Say you go fiend at first with the blade boon. What if you want your character to make a pact with a hexblade patron. Can you have multiple patrons and what's the limit?
You can only have 1 patron at a time. You're selling your soul, or whatever, for the pact. The way I handle this as a DM is I make it so your new patron basically buys out your old contract, like a company selling your debt to a third party. You can make it a lot of fun if you make it like you dont want your contract to be sold and lose your abilities from your old patron, or make your new one a ******, or you two not get along, etc.
I’ve seen several interesting role plays between different patrons. Most of them have been the same subclass type of patron but there can be exceptions if you choose. Here are just the ones I’ve seen.
Some are just between archdevils, over who takes better care of the warlock.
Different members of an undead council, that each want different things, so they pressure (or bribe) the warlock, to disobey the previous patrons actions and follow them (there were only 4 members on the council for simplicity)
Other more drastic I’ve seen are like, devil (fiend subclass) and angel (celestial domain) bargaining for someone’s soul.
A character switched from an efreeti patron to an archfey patron they met in the adventure.
Even fjord in critical role kind of had 2 patrons at a time (though not necessarily in a pact)
I guess what I’m saying is, if you want you can be as creative as you can get. With dm permission of course. But definitely have fun with it!
The way I handle this as a DM is I make it so your new patron basically buys out your old contract, like a company selling your debt to a third party.
This is also a great way to handle a character disobeying their patron. *Asmodeus appears out of nowhere* “Hey you [insert what they did wrong] so I traded you to Buhamut” like in sports when players get traded, warlock patrons can do it too.
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I’m a decent DM and an above average rules lawyer
I have several complete Pokedexes | I may be stupid, but at least I’m not smart!
Stay Paranoid!! My Drummer given title is… Swift as the Dragon
I sort of have two patrons right now. The primary is a succubus. Given she's not very powerful, she had to seek an outside source for arcane knowledge. Now she has an agreement with the spirit of an ancient dragon queen who has a vested interest in our party's adventures. What we're doing is, my first four levels of warlock powers are infernal themed. Fire, and lots of it, including eldritch blast being changed from force to fire damage (with all the drawback that comes from that). The dragon was blue, so moving forward, there will be a lot of lightning, instead of fireball, I'll be getting lightning bolt for example.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
What' makes up a "patron" is nebulus, though. For example, mechanically, you can't have two different patronages (e.g., Great Old One and Archfey), but there's nothing that prevents you from having your patron be a small group instead of a single entity. The Norns, an ancient Coven, etc., could be your patrons.
You could even take it to the extreme and have a "Patreon" that consists of many small entities all contributing their power to the pact. Perhaps an army of thousands of imps, quasits, pseudodragons, sprites, etc., form a council and support the fey Pact by combining their power. When you summon one for Pact of the Chain familiars, you're giving one of your patrons a special reward of being able to adventure with you. :-D
These don't change the mechanics of your character; a Great Old One Warlock is still a Great Old One warlock. It's just flavor.
Rules wise, 2014 generally refers to only ever having 1 patron but in 2024 (given this thread was created pre-2024), Archfey and Celestial both technically permit having multiple "patrons"
Archfey:
Or you might call on a spectrum of Fey, weaving a web of favors and debts.
Celestial:
Or you might call on numerous such beings as you pursue goals aligned with theirs.
Naturally it mostly depends on what DM at table permits regarding number of patrons (I personally would have allow an archfey contracting with a coven of hags in 2014 for example) but I thought it'd be worth noting that the restriction of 1 patron is not so strict in 2024.
Honestly, it doesn't matter. There's no mechanical advantage to having a coterie of patrons, so it's just fluff. DM's got the only word on the matter that counts for anything.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
under 2024 I think you can have multiple patrons. what you get from level 1-2 patron can be one, then when you hit 3rd you can get another, think of 1-2 is you are are working at job one which is your resume for your second job, what you learned at job 1 is still there though. Not sure I am a fan of the new meta, but that is how it currently exists. And i always think you could have multiple in the sense of a pantheon style concept. They all would be celestial or whatever but I don't mind the idea that you signed on with a group and not just their boss.
Honestly, it doesn't matter. There's no mechanical advantage to having a coterie of patrons, so it's just fluff. DM's got the only word on the matter that counts for anything.
Mechanically it definitely does not matter, however setting/campaign wise it can do, so it's really just going to be how DM wants to enforce things.
Somebody might insist they believe in a god that doesn't exist in setting, mechanical that doesn't matter but setting/campaign wise, it does.
So I get your argument, I just think there is more to consider about it, if you're trying to run a game world based in a particular setting where that wouldn't be the case.
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Say you go fiend at first with the blade boon. What if you want your character to make a pact with a hexblade patron. Can you have multiple patrons and what's the limit?
You can only have 1 patron at a time. You're selling your soul, or whatever, for the pact. The way I handle this as a DM is I make it so your new patron basically buys out your old contract, like a company selling your debt to a third party. You can make it a lot of fun if you make it like you dont want your contract to be sold and lose your abilities from your old patron, or make your new one a ******, or you two not get along, etc.
I’ve seen several interesting role plays between different patrons. Most of them have been the same subclass type of patron but there can be exceptions if you choose. Here are just the ones I’ve seen.
Some are just between archdevils, over who takes better care of the warlock.
Different members of an undead council, that each want different things, so they pressure (or bribe) the warlock, to disobey the previous patrons actions and follow them (there were only 4 members on the council for simplicity)
Other more drastic I’ve seen are like, devil (fiend subclass) and angel (celestial domain) bargaining for someone’s soul.
A character switched from an efreeti patron to an archfey patron they met in the adventure.
Even fjord in critical role kind of had 2 patrons at a time (though not necessarily in a pact)
I guess what I’m saying is, if you want you can be as creative as you can get. With dm permission of course. But definitely have fun with it!
This is also a great way to handle a character disobeying their patron. *Asmodeus appears out of nowhere* “Hey you [insert what they did wrong] so I traded you to Buhamut” like in sports when players get traded, warlock patrons can do it too.
I’m a decent DM and an above average rules lawyer
I have several complete Pokedexes | I may be stupid, but at least I’m not smart!
Stay Paranoid!! My Drummer given title is… Swift as the Dragon
May the dice roll ever in your favor
You can multiclass with order of the profane soul blood hunter to get multiple patrons.
DM: “Who’s your patron?”
Warlock: “Ummm”
DM: “Hurry Up”
Warlock: “yOu”
*All other players look at each other with utter fear*
__________________________________________________________________________________
Check out my homebrew: My Homebrew
I sort of have two patrons right now. The primary is a succubus. Given she's not very powerful, she had to seek an outside source for arcane knowledge. Now she has an agreement with the spirit of an ancient dragon queen who has a vested interest in our party's adventures. What we're doing is, my first four levels of warlock powers are infernal themed. Fire, and lots of it, including eldritch blast being changed from force to fire damage (with all the drawback that comes from that). The dragon was blue, so moving forward, there will be a lot of lightning, instead of fireball, I'll be getting lightning bolt for example.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
What' makes up a "patron" is nebulus, though. For example, mechanically, you can't have two different patronages (e.g., Great Old One and Archfey), but there's nothing that prevents you from having your patron be a small group instead of a single entity. The Norns, an ancient Coven, etc., could be your patrons.
You could even take it to the extreme and have a "Patreon" that consists of many small entities all contributing their power to the pact. Perhaps an army of thousands of imps, quasits, pseudodragons, sprites, etc., form a council and support the fey Pact by combining their power. When you summon one for Pact of the Chain familiars, you're giving one of your patrons a special reward of being able to adventure with you. :-D
These don't change the mechanics of your character; a Great Old One Warlock is still a Great Old One warlock. It's just flavor.
Rules wise, 2014 generally refers to only ever having 1 patron but in 2024 (given this thread was created pre-2024), Archfey and Celestial both technically permit having multiple "patrons"
Archfey:
Celestial:
Naturally it mostly depends on what DM at table permits regarding number of patrons (I personally would have allow an archfey contracting with a coven of hags in 2014 for example) but I thought it'd be worth noting that the restriction of 1 patron is not so strict in 2024.
Honestly, it doesn't matter. There's no mechanical advantage to having a coterie of patrons, so it's just fluff. DM's got the only word on the matter that counts for anything.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
under 2024 I think you can have multiple patrons. what you get from level 1-2 patron can be one, then when you hit 3rd you can get another, think of 1-2 is you are are working at job one which is your resume for your second job, what you learned at job 1 is still there though. Not sure I am a fan of the new meta, but that is how it currently exists. And i always think you could have multiple in the sense of a pantheon style concept. They all would be celestial or whatever but I don't mind the idea that you signed on with a group and not just their boss.
Mechanically it definitely does not matter, however setting/campaign wise it can do, so it's really just going to be how DM wants to enforce things.
Somebody might insist they believe in a god that doesn't exist in setting, mechanical that doesn't matter but setting/campaign wise, it does.
So I get your argument, I just think there is more to consider about it, if you're trying to run a game world based in a particular setting where that wouldn't be the case.