I'll start right off by admitting that I may be guilty of wanting to have my cake and eat it too, but I'm trying to build a character that is both fun to play, RP'ing-wise, and effective mechanics-wise. I'm not min-maxing per se, but I want to squeeze the most out of this character without sacrificing backstory/fluff.
Hurm is a Half-Orc Ranger. His starting attributes at lvl 1 are STR 15, DEX 15, CON 13, INT 10, WIS 14, CHA 8
I want him to specialize in ranged combat (archery) but I also want him to be able to hold his own in melee combat (I'm thinking of Natty Bumppo/Hawkeye from Last of the Mohicans). To that end, at the moment, the plan is to start him off at lvl 1 as a Barbarian, mostly for backstory (childhood anger issues), but also to acquire the Rage ability (and to start off with 2 more HP than a Ranger does). I think Rage is useful at lower levels in that it halves most non-magical damage and improves STR saving throws, which can really make a difference when fighting goblins and kobolds. I'm aware that Rage probably won't scale well given that I'm going to emphasize his archery skill by focusing attribute improvements on DEX.
After one level of Barbarian for flavor, Rage, and two HP, it's Ranger [with no spells- variant from Unearthed Arcana] all the way. He'll take Archery as his fighting style.
His bow will be his go-to weapon, but for situations where he needs get up close and personal, he'll dual wield a scimitar & tomahawk (ie hand axe). The scimitar can use his DEX until he Rages, then STR kicks in. I know that I won't benefit much from dual wielding without the Two Weapon Fighting style (or associated feat) and I'm OK with that.
When he achieves his first Attribute boost, I'm thinking about adding one point each to DEX and STR. That'll improve his archery while also giving his later Rage-powered melee utility, and STR checks and saves, a bit of a boost.
Am I trying to squeeze too much out of an already non-optimal building (ie Half-Orc DEX Ranger)? Is this a viable build or is taking one level of Barbarian a waste? If it is a viable build, should I wait to take a level of Barbarian until later (after Ranger 4 or 5)? I figure, by then, Rage will be much less useful.
Have you considered taking the dragonmark variant of the half orc? It gets you plus one wisdom and strength, as well as whatever other ASI you want. You also get some very tracky abilities, essentially a slightly weaker hunters mark and similar stuff. I think that barb could or couldn't be good. With archery? Not really. Although he should be good in melee, dex based in melee is actually a bit better (higher AC).
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'The Cleverness of mushrooms always surprises me!' - Ivern Bramblefoot.
Flavor/fluff-wise, I don't particularly care for the idea that Rangers are also magic users. I guess I have a hard time separating the D&D Ranger concept from how Strider & the Dunadain rangers are portrayed in LOTR. I haven't tested the variant build out yet (or a standard, with magic Ranger build either), so I may end up changing my opinion, but I think the addition of Combat Maneuvers and Poultices for the non-magic using Ranger pretty much make up for a lack of spells. If you haven't looked at it yet, scroll down to EXAMPLE: RANGERS WITH NO SPELLS and see what you think.
I hadn't. It's an Eberron variant, no? I don't think I can go with that but thanks for the suggestion.
I'm only considering taking one lv. l of Barbarian, the rest in Ranger [With No Spells].
First of all tips specifically about the spelless ranger variant:
-take short rests often to let you replenish superiority Dice and to give yourself time to make and apply poultices
-some manuvers can be used Only with melee attacks, others can be used with both ranged and melee attacks, keep
- there is Another unearthed arcana article called class feature variants that introduces some New manuvers you could use, but they are all subject to the Approval of the dungeon master
-call natural allies does not need you to use your voice, and is more like an telepathic abillity, it cannot be used on any particular beasts and you do not get to decide how many creatures appear. Can be a fantastic source of deus ex machina if you are captured. If your group is fleeing long distances against an pursuer you might be able to do this many times
- you Will not know many manuvers, so the martial adept feat might be a Good choice since it gives you two extra manuvers and an additional Dice, while also giving you a boost to ether strength or dexterity
With all that advice out of the way:
the spelless ranger is an neat and flavourful option, and it might work out fine but please remember that it is an thing open to playtest that went through no further itterations beyond its first appearance, it might end up far weaker than expected and is more a showcase of the design process behind making New features than a proper class option.
That being Said the spelless ranger IS indeed rather cool and i can see why you would find the appeal.
I hadn't. It's an Eberron variant, no? I don't think I can go with that but thanks for the suggestion.
I'm only considering taking one lv. l of Barbarian, the rest in Ranger [With No Spells].
First of all tips specifically about the spelless ranger variant:
-take short rests often to let you replenish superiority Dice and to give yourself time to make and apply poultices
-some manuvers can be used Only with melee attacks, others can be used with both ranged and melee attacks, keep
- the text seems to contradict itself on if the ranger can or cannot apply its poultices to other People, so make shure to ask your dungeon master if you can or cannot apply them to others, it seems designed with the idea that you can and uses a lot of ambiguous language and seems to mention using it on other creatures, and it seems designed to be used on others. I Think it can be used on others
-call natural allies does not need you to use your voice, and is more like an telepathic abillity, it cannot be used on any particular beasts and you do not get to decide how many creatures appear. Can be a fantastic source of deus ex machina if you are captured. If your group is fleeing long distances against an pursuer you might be able to do this many times
- you Will not know many manuvers, so the martial adept feat might be a Good choice since it gives you two extra manuvers and an additional Dice, while also giving you a boost to ether strength or dexterity
With all that advice out of the way:
the spelless ranger is an neat and flavourful option, and it might work out fine but please remember that it is an thing open to playtest that went through no further itterations beyond its first appearance, it might end up far weaker than expected and is more a showcase of the design process behind making New features than a proper class option.
That being Said the spelless ranger IS indeed rather cool and i can see why you would find the appeal.
What is this spelless ranger?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
'The Cleverness of mushrooms always surprises me!' - Ivern Bramblefoot.
Flavor/fluff-wise, I don't particularly care for the idea that Rangers are also magic users. I guess I have a hard time separating the D&D Ranger concept from how Strider & the Dunadain rangers are portrayed in LOTR. I haven't tested the variant build out yet (or a standard, with magic Ranger build either), so I may end up changing my opinion, but I think the addition of Combat Maneuvers and Poultices for the non-magic using Ranger pretty much make up for a lack of spells. If you haven't looked at it yet, scroll down to EXAMPLE: RANGERS WITH NO SPELLS and see what you think.
I hadn't. It's an Eberron variant, no? I don't think I can go with that but thanks for the suggestion.
I'm only considering taking one lv. l of Barbarian, the rest in Ranger [With No Spells].
- you Will not know many manuvers, so the martial adept feat might be a Good choice since it gives you two extra manuvers and an additional Dice, while also giving you a boost to ether strength or dexterity
Thanks for that tip. It's definitely a Feat worth considering. The extra Superior Die that it adds is a d6 instead of d8, and it doesn't appear to give a boost to either STR or DEX. If it did give me a +1 to STR or DEX in addition to the extra CM and SD, I'd definitely take it rather than the standard Attribute boost at 4th lvl. Without that boost, I'm not sure.
If anyone is still following this thread, I decided not to dip into Barbarian. RP-wise, I've concluded that the angst-filled, raging Half-Orc is a bit cliche. Hurm is going to be chill. Mechanics-wise, the CON saving throw and two extra starting HP of the class are nice (I can boost his HP a bit by swapping STR for CON), but it probably doesn't merit delaying the acquisition of the good Ranger progression bits. As for Rage, I do like the halving of most battle damage at lower levels, but I realized that if he's getting into melee often enough to use it, then I'm probably playing him wrong (his focus is Archery). Thanks again for all of the advice.
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I'd like feedback on a character concept/build.
I'll start right off by admitting that I may be guilty of wanting to have my cake and eat it too, but I'm trying to build a character that is both fun to play, RP'ing-wise, and effective mechanics-wise. I'm not min-maxing per se, but I want to squeeze the most out of this character without sacrificing backstory/fluff.
Hurm is a Half-Orc Ranger. His starting attributes at lvl 1 are STR 15, DEX 15, CON 13, INT 10, WIS 14, CHA 8
I want him to specialize in ranged combat (archery) but I also want him to be able to hold his own in melee combat (I'm thinking of Natty Bumppo/Hawkeye from Last of the Mohicans). To that end, at the moment, the plan is to start him off at lvl 1 as a Barbarian, mostly for backstory (childhood anger issues), but also to acquire the Rage ability (and to start off with 2 more HP than a Ranger does). I think Rage is useful at lower levels in that it halves most non-magical damage and improves STR saving throws, which can really make a difference when fighting goblins and kobolds. I'm aware that Rage probably won't scale well given that I'm going to emphasize his archery skill by focusing attribute improvements on DEX.
After one level of Barbarian for flavor, Rage, and two HP, it's Ranger [with no spells- variant from Unearthed Arcana] all the way. He'll take Archery as his fighting style.
His bow will be his go-to weapon, but for situations where he needs get up close and personal, he'll dual wield a scimitar & tomahawk (ie hand axe). The scimitar can use his DEX until he Rages, then STR kicks in. I know that I won't benefit much from dual wielding without the Two Weapon Fighting style (or associated feat) and I'm OK with that.
When he achieves his first Attribute boost, I'm thinking about adding one point each to DEX and STR. That'll improve his archery while also giving his later Rage-powered melee utility, and STR checks and saves, a bit of a boost.
Am I trying to squeeze too much out of an already non-optimal building (ie Half-Orc DEX Ranger)? Is this a viable build or is taking one level of Barbarian a waste? If it is a viable build, should I wait to take a level of Barbarian until later (after Ranger 4 or 5)? I figure, by then, Rage will be much less useful.
Thanks, in advance.
Have you considered taking the dragonmark variant of the half orc? It gets you plus one wisdom and strength, as well as whatever other ASI you want. You also get some very tracky abilities, essentially a slightly weaker hunters mark and similar stuff. I think that barb could or couldn't be good. With archery? Not really. Although he should be good in melee, dex based in melee is actually a bit better (higher AC).
'The Cleverness of mushrooms always surprises me!' - Ivern Bramblefoot.
I'll worldbuild for your DnD games!
Just a D&D enjoyer, check out my fiverr page if you need any worldbuilding done for ya!
I hadn't. It's an Eberron variant, no? I don't think I can go with that but thanks for the suggestion.
I'm only considering taking one lvl of Barbarian, the rest in Ranger [With No Spells].
Why no spells? That's a part of ranger identity, and you miss out on a whole host of stuff, especially for combat. You can also get some heal etc.
'The Cleverness of mushrooms always surprises me!' - Ivern Bramblefoot.
I'll worldbuild for your DnD games!
Just a D&D enjoyer, check out my fiverr page if you need any worldbuilding done for ya!
Flavor/fluff-wise, I don't particularly care for the idea that Rangers are also magic users. I guess I have a hard time separating the D&D Ranger concept from how Strider & the Dunadain rangers are portrayed in LOTR. I haven't tested the variant build out yet (or a standard, with magic Ranger build either), so I may end up changing my opinion, but I think the addition of Combat Maneuvers and Poultices for the non-magic using Ranger pretty much make up for a lack of spells. If you haven't looked at it yet, scroll down to EXAMPLE: RANGERS WITH NO SPELLS and see what you think.
https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/unearthed-arcana/modifying-classes
-
First of all tips specifically about the spelless ranger variant:
-take short rests often to let you replenish superiority Dice and to give yourself time to make and apply poultices
-some manuvers can be used Only with melee attacks, others can be used with both ranged and melee attacks, keep
- there is Another unearthed arcana article called class feature variants that introduces some New manuvers you could use, but they are all subject to the Approval of the dungeon master
-call natural allies does not need you to use your voice, and is more like an telepathic abillity, it cannot be used on any particular beasts and you do not get to decide how many creatures appear. Can be a fantastic source of deus ex machina if you are captured. If your group is fleeing long distances against an pursuer you might be able to do this many times
- you Will not know many manuvers, so the martial adept feat might be a Good choice since it gives you two extra manuvers and an additional Dice, while also giving you a boost to ether strength or dexterity
With all that advice out of the way:
the spelless ranger is an neat and flavourful option, and it might work out fine but please remember that it is an thing open to playtest that went through no further itterations beyond its first appearance, it might end up far weaker than expected and is more a showcase of the design process behind making New features than a proper class option.
That being Said the spelless ranger IS indeed rather cool and i can see why you would find the appeal.
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
What is this spelless ranger?
'The Cleverness of mushrooms always surprises me!' - Ivern Bramblefoot.
I'll worldbuild for your DnD games!
Just a D&D enjoyer, check out my fiverr page if you need any worldbuilding done for ya!
Ah. That seems cool. What subclass are you thinking of?
'The Cleverness of mushrooms always surprises me!' - Ivern Bramblefoot.
I'll worldbuild for your DnD games!
Just a D&D enjoyer, check out my fiverr page if you need any worldbuilding done for ya!
I'm not sure what you mean.
As in, ranger archetype? Level 3 choice? Like hunter, or beast master?
'The Cleverness of mushrooms always surprises me!' - Ivern Bramblefoot.
I'll worldbuild for your DnD games!
Just a D&D enjoyer, check out my fiverr page if you need any worldbuilding done for ya!
Ok, got it. Sorry. Hunter. Gonna take Colossus slayer as Hunter's Prey feature.
Nice. Hope you the best of luck!
'The Cleverness of mushrooms always surprises me!' - Ivern Bramblefoot.
I'll worldbuild for your DnD games!
Just a D&D enjoyer, check out my fiverr page if you need any worldbuilding done for ya!
Thanks for that tip. It's definitely a Feat worth considering. The extra Superior Die that it adds is a d6 instead of d8, and it doesn't appear to give a boost to either STR or DEX. If it did give me a +1 to STR or DEX in addition to the extra CM and SD, I'd definitely take it rather than the standard Attribute boost at 4th lvl. Without that boost, I'm not sure.
If anyone is still following this thread, I decided not to dip into Barbarian. RP-wise, I've concluded that the angst-filled, raging Half-Orc is a bit cliche. Hurm is going to be chill. Mechanics-wise, the CON saving throw and two extra starting HP of the class are nice (I can boost his HP a bit by swapping STR for CON), but it probably doesn't merit delaying the acquisition of the good Ranger progression bits. As for Rage, I do like the halving of most battle damage at lower levels, but I realized that if he's getting into melee often enough to use it, then I'm probably playing him wrong (his focus is Archery). Thanks again for all of the advice.