I'm playing a character who is a Level 2 Circle of Stars Druid. I'd like to pick up one or two levels of Twilight Cleric and then return to Druid. I'm wondering about the interaction between the Twilight Cleric's Twilight Sanctuary and the Circle of Stars Druid's Starry Form:
Twilight Sanctuary: "As an action, you present your holy symbol, and a sphere of twilight emanates from you. The sphere is centered on you, has a 30-foot radius, and is filled with dim light. The sphere moves with you, and it lasts for 1 minute ... " (TCoE, p. 35)
Starry Form: "As a bonus action, you can expend a use of your Wild Shape feature to take on a starry form ... While in your starry form, you retain your game statistics, but your body becomes luminous ... This form sheds bright light in a 10-foot radius and dim light for an additional 10 feet. The form lasts for 10 minutes." (TCoE, p. 38)
If my character had both of these effects running at the same time, would the bright light of Starry Form override the dim light on Twilight Sanctuary? That is, would the character shed bright light for 10 feet (from Starry Form) and then dim light for an additional 20 feet (from Twilight Sanctuary)?
Twilight Sanctuary has no rules in it dimming light, so it acts like an other source of dim light. Your question isn't any different from asking what happens when a Twilight Cleric uses Twilight Sanctuary when holding a lit torch. The answer is the TS emits dim light and the other light source emits bright light, so within any overlap, the light is bright.
I can't help but wonder though if this RAI isn't that the dim light overrides other light effects. It seems like that would be the interpretation considering the name of the ability and the theme of the domain.
I'm making this same multiclass (except I'm planning on only going 2 levels into druid and the rest into cleric). I certainly think it depends on how your dm would rule it. Personally, I think I would let the player choose what type of light is emitted since it is two of their own abilities conflicting. But other people could (and probably would) run it differently.
Not so much multiclass, but in our group we have a Circle of Stars Druid, a Hexblade Warlock who will use Darkness and I'm a Twilight Cleric.
The way I read Twilight Sanctuary it does create "a sphere of twilight" which I understand would dim bright light emanating within it or even daylight in the same way as a sphere of magical darkness.
However, because we are going to have numerous potential conflicts in lighting effects I am going to suggest a bit of homebrew to the DM. Rather than attempt to define in advance what each interaction will do every time, have the casters roll off using their spellcasting ability and modifier to determine which effect prevails over another for that combat. This adds some variability to the outcome which I think will be more fun.
Since neither Starry Form nor Twilight Sanctuary are spells they will not be dispelled by Darkness. The effects of Twilight Sanctuary extend to any creature within "the sphere" which I think means 30 feet radius rather than within the dim light. So the lighting effects shouldn't affect the mechanics of either Starry Form or Twilight Sanctuary, but could overwrite Darkness, depending on the rolls.
I can't help but wonder though if this RAI isn't that the dim light overrides other light effects. It seems like that would be the interpretation considering the name of the ability and the theme of the domain.
I wondered the same thing. Would be helpful for the party members that have features that work in dim light, like shadow blade advantage, even when outside in bright light. Initially I had assumed like others mentioned, you would have bright light 10’ then dim the rest, but it says the the sphere is filled with dim light not sheds dim light. maybe it would depend on what you activate first. If you do starry form first then twilight sanctuary then maybe it would dim the forms light but if it was reversed you would have dim light and then the SF would then shed bright light the 10’ overriding the dim light in that range.
The way twillight sanctuary is described aswell as the entire theme of the subclass tells me that RAI is that the sets the light level to dim light and overrides light sources in the sphere... I mean if you look at how jeremy crawford talks about the subclass, it's all about seeking comfort in the space between darkness and light.. seeking refuge from the blackness of night but also the hard light of the day... So it'd be weird if their channel divinity is then only a light source, considering the subclass is all about specfically dimmed light... That aswell as the the fact that the flavor text and the name of the feature itself seems to imply that it does not shed light, but rather fills a magical sphere with dim light... It's a sanctuary from the darkness and the light.
To me it seems like an oversight that they didn't clarify the effect tbh... By it's true that raw it does not dim light sources.
Basically, this is a way to prevent darkness from affecting your twilight sanctuary since the darkness spell only cares about whether the light is magical and if it's fueled by a spell. Twilight sanctuary is magical and is not a spell so it overcomes the darkness spell, filling the sphere with dim light, but TS does not dispel the darkness nor is it also dispelled by the darkness spell.
However, by RAW, it still appears that TS cannot overcome bright light, eg activating TS in a field at noon, and on a clear day, the sphere is still there to trigger the other effects but the sphere is not dim light since the brighter source of light will overcome it. So no Steps of Night in broad daylight. Maybe add an umbrella to your inventory? But in the end Starry form's light just lights up the dim light of TS since the spell doesn't explicitly state what it does otherwise.
OP rule of cool makes this an always on flight feature, with Steps of Night, and a way to overcome sunlight sensitivity. Not sure the twilight domain really needs any more power, so ask your DM.
On a final note:
Twilight Shroud
17th-level Twilight Domain feature
The twilight that you summon offers a protective embrace: you and your allies have half cover while in the sphere created by your Twilight Sanctuary.
TS doesn't care about dim light btw and the sphere still works whether you're in dim light or not, only SoN does. All of the other features always work no matter the lighting.
I rule that Twilight Sanctuary set the light to Dim, overriding any natural ambient lighting levels. This is a magical effect that creates a sphere of twilight "that is filled with dim light". That, to me, reads as the sphere has its own lighting condition as compared to outside it, and so is just dim light.
Now... how does this interact with other effects?
I also rule that effects that are inside the sphere behave normally. A light spell creates bright light inside the sphere if the spell is in the sphere. So does a torch, for that matter. Torch outside the sphere? No go, its light doesn't get in. Torch inside the sphere? Lights up like normal.
Visually, imagine a giant stained/fogged/smoked glass dome. It strains out light from the outside while also being gently lit internally. But, you bring a giant light source inside and it'll get brighter for sure. But what it'll never do is get darker! (at least not from the darkness spell) Why? Because the light it creates inside is magical light, and so Darkness specifically can't darken it, since it can only darken natural light and/or dispel light spells. But this isn't a light spell nor natural light, so darkness gets overridden.
But a torch inside? Sure, brighter. Can you use this outside at high noon? Yeah, as long as that sun is more than 30ft away, it isn't going to be in the sphere with you, so it'll just be filled with dim light. (You'd have bigger problems if it were in there anyway)
How RAW is this? I'm not sure, I've seen this topic pop up several times and can't seem to find a definitive answer either. But I like this ruling. I think its as close to RAW as you can get. It's also, I think personally, the coolest interpretation.
TLDR: Creates a bubble that keeps out lighting from outside and supplies its own dim light, brighter light brought inside the sphere works normally but any light source outside it can't get through the sphere. Darkness is overridden normally.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
The dim light shed does not change or negate other light.
It just emits dim light. Doea not negate or change anything
Example... at night, turn the light off in a room of your house. Its darkness yeh
Now light a candle.... wah lah... thats dim light. Now turn the light of the room back on, its not dim anymore from the candle, its bright now right... but the candle is still emitting its same dim light.....
You create a sphere that is filled with dim light. It is not a light source like a candle. Basically you are in a fantasy version of a car with tinted windows. The sunlight on a bright day is filtered out but if you turn on a bright light inside, that light source makes it bright in the “car”
Kind of like Tiny Hut makes the interior comfortable and dry no matter the environment outside it. The sphere you create fills with dim light no matter the light conditions outside it.
To me, the neat trick (until they take away sunlight sensitivity) is to imagine a drow/kobold twilight priest. Is his god going to make dark areas lighter, or light areas darker? Then you look at the wording and realize it does both.
I imagine a drow cleric of Ellistraee who is trying to bridge the gap between the drow and their light side brethren. Forever caught between in the twilight.
You're just making up the fantasy which is your prerogative but it's certainly not RAW.
Making up fantasy is indeed what you're supposed to do while playing D&D, per the rules.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
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I'm playing a character who is a Level 2 Circle of Stars Druid. I'd like to pick up one or two levels of Twilight Cleric and then return to Druid. I'm wondering about the interaction between the Twilight Cleric's Twilight Sanctuary and the Circle of Stars Druid's Starry Form:
Twilight Sanctuary: "As an action, you present your holy symbol, and a sphere of twilight emanates from you. The sphere is centered on you, has a 30-foot radius, and is filled with dim light. The sphere moves with you, and it lasts for 1 minute ... " (TCoE, p. 35)
Starry Form: "As a bonus action, you can expend a use of your Wild Shape feature to take on a starry form ... While in your starry form, you retain your game statistics, but your body becomes luminous ... This form sheds bright light in a 10-foot radius and dim light for an additional 10 feet. The form lasts for 10 minutes." (TCoE, p. 38)
If my character had both of these effects running at the same time, would the bright light of Starry Form override the dim light on Twilight Sanctuary? That is, would the character shed bright light for 10 feet (from Starry Form) and then dim light for an additional 20 feet (from Twilight Sanctuary)?
Yes.
I agree with ElSpivo, but this seems like a DM ruling type question. You should check with your DM.
Twilight Sanctuary has no rules in it dimming light, so it acts like an other source of dim light. Your question isn't any different from asking what happens when a Twilight Cleric uses Twilight Sanctuary when holding a lit torch. The answer is the TS emits dim light and the other light source emits bright light, so within any overlap, the light is bright.
I can't help but wonder though if this RAI isn't that the dim light overrides other light effects. It seems like that would be the interpretation considering the name of the ability and the theme of the domain.
Altrazin Aghanes - Wizard/Fighter
Varpulis Windhowl - Fighter
Skolson Demjon - Cleric/Fighter
I'm making this same multiclass (except I'm planning on only going 2 levels into druid and the rest into cleric). I certainly think it depends on how your dm would rule it. Personally, I think I would let the player choose what type of light is emitted since it is two of their own abilities conflicting. But other people could (and probably would) run it differently.
What am I supposed to do with a signature?
Egg
Not so much multiclass, but in our group we have a Circle of Stars Druid, a Hexblade Warlock who will use Darkness and I'm a Twilight Cleric.
The way I read Twilight Sanctuary it does create "a sphere of twilight" which I understand would dim bright light emanating within it or even daylight in the same way as a sphere of magical darkness.
However, because we are going to have numerous potential conflicts in lighting effects I am going to suggest a bit of homebrew to the DM. Rather than attempt to define in advance what each interaction will do every time, have the casters roll off using their spellcasting ability and modifier to determine which effect prevails over another for that combat. This adds some variability to the outcome which I think will be more fun.
Since neither Starry Form nor Twilight Sanctuary are spells they will not be dispelled by Darkness. The effects of Twilight Sanctuary extend to any creature within "the sphere" which I think means 30 feet radius rather than within the dim light. So the lighting effects shouldn't affect the mechanics of either Starry Form or Twilight Sanctuary, but could overwrite Darkness, depending on the rolls.
I wondered the same thing. Would be helpful for the party members that have features that work in dim light, like shadow blade advantage, even when outside in bright light.
Initially I had assumed like others mentioned, you would have bright light 10’ then dim the rest, but it says the the sphere is filled with dim light not sheds dim light.
maybe it would depend on what you activate first. If you do starry form first then twilight sanctuary then maybe it would dim the forms light but if it was reversed you would have dim light and then the SF would then shed bright light the 10’ overriding the dim light in that range.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
The way twillight sanctuary is described aswell as the entire theme of the subclass tells me that RAI is that the sets the light level to dim light and overrides light sources in the sphere... I mean if you look at how jeremy crawford talks about the subclass, it's all about seeking comfort in the space between darkness and light.. seeking refuge from the blackness of night but also the hard light of the day... So it'd be weird if their channel divinity is then only a light source, considering the subclass is all about specfically dimmed light... That aswell as the the fact that the flavor text and the name of the feature itself seems to imply that it does not shed light, but rather fills a magical sphere with dim light... It's a sanctuary from the darkness and the light.
To me it seems like an oversight that they didn't clarify the effect tbh... By it's true that raw it does not dim light sources.
I would rule 10 feet around you,: no the bright light of starry form overtakes the other.
However. the 20 feet following for twilight sanctuary would be still in effect as it still is dull light.
As a DM I would also agree with your interpretation of the effect.
Here's Jeremy Crawford tangentially answering the darkness portion at least:
https://www.sageadvice.eu/does-light-from-a-magic-weapons-count-as-magical-that-can-illuminate-a-darkness-spell/
Basically, this is a way to prevent darkness from affecting your twilight sanctuary since the darkness spell only cares about whether the light is magical and if it's fueled by a spell. Twilight sanctuary is magical and is not a spell so it overcomes the darkness spell, filling the sphere with dim light, but TS does not dispel the darkness nor is it also dispelled by the darkness spell.
However, by RAW, it still appears that TS cannot overcome bright light, eg activating TS in a field at noon, and on a clear day, the sphere is still there to trigger the other effects but the sphere is not dim light since the brighter source of light will overcome it. So no Steps of Night in broad daylight. Maybe add an umbrella to your inventory? But in the end Starry form's light just lights up the dim light of TS since the spell doesn't explicitly state what it does otherwise.
OP rule of cool makes this an always on flight feature, with Steps of Night, and a way to overcome sunlight sensitivity. Not sure the twilight domain really needs any more power, so ask your DM.
On a final note:
Twilight Shroud
17th-level Twilight Domain feature
The twilight that you summon offers a protective embrace: you and your allies have half cover while in the sphere created by your Twilight Sanctuary.
TS doesn't care about dim light btw and the sphere still works whether you're in dim light or not, only SoN does. All of the other features always work no matter the lighting.
I rule that Twilight Sanctuary set the light to Dim, overriding any natural ambient lighting levels. This is a magical effect that creates a sphere of twilight "that is filled with dim light". That, to me, reads as the sphere has its own lighting condition as compared to outside it, and so is just dim light.
Now... how does this interact with other effects?
I also rule that effects that are inside the sphere behave normally. A light spell creates bright light inside the sphere if the spell is in the sphere. So does a torch, for that matter. Torch outside the sphere? No go, its light doesn't get in. Torch inside the sphere? Lights up like normal.
Visually, imagine a giant stained/fogged/smoked glass dome. It strains out light from the outside while also being gently lit internally. But, you bring a giant light source inside and it'll get brighter for sure. But what it'll never do is get darker! (at least not from the darkness spell) Why? Because the light it creates inside is magical light, and so Darkness specifically can't darken it, since it can only darken natural light and/or dispel light spells. But this isn't a light spell nor natural light, so darkness gets overridden.
But a torch inside? Sure, brighter. Can you use this outside at high noon? Yeah, as long as that sun is more than 30ft away, it isn't going to be in the sphere with you, so it'll just be filled with dim light. (You'd have bigger problems if it were in there anyway)
How RAW is this? I'm not sure, I've seen this topic pop up several times and can't seem to find a definitive answer either. But I like this ruling. I think its as close to RAW as you can get. It's also, I think personally, the coolest interpretation.
TLDR: Creates a bubble that keeps out lighting from outside and supplies its own dim light, brighter light brought inside the sphere works normally but any light source outside it can't get through the sphere. Darkness is overridden normally.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Wow, just wow...
The dim light shed does not change or negate other light.
It just emits dim light. Doea not negate or change anything
Example... at night, turn the light off in a room of your house. Its darkness yeh
Now light a candle.... wah lah... thats dim light. Now turn the light of the room back on, its not dim anymore from the candle, its bright now right... but the candle is still emitting its same dim light.....
Thats how it works
You create a sphere that is filled with dim light. It is not a light source like a candle. Basically you are in a fantasy version of a car with tinted windows. The sunlight on a bright day is filtered out but if you turn on a bright light inside, that light source makes it bright in the “car”
Kind of like Tiny Hut makes the interior comfortable and dry no matter the environment outside it. The sphere you create fills with dim light no matter the light conditions outside it.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
Except nothing in the description specifically says this. You're just making up the fantasy which is your prerogative but it's certainly not RAW.
To me, the neat trick (until they take away sunlight sensitivity) is to imagine a drow/kobold twilight priest. Is his god going to make dark areas lighter, or light areas darker? Then you look at the wording and realize it does both.
I imagine a drow cleric of Ellistraee who is trying to bridge the gap between the drow and their light side brethren. Forever caught between in the twilight.
Making up fantasy is indeed what you're supposed to do while playing D&D, per the rules.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.