Me and my mates are going to be playing D&D for the first time in 2 two weeks from now. I spend a lot of time looking up rules and so on and decided to go for a divination wizard build. Note: We are only using the Players Handbook Ruleset (spells, etc.) for now.
Now for the questions. Do I need two damage cantrips? Right now I am looking to take Ray of Frost, Fire Bolt and Minor Illusion. two dmg spells because I am afraid im gonna be meeting enemies with resistances. Should I really take two dmg cantrips or is that overkill? (I only have chosen Magic missile as a dmg spell on lvl 1). What do you guys think? What do you think is most efficient as divination wizard to pick for your starting cantrips and lvl 1 spells?
It’s a matter of preference if you want more than one damaging cantrip.
Thankfully, your choice of “Minor Illusion” means that you have a lot of flexibility for out-of-combat situations.
So I think your cantrip load-out is solid.
Fire & ice pairs rather well.
You have stated that you are only using the default rules…for now.
Should you eventually implement the optional “Tasha’s Cauldron” Wizard Options, you would then be able to change a single cantrip each long rest, thus alleviating some of the “cantrip stress” that comes with character creation.
A lot of it is going to depend on the kind of game you're playing. If its going to be very, very combat heavy, then maybe two damage cantrips can make sense. But if you're going to go that route, I'd usually suggest one that makes an attack roll, and one that forces a save (like acid splash or poison spray), in case you have a high AC enemy that you have a hard time hitting. Also, you won't run into a lot of creatures with resistances at low levels. If there's not as much combat, then multiple damage cantrips aren't as good a choice.
I usually only go one damage cantrip at level 1 for pretty much any class that uses cantrips. For a halfling, you might want to pick up light as another cantrip (you can cast it right on your staff or wand or whatever, so you don't have to worry about having a free hand to hold a torch), but I'd also suggest coordinating with other casters in the party. As long as one character has light, you're good. Beyond that prestidigitation or mending can both be very, very useful.
And keep in mind you can use your portent for a lot of things, not just for tasha's. For example, if you rolled a 3, well, the next time an enemy crits one of your allies, use that 3 instead of the 20 the DM rolled. It doesn't just apply to your rolls, is the big thing to remember.
so if you had to go for a single dmg cantrip of the PHB. Which one would you choose?
i was also looking at mage hand which sounded usefull. With the light cantrip i thought its not gonna be worth the one spot as i only have 3… pretty tough choice
with the acid and poisen spells the range is kind of weak right?
so if you had to go for a single dmg cantrip of the PHB. Which one would you choose?
i was also looking at mage hand which sounded usefull. With the light cantrip i thought its not gonna be worth the one spot as i only have 3… pretty tough choice
with the acid and poisen spells the range is kind of weak right?
I think poison spray might well be the worst damage cantrip in the game, don't take it. Also, bear in mind these choices need not be permanent - once you guys get comfortable opening Tasha's, there are rules for rotating your cantrips out.
It's quite complicated picking one damage cantrip, but seeing as you have Tasha's Hideous Laughter, Mind Sliver is hard to argue with, if you can take it - didn't you say you're PHB only? Alright, I take that back, let me see what you have to pick from...
Definitely Fire Bolt. But once you crack open Tasha's and Xanathar's, Fire Bolt fades into obscurity. These are the best damaging wizard cantrips, with sources:
Toll the Dead (Xanathar's)
Create Bonfire (Xanathar's)
Mind Sliver (Tasha's)
Booming Blade (Tasha's) <- you won't actually want this, as you're the wrong build for it, but I promise it's awesome in the right hands.
For your spell load out see what other classes are in the party and if they have arcana proficiency. If someone else is rocking Detect Magic then you can use Identify instead. If you have a cleric or druid with Arcana you can have them make scrolls to assist your spellbook pokemon.
For cantrips I go with one range attack roll, one attack save and one utility spell. This helps with high AC mobs or resistance.
Personally id go with 1 damage cantrip at level 1 and see how the campaign fleshes out and maybe pick a second one at level 4. If you fo that maybe take prestidigitation or mage hand in its place. Chill touch is a worthy damage cantrip option. Also I'd ditch magic missile at level 1 and pick up sleep, it just works no saves. At level 2 take magic missile but even then in my experience your bread and butter damage will be cantrip based until level 5-6. Remember you can research spells and arent restricted to the 2 freebies per level.
Something to think about. A lot of cantrips have secondary effects. Ray of Frost slows its Target, Firebolt can affect objects as well as creatures, Chill Touch prevents its target from healing for one round, etc.. Think about that when you’re picking your cantrips.
When it comes to cantrips something else to consider, if you're using Tasha's variant rules and your dm allows "cantrip formulae" then you can swap out cantrips on a long rest after level 3.
ive decided on minor illusion. now for the last two I have 3 possible combinations:
1) Firebolt, acid splash (two dmg cantrip because fire is common resistance) - more and consistent damage (one save roll spell, one normal), less utility
2) chill touch, mage hand (Necrotic will rarely get resisted) - less damage, more utility - maybe the most average but versatile choice
3)fire bolt, mage hand (maybe pick up a light crossbow, ignore resistance for now and wait to learn more dmg cantrips) - decent damage, good utility - but risky
which one would you choose 1) , 2) or 3) ?
my dm said for the first adventure we are going to stay with PHB rules but we might open them on a later occasion so I only can choose PHB for now.
EDIT: my dm said there potantially could be a lot of fighting, depends on how we act. party: Paladin, Fighter, Bard, rogue, me
The paladin and bard likely having healing covered but if you are unsure of which cantrips to take you could go with a level of Arcana cleric for your second level. This would give you access to 5 more cantrips as well as medium armor and always prepared magic missile and detect magic. This lets you get the paladin back up if he falls with a healing word. That would mean you don’t need to waste a spell slot on mage armor
How does that work in particular that i am a cleric for level 2?
If you’re a new player, probably don’t try and multi-class. Falconcry’s advice is correct, but multiclassing can be a bit complex for people just starting out, and doing it wrong is one of the only ways to make an ineffective character.
Given your choices, I’d go with 3: firebolt, mage hand. And don’t worry about the crossbow. Your spell attack rolls will be better than ranged weapon attack rolls, and you need to actually hit before you can do any damage. Stop stressing about resistance, there’s precious little of it at low levels, and even if it happens, you still do half damage. So at worst you’re looking at half a d10, vs all of a d8. Yes, the 8 will be better when you hit (on average) but you won’t hit as often.
If I were you the cantrips I would go with are chill touch, mage hand and minor illusion. evaluate the campaign, how your spells are doing and the such at level 4 and either take a damage cantrip to augment chill touch, prestidigitation which is incredibly useful for out of the box thinkers or light depending on the party and what you guys are doing.
thank you for the advice! I am gonna go with option 3) now
yes I was also worrying about light because I have no dark vision. But I am afraid that's a trad off I have to make. I know that I have torches from my explorers pack so that will be ok for the start I guess?
EDIT: my character ddb.ac/characters/54802159/PhH5Bh
Good standard loadout of spells. You are short one spell though you get six spells at level one, I only see five listed. You should use the Tasha's optional rules to move your dex score to Int so you can prepare all four spells (having two as rituals are fine).
For my first level divination wizard I took the Acid Splash cantrip (along with Gust and Mending), and I've been using a light crossbow an awful lot since I have Dex 16 (being an Eladrin Elf).
And having written the above, I just checked and all my spells which will require attack rolls will use INT and not DEX for the attack and damage rolls! (This is my first time playing a wizard in 5E, having DMed 5E for the past year.)
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Hi Guys,
Me and my mates are going to be playing D&D for the first time in 2 two weeks from now. I spend a lot of time looking up rules and so on and decided to go for a divination wizard build. Note: We are only using the Players Handbook Ruleset (spells, etc.) for now.
Now for the questions. Do I need two damage cantrips? Right now I am looking to take Ray of Frost, Fire Bolt and Minor Illusion. two dmg spells because I am afraid im gonna be meeting enemies with resistances. Should I really take two dmg cantrips or is that overkill? (I only have chosen Magic missile as a dmg spell on lvl 1). What do you guys think? What do you think is most efficient as divination wizard to pick for your starting cantrips and lvl 1 spells?
My current build:
Hafling, Sage (Arcana, History), Investigation, Insight
Cantrips: Minor illusion, Fire Bolt, Ray of frost
Lvl1: Find familiar (R), Mage armor, Shield, Detect magic (R), Magic Missile, Tasha's Hideous Laughter (for portant)
What do you think? thank you in advance and happy rolling,
LaFiesta
It’s a matter of preference if you want more than one damaging cantrip.
Thankfully, your choice of “Minor Illusion” means that you have a lot of flexibility for out-of-combat situations.
So I think your cantrip load-out is solid.
Fire & ice pairs rather well.
You have stated that you are only using the default rules…for now.
Should you eventually implement the optional “Tasha’s Cauldron” Wizard Options, you would then be able to change a single cantrip each long rest, thus alleviating some of the “cantrip stress” that comes with character creation.
A lot of it is going to depend on the kind of game you're playing. If its going to be very, very combat heavy, then maybe two damage cantrips can make sense. But if you're going to go that route, I'd usually suggest one that makes an attack roll, and one that forces a save (like acid splash or poison spray), in case you have a high AC enemy that you have a hard time hitting. Also, you won't run into a lot of creatures with resistances at low levels. If there's not as much combat, then multiple damage cantrips aren't as good a choice.
I usually only go one damage cantrip at level 1 for pretty much any class that uses cantrips. For a halfling, you might want to pick up light as another cantrip (you can cast it right on your staff or wand or whatever, so you don't have to worry about having a free hand to hold a torch), but I'd also suggest coordinating with other casters in the party. As long as one character has light, you're good. Beyond that prestidigitation or mending can both be very, very useful.
And keep in mind you can use your portent for a lot of things, not just for tasha's. For example, if you rolled a 3, well, the next time an enemy crits one of your allies, use that 3 instead of the 20 the DM rolled. It doesn't just apply to your rolls, is the big thing to remember.
Ok thank you guys!
so if you had to go for a single dmg cantrip of the PHB. Which one would you choose?
i was also looking at mage hand which sounded usefull. With the light cantrip i thought its not gonna be worth the one spot as i only have 3… pretty tough choice
with the acid and poisen spells the range is kind of weak right?
I think poison spray might well be the worst damage cantrip in the game, don't take it. Also, bear in mind these choices need not be permanent - once you guys get comfortable opening Tasha's, there are rules for rotating your cantrips out.
It's quite complicated picking one damage cantrip, but seeing as you have Tasha's Hideous Laughter, Mind Sliver is hard to argue with, if you can take it - didn't you say you're PHB only? Alright, I take that back, let me see what you have to pick from...
Definitely Fire Bolt. But once you crack open Tasha's and Xanathar's, Fire Bolt fades into obscurity. These are the best damaging wizard cantrips, with sources:
For your spell load out see what other classes are in the party and if they have arcana proficiency. If someone else is rocking Detect Magic then you can use Identify instead. If you have a cleric or druid with Arcana you can have them make scrolls to assist your spellbook pokemon.
For cantrips I go with one range attack roll, one attack save and one utility spell. This helps with high AC mobs or resistance.
Personally id go with 1 damage cantrip at level 1 and see how the campaign fleshes out and maybe pick a second one at level 4. If you fo that maybe take prestidigitation or mage hand in its place. Chill touch is a worthy damage cantrip option. Also I'd ditch magic missile at level 1 and pick up sleep, it just works no saves. At level 2 take magic missile but even then in my experience your bread and butter damage will be cantrip based until level 5-6. Remember you can research spells and arent restricted to the 2 freebies per level.
Something to think about. A lot of cantrips have secondary effects. Ray of Frost slows its Target, Firebolt can affect objects as well as creatures, Chill Touch prevents its target from healing for one round, etc.. Think about that when you’re picking your cantrips.
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When it comes to cantrips something else to consider, if you're using Tasha's variant rules and your dm allows "cantrip formulae" then you can swap out cantrips on a long rest after level 3.
Thank you guys so much for the help!
ive decided on minor illusion. now for the last two I have 3 possible combinations:
1) Firebolt, acid splash (two dmg cantrip because fire is common resistance) - more and consistent damage (one save roll spell, one normal), less utility
2) chill touch, mage hand (Necrotic will rarely get resisted) - less damage, more utility - maybe the most average but versatile choice
3)fire bolt, mage hand (maybe pick up a light crossbow, ignore resistance for now and wait to learn more dmg cantrips) - decent damage, good utility - but risky
which one would you choose 1) , 2) or 3) ?
my dm said for the first adventure we are going to stay with PHB rules but we might open them on a later occasion so I only can choose PHB for now.
EDIT: my dm said there potantially could be a lot of fighting, depends on how we act. party: Paladin, Fighter, Bard, rogue, me
The paladin and bard likely having healing covered but if you are unsure of which cantrips to take you could go with a level of Arcana cleric for your second level. This would give you access to 5 more cantrips as well as medium armor and always prepared magic missile and detect magic. This lets you get the paladin back up if he falls with a healing word. That would mean you don’t need to waste a spell slot on mage armor
How does that work in particular that i am a cleric for level 2?
If you’re a new player, probably don’t try and multi-class. Falconcry’s advice is correct, but multiclassing can be a bit complex for people just starting out, and doing it wrong is one of the only ways to make an ineffective character.
Given your choices, I’d go with 3: firebolt, mage hand. And don’t worry about the crossbow. Your spell attack rolls will be better than ranged weapon attack rolls, and you need to actually hit before you can do any damage. Stop stressing about resistance, there’s precious little of it at low levels, and even if it happens, you still do half damage. So at worst you’re looking at half a d10, vs all of a d8. Yes, the 8 will be better when you hit (on average) but you won’t hit as often.
If I were you the cantrips I would go with are chill touch, mage hand and minor illusion. evaluate the campaign, how your spells are doing and the such at level 4 and either take a damage cantrip to augment chill touch, prestidigitation which is incredibly useful for out of the box thinkers or light depending on the party and what you guys are doing.
thank you for the advice! I am gonna go with option 3) now
yes I was also worrying about light because I have no dark vision. But I am afraid that's a trad off I have to make. I know that I have torches from my explorers pack so that will be ok for the start I guess?
EDIT: my character ddb.ac/characters/54802159/PhH5Bh
Good standard loadout of spells. You are short one spell though you get six spells at level one, I only see five listed. You should use the Tasha's optional rules to move your dex score to Int so you can prepare all four spells (having two as rituals are fine).
I do have 6 one doenst show up there as it is not prepared. Sadly, as i said, were only using PHB. Ill talk to my dm if we can add some rules
For my first level divination wizard I took the Acid Splash cantrip (along with Gust and Mending), and I've been using a light crossbow an awful lot since I have Dex 16 (being an Eladrin Elf).
And having written the above, I just checked and all my spells which will require attack rolls will use INT and not DEX for the attack and damage rolls! (This is my first time playing a wizard in 5E, having DMed 5E for the past year.)