Rage damage updates at 9th level, not 5th level. The number of rages you get is 3 at 5th level, but damage is still +2.
True enough. That's what I get for trying to do this middle of the night. It doesn't explain why I misread it earlier though ;)
Speaking of 9th level, Brutal Criticals do favor larger damage die. The d10 for a glaive, followed by the d8 for the dual wielder, followed by the d6 for hoplite and greatsword (while 2d6 for a normal crit, only 1d6 is added for brutal critical), with the PAM d4 bringing up the rear. Using their primary weapons, the dual wielder gets full advantage of their brutal criticals while the glaive might crit on the d4 and the hoplite is always at a disadvantage. 9th level is often late in the game for most campaigns and banking on crits isn't a great way to account for damage (or else champions would be better), but does bring a little more benefit to the larger die builds. Again, it's mostly a matter of taste.
Eh, true, but I'm of the opinion none of them are worth a feat except archery style for the plink plink types. Considering I already like the fighter dip more than full barb, I'm not put out by going that way on the build.
Generally, in the case of a barbarian I agree. There are cases where the feat might be superior, but in general I'd rather have fighter. That said, many DMs don't allow multi-classing, and in a game to 20 getting the capstone might be a player goal which precludes a player taking the MC option. I view the feats as better picks in general for MC builds which do not include fighter. I generally speaking loathe 3 class MC's so considering adding that third class to get a fighting style is not something I will regularly consider.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Rage damage updates at 9th level, not 5th level. The number of rages you get is 3 at 5th level, but damage is still +2.
True enough. That's what I get for trying to do this middle of the night. It doesn't explain why I misread it earlier though ;)
Speaking of 9th level, Brutal Criticals do favor larger damage die. The d10 for a glaive, followed by the d8 for the dual wielder, followed by the d6 for hoplite and greatsword (while 2d6 for a normal crit, only 1d6 is added for brutal critical), with the PAM d4 bringing up the rear. Using their primary weapons, the dual wielder gets full advantage of their brutal criticals while the glaive might crit on the d4 and the hoplite is always at a disadvantage. 9th level is often late in the game for most campaigns and banking on crits isn't a great way to account for damage (or else champions would be better), but does bring a little more benefit to the larger die builds. Again, it's mostly a matter of taste.
hoplite looks a lot better with a fighting style for duelling. I'm not sure if you factored that possibility in. Hoplites get +2 to both the primary and secondary hits and stacking static modifiers is a great way to boost the consistency of damage.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Rage damage updates at 9th level, not 5th level. The number of rages you get is 3 at 5th level, but damage is still +2.
True enough. That's what I get for trying to do this middle of the night. It doesn't explain why I misread it earlier though ;)
Speaking of 9th level, Brutal Criticals do favor larger damage die. The d10 for a glaive, followed by the d8 for the dual wielder, followed by the d6 for hoplite and greatsword (while 2d6 for a normal crit, only 1d6 is added for brutal critical), with the PAM d4 bringing up the rear. Using their primary weapons, the dual wielder gets full advantage of their brutal criticals while the glaive might crit on the d4 and the hoplite is always at a disadvantage. 9th level is often late in the game for most campaigns and banking on crits isn't a great way to account for damage (or else champions would be better), but does bring a little more benefit to the larger die builds. Again, it's mostly a matter of taste.
hoplite looks a lot better with a fighting style for duelling. I'm not sure if you factored that possibility in. Hoplites get +2 to both the primary and secondary hits and stacking static modifiers is a great way to boost the consistency of damage.
Didn't for the same reason I didn't factor in two weapon fighting style. The comparison was made between everything without fighting styles. +2 on three attacks will be better than even a +5 on dual wielding until barb 20 but doesn't consider the extras opportunity attacks that hoplite PAM can bring.
Eh, true, but I'm of the opinion none of them are worth a feat except archery style for the plink plink types. Considering I already like the fighter dip more than full barb, I'm not put out by going that way on the build.
Generally, in the case of a barbarian I agree. There are cases where the feat might be superior, but in general I'd rather have fighter. That said, many DMs don't allow multi-classing, and in a game to 20 getting the capstone might be a player goal which precludes a player taking the MC option. I view the feats as better picks in general for MC builds which do not include fighter. I generally speaking loathe 3 class MC's so considering adding that third class to get a fighting style is not something I will regularly consider.
Ah see I never think about games where you can't multiclass because I would never play in one of them. Those DMs can do their thing, but I'm not a fan of that dynamic or energy.
But frankly, even on a single class barbarian I don't think fighting initiate is worth it. At least not more than maximizing strength and getting resilient (wisdom). I don't plan characters past level 12. Whatever could happen after that is a moot point to me. I haven't played to the late levels since 3.5 and I don't expect to any time soon.
After calculating the numbers I will revise my earlier statement. I no longer think duel wielding on a barbarian is "bad." It's just the least effective of options, but not by such a large degree that it should be avoided.
After calculating the numbers I will revise my earlier statement. I no longer think duel wielding on a barbarian is "bad." It's just the least effective of options, but not by such a large degree that it should be avoided.
It does suffer more on the turn that you rage if you have the fighting style, but less otherwise. It certainly depends on which subclass you go with as some have bonus action options as well.
Having two options isn't bad, as it gives you options. Having the storm herald desert aura would give 2 damage to everyone in the aura except you until it bumped at 5th to 3 damage, up to 6 damage at 20th. Having dual wielding would give you the option to use the weapon attack against a single target or the Aura against multiple targets. Going with berserker, you could use the dual wield bonus action normally and get the frenzy one when you need the full damage.
It's generally preferred to not have lots of options, especially in the instances given, because they don't provide a large enough difference for the opportunity cost. Just going with a heavy weapon in both cases and using the bonus option would be better, except perhaps in the case of the berserker, which would probably want PAM for the more consistent bonus action to get upgraded to frenzy. Both cases would likely also have GWM giving more consistency to the heavier hitting bonus action, should that be the optimal choice with storm herald.
Yes, dual wielding is typically inferior, especially if you have options for a bonus action to replace it, but it's competitive enough to usually not be a terrible idea. It also suffers less from overkill, meaning more of it's damage is meaningful, though just missing a kill and using another attack or forcing a teammate to finish the creature can also lead to overkill and a loss of efficiency. So you pick your poison.
As long as you know the pros and cons of each build, you can have fun with any of them provided that you can live with the cons. Play to your builder's strengths and you'll be good. I do think that all barbarians should either sword and board or dual wield levels 1 and 2, just because it gives you better consistency or more survivability early on. After third, you've usually got enough HP to take hits and you've usually got something to incentivize using the larger weapons if that's the path that you choose. Encounters become more consistent as everyone had options to be able to overcome a string of bad rolls. Switching between weapons is also not a bad idea as it gives you an idea of what each is good at to inform you of options later on.
After calculating the numbers I will revise my earlier statement. I no longer think duel wielding on a barbarian is "bad." It's just the least effective of options, but not by such a large degree that it should be avoided.
It does suffer more on the turn that you rage if you have the fighting style, but less otherwise. It certainly depends on which subclass you go with as some have bonus action options as well.
Having two options isn't bad, as it gives you options. Having the storm herald desert aura would give 2 damage to everyone in the aura except you until it bumped at 5th to 3 damage, up to 6 damage at 20th. Having dual wielding would give you the option to use the weapon attack against a single target or the Aura against multiple targets. Going with berserker, you could use the dual wield bonus action normally and get the frenzy one when you need the full damage.
It's generally preferred to not have lots of options, especially in the instances given, because they don't provide a large enough difference for the opportunity cost. Just going with a heavy weapon in both cases and using the bonus option would be better, except perhaps in the case of the berserker, which would probably want PAM for the more consistent bonus action to get upgraded to frenzy. Both cases would likely also have GWM giving more consistency to the heavier hitting bonus action, should that be the optimal choice with storm herald.
Yes, dual wielding is typically inferior, especially if you have options for a bonus action to replace it, but it's competitive enough to usually not be a terrible idea. It also suffers less from overkill, meaning more of it's damage is meaningful, though just missing a kill and using another attack or forcing a teammate to finish the creature can also lead to overkill and a loss of efficiency. So you pick your poison.
As long as you know the pros and cons of each build, you can have fun with any of them provided that you can live with the cons. Play to your builder's strengths and you'll be good. I do think that all barbarians should either sword and board or dual wield levels 1 and 2, just because it gives you better consistency or more survivability early on. After third, you've usually got enough HP to take hits and you've usually got something to incentivize using the larger weapons if that's the path that you choose. Encounters become more consistent as everyone had options to be able to overcome a string of bad rolls. Switching between weapons is also not a bad idea as it gives you an idea of what each is good at to inform you of options later on.
This brings up another topic - storm harold is in serious need of a buff, and the desert aura has problems with friendly fire. Berserker is bad, really bad. Its main ability is excruciatingly punishing to use, and it's an ability that you can gain from multiple other ways. A long rest only gets rid of 1 level of exhaustion. Like literally, if you only use frenzy twice per long rest the levels continue to accumulate. I can't believe the mechanics made it all the way through the approval process for final print, and they never fixed it.
After calculating the numbers I will revise my earlier statement. I no longer think duel wielding on a barbarian is "bad." It's just the least effective of options, but not by such a large degree that it should be avoided.
It does suffer more on the turn that you rage if you have the fighting style, but less otherwise. It certainly depends on which subclass you go with as some have bonus action options as well.
Having two options isn't bad, as it gives you options. Having the storm herald desert aura would give 2 damage to everyone in the aura except you until it bumped at 5th to 3 damage, up to 6 damage at 20th. Having dual wielding would give you the option to use the weapon attack against a single target or the Aura against multiple targets. Going with berserker, you could use the dual wield bonus action normally and get the frenzy one when you need the full damage.
It's generally preferred to not have lots of options, especially in the instances given, because they don't provide a large enough difference for the opportunity cost. Just going with a heavy weapon in both cases and using the bonus option would be better, except perhaps in the case of the berserker, which would probably want PAM for the more consistent bonus action to get upgraded to frenzy. Both cases would likely also have GWM giving more consistency to the heavier hitting bonus action, should that be the optimal choice with storm herald.
Yes, dual wielding is typically inferior, especially if you have options for a bonus action to replace it, but it's competitive enough to usually not be a terrible idea. It also suffers less from overkill, meaning more of it's damage is meaningful, though just missing a kill and using another attack or forcing a teammate to finish the creature can also lead to overkill and a loss of efficiency. So you pick your poison.
As long as you know the pros and cons of each build, you can have fun with any of them provided that you can live with the cons. Play to your builder's strengths and you'll be good. I do think that all barbarians should either sword and board or dual wield levels 1 and 2, just because it gives you better consistency or more survivability early on. After third, you've usually got enough HP to take hits and you've usually got something to incentivize using the larger weapons if that's the path that you choose. Encounters become more consistent as everyone had options to be able to overcome a string of bad rolls. Switching between weapons is also not a bad idea as it gives you an idea of what each is good at to inform you of options later on.
This brings up another topic - storm harold is in serious need of a buff, and the desert aura has problems with friendly fire. Berserker is bad, really bad. Its main ability is excruciatingly punishing to use, and it's an ability that you can gain from multiple other ways. A long rest only gets rid of 1 level of exhaustion. Like literally, if you only use frenzy twice per long rest the levels continue to accumulate. I can't believe the mechanics made it all the way through the approval process for final print, and they never fixed it.
The way I have fixed berserker is to add the option of short rests getting rid of exhaustion that was gained by the subclass. Another way is to remove it entirely and replace it with a sudo exhaustion that goes up to level 3 not no higher; and allow short rests to lower it by one and a long rest reset.
I'm not sure about storm herald fixing. Maybe the ability adds damage to weapon attacks. Desert = sudo GFB. Sea = sudo BB. Tundra is still the temporary HP but one point higher or gives AC buff.
After calculating the numbers I will revise my earlier statement. I no longer think duel wielding on a barbarian is "bad." It's just the least effective of options, but not by such a large degree that it should be avoided.
It does suffer more on the turn that you rage if you have the fighting style, but less otherwise. It certainly depends on which subclass you go with as some have bonus action options as well.
Having two options isn't bad, as it gives you options. Having the storm herald desert aura would give 2 damage to everyone in the aura except you until it bumped at 5th to 3 damage, up to 6 damage at 20th. Having dual wielding would give you the option to use the weapon attack against a single target or the Aura against multiple targets. Going with berserker, you could use the dual wield bonus action normally and get the frenzy one when you need the full damage.
It's generally preferred to not have lots of options, especially in the instances given, because they don't provide a large enough difference for the opportunity cost. Just going with a heavy weapon in both cases and using the bonus option would be better, except perhaps in the case of the berserker, which would probably want PAM for the more consistent bonus action to get upgraded to frenzy. Both cases would likely also have GWM giving more consistency to the heavier hitting bonus action, should that be the optimal choice with storm herald.
Yes, dual wielding is typically inferior, especially if you have options for a bonus action to replace it, but it's competitive enough to usually not be a terrible idea. It also suffers less from overkill, meaning more of it's damage is meaningful, though just missing a kill and using another attack or forcing a teammate to finish the creature can also lead to overkill and a loss of efficiency. So you pick your poison.
As long as you know the pros and cons of each build, you can have fun with any of them provided that you can live with the cons. Play to your builder's strengths and you'll be good. I do think that all barbarians should either sword and board or dual wield levels 1 and 2, just because it gives you better consistency or more survivability early on. After third, you've usually got enough HP to take hits and you've usually got something to incentivize using the larger weapons if that's the path that you choose. Encounters become more consistent as everyone had options to be able to overcome a string of bad rolls. Switching between weapons is also not a bad idea as it gives you an idea of what each is good at to inform you of options later on.
This brings up another topic - storm harold is in serious need of a buff, and the desert aura has problems with friendly fire. Berserker is bad, really bad. Its main ability is excruciatingly punishing to use, and it's an ability that you can gain from multiple other ways. A long rest only gets rid of 1 level of exhaustion. Like literally, if you only use frenzy twice per long rest the levels continue to accumulate. I can't believe the mechanics made it all the way through the approval process for final print, and they never fixed it.
The way I have fixed berserker is to add the option of short rests getting rid of exhaustion that was gained by the subclass. Another way is to remove it entirely and replace it with a sudo exhaustion that goes up to level 3 not no higher; and allow short rests to lower it by one and a long rest reset.
I'm not sure about storm herald fixing. Maybe the ability adds damage to weapon attacks. Desert = sudo GFB. Sea = sudo BB. Tundra is still the temporary HP but one point higher or gives AC buff.
Storm herald does require some planning when considering melee buddies. The damage potential is quite good in packs and can regularly overcome a single bonus action attack from two weapon fighting (without fighting style) starting at fifth and dual wielder d8 at 10th. For GWM/PAM builds, you do have options to prevent friendly fire and even the PAM bonus attack gives 2.5 plus rage plus strength mod damage which is 7.5 average damage and 6 minimum with rage bonus 2 and strength mod 3. Having to hit 3 enemies to equal that and at least 1 more for every ally hit to break even doesn't leave a bunch of wiggle room considering the 10 radius aura. You have a maximum of 24 squares hit assuming that the DM centers it on your square and doesn't allow for extras by being off center in your square. 3 to break even and 2 more for every ally hit just to break even will usually leave you with few targets to merit the extra damage unless your allies have resistence to fire damage and/or the enemies have vulnerability to it. I've rarely seen character density get much higher than 5 or 6 in that range for longer than a turn or two. Doesn't mean it can't happen, but it does limit the usefulness somewhat.
I think those are good fixes. Back on topic, I've been playing the Shifter Wildhunt and it's amazing. It's especially good when you use the Tasha's flexible ASI option. Like it was tailor made for the barbarian.
I think those are good fixes. Back on topic, I've been playing the Shifter Wildhunt and it's amazing. It's especially good when you use the Tasha's flexible ASI option. Like it was tailor made for the barbarian.
Yes, even better than the shifters that you would think would be better barbarians. Reckless attacks without disadvantage are awesome. Much better than a few extra temp HPs and an extra AC (Beasthide) and much better than an improved unarmed strike (Longtooth). Swiftstride actually can be decent, too, if that fits your playstyle, but Wildhunt is simply amazing. Even the Dexterity +2 and Wisdom +1 aren't bad on barbarians if you can't reassign per Tasha's. Not ideal, but workable. Getting 15, 12+2, 14, 8, 13+1, 10 isn't ideal at low levels, but it still gives a 14 AC like my 16, 13, 16, 8, 12, 10 half orc. You can always point buy to give 15, 15, 15, 8, 13, 8 to load up on half feats or split ASIs too. Getting Tasha's to move the Wisdom to Strength and select your preference of dex or con is just icing on the cake.
I think those are good fixes. Back on topic, I've been playing the Shifter Wildhunt and it's amazing. It's especially good when you use the Tasha's flexible ASI option. Like it was tailor made for the barbarian.
Yes, even better than the shifters that you would think would be better barbarians. Reckless attacks without disadvantage are awesome. Much better than a few extra temp HPs and an extra AC (Beasthide) and much better than an improved unarmed strike (Longtooth). Swiftstride actually can be decent, too, if that fits your playstyle, but Wildhunt is simply amazing. Even the Dexterity +2 and Wisdom +1 aren't bad on barbarians if you can't reassign per Tasha's. Not ideal, but workable. Getting 15, 12+2, 14, 8, 13+1, 10 isn't ideal at low levels, but it still gives a 14 AC like my 16, 13, 16, 8, 12, 10 half orc. You can always point buy to give 15, 15, 15, 8, 13, 8 to load up on half feats or split ASIs too. Getting Tasha's to move the Wisdom to Strength and select your preference of dex or con is just icing on the cake.
I think those are good fixes. Back on topic, I've been playing the Shifter Wildhunt and it's amazing. It's especially good when you use the Tasha's flexible ASI option. Like it was tailor made for the barbarian.
Yes, even better than the shifters that you would think would be better barbarians. Reckless attacks without disadvantage are awesome. Much better than a few extra temp HPs and an extra AC (Beasthide) and much better than an improved unarmed strike (Longtooth). Swiftstride actually can be decent, too, if that fits your playstyle, but Wildhunt is simply amazing. Even the Dexterity +2 and Wisdom +1 aren't bad on barbarians if you can't reassign per Tasha's. Not ideal, but workable. Getting 15, 12+2, 14, 8, 13+1, 10 isn't ideal at low levels, but it still gives a 14 AC like my 16, 13, 16, 8, 12, 10 half orc. You can always point buy to give 15, 15, 15, 8, 13, 8 to load up on half feats or split ASIs too. Getting Tasha's to move the Wisdom to Strength and select your preference of dex or con is just icing on the cake.
I will also add: I started out with Longtooth and my DM allowed me to switch. It looks better on paper until you really examine it. First of all, it's once per short rest, which is till pretty good to have an extra attack for an entire combat encounter. But what hurts it more is that it's a bonus action to shift, for a bonus action attack. Round 1: bonus action rage. Round 2: bonus action shift. Round 3: now you can finally bite with a bonus action.
The best way to use Longtooth in my opinion, is to use it as another option between rages. When you're stuck with 2, 3 or 4 rages per day, it gives you an additional thing you can do. It's nice for a dungeon crawl with a lot of smaller combat encounters.
I think those are good fixes. Back on topic, I've been playing the Shifter Wildhunt and it's amazing. It's especially good when you use the Tasha's flexible ASI option. Like it was tailor made for the barbarian.
Yes, even better than the shifters that you would think would be better barbarians. Reckless attacks without disadvantage are awesome. Much better than a few extra temp HPs and an extra AC (Beasthide) and much better than an improved unarmed strike (Longtooth). Swiftstride actually can be decent, too, if that fits your playstyle, but Wildhunt is simply amazing. Even the Dexterity +2 and Wisdom +1 aren't bad on barbarians if you can't reassign per Tasha's. Not ideal, but workable. Getting 15, 12+2, 14, 8, 13+1, 10 isn't ideal at low levels, but it still gives a 14 AC like my 16, 13, 16, 8, 12, 10 half orc. You can always point buy to give 15, 15, 15, 8, 13, 8 to load up on half feats or split ASIs too. Getting Tasha's to move the Wisdom to Strength and select your preference of dex or con is just icing on the cake.
I think those are good fixes. Back on topic, I've been playing the Shifter Wildhunt and it's amazing. It's especially good when you use the Tasha's flexible ASI option. Like it was tailor made for the barbarian.
Yes, even better than the shifters that you would think would be better barbarians. Reckless attacks without disadvantage are awesome. Much better than a few extra temp HPs and an extra AC (Beasthide) and much better than an improved unarmed strike (Longtooth). Swiftstride actually can be decent, too, if that fits your playstyle, but Wildhunt is simply amazing. Even the Dexterity +2 and Wisdom +1 aren't bad on barbarians if you can't reassign per Tasha's. Not ideal, but workable. Getting 15, 12+2, 14, 8, 13+1, 10 isn't ideal at low levels, but it still gives a 14 AC like my 16, 13, 16, 8, 12, 10 half orc. You can always point buy to give 15, 15, 15, 8, 13, 8 to load up on half feats or split ASIs too. Getting Tasha's to move the Wisdom to Strength and select your preference of dex or con is just icing on the cake.
I will also add: I started out with Longtooth and my DM allowed me to switch. It looks better on paper until you really examine it. First of all, it's once per short rest, which is till pretty good to have an extra attack for an entire combat encounter. But what hurts it more is that it's a bonus action to shift, for a bonus action attack. Round 1: bonus action rage. Round 2: bonus action shift. Round 3: now you can finally bite with a bonus action.
The best way to use Longtooth in my opinion, is to use it as another option between rages. When you're stuck with 2, 3 or 4 rages per day, it gives you an additional thing you can do. It's nice for a dungeon crawl with a lot of smaller combat encounters.
Yeah, it essentially gives you an additional rage that way. I think it's the only one that doesn't stack well with rage for a barbarian, though the two rounds to stack them does limit it a bit. Having any as a quasi additional rage per short rest.
That said the Temp HPs granted wherever you shift is always nice on a barb, especially if they cover resisted damage. With the right build, anyone of them compliments a barbarian very well.
Exactly, those temp hit points really make a difference! I have a 16 Con at level 4, so that's 7 hit points. When raging it's functionally 14. Even better, our DM has me round-down the damage (which I think is RAW?). So if I take 13 raw damage, it's marked as 6 instead.
I got to make a hero move on our last encounter. There was an archer and a druid on a 40 foot tower next to us. I attacked, and began climbing the outside of the tower (with athletics advantage from rage). I made it to the top and threw a javelin at the druid, breaking his concentration on some summoned giant snakes. The next round my two teammates both went down! I bonus action shifted, gaining 7 temp hit points, and then leaped off of the 40 foot tower so I could feed the Paladin/Divine Soul Sorcerer a healing potion. He got up and healing worded the cleric/fighter.
That was a fun moment :) Afterwords one of the other players gave me an improvement to the moment. I should have landed on a bad guy so I can make him take the full damage, while I take half!
I've really been trying to think outside the box and use all of the Barbarian abilities, instead of just attack attack attack. It makes playing so much more fun, and it makes you more effective as well. I'm finally appreciating things like advantage on strength checks and other abilities that i had previously overlooked.
That's what I'm freakin talkin about SeanJP. Good show! It sounds like you're having a blast with this barbarian. Just cause you like to smashy smashy doesn't mean you can't be smart about it 😜
I love using the environment like that. Totally different character, but my wizard would regularly use spider climb to get to ridiculous and very tactically useful spots. Considering barbarians have a pretty limited pool of abilities, milking that athletics for all it's worth is a great move.
Exactly, those temp hit points really make a difference! I have a 16 Con at level 4, so that's 7 hit points. When raging it's functionally 14. Even better, our DM has me round-down the damage (which I think is RAW?). So if I take 13 raw damage, it's marked as 6 instead.
I got to make a hero move on our last encounter. There was an archer and a druid on a 40 foot tower next to us. I attacked, and began climbing the outside of the tower (with athletics advantage from rage). I made it to the top and threw a javelin at the druid, breaking his concentration on some summoned giant snakes. The next round my two teammates both went down! I bonus action shifted, gaining 7 temp hit points, and then leaped off of the 40 foot tower so I could feed the Paladin/Divine Soul Sorcerer a healing potion. He got up and healing worded the cleric/fighter.
That was a fun moment :) Afterwords one of the other players gave me an improvement to the moment. I should have landed on a bad guy so I can make him take the full damage, while I take half!
I've really been trying to think outside the box and use all of the Barbarian abilities, instead of just attack attack attack. It makes playing so much more fun, and it makes you more effective as well. I'm finally appreciating things like advantage on strength checks and other abilities that i had previously overlooked.
I had that moment of landing on the bad guy. We were playing LMOP and in Cragmaw Hideout. We were fighting the Bugbear and he started to escape via the secret hatch. I couldn't attack him directly and was thinking about dashing around to get him, but that didn't feel right plus I didn't want to lose my rage. I jumped down after him. It just so happened that the bugbear had failed his athletics check to climb down so he'd fallen. I landed on him and killed him. I was low enough HP wise that it could have been bad news if the fall damage had been worse or if the bugbear was waiting to strike. A very impulsive move that felt very right as an in the moment, seeing blood decision.
I am having a absolute blast playing a level Scourge Aasimar Zealot Barbarian right now. The amount of extra damage from Radiant Consumption can get pretty nuts at higher levels and the necrotic resistance makes most undead encounters a cake walk. The +2 CHA bonus is a bit of a waste but the player options from TCoE could make this race even better for the barbarian.
Shifter overall is great, the psychic resistant race, forgot the name, they are great as a bear totem, resistance to every type of damage, effectively doubling hp
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True enough. That's what I get for trying to do this middle of the night. It doesn't explain why I misread it earlier though ;)
Speaking of 9th level, Brutal Criticals do favor larger damage die. The d10 for a glaive, followed by the d8 for the dual wielder, followed by the d6 for hoplite and greatsword (while 2d6 for a normal crit, only 1d6 is added for brutal critical), with the PAM d4 bringing up the rear. Using their primary weapons, the dual wielder gets full advantage of their brutal criticals while the glaive might crit on the d4 and the hoplite is always at a disadvantage. 9th level is often late in the game for most campaigns and banking on crits isn't a great way to account for damage (or else champions would be better), but does bring a little more benefit to the larger die builds. Again, it's mostly a matter of taste.
Generally, in the case of a barbarian I agree. There are cases where the feat might be superior, but in general I'd rather have fighter. That said, many DMs don't allow multi-classing, and in a game to 20 getting the capstone might be a player goal which precludes a player taking the MC option. I view the feats as better picks in general for MC builds which do not include fighter. I generally speaking loathe 3 class MC's so considering adding that third class to get a fighting style is not something I will regularly consider.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
hoplite looks a lot better with a fighting style for duelling. I'm not sure if you factored that possibility in. Hoplites get +2 to both the primary and secondary hits and stacking static modifiers is a great way to boost the consistency of damage.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
Didn't for the same reason I didn't factor in two weapon fighting style. The comparison was made between everything without fighting styles. +2 on three attacks will be better than even a +5 on dual wielding until barb 20 but doesn't consider the extras opportunity attacks that hoplite PAM can bring.
Ah see I never think about games where you can't multiclass because I would never play in one of them. Those DMs can do their thing, but I'm not a fan of that dynamic or energy.
But frankly, even on a single class barbarian I don't think fighting initiate is worth it. At least not more than maximizing strength and getting resilient (wisdom). I don't plan characters past level 12. Whatever could happen after that is a moot point to me. I haven't played to the late levels since 3.5 and I don't expect to any time soon.
After calculating the numbers I will revise my earlier statement. I no longer think duel wielding on a barbarian is "bad." It's just the least effective of options, but not by such a large degree that it should be avoided.
It does suffer more on the turn that you rage if you have the fighting style, but less otherwise. It certainly depends on which subclass you go with as some have bonus action options as well.
Having two options isn't bad, as it gives you options. Having the storm herald desert aura would give 2 damage to everyone in the aura except you until it bumped at 5th to 3 damage, up to 6 damage at 20th. Having dual wielding would give you the option to use the weapon attack against a single target or the Aura against multiple targets. Going with berserker, you could use the dual wield bonus action normally and get the frenzy one when you need the full damage.
It's generally preferred to not have lots of options, especially in the instances given, because they don't provide a large enough difference for the opportunity cost. Just going with a heavy weapon in both cases and using the bonus option would be better, except perhaps in the case of the berserker, which would probably want PAM for the more consistent bonus action to get upgraded to frenzy. Both cases would likely also have GWM giving more consistency to the heavier hitting bonus action, should that be the optimal choice with storm herald.
Yes, dual wielding is typically inferior, especially if you have options for a bonus action to replace it, but it's competitive enough to usually not be a terrible idea. It also suffers less from overkill, meaning more of it's damage is meaningful, though just missing a kill and using another attack or forcing a teammate to finish the creature can also lead to overkill and a loss of efficiency. So you pick your poison.
As long as you know the pros and cons of each build, you can have fun with any of them provided that you can live with the cons. Play to your builder's strengths and you'll be good. I do think that all barbarians should either sword and board or dual wield levels 1 and 2, just because it gives you better consistency or more survivability early on. After third, you've usually got enough HP to take hits and you've usually got something to incentivize using the larger weapons if that's the path that you choose. Encounters become more consistent as everyone had options to be able to overcome a string of bad rolls. Switching between weapons is also not a bad idea as it gives you an idea of what each is good at to inform you of options later on.
This brings up another topic - storm harold is in serious need of a buff, and the desert aura has problems with friendly fire. Berserker is bad, really bad. Its main ability is excruciatingly punishing to use, and it's an ability that you can gain from multiple other ways. A long rest only gets rid of 1 level of exhaustion. Like literally, if you only use frenzy twice per long rest the levels continue to accumulate. I can't believe the mechanics made it all the way through the approval process for final print, and they never fixed it.
The way I have fixed berserker is to add the option of short rests getting rid of exhaustion that was gained by the subclass. Another way is to remove it entirely and replace it with a sudo exhaustion that goes up to level 3 not no higher; and allow short rests to lower it by one and a long rest reset.
I'm not sure about storm herald fixing. Maybe the ability adds damage to weapon attacks. Desert = sudo GFB. Sea = sudo BB. Tundra is still the temporary HP but one point higher or gives AC buff.
Storm herald does require some planning when considering melee buddies. The damage potential is quite good in packs and can regularly overcome a single bonus action attack from two weapon fighting (without fighting style) starting at fifth and dual wielder d8 at 10th. For GWM/PAM builds, you do have options to prevent friendly fire and even the PAM bonus attack gives 2.5 plus rage plus strength mod damage which is 7.5 average damage and 6 minimum with rage bonus 2 and strength mod 3. Having to hit 3 enemies to equal that and at least 1 more for every ally hit to break even doesn't leave a bunch of wiggle room considering the 10 radius aura. You have a maximum of 24 squares hit assuming that the DM centers it on your square and doesn't allow for extras by being off center in your square. 3 to break even and 2 more for every ally hit just to break even will usually leave you with few targets to merit the extra damage unless your allies have resistence to fire damage and/or the enemies have vulnerability to it. I've rarely seen character density get much higher than 5 or 6 in that range for longer than a turn or two. Doesn't mean it can't happen, but it does limit the usefulness somewhat.
I think those are good fixes. Back on topic, I've been playing the Shifter Wildhunt and it's amazing. It's especially good when you use the Tasha's flexible ASI option. Like it was tailor made for the barbarian.
Yes, even better than the shifters that you would think would be better barbarians. Reckless attacks without disadvantage are awesome. Much better than a few extra temp HPs and an extra AC (Beasthide) and much better than an improved unarmed strike (Longtooth). Swiftstride actually can be decent, too, if that fits your playstyle, but Wildhunt is simply amazing. Even the Dexterity +2 and Wisdom +1 aren't bad on barbarians if you can't reassign per Tasha's. Not ideal, but workable. Getting 15, 12+2, 14, 8, 13+1, 10 isn't ideal at low levels, but it still gives a 14 AC like my 16, 13, 16, 8, 12, 10 half orc. You can always point buy to give 15, 15, 15, 8, 13, 8 to load up on half feats or split ASIs too. Getting Tasha's to move the Wisdom to Strength and select your preference of dex or con is just icing on the cake.
I will also add: I started out with Longtooth and my DM allowed me to switch. It looks better on paper until you really examine it. First of all, it's once per short rest, which is till pretty good to have an extra attack for an entire combat encounter. But what hurts it more is that it's a bonus action to shift, for a bonus action attack. Round 1: bonus action rage. Round 2: bonus action shift. Round 3: now you can finally bite with a bonus action.
The best way to use Longtooth in my opinion, is to use it as another option between rages. When you're stuck with 2, 3 or 4 rages per day, it gives you an additional thing you can do. It's nice for a dungeon crawl with a lot of smaller combat encounters.
Yeah, it essentially gives you an additional rage that way. I think it's the only one that doesn't stack well with rage for a barbarian, though the two rounds to stack them does limit it a bit. Having any as a quasi additional rage per short rest.
That said the Temp HPs granted wherever you shift is always nice on a barb, especially if they cover resisted damage. With the right build, anyone of them compliments a barbarian very well.
Exactly, those temp hit points really make a difference! I have a 16 Con at level 4, so that's 7 hit points. When raging it's functionally 14. Even better, our DM has me round-down the damage (which I think is RAW?). So if I take 13 raw damage, it's marked as 6 instead.
I got to make a hero move on our last encounter. There was an archer and a druid on a 40 foot tower next to us. I attacked, and began climbing the outside of the tower (with athletics advantage from rage). I made it to the top and threw a javelin at the druid, breaking his concentration on some summoned giant snakes. The next round my two teammates both went down! I bonus action shifted, gaining 7 temp hit points, and then leaped off of the 40 foot tower so I could feed the Paladin/Divine Soul Sorcerer a healing potion. He got up and healing worded the cleric/fighter.
That was a fun moment :) Afterwords one of the other players gave me an improvement to the moment. I should have landed on a bad guy so I can make him take the full damage, while I take half!
I've really been trying to think outside the box and use all of the Barbarian abilities, instead of just attack attack attack. It makes playing so much more fun, and it makes you more effective as well. I'm finally appreciating things like advantage on strength checks and other abilities that i had previously overlooked.
That's what I'm freakin talkin about SeanJP. Good show! It sounds like you're having a blast with this barbarian. Just cause you like to smashy smashy doesn't mean you can't be smart about it 😜
I love using the environment like that. Totally different character, but my wizard would regularly use spider climb to get to ridiculous and very tactically useful spots. Considering barbarians have a pretty limited pool of abilities, milking that athletics for all it's worth is a great move.
I had that moment of landing on the bad guy. We were playing LMOP and in Cragmaw Hideout. We were fighting the Bugbear and he started to escape via the secret hatch. I couldn't attack him directly and was thinking about dashing around to get him, but that didn't feel right plus I didn't want to lose my rage. I jumped down after him. It just so happened that the bugbear had failed his athletics check to climb down so he'd fallen. I landed on him and killed him. I was low enough HP wise that it could have been bad news if the fall damage had been worse or if the bugbear was waiting to strike. A very impulsive move that felt very right as an in the moment, seeing blood decision.
I am having a absolute blast playing a level Scourge Aasimar Zealot Barbarian right now. The amount of extra damage from Radiant Consumption can get pretty nuts at higher levels and the necrotic resistance makes most undead encounters a cake walk. The +2 CHA bonus is a bit of a waste but the player options from TCoE could make this race even better for the barbarian.
One race that isn't an option on your poll but deserves recognition is Bugbear
Shifter overall is great, the psychic resistant race, forgot the name, they are great as a bear totem, resistance to every type of damage, effectively doubling hp