Re being/not-being the GM: have conversations with your GM. The general point I was trying to make is that reasonable GMs will allow the 2014 CA spell as long as it doesn't slow down the game. There are lots of unreasonable (and just bad) GMs. Not allowing the use of a spell that doesn't slow down the game is just one of many reasons not to play with a GM.
Re whether a VTT will allow the 2014 CA spell. WoTC says that all of the 2014 stuff is compatible with the 2024 stuff. If a VTT doesn't allow 2014 stuff, that's either a technical or business problem. If a VTTs doesn't integrate the 2014 and 2024 stuff into their VTT, that's a flawed VTT. And it appears that the character sheet in D&D Beyond includes some legacy spells, but not others, which makes no sense and is something that needs fixing asap. There are workarounds for this for online games, but they're not ideal.
Re video games: don't care lol, video game =/= D&D the game.
So, do you have a way to run the 2014 CA spell without slowing down the game?
Look, the devs will clearly say ANYTHING if it's good for P.R. We saw that in 2021. Completely changing Conjure Animals and all the other big summoning spells from Druids makes the entire Shepherd Druid subclass invalid. How's that backwards compatibility?
The VTT will Not incorporate 2 different sets of rules in the system. That's precisely the kind of thing that creates bugs.
WotC is already shelving the 2014 PHB as Legacy content, which includes spell versions from 2014. Meaning it won't be sold in stores or online. That means they want to phase it out entirely from endorsed gaming events from here on out.
Running the 2014 spell isn't difficult, but it means extensive preparation and the player and DM agreeing to limit the number of beasts/fey/elementals. That is definitely do-able and should have been the go-to solution to "too slow" combat. They could have just raised the CR of the summonable and beasts/fey/elementals and capped it at 4, which makes it interesting for other players too, since they can conceivably control one beast each. The problem is solvable, but WotC wants a video game-like experience evidently, so they're claiming to "streamline" the game....by taking away player choice and agency on several spells and abilities. This doesn't just affect the Druid, either. Rangers also use the Primal spell list.
It needs to be said that a lot of people did not like the 2014 version for a variety of reasons. All I can say is I'm sorry for your loss, but, I'll no longer have to warn people that I am going to AOE clear their swarms if they get annoying or slow things down. Good riddance is my opinion.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Yes, the point of playing a druid is to play a druid. But the point of playing a druid is not to have access to 2014 Conjure Animals and Conjure Woodland Beings. Because it sounds like you were fine with the class before, and this change is ruining it for you. So if this is the big issue, and the reason there's no point of playing druids anymore for you, then I don't think you know the point of playing a druid. I've played druids before, I never learned any of these spells. And I had a blast, and I never felt like I was playing a worse version of a cleric or wizard. So if you can't see why play a druid because Conjure spells got updated, it's not the update's fault, it's your limited understanding of the class.
I also don't understand the comparisons. Spirit Guardians and Conjure Animals are 3rd level emanation spells...and that's where the comparison should end. They're not on the same spell lists and they're not supposed to do the same. And if we say that 3rd level spells suck because Spirit Guardians is better, then we're gonna be saying that about most spells. You're talking about one of the best spells in the game (for their level). Same with classes. Wizard and cleric are usually considered the best classes, or close to being the best. So if them being better makes playing druids pointless, well, then that applies to most classes. Again, I don't understand the comparisons.
Druids have A LOT of spells that nobody (except rangers, and only sometimes) gets. And class features that are unique to them. And subclasses that, of course, only they get. If you can't see the point of playing a druid in spite of that then it's your fault, not game design. Sounds like you don't want to play a druid, you want to play a Conjure X spellcaster.
I've seen the changed made the 2024 PHB, so I know this is not exclusively about Conjure Animals. Conjure Minor Elementals, Conjure Woodland Beings, etc. ALL of them got seriously nerfed. Druids had very few spells Improved through the whole revision process. Grasping Vine (4th lvl) was one of the few Druid spells that got a major iimprovement...probably b/c nobody thought that spending a 4th level slot just to grab one creature was worth it. The overall problem is that Druids are a primary spellcasting class, like the Cleric, the Bard, the Sorcerer, and the Wizard. If most of their most powerful spells get nerfed, that takes a lot way from the class.
Yes, I know that some improvements were made to armor proficiency and resource economy via Wildshaping. I think that those were good changes. However, Druid has never been a front-line melee class (with the obs exception of Moon Druid sometimes), so spellcasting has always been their main strength. They are not the Gish class.They are a Spellcasting class. It's insulting that NOT ONLY do many of the most powerful elemental spells remain out of reach of most Druids (think Fireball, Meteor Swarm, Storm Sphere), but they ALSO had their most powerful spells, the ONE area where they could outclass other spellcasters (except maybe Bards) nerfed into the ground. The fact that Conjure Animals is very evidently weaker than Spirit Guardians (which you have not disputed) just further demonstrates that the devs really are pushing Primal casting away in favor of Clerics and Wizards.
Conjure Animals had to go. A lot of people hated it. Especially DMs. It's not just the slow play, which you seem to be focusing on. The spell was straight up broken. Yes, it can be modified to make it less broken and less annoying, but the Summon spells from Tasha's have been out for a while. Your suggestions (and the suggestions of other people) tend to make these spells more like the Summon spells from Tasha's. We don't need two very similar spells on the same spell list.
It seems like you're some kind of power gamer, since you can't conceive why you'd pick a class if there's another class that's more powerful. Why do you need your class to outclass other classes? Just play something fun. Like I said before, I've played druids before, never used any Conjure spell, and I had a blast. It's possible, really, you should try it.
Conjure spells were very poorly designed, Tasha's Summon spells made much better versions of them, so they had to go. Like crzyhawk said, good riddance. You can always ask your DM if they'd let you use the 2014 versions. If they say yes, then no problem. If they say no, then I'm glad that your DM didn't feel like they had to allow a spell they don't like just because it's printed in an official book.
I've seen the changed made the 2024 PHB, so I know this is not exclusively about Conjure Animals. Conjure Minor Elementals, Conjure Woodland Beings, etc. ALL of them got seriously nerfed. Druids had very few spells Improved through the whole revision process. Grasping Vine (4th lvl) was one of the few Druid spells that got a major iimprovement...probably b/c nobody thought that spending a 4th level slot just to grab one creature was worth it. The overall problem is that Druids are a primary spellcasting class, like the Cleric, the Bard, the Sorcerer, and the Wizard. If most of their most powerful spells get nerfed, that takes a lot way from the class.
Yes, I know that some improvements were made to armor proficiency and resource economy via Wildshaping. I think that those were good changes. However, Druid has never been a front-line melee class (with the obs exception of Moon Druid sometimes), so spellcasting has always been their main strength. They are not the Gish class.They are a Spellcasting class. It's insulting that NOT ONLY do many of the most powerful elemental spells remain out of reach of most Druids (think Fireball, Meteor Swarm, Storm Sphere), but they ALSO had their most powerful spells, the ONE area where they could outclass other spellcasters (except maybe Bards) nerfed into the ground. The fact that Conjure Animals is very evidently weaker than Spirit Guardians (which you have not disputed) just further demonstrates that the devs really are pushing Primal casting away in favor of Clerics and Wizards.
Conjure Animals had to go. A lot of people hated it. Especially DMs. It's not just the slow play, which you seem to be focusing on. The spell was straight up broken. Yes, it can be modified to make it less broken and less annoying, but the Summon spells from Tasha's have been out for a while. Your suggestions (and the suggestions of other people) tend to make these spells more like the Summon spells from Tasha's. We don't need two very similar spells on the same spell list.
It seems like you're some kind of power gamer, since you can't conceive why you'd pick a class if there's another class that's more powerful. Why do you need your class to outclass other classes? Just play something fun. Like I said before, I've played druids before, never used any Conjure spell, and I had a blast. It's possible, really, you should try it.
The change to all the major conjuration spells also creates a world-building problem. Note that it's only the PC-versions of these spells that got nerfed (most heavily hurting Druids and Rangers). If you look at the 2025 Monster Manual, monsters that have Conjure Elemental, for instance, still get an actual Elemental. Whodathunk?
Also note that while Wizards got to keep Summon Aberration and Summon Construct, temporary pets that actually do stuff and have hit points besides just damage. Meanwhile Druids/Rangers lost almost half their powerful spells. This is very clearly favoritism towards a certain set of classes.
Reducing the # of beasts/elementals/fey would have been a far more reasonable solution. Heck, they could have easily put in a table at the back of the PHB or MM of suggested summonables to make it easier on the DM.
You don't need to be a power gamer to see how making alll the Conjure X spells into "do X d X damage" plus a weak rider effect literally drains the creativity out of the spell. The larger issue that a lot of people are not acknowledging is that Hasbro/WotC is slowly acclimating players to having less choices PERIOD when it comes to spell effects. Look at the new Command spell. Now much less creative potential. Look at the new Elements Monk. They ALMOST nerfed Wildshape the same way as they did the Conjure X spells. The only reason they didn't is bcause a lot of players loudly said something like "This SUXXX." But they are going to keep taking away agency from players bit by bit withe new rules updates so that in 5 years they can make a A.I. DM do all the DMing at their Digital Tabletops and rake in the $$$ - which I'm not against per se, except when it is clearly REMOVING player opportunity to be creative and to make meaningful and thematic choices for their game.
Also, if Druid/Ranger players are "power gaming" just by wanting to use conjuration spells that have actual hit points and control abilities, what does your accusation say about Wizard (and some Bard) players, who Actually get conjuration spells that get them magic pets with hit points and control abilities? (On top of what is already the best sheer variety of spells in the game.) Hypocritical, isn't it? If what I'm arguing for is "power gaming" then you should agree to wanting to nerf the Arcane spell list as well, not just the Primal spell list.
Look, the devs will clearly say ANYTHING if it's good for P.R. We saw that in 2021. Completely changing Conjure Animals and all the other big summoning spells from Druids makes the entire Shepherd Druid subclass invalid. How's that backwards compatibility?
The VTT will Not incorporate 2 different sets of rules in the system. That's precisely the kind of thing that creates bugs.
WotC is already shelving the 2014 PHB as Legacy content, which includes spell versions from 2014. Meaning it won't be sold in stores or online. That means they want to phase it out entirely from endorsed gaming events from here on out.
Running the 2014 spell isn't difficult, but it means extensive preparation and the player and DM agreeing to limit the number of beasts/fey/elementals. That is definitely do-able and should have been the go-to solution to "too slow" combat. They could have just raised the CR of the summonable and beasts/fey/elementals and capped it at 4, which makes it interesting for other players too, since they can conceivably control one beast each. The problem is solvable, but WotC wants a video game-like experience evidently, so they're claiming to "streamline" the game....by taking away player choice and agency on several spells and abilities. This doesn't just affect the Druid, either. Rangers also use the Primal spell list.
It needs to be said that a lot of people did not like the 2014 version for a variety of reasons. All I can say is I'm sorry for your loss, but, I'll no longer have to warn people that I am going to AOE clear their swarms if they get annoying or slow things down. Good riddance is my opinion.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
Conjure Animals had to go. A lot of people hated it. Especially DMs. It's not just the slow play, which you seem to be focusing on. The spell was straight up broken. Yes, it can be modified to make it less broken and less annoying, but the Summon spells from Tasha's have been out for a while. Your suggestions (and the suggestions of other people) tend to make these spells more like the Summon spells from Tasha's. We don't need two very similar spells on the same spell list.
It seems like you're some kind of power gamer, since you can't conceive why you'd pick a class if there's another class that's more powerful. Why do you need your class to outclass other classes? Just play something fun. Like I said before, I've played druids before, never used any Conjure spell, and I had a blast. It's possible, really, you should try it.
Conjure spells were very poorly designed, Tasha's Summon spells made much better versions of them, so they had to go. Like crzyhawk said, good riddance. You can always ask your DM if they'd let you use the 2014 versions. If they say yes, then no problem. If they say no, then I'm glad that your DM didn't feel like they had to allow a spell they don't like just because it's printed in an official book.
The change to all the major conjuration spells also creates a world-building problem. Note that it's only the PC-versions of these spells that got nerfed (most heavily hurting Druids and Rangers). If you look at the 2025 Monster Manual, monsters that have Conjure Elemental, for instance, still get an actual Elemental. Whodathunk?
Also note that while Wizards got to keep Summon Aberration and Summon Construct, temporary pets that actually do stuff and have hit points besides just damage. Meanwhile Druids/Rangers lost almost half their powerful spells. This is very clearly favoritism towards a certain set of classes.
Reducing the # of beasts/elementals/fey would have been a far more reasonable solution. Heck, they could have easily put in a table at the back of the PHB or MM of suggested summonables to make it easier on the DM.
You don't need to be a power gamer to see how making alll the Conjure X spells into "do X d X damage" plus a weak rider effect literally drains the creativity out of the spell. The larger issue that a lot of people are not acknowledging is that Hasbro/WotC is slowly acclimating players to having less choices PERIOD when it comes to spell effects. Look at the new Command spell. Now much less creative potential. Look at the new Elements Monk. They ALMOST nerfed Wildshape the same way as they did the Conjure X spells. The only reason they didn't is bcause a lot of players loudly said something like "This SUXXX." But they are going to keep taking away agency from players bit by bit withe new rules updates so that in 5 years they can make a A.I. DM do all the DMing at their Digital Tabletops and rake in the $$$ - which I'm not against per se, except when it is clearly REMOVING player opportunity to be creative and to make meaningful and thematic choices for their game.
Also, if Druid/Ranger players are "power gaming" just by wanting to use conjuration spells that have actual hit points and control abilities, what does your accusation say about Wizard (and some Bard) players, who Actually get conjuration spells that get them magic pets with hit points and control abilities? (On top of what is already the best sheer variety of spells in the game.) Hypocritical, isn't it? If what I'm arguing for is "power gaming" then you should agree to wanting to nerf the Arcane spell list as well, not just the Primal spell list.