I can't seem to find a clear cut answer, but when you're replicating a magic item as one of your infusions, what exactly are you supposed to infuse?
For something like a bag of holding, can you infuse any kind of bag or compartment to act as a Bag of Holding? Or does it have to be a specific type of bag? Could you make your backpack a Bag of Holding? Or even just 1 pocket in your backpack? Take it even a step further, your artificer has a prosthetic arm, which has a forearm length compartment in it, can THAT be a Bag of holding?
I'm looking for RAW or RAI level of interpretation, there are obviously lots of different variations of enforcement based on the DM, but in a "typical" game (even though there's no such thing), what would be considered okay to infuse into a Bag of Holding?
Interested in people's thoughts and how people have been using the Replicate Magic Item infusion
Ahh okay, you kinda answered a question for me, so the bag would have to be about the same size to be considered? I'm seeing that a bag of holding in supposed to be 2 feet wide by 4 feet long. So to create a bag of holding as an infused item, I'd need a similar sized bag?
Doesn't seem very practical if that's the case, cause who the hell just carries around a big ass burlap sack like that haha, but that's too bad if that's the case.
Was really hoping I could make a smaller bag that has the capability to hold things like the Bag of Holding.
edit: and what exactly defines a "bag"? In theory a backpack could just become a bag of holding if it were infused then correct? That actually seems generally the same size
You can't replicate a BoH without having a bag. Any bag similar in size to a BoH would work.
This doesn't really answer my question fully. If I tie a pair of pants at the legs, can I use that as a bag of holding if I infuse it? It's technically a bag, since it can hold things, can be tied to close, and made of flexible materials (dictionary definition of a "bag"). And it's honestly pretty similar in size still.
and how similar is considered similar? are we considering a 1 foot by 2 foot bag to be "similar" in size to 2 feet by 4 feet? what's the cut off?
Or is this one of those things that's so vaguely worded that it's essentially fully up to the discretion of the DM?
You would need a bag of similar dimensions to the outside of a BoH, so about the size of a messenger bag or a clutch bag, a handbag. A sack could work (and it is listed in equipment so i imagine a whole lot of people would use them) You mention a backpack but that would be more along the lines of a Handy Haversack and not a Bag of Holding. BoHs are usually kept on the character during combat, something that wouldn't get in the way but still offers easy access to things stored inside if needed (potions and such) a backpack would be a whole thing if trying to take it off, open it up and route around while people are fighting.
What is with your obsession with trying to turn weird objects in to a bag instead of just buying something that is vaguely bag-ish? You could try to turn a pair of pants into a bag if you have tailoring tools and do it properly otherwise the pants are just pants that you're using incorrectly. You can use a skillet to bang a nail into some wood but that doesn't make it a hammer.
Regarding RAW, the infusions tell you what item they require. "Suit of armour or shield", "Simple or martial weapon", "rod, staff, or wand", etc. The exception to this is, as you've noticed, the Replicate Magic Item option. These don't tell you what item you need, therefore RAW doesn't apply to these. It's generally accepted as RAI that you would need the base item. So a bag for bag of holding, goggles for goggles of night, etc.
However, I believe some creativity should be allowed for infusions. For example, my artificer is currently using their top hat as a bag of holding. One thing to keep in mind is that, RAW, the opening of a bag of holding can open to 2 feet. In my case, I just say the brim of my hat can stretch open to 2 feet. For the sewed pants you suggested, this could work. For the prosthetic limb compartment, this would be more difficult. You could say that you have a bag of holding folded into/attached to the interior of your arm and fold it out when you want to use it, but that may be sort of clunky. You could even possibly infuse the pockets on a jacket or skirt as a bag of holding.
As far as "typical" games go, or maybe more RAW strict games, I think you'd probably need to stick to things vaguely bag-like. So things like a backpack, bag, or purse. However, the artificer is already intended to be creative with their spells so limiting the infusions too much seems very counterintuitive.
What is with your obsession with trying to turn weird objects in to a bag instead of just buying something that is vaguely bag-ish? You could try to turn a pair of pants into a bag if you have tailoring tools and do it properly otherwise the pants are just pants that you're using incorrectly. You can use a skillet to bang a nail into some wood but that doesn't make it a hammer.
Finding ways to use things for purposes they weren't meant for originally is half the fun of engineering. Or at least half of my fun with engineering. So I can absolutely understand the appeal for it in application with the Artificer.
And there are possible, obscure scenarios where it could be practical. Such an artificer waking up in a prison cell having no access to any tools or materials outside of their own clothes. Bereft of theives' tools or any spellcasting foci this would make escaping prison difficult. So they then take off their pants, remove their shoelaces to convert their pants into a makeshift bag for the purpose of infusing it into a bag of holding. Then the artificer now has a spellcasting focus with them in their prison cell that they didn't have previously. They also have a means of confusing a guard on patrol by escaping momentarily into their own pants to spoof their escape, etc. It's a means of increasing the options you have available via outside of the box thinking.
You can't replicate a BoH without having a bag. Any bag similar in size to a BoH would work.
This doesn't really answer my question fully. If I tie a pair of pants at the legs, can I use that as a bag of holding if I infuse it? It's technically a bag, since it can hold things, can be tied to close, and made of flexible materials (dictionary definition of a "bag"). And it's honestly pretty similar in size still.
and how similar is considered similar? are we considering a 1 foot by 2 foot bag to be "similar" in size to 2 feet by 4 feet? what's the cut off?
Or is this one of those things that's so vaguely worded that it's essentially fully up to the discretion of the DM?
Ultimately this is one of those things that's so vaguely worded that it's up to the discretion of the DM.
Regarding RAW, the infusions tell you what item they require. "Suit of armour or shield", "Simple or martial weapon", "rod, staff, or wand", etc. The exception to this is, as you've noticed, the Replicate Magic Item option. These don't tell you what item you need, therefore RAW doesn't apply to these. It's generally accepted as RAI that you would need the base item. So a bag for bag of holding, goggles for goggles of night, etc.
From the Replicate Magic Items description
In the tables, an item’s entry tells you whether the item requires attunement. See the item’s description in the Dungeon Master’s Guide for more information about it, including the type of object required for its making.
It's pretty clear that RAW indicates it must be a bag. Just as Rope of Climbing must be a rope. Despite the base item not being listed in the infusion when picked it clearly states that you must get the required object from the description if the item you're trying to replicate.
I am not against people being creative, just against people looking at a pair of pants and saying it is a bag or looking at a hidden compartment in a prosthetic leg and calling it a bag. one is simply a pair of pants and the other it a hidden compartment in a wooden leg.
The way you get around this creatively is to work with your DM and flavour those infusions as "Boundless Bottoms" or "Prosthetic Purse"
It's pretty clear that RAW indicates it must be a bag. Just as Rope of Climbing must be a rope. Despite the base item not being listed in the infusion when picked it clearly states that you must get the required object from the description if the item you're trying to replicate.
I am not against people being creative, just against people looking at a pair of pants and saying it is a bag or looking at a hidden compartment in a prosthetic leg and calling it a bag. one is simply a pair of pants and the other it a hidden compartment in a wooden leg.
The way you get around this creatively is to work with your DM and flavour those infusions as "Boundless Bottoms" or "Prosthetic Purse"
The definition of a bag is "a container made of flexible material with an opening at the top, used for carrying things". Sealing the legs of a pair of pants turns it into a bag. A hidden compartment of a prosthetic leg can have a bag attached to it. If the prosthetic itself is made of flexible material then a hollow prosthetic limb is a bag by definition. By definition, a single pocket in a pair of pants is also a bag. So why can't these things be infused as a bag of holding?
It's pretty clear that RAW indicates it must be a bag. Just as Rope of Climbing must be a rope. Despite the base item not being listed in the infusion when picked it clearly states that you must get the required object from the description if the item you're trying to replicate.
I am not against people being creative, just against people looking at a pair of pants and saying it is a bag or looking at a hidden compartment in a prosthetic leg and calling it a bag. one is simply a pair of pants and the other it a hidden compartment in a wooden leg.
The way you get around this creatively is to work with your DM and flavour those infusions as "Boundless Bottoms" or "Prosthetic Purse"
The definition of a bag is "a container made of flexible material with an opening at the top, used for carrying things". Sealing the legs of a pair of pants turns it into a bag. A hidden compartment of a prosthetic leg can have a bag attached to it. If the prosthetic itself is made of flexible material then a hollow prosthetic limb is a bag by definition. By definition, a single pocket in a pair of pants is also a bag. So why can't these things be infused as a bag of holding?
You can try to use the dictionary definition rather than common sense but then you have to account for the definition of container and the definition of pants. Because pants aren't a container. I also previously stated that you could use the fabric from pants to create a bag, but if you do that then they're no longer pants, it's just a bag.
You can try to use the dictionary definition rather than common sense but then you have to account for the definition of container and the definition of pants. Because pants aren't a container. I also previously stated that you could use the fabric from pants to create a bag, but if you do that then they're no longer pants, it's just a bag.
I don't think anyone is trying to argue about using a pair of pants as both clothing and a bag of holding simultaneously.
For a bag of holding, I allow any sack or pouch to be turned into a BoH. if someone were to later instal that BoH into a hollowed out prosthesis…. Why not? As long as it doesn’t interfere with the mechanism that articulates the limb.
It's pretty clear that RAW indicates it must be a bag. Just as Rope of Climbing must be a rope. Despite the base item not being listed in the infusion when picked it clearly states that you must get the required object from the description if the item you're trying to replicate.
I am not against people being creative, just against people looking at a pair of pants and saying it is a bag or looking at a hidden compartment in a prosthetic leg and calling it a bag. one is simply a pair of pants and the other it a hidden compartment in a wooden leg.
The way you get around this creatively is to work with your DM and flavour those infusions as "Boundless Bottoms" or "Prosthetic Purse"
The definition of a bag is "a container made of flexible material with an opening at the top, used for carrying things". Sealing the legs of a pair of pants turns it into a bag. A hidden compartment of a prosthetic leg can have a bag attached to it. If the prosthetic itself is made of flexible material then a hollow prosthetic limb is a bag by definition. By definition, a single pocket in a pair of pants is also a bag. So why can't these things be infused as a bag of holding?
You can try to use the dictionary definition rather than common sense but then you have to account for the definition of container and the definition of pants. Because pants aren't a container. I also previously stated that you could use the fabric from pants to create a bag, but if you do that then they're no longer pants, it's just a bag.
Using definitions is literally the point of RaW, which is what you are arguing for. I'm debating on your terms. Definitions and common sense are also not opposites, nor are they mutually exclusive.
As I said, if you seal the bottom of the pants then they become a bag. Have you never sewed or tied the bottom of pants to fill with leaves for Halloween? That is certainly a container.
I don't think there is RAW on this. I doubt there's a SA ruling or other source that tells us RAI on this.
I'd be reluctant to allow trousers to be turned into a Bag of Holding as a general rule since that is a very slippery slope and could have unintended and unforeseen consequences. However, the ingenuity of it would interest me and I'd most likely issue a special ruling - I'd allow it in that instance but without any concession that I'd necessarily allow in future instances.
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I can't seem to find a clear cut answer, but when you're replicating a magic item as one of your infusions, what exactly are you supposed to infuse?
For something like a bag of holding, can you infuse any kind of bag or compartment to act as a Bag of Holding? Or does it have to be a specific type of bag? Could you make your backpack a Bag of Holding? Or even just 1 pocket in your backpack? Take it even a step further, your artificer has a prosthetic arm, which has a forearm length compartment in it, can THAT be a Bag of holding?
I'm looking for RAW or RAI level of interpretation, there are obviously lots of different variations of enforcement based on the DM, but in a "typical" game (even though there's no such thing), what would be considered okay to infuse into a Bag of Holding?
Interested in people's thoughts and how people have been using the Replicate Magic Item infusion
Any item similar to the base description of the infusion.
You can't replicate a BoH without having a bag. Any bag similar in size to a BoH would work.
Ahh okay, you kinda answered a question for me, so the bag would have to be about the same size to be considered? I'm seeing that a bag of holding in supposed to be 2 feet wide by 4 feet long. So to create a bag of holding as an infused item, I'd need a similar sized bag?
Doesn't seem very practical if that's the case, cause who the hell just carries around a big ass burlap sack like that haha, but that's too bad if that's the case.
Was really hoping I could make a smaller bag that has the capability to hold things like the Bag of Holding.
edit: and what exactly defines a "bag"? In theory a backpack could just become a bag of holding if it were infused then correct? That actually seems generally the same size
Thinking more now
This doesn't really answer my question fully. If I tie a pair of pants at the legs, can I use that as a bag of holding if I infuse it? It's technically a bag, since it can hold things, can be tied to close, and made of flexible materials (dictionary definition of a "bag"). And it's honestly pretty similar in size still.
and how similar is considered similar? are we considering a 1 foot by 2 foot bag to be "similar" in size to 2 feet by 4 feet? what's the cut off?
Or is this one of those things that's so vaguely worded that it's essentially fully up to the discretion of the DM?
You would need a bag of similar dimensions to the outside of a BoH, so about the size of a messenger bag or a clutch bag, a handbag. A sack could work (and it is listed in equipment so i imagine a whole lot of people would use them) You mention a backpack but that would be more along the lines of a Handy Haversack and not a Bag of Holding. BoHs are usually kept on the character during combat, something that wouldn't get in the way but still offers easy access to things stored inside if needed (potions and such) a backpack would be a whole thing if trying to take it off, open it up and route around while people are fighting.
What is with your obsession with trying to turn weird objects in to a bag instead of just buying something that is vaguely bag-ish? You could try to turn a pair of pants into a bag if you have tailoring tools and do it properly otherwise the pants are just pants that you're using incorrectly. You can use a skillet to bang a nail into some wood but that doesn't make it a hammer.
Regarding RAW, the infusions tell you what item they require. "Suit of armour or shield", "Simple or martial weapon", "rod, staff, or wand", etc. The exception to this is, as you've noticed, the Replicate Magic Item option. These don't tell you what item you need, therefore RAW doesn't apply to these. It's generally accepted as RAI that you would need the base item. So a bag for bag of holding, goggles for goggles of night, etc.
However, I believe some creativity should be allowed for infusions. For example, my artificer is currently using their top hat as a bag of holding. One thing to keep in mind is that, RAW, the opening of a bag of holding can open to 2 feet. In my case, I just say the brim of my hat can stretch open to 2 feet. For the sewed pants you suggested, this could work. For the prosthetic limb compartment, this would be more difficult. You could say that you have a bag of holding folded into/attached to the interior of your arm and fold it out when you want to use it, but that may be sort of clunky. You could even possibly infuse the pockets on a jacket or skirt as a bag of holding.
As far as "typical" games go, or maybe more RAW strict games, I think you'd probably need to stick to things vaguely bag-like. So things like a backpack, bag, or purse. However, the artificer is already intended to be creative with their spells so limiting the infusions too much seems very counterintuitive.
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Finding ways to use things for purposes they weren't meant for originally is half the fun of engineering. Or at least half of my fun with engineering. So I can absolutely understand the appeal for it in application with the Artificer.
And there are possible, obscure scenarios where it could be practical. Such an artificer waking up in a prison cell having no access to any tools or materials outside of their own clothes. Bereft of theives' tools or any spellcasting foci this would make escaping prison difficult. So they then take off their pants, remove their shoelaces to convert their pants into a makeshift bag for the purpose of infusing it into a bag of holding. Then the artificer now has a spellcasting focus with them in their prison cell that they didn't have previously. They also have a means of confusing a guard on patrol by escaping momentarily into their own pants to spoof their escape, etc. It's a means of increasing the options you have available via outside of the box thinking.
Ultimately this is one of those things that's so vaguely worded that it's up to the discretion of the DM.
From the Replicate Magic Items description
It's pretty clear that RAW indicates it must be a bag. Just as Rope of Climbing must be a rope. Despite the base item not being listed in the infusion when picked it clearly states that you must get the required object from the description if the item you're trying to replicate.
I am not against people being creative, just against people looking at a pair of pants and saying it is a bag or looking at a hidden compartment in a prosthetic leg and calling it a bag. one is simply a pair of pants and the other it a hidden compartment in a wooden leg.
The way you get around this creatively is to work with your DM and flavour those infusions as "Boundless Bottoms" or "Prosthetic Purse"
The definition of a bag is "a container made of flexible material with an opening at the top, used for carrying things". Sealing the legs of a pair of pants turns it into a bag. A hidden compartment of a prosthetic leg can have a bag attached to it. If the prosthetic itself is made of flexible material then a hollow prosthetic limb is a bag by definition. By definition, a single pocket in a pair of pants is also a bag.
So why can't these things be infused as a bag of holding?
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You can try to use the dictionary definition rather than common sense but then you have to account for the definition of container and the definition of pants. Because pants aren't a container. I also previously stated that you could use the fabric from pants to create a bag, but if you do that then they're no longer pants, it's just a bag.
I don't think anyone is trying to argue about using a pair of pants as both clothing and a bag of holding simultaneously.
For a bag of holding, I allow any sack or pouch to be turned into a BoH. if someone were to later instal that BoH into a hollowed out prosthesis…. Why not? As long as it doesn’t interfere with the mechanism that articulates the limb.
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Using definitions is literally the point of RaW, which is what you are arguing for. I'm debating on your terms.
Definitions and common sense are also not opposites, nor are they mutually exclusive.
As I said, if you seal the bottom of the pants then they become a bag. Have you never sewed or tied the bottom of pants to fill with leaves for Halloween? That is certainly a container.
How to add tooltips on dndbeyond
I don't think there is RAW on this. I doubt there's a SA ruling or other source that tells us RAI on this.
I'd be reluctant to allow trousers to be turned into a Bag of Holding as a general rule since that is a very slippery slope and could have unintended and unforeseen consequences. However, the ingenuity of it would interest me and I'd most likely issue a special ruling - I'd allow it in that instance but without any concession that I'd necessarily allow in future instances.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.