department. Githzerai is good for the same reason. For a ranged-ranger, you want something that can get out of trouble, so a Goblin or Eladrin would be my choices. Tabaxi is also a good option for ranged characters if your DM provides interesting terrain to climb on.
Rogue - Kobold or High Elf, being able to pick up Booming Blade with your species allows any Rogue to get the best of Arcane Trickster without having to choose that subclass. Kobold is probably the best for that Adv versus being Frightened since Frightened is one of the worst conditions for a Rogue. For any rogue with CHA as their secondary ability, Changeling is also fantastic for optimizing scouting & infiltration, put one of your Expertise into Deception and you can walk around as anyone at anytime and fool their own family that you are them. Alternatively, Kalashtar with their telepathy and Wis save Adv is also a really good choice for any Rogue planning to get themselves into trouble. For a ranged-focused Rogue, Aasimar or Goliath would be my choice
Sorcerer - Goblin for that BA:Disgengage or Hide is probably my best pick, especially since there is more emphasis of Sorcerers using attack roll spells. Firbolg is also good for a bit more utility without needing to use up known spells for it.
Warlock - Goblin for an Eldritch Blaster, for a Blade-lock Eladrin. For an ArchFey patron I'd go with Fairy for a few bonus utility spells.
Wizard - Goblin is always good for a squishy character, but Tortle better for a low to mid level campaign when spellslots are still precious. Aasimar for an Evoker or other blaster-focused build, Fairy for a more support character, or High Elf or Firbolg if you just need a few more spells prepared. Tabaxi would be my choice for a low-level campaign for two very good skill proficiencies and extra maneuverability.
Wow. I’m embarrassed to say i didn’t put much thought into how the different subclasses and other features like eldritch invocations could swing the “answer.” I appreciate your response. Thank you!
I guess the next step of this for me would be to look at what subclasses are the best and focus on which of these options fit the best.
I’m the kind of person that likes picking out the best combinations of things, as if it were a puzzle. Unfortunately, I have found in this search that old-school picks for race/species don’t seem as popular. Are the new ones really that good?
in addition, I’ve made a list of what i feel personally yet based on data/other opinions are the best combinations of race/species and classes. I would be interested in your own opinions and feedback.
Artificer: Warforged
Barbarian: Gnome
Bard: Aasimar
Cleric: High Elf
Druid: ?
Fighter: Shifter (Beast-hide)
Illrigger: Bugbear/Goblin
Monk: Plasmoid*
Paladin: Eladrin
Ranger: Shadar-kai
Rogue: Tabaxi
Sorcerer: Harengon
Warlock: Infernal Tiefling
Wizard: Hobgoblin
(* is more of a personal choice)
I think the idea about best used to be a species that had a +2 in the class’s primary stat. I agree that has really gone by the wayside, and personally I’m a big fan of that shift. Of course now, it seems like that’s moved to background.
For me, I don’t know about a best option. I just make a character that fits my idea and species is just part of that. I’m sure there are mechanically advantageous combinations, it’s just not something I look at, really. (Disclaimer that I’m not trying to criticize people that focus on mechanical optimization, it’s a perfectly valid way to play.)
Personally, I doubt the power of races has much impact on which classes they get paired with. I, as well as everyone else in my D&D group, would never play a bugbear just because they pair well with a certain class. This is a roleplaying game, not an optimizing game.
Greetings Actionsparda,
When you say 'Best', I will assume you are talking from a damage output optimization standpoint for my initial response.
As D&D is not a video game, the primary focus isn't the typical 'Tank', 'DPS' & 'Heals' roles, and being 'good' in something can be very open to interpretation.
The majority of people build their characters to achieve what they think will be a 'Fun' character to play.
This is not to say, that people that like to optimize certain stats don't have fun playing their characters, as the optimization part is what makes it 'fun' for them.
So if you want to play a smooth-talking character that has a very high Charisma and associated bonuses (Persuasion, Deception, Etc.), then a 'good' Species/Class/Subclass combo would look VERY different than one that is focused on brutal combat.
So 'Good' is relative to what you are trying to build for your character and what you think will be 'Fun' to play.
I hope that makes sense :)
So, when you say 'Good' what specifically do you want your character to be good at?
Let us know and we can help answer your question for you.
Cheers!
Breathe, dragons; sing of the First World, forged out of chaos and painted with beauty.
Sing of Bahamut, the Platinum, molding the shape of the mountains and rivers;
Sing too of Chromatic Tiamat, painting all over the infinite canvas.
Partnered, they woke in the darkness; partnered, they labored in acts of creation.
I would say it’s not one or the other, and they shouldn’t be set up in opposition. It’s sometimes one, sometimes the other, most often a bit of both. It’s really a playstyle difference.
And I find even people who say they are against optimizing do it at least a little. I’ve yet to see the barbarian put their asi into a charisma increase because it better “fits what the character has gone through” for example.
I don’t necessarily mean roles or best damage. I think the best example I can give is certain characters already have high speed and are meant to go fast (walking), so you would want to make it go even faster. A similar example is I believe Tabaxi have a climbing speed equal to their movement speed, and “Winged” Tieflings have a flying speed equal to their movement speed, so to get the most out of it, one would want a class that moves as fast as possible to maximize their other forms of movement too.
I think the word I’m looking for is synergy, or what races/species best synergies with what class. Does that make more sense?
I too tend to so far play what I want… kind of. My table uses miniatures a lot, so I want to use what that figure looks like. What I am doing here is almost more of a thought process than anything, although it could influence what future game pieces I make/buy.
Similarly, I kind of do what Xalthu does backwards: i take the efficient build stats and base my character around those rather than trying different stats solely for the purpose of telling a different story. The only close thing to an exception to this is in my campaign now we roll for our stats, and I didn’t really roll any low numbers, so my Barbarian was smarter than the average one or more well-rounded.
This is my personal opinion so it may not be the best, and I'll give an explanation for each. Just what I think would be the most optimal/synergize the best. I'm also not including any elf races here because bonus action teleport is good on everyone. Also this is keeping 2014 rules in mind, I don't know much about 2024.
Artificer: Warforged - Extra AC is really nice especially since artificers are already tanky.
Barbarian: Orc - A lot of races are pretty good for barb, but orc gives them a free revive on themselves if they drop, plus more carrying capacity, plus dashing to engage and disengage from combat more quickly.
Bard: Changeling - Bards are best out of combat and changeling is one of the best out of combat races out there, plus you get free skill proficiencies.
Cleric: Aarakocra - Flying is good, don't know what else to say. Anything that works for the other casters also works for cleric except for maybe aasimar which is only slightly less optimal.
Druid: Plasmoid - In a pinch, you can disenegage from combat by just condensing yourself into a little slime in a crack, which is good for druids that usually frontline. Plus, they don't need a lot of gear so they aren't suffering as much from the penalty of wearing and carrying things.
Fighter: Bugbear - That extra reach lets you pull off really good combos and lockdown, plus the extra damage is always really really good.
Monk: Centaur - You get unarmed strikes that do more damage than base monk, plus 40 ft movement which is really good.
Paladin: Satyr - Advantage on magical saving throws makes your aura even more effective on yourself, plus with 35 ft of movement. You also get some charisma skills for free, and some leaping movement.
Ranger: Harengon - The bonus action leap lets you disengage and the initiative bonus gives you an upper hand for pulling off gloomstalker shenanigans, but harengon is good on pretty much every class.
Rogue: Dhampir - Spiderclimb lets you hide in hard to reach places, plus you get a speed bonus.
Sorcerer: Aasimar (Protector) - The legacy version allows you to add damage equal to your level while in your angellic state once per turn, which is really really good with blaster casters like sorcerer to rack up high damage with an AOE. It's also got healing which is always nice when you're more squishy, and resistances to round it out.
Warlock: Thri Kreen - You get secondary arms you can use to cast while still holding a weapon or shield or both in your main hands, plus telepathy which is always nice. And you get unarmored defense too, meaning you don't have to wear armor. This is also really good on wizard and sorcerer, casters in general.
Wizard: Hill Dwarf - Extra health to pad out your wizard HP plus a lot of survivability. You get really good proficiencies too, which wizard needs, I think you get shield prof?
— δ cyno • he/him • number one paladin fan δ —
making a smoothie for meta
——————| EXTENDED SIG |——————
Φ • happily married to my lovely redpelt, minmaxer, microbiology undergrad, and lover of anything colored red • Φ
Artificer- Warforged, especially if you’re playing an armorer
Barbarian - Goliath for that Strength boost
Bard - Tieflings, Changelings, etc. for the roleplay potential
Cleric - Aasimar for that healing boost
Druid - Eladrin because of the connection to nature
Fighter - Hobgoblin, who are known for their discipline, and are great at fighting
Monk - Githzerai. They are literally all monks already
Paladin - Aasimar OR anything else that can fly e.g. aarakocra
Ranger - any elf because of all the bow prof and also keen senses
Rogue - Shadar-kai, great stealth, also shadow step is an uncanny dodge in and of itself
Sorcerer - Tiefling of any type or Drow for the role play & charisma boost
Warlock - Can be LITERALLY anything as long as you know what you’re doing, but Aasimar are very funny warlocks
Wizard - High elf, because. Goblins work too.
I am keeping in mind MotM, 2014 rules, 2024 rules, and all official side books. All of this is just my opinion. Hope this is of use to anyone.
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Hm... the subclasses can change the choice quite a bit.
Artificer - Giff would be my choice for a ranged Battlesmith. Aasimar would be best for an Artillerist or Alchemist to stack as much damage on their one attack as they can. Dragonborn or Warforged would be best for a melee-Armourer or Battlesmith.
Barbarian - Shifter-Wildhunt is by far the best choice overall, being able to go Reckless with no penalty is borderline broken. For 2024 though, many more monsters have charm/fear effects so for non-Beserkers you want something to help you avoid getting frightened/charmed, so Gnome, Vedalken, or Kalashtar.
Bard - Changeling if you want to double-down on the social/deception aspects, otherwise Infernal Tiefling or a Githzerai to get access to a reaction-spell either for defence or for some retribution damage. Firbolg is also a solid choice for a support-focused Bard. Tortle is a good choice for a Swords Bard.
Cleric - Similar to Bard, the main weakness is lack of reaction spells so Infernal Tiefling of Githzerai are great for caster-focused clerics. Goliath is also solid choice if you want to be more of a melee-focused Cleric. Firbolg is the best option for a squishy support cleric, whereas Hobgoblin is excellent for a tanky support cleric.
Druid - Goblin all the way, the new druid has tons of distance spells that can be moved around and deal damage turn after turn, being able to then go duck and Hide as an BA is borderline broken.
Fighter - Bugbear is again at the top of the list for a dual-wielding Fighter, but Hexblood for that free Hex spell is your best option for an archer. Kobold would be my choice for a two-handed weapon melee Fighter, though Leonin or Orc are pretty good as well. For maximum damage for a two-hander then Shifter Longtooth is the way to go.
Monk - Bugbear for sure, nothing like comboing that 2d6 extra damage on 4 attacks at level 5. Both also do best with many short combats with SRs in between. Another good choice for Monk is Centaur if your DM allows other PCs to ride you since it lets you get double the benefits of Monk's awesome movement, and the flavour of trampling enemies with your ninja-hooves is very very fun. However, for Shadow Monk I'd go for Dhampir so you can keep your Darkness aura out of the way of your allies and there is something awesome about teleporting onto the ceiling and just hanging there. Though if you go for a Grapple build e.g. Elements monk then Goliath is the way to go for their Large size so you can grapple even Huge enemies.
Paladin - Infernal Tiefling, now that Smite is a BA, it's way better to use your Smite-slots as Hellish Rebukes. Fairy or Elf are excellent choices if you want to be a CHA-focused paladin. Hexblood is also a great option for low-medium campaigns when Smite eats your spell slots too quickly.
Ranger - Dwarf is a good pick now that the melee-ranger is so much better than the ranged-ranger, since rangers are quite lacking in the defense department. Githzerai is good for the same reason. For a ranged-ranger, you want something that can get out of trouble, so a Goblin or Eladrin would be my choices. Tabaxi is also a good option for ranged characters if your DM provides interesting terrain to climb on.
Rogue - Kobold or High Elf, being able to pick up Booming Blade with your species allows any Rogue to get the best of Arcane Trickster without having to choose that subclass. Kobold is probably the best for that Adv versus being Frightened since Frightened is one of the worst conditions for a Rogue. For any rogue with CHA as their secondary ability, Changeling is also fantastic for optimizing scouting & infiltration, put one of your Expertise into Deception and you can walk around as anyone at anytime and fool their own family that you are them. Alternatively, Kalashtar with their telepathy and Wis save Adv is also a really good choice for any Rogue planning to get themselves into trouble. For a ranged-focused Rogue, Aasimar or Goliath would be my choice
Sorcerer - Goblin for that BA:Disgengage or Hide is probably my best pick, especially since there is more emphasis of Sorcerers using attack roll spells. Firbolg is also good for a bit more utility without needing to use up known spells for it.
Warlock - Goblin for an Eldritch Blaster, for a Blade-lock Eladrin. For an ArchFey patron I'd go with Fairy for a few bonus utility spells.
Wizard - Goblin is always good for a squishy character, but Tortle better for a low to mid level campaign when spellslots are still precious. Aasimar for an Evoker or other blaster-focused build, Fairy for a more support character, or High Elf or Firbolg if you just need a few more spells prepared. Tabaxi would be my choice for a low-level campaign for two very good skill proficiencies and extra maneuverability.
Wow. I’m embarrassed to say i didn’t put much thought into how the different subclasses and other features like eldritch invocations could swing the “answer.” I appreciate your response. Thank you!
I guess the next step of this for me would be to look at what subclasses are the best and focus on which of these options fit the best.
I’ll save that for another post though.
With 2024 they made the species more versatile.
Anything can be anything.
But there are a few obvious choices.
Halfing rogue is a trope. What if the halfling is a barbarian instead?
Goliaths are brutes. But what if one was a wizard?
Dwarves are usually hardy and miner types. What if one was a ranger or a druid and fought with bows?
Tieflings are evil looking. What if one was a Life Cleric and healed everyone and was a pacifist?
What if a Dragonborn was a warlock with Mask of Many faces and went around in disguises everywhere to cover up his face?
What would happen if a Rock gnome became a monk and swore to never use machines? But the plot forces them to break their vow?
Sure you could always just play an elf archer. But what if the elf was instead a heavy weapon’s battle master?
Defying the tropes is fun.
But to answer the question in the subject line, Yes it appears the old races are dead.
Gygax really did not even like elves and dwarves that much. He prefered players playing a human. LOL.
Defying tropes can be fun, yes.
It’s a shame they are doing away with them. Such a rich history.
Thank you all for your suggestions as always. It’s certainly given me a lot to think about.