So, yesterday I ran a one-shot campaign with some friends with me as the DM. My friends played a cleric, a sorcerer, and a wizard (all at level 1). It was super unbalanced, and they whipped the floor with the enemies. How can I make balanced encounters for them in the future that they don't finish before the second turn?
It’s difficult to say without the details. First combat often only take 4-5 rounds, so finishing in 2 is a bit quick, bunt maybe not too quick. Second, if you are using CR to gague the fights, you should know that it’s an imperfect measure.
That said my first question would be how many fights are you having in a day? At level 1, they will have very limited resources, and the game is designed for multiple fights per day. So if they blow all of their spells in the first fight, the second one leaves them with nothing but cantrips.
My next question would be about tactics. Did you have melee enemies run past the cleric to get to the wizard and sorcerer? Or have archers shooting at them? Level 1 wizard and sorcerer are pretty fragile, 1-2 hits should drop them.
Third, and this is a stretch, are you all new to the game? If so, you might want to double check the rules. Could be you were doing something accidentally that unbalanced the encounters; giving them too many leveled spells, not giving disadvantage on ranged attack rolls in melee, allowing too many actions per turn or something like that. (I’m not trying to say you are doing it wrong, just that it’s a possibility.)
It’s difficult to say without the details. First combat often only take 4-5 rounds, so finishing in 2 is a bit quick, bunt maybe not too quick. Second, if you are using CR to gague the fights, you should know that it’s an imperfect measure.
That said my first question would be how many fights are you having in a day? At level 1, they will have very limited resources, and the game is designed for multiple fights per day. So if they blow all of their spells in the first fight, the second one leaves them with nothing but cantrips.
My next question would be about tactics. Did you have melee enemies run past the cleric to get to the wizard and sorcerer? Or have archers shooting at them? Level 1 wizard and sorcerer are pretty fragile, 1-2 hits should drop them.
Third, and this is a stretch, are you all new to the game? If so, you might want to double check the rules. Could be you were doing something accidentally that unbalanced the encounters; giving them too many leveled spells, not giving disadvantage on ranged attack rolls in melee, allowing too many actions per turn or something like that. (I’m not trying to say you are doing it wrong, just that it’s a possibility.)
We had two fights in the game, one I miscalculated so they won it horribly fast and the second one I had made sure was harder, I've never DMed before and my first campaign with a different group started this month so I'm very new. Two of my players had never played before and the third hadn't played in a year or two. I don't really have any tactics for encounters, I used dndbeyond's encounter builder and I was very confused.
The cleric was the only one using any spells, everyone else was kind of just using daggers and weapons. Those who did use weapons though kept adding all kinds of tricks they did while throwing daggers and it really confused me so maybe that was the problem?
They were out there doing flips and throwing daggers while trying to save a hostage who was in the room. It was awful and I don't know how they didn't kill her, honestly. Maybe I should be harder on them for doing dumb stuff and almost killing the queen?
At level 1 they only get to make a single attack each, with a dagger that is 1d4 plus their stat modifier which is likely to be low as they are all casters, likewise only the cleric would be in armour or have a shield so the the wizard and sorcerer should have had a low AC and would have been easy pickings. Chances are that there was a lot of things going on that shouldn't have because you weren't following the rules correctly.
I plan to review the rules again for any future sessions, but our sorcerer got some good rolls for their strength stats when they were made so they were just unstoppable I guess? I tried to follow along with whatever the stat sheets said to do.
People were definitely accidentally rolling the wrong dice at times, we were talking over discord and they were doing their own rolls. No one was cheating, the sorcerer was just new and kept getting confused. The cleric was also new and rolled 8d10s instead of 4d8s (I have no idea) so I don't doubt some people were probably using the wrong dice despite what I told them. I'm thinking accidents like that are what happened, I'll try and get a discord bot to roll for everyone next time.
I'd agree with some others that it doesn't look like a very unbalanced party. I think the combat sequence somehow didn't quite follow proper path and there is like the biggest source of issue. The encounter builder mentioned, I use as well, but only as a rough gauge of what I want to throw at them. I find anything under Hard is cakewalk and burns zero resources, so I use Hard and Deadly encounters. If you had a pair of casters fighting melee and neither of them hit the ground, you certainly had something being done incorrectly in the combat encounters.
Like everyone said, review your rules and order of operations carefully and make sure you stick to that. If they're getting goofy and as you said, "doing backflips" and so forth, then DM it. Acrobatics check for the backflip. I would rank a backflip at around a 15DC, as it isn't easy to do by any means. Failure means they jump up, partly rotate and land on their face or back (your call) but are now prone. The dagger you tried to throw ends up skipping along the ground. It's realistic, it uses the rules appropriately and SHOULD put a stop to distractions in a new DM trying to keep everything sorted.
Also keep a close eye on rolls. Yes, people will have sessions that the dice gods LOVE them. If every sessions is like that, there is cheating going on. A lot of really good folks will cheat rolls, partly from not understanding how the game really works and not realizing the missing and such is as much part of the adventure as cutting Goblins in half with a greataxe.
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Talk to your Players.Talk to your DM. If more people used this advice, there would be 24.74% fewer threads on Tactics, Rules and DM discussions.
I would suggest setting things up on Roll20, you can create a game on there for free. Then if you use Chrome as your browser, you can link DnD Beyond with it using the Beyond20 plug in. That way you can see all character sheets and all dice rolling is online so everyone can see and learn.
I would suggest setting things up on Roll20, you can create a game on there for free. Then if you use Chrome as your browser, you can link DnD Beyond with it using the Beyond20 plug in. That way you can see all character sheets and all dice rolling is online so everyone can see and learn.
Beyond20 will also export rolls to Discord channels too, if that’s your preference. Avrae can be used for rolls on discord as well, and also track combat.
The cleric has Guiding Bolt which deals 4d6 damage.
Haha, makes more sense - and they rolled 8d10 by mistake???! Even a critical hit is only 8d6. Hahaha. It really sounds like everyone is playing pretty loose with the rules here haha.
I've never DMed before and my first campaign with a different group started this month so I'm very new.
Welcome to this side of the DM Screen! We have cookies. At least, we better have. If those players know what's good for them they will keep the DM well bribed supplied…
Combat at low levels is very swingy. Combats either seem to be cakewalks or disasters. Don't stress over it. By the time the characters reach 3rd level all of you will have got a feel for the game.
One thing you should always be doing, however, is varying the opponents. Don't have six goblins with swords; have two goblins with swords, two goblins with bows hiding behind cover and two wolves skulking around harassing the back line (and dragging away anyone who goes down).
Welcome to this side of the DM Screen! We have cookies. At least, we better have. If those players know what's good for them they will keep the DM well bribed supplied…
Combat at low levels is very swingy. Combats either seem to be cakewalks or disasters. Don't stress over it. By the time the characters reach 3rd level all of you will have got a feel for the game.
One thing you should always be doing, however, is varying the opponents. Don't have six goblins with swords; have two goblins with swords, two goblins with bows hiding behind cover and two wolves skulking around harassing the back line (and dragging away anyone who goes down).
The thing I should also have said in my first post was: if everyone had fun, you were doing it right; so don’t beat yourself up. Everyone has given some good advice, but as you (OP) noted, probably it would be good to review the rules. They may actually make more sense to you now that you’ve run a session, so that could really help. Then when time comes to play, do your best to remember them. If you forget or aren’t sure, don’t spend more than a minute or so trying to look it up. Just explain you’re not sure, make a ruling so everyone can move on and keep playing, and worry about figuring out if you were right in between sessions.
Back in the 80's there was an article in Dragon Magazine titled "Tucker's Kobolds". It showed how smart kobolds in a dungeon could take on 2nd or even 3rd tier characters. If you can find that article, it has lots of good ideas for teaching uppity players a lesson.
oops. Just noticed this was an old thread.
oops again. I was looking at join dates. Thread is actually recent. I'll figure it out eventually.
So, yesterday I ran a one-shot campaign with some friends with me as the DM. My friends played a cleric, a sorcerer, and a wizard (all at level 1). It was super unbalanced, and they whipped the floor with the enemies. How can I make balanced encounters for them in the future that they don't finish before the second turn?
Edit: No longer need help, thank you everyone.
It’s difficult to say without the details. First combat often only take 4-5 rounds, so finishing in 2 is a bit quick, bunt maybe not too quick. Second, if you are using CR to gague the fights, you should know that it’s an imperfect measure.
That said my first question would be how many fights are you having in a day? At level 1, they will have very limited resources, and the game is designed for multiple fights per day. So if they blow all of their spells in the first fight, the second one leaves them with nothing but cantrips.
My next question would be about tactics. Did you have melee enemies run past the cleric to get to the wizard and sorcerer? Or have archers shooting at them? Level 1 wizard and sorcerer are pretty fragile, 1-2 hits should drop them.
Third, and this is a stretch, are you all new to the game? If so, you might want to double check the rules. Could be you were doing something accidentally that unbalanced the encounters; giving them too many leveled spells, not giving disadvantage on ranged attack rolls in melee, allowing too many actions per turn or something like that. (I’m not trying to say you are doing it wrong, just that it’s a possibility.)
This guy DMs
We had two fights in the game, one I miscalculated so they won it horribly fast and the second one I had made sure was harder, I've never DMed before and my first campaign with a different group started this month so I'm very new. Two of my players had never played before and the third hadn't played in a year or two. I don't really have any tactics for encounters, I used dndbeyond's encounter builder and I was very confused.
The cleric was the only one using any spells, everyone else was kind of just using daggers and weapons. Those who did use weapons though kept adding all kinds of tricks they did while throwing daggers and it really confused me so maybe that was the problem?
They were out there doing flips and throwing daggers while trying to save a hostage who was in the room. It was awful and I don't know how they didn't kill her, honestly. Maybe I should be harder on them for doing dumb stuff and almost killing the queen?
At level 1 they only get to make a single attack each, with a dagger that is 1d4 plus their stat modifier which is likely to be low as they are all casters, likewise only the cleric would be in armour or have a shield so the the wizard and sorcerer should have had a low AC and would have been easy pickings. Chances are that there was a lot of things going on that shouldn't have because you weren't following the rules correctly.
I plan to review the rules again for any future sessions, but our sorcerer got some good rolls for their strength stats when they were made so they were just unstoppable I guess? I tried to follow along with whatever the stat sheets said to do.
People were definitely accidentally rolling the wrong dice at times, we were talking over discord and they were doing their own rolls. No one was cheating, the sorcerer was just new and kept getting confused. The cleric was also new and rolled 8d10s instead of 4d8s (I have no idea) so I don't doubt some people were probably using the wrong dice despite what I told them. I'm thinking accidents like that are what happened, I'll try and get a discord bot to roll for everyone next time.
I'd agree with some others that it doesn't look like a very unbalanced party. I think the combat sequence somehow didn't quite follow proper path and there is like the biggest source of issue. The encounter builder mentioned, I use as well, but only as a rough gauge of what I want to throw at them. I find anything under Hard is cakewalk and burns zero resources, so I use Hard and Deadly encounters. If you had a pair of casters fighting melee and neither of them hit the ground, you certainly had something being done incorrectly in the combat encounters.
Like everyone said, review your rules and order of operations carefully and make sure you stick to that. If they're getting goofy and as you said, "doing backflips" and so forth, then DM it. Acrobatics check for the backflip. I would rank a backflip at around a 15DC, as it isn't easy to do by any means. Failure means they jump up, partly rotate and land on their face or back (your call) but are now prone. The dagger you tried to throw ends up skipping along the ground. It's realistic, it uses the rules appropriately and SHOULD put a stop to distractions in a new DM trying to keep everything sorted.
Also keep a close eye on rolls. Yes, people will have sessions that the dice gods LOVE them. If every sessions is like that, there is cheating going on. A lot of really good folks will cheat rolls, partly from not understanding how the game really works and not realizing the missing and such is as much part of the adventure as cutting Goblins in half with a greataxe.
Talk to your Players. Talk to your DM. If more people used this advice, there would be 24.74% fewer threads on Tactics, Rules and DM discussions.
Thank you, that's super helpful advice!
I would suggest setting things up on Roll20, you can create a game on there for free. Then if you use Chrome as your browser, you can link DnD Beyond with it using the Beyond20 plug in. That way you can see all character sheets and all dice rolling is online so everyone can see and learn.
Beyond20 will also export rolls to Discord channels too, if that’s your preference. Avrae can be used for rolls on discord as well, and also track combat.
VTT or not.
Not sure how level 1s are rolling 4d8??!
I meant to say 4d6s sorry.
The cleric has Guiding Bolt which deals 4d6 damage.
Haha, makes more sense - and they rolled 8d10 by mistake???! Even a critical hit is only 8d6. Hahaha. It really sounds like everyone is playing pretty loose with the rules here haha.
Yeah, I'm still getting used to them lol. I didn't count her accident though and made her redo it.
Welcome to this side of the DM Screen! We have cookies. At least, we better have. If those players know what's good for them they will keep the DM well
bribedsupplied…Combat at low levels is very swingy. Combats either seem to be cakewalks or disasters. Don't stress over it. By the time the characters reach 3rd level all of you will have got a feel for the game.
One thing you should always be doing, however, is varying the opponents. Don't have six goblins with swords; have two goblins with swords, two goblins with bows hiding behind cover and two wolves skulking around harassing the back line (and dragging away anyone who goes down).
Have fun!
Thank you for the advice!!
Edit: And the cookies :3 >.>
The thing I should also have said in my first post was: if everyone had fun, you were doing it right; so don’t beat yourself up.
Everyone has given some good advice, but as you (OP) noted, probably it would be good to review the rules. They may actually make more sense to you now that you’ve run a session, so that could really help.
Then when time comes to play, do your best to remember them. If you forget or aren’t sure, don’t spend more than a minute or so trying to look it up. Just explain you’re not sure, make a ruling so everyone can move on and keep playing, and worry about figuring out if you were right in between sessions.
Back in the 80's there was an article in Dragon Magazine titled "Tucker's Kobolds". It showed how smart kobolds in a dungeon could take on 2nd or even 3rd tier characters. If you can find that article, it has lots of good ideas for teaching uppity players a lesson.
oops. Just noticed this was an old thread.
oops again. I was looking at join dates. Thread is actually recent. I'll figure it out eventually.