The way I understand this website, it's a huge searchable database. You don't have the option to "consult" a book per say, you just search for what you need. This makes finding material very fast and it also makes it very hard to copy since the format isn't readily view able all at once. Anyways that's the way I understand it.
If it's like $1 a month, I might be able to do that. Seems reasonable.
I'm going to assume it will be at least 6 bucks a month for the most basic stuff, and up to 20 a month for "everything" which is ludicrous. If anything, it should be like a flat 10 dollar fee once per year.
The way I understand this website, it's a huge searchable database. You don't have the option to "consult" a book per say, you just search for what you need. This makes finding material very fast and it also makes it very hard to copy since the format isn't readily view able all at once. Anyways that's the way I understand it.
If it's like $1 a month, I might be able to do that. Seems reasonable.
I'm going to assume it will be at least 6 bucks a month for the most basic stuff, and up to 20 a month for "everything" which is ludicrous. If anything, it should be like a flat 10 dollar fee once per year.
The way I understand this website, it's a huge searchable database. You don't have the option to "consult" a book per say, you just search for what you need. This makes finding material very fast and it also makes it very hard to copy since the format isn't readily view able all at once. Anyways that's the way I understand it.
Ever heard of google?
I did, what I meant is that I believe that a monthly fee of around $10 to have access legally to quick, unlimited and searchable information from any book is valuable and reasonable in my opinion. :) But that's my point of view, I can also easily understand that other people have an issue with paying a monthly fee, especially if you don't play D&D often!
I like both ideas and to expand on the one time fee, it should be available without connection to the internet. The second part would be awesome if it was updated with all content for a monthly fee at no additional cost. But $14.99 is a bit expensive for a subscription for a 352 page book (ex MM).
I'm pretty sure that Tyraz was stating that $14.99 was the monthly subscription price that got you everything (so, all of the books, as well as all of the extra features like unlimited character slots, etc.). And, should you let the subscription lapse, you lose access to that paid content (so only SRD, can't create new characters until you delete enough although all your previous ones are still usable, etc.). This would be an alternative to purchasing each book individually as a one-time purchase.
At least, that's what I would assume would be covered for such a subscription cost -- I'd feel very cheated if I was having to pay a sub around that level and then also had to buy all the books individually as well. I should be able to either get a sub that unlocks everything as long as I pay, or to pay as I go on each book individually but then have that content as long as D&D Beyond is a thing.
>>I did, what I meant is that I believe that a monthly fee of around $10 to have access legally to quick, unlimited and searchable information from any book is valuable and reasonable in my opinion. :) But that's my point of view, I can also easily understand that other people have an issue with paying a monthly fee, especially if you don't play D&D often!
10 bucks a month is ridiculous! How can people think that's a legit, acceptable price?? Regardless whether or not you make 40 dollars an hour or minimum wage or whatever. I played 2 sessions a week each one 6-10 hours long, it's not that I don't play a lot of d&d it's just that the price simply isn't worth it. You can just hit up an app on your phone and for an entire compendium for spells and monsters and what not for free!
You play D&D 4 times more than I do, and I would say that $10/month would be a fair price for everything I outlined in my post above ($15 would be pushing it, I don't think WotC's release cadence for hardbacks is swift enough to merit that price).
You can get the free SRD content on this site for free, or you can get it from dozens of other sites and apps for free. The subscription would ideally unlock all official content as well, meaning you get all of the non-SRD stuff that you can't find on other sites or apps, at least not legally or for free (for the ones that are legal, expect to re-buy all of the books again at full price).
I also think people are only focused on books. There are other great tools I'm really looking forward to and as a DM, if this tool makes managing my campaign much faster, I am totally willing to pay $10 a month for it. :)
Also...you play like 50 HOURS of D&D per month, $10 for a very very useful service (for you) amounts to 20 cents an hour in your case. It's not SO bad I'd say.
But hey, we don't know the pricing model yet, maybe they will come up with something great that satisfies everyone, who knows!
I also think people are only focused on books. There are other great tools I'm really looking forward to and as a DM, if this tool makes managing my campaign much faster, I am totally willing to pay $10 a month for it. :)
Also...you play like 50 HOURS of D&D per month, $10 for a very very useful service (for you) amounts to 20 cents an hour in your case. It's not SO bad I'd say.
But hey, we don't know the pricing model yet, maybe they will come up with something great that satisfies everyone, who knows!
50 hours a week? That's insane. Literally more than a full time job. Oh how envious I am of that group...
Here is the problem with speculating costs with what we would actually want to see for our money as consumers (I work for a cable company so I have the joy of getting yelled at once a year because the price changed for this reason as well). To be able to offer all materials there would have to be more than just a partnership to develop and release this as a full tool for everything. A few things would have to happen:
1. WotC would need to convince their parent company Hasbro, to allow them to set up the kind of partnership need to make that happen.
2. WotC and Curse would then need to get together and negotiate an annual licensing fee (in the cable industry this is usually the cable company paying X per subscriber, but I would hope it would be more reasonable with WotC). The other option of negotiation would either be investment (not likely) or profit sharing (i.e. WotC gets X% of profits).
With that in mind remember that the licensing prices are controlled by WotC who, in turn, does have to report to Hasbro. In spite of what people think WotC does care about us. That's why when they worked on developing 5e we were able to play test it and submit feedback. That's why they put out some material for us to play test and send feedback (like psionics).
Don't get me wrong I would love to see a monthly fee gets you free access to all of the content, but it won't happen. The best that would happen is that all hardcover books going forward would have a code that you can use to redeem for a digital library copy either here directly or that you can link to your Beyond account. I would also like to see it where if you already own a digital copy (regardless of where you purchased it from, drive thru, roll20, fantasy grounds, etc.) that you can link it to your Beyond account.
But we'll have to wait and see what the pricing will look like once Beyond officially goes live and is no longer in beta.
I also think people are only focused on books. There are other great tools I'm really looking forward to and as a DM, if this tool makes managing my campaign much faster, I am totally willing to pay $10 a month for it. :)
Also...you play like 50 HOURS of D&D per month, $10 for a very very useful service (for you) amounts to 20 cents an hour in your case. It's not SO bad I'd say.
But hey, we don't know the pricing model yet, maybe they will come up with something great that satisfies everyone, who knows!
And you hit more of what I am looking for as well. I can make notes of what supplement and what page in my hard cover books if it ends up needing to pay full price again. I do that anyway, so that would not change in and of itself. If I can get a bundle discount for the core books I might buy them digitally, but I would have to consider that very carefully. It's part of why I haven't touched Fantasy Grounds.
I am always on the lookout for a better method to manage my campaigns (especially since I'm working on writing 3 level 1-20 campaigns. 1 of them is for 2e though, so I wouldn't be able to use Beyond for it (unless they have plans to expand into previous editions later). Our campaigns take a while longer since we get about 8 hours a month of game play. I would still pay $10 a month for a subscription as long as the character creator, homebrew, and campaign manager tools are spot on.
What if you are already paying for access to the 4th edition stuff like the character builder, would this set of tools be included or would it be an additional cost?
What if you are already paying for access to the 4th edition stuff like the character builder, would this set of tools be included or would it be an additional cost?
The D&D Beyond toolset is fully separate from the 4th edition toolset.
We don't have information on pricing structures yet, so unable to let you know whether there will be any saving for subscribing to both, but I suspect the answer is no.
What if you are already paying for access to the 4th edition stuff like the character builder, would this set of tools be included or would it be an additional cost?
The D&D Beyond toolset is fully separate from the 4th edition toolset.
We don't have information on pricing structures yet, so unable to let you know whether there will be any saving for subscribing to both, but I suspect the answer is no.
That's the wrrrooonnngg answer bud.... hopefully that will change to "It will be included."
I don't have visibility on any commercial discussions that may be going on.
That's the main message really at this point - there are lots of questions and I really understand why - I have the same questions myself, but there just aren't answers available until the commercial discussions are completed.
I'm certain that a member of staff will let everyone know what the pricing will be when those discussions are complete.
In the meantime, let's please try not to assume the worst!
Stormknight, You are correct. We as the public, myself included, sometimes start a conversations that are all well and good... It then snowballs into something it wasn't intended to be. I can't speak for everyone but I can speak for myself and say that I apologize for any misgivings in my posts and the consequences it has lead to. We all can probably agree that we want a product that surpasses the competition and have a price is to shake up the market in the process. That would be our dream. (i.e. better quality at a cheaper price) We don't have a clue to what price this product will go for, but we do like to speculate, that is just human nature. So, if anything, this thread is our "rocking chair". (an old but effective analogy)
Until then, I can smile, dream and play D&D!! Isn't that why we are here in the first place?? :)
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-There are no right or wrong answers, just difficult Choices.
I think the opposition to $14.99/MO is the the long term pricing and the fact that most groups meet twice a month tops. If you meet twice a month that comes down to $7.50/sit. That price per sit goes up overall after every missed session because of any number of reasons a session has to be canceled. It also goes down if you get a 3rd sit in but for ease of pricing we will assume 2sit/MO is average for most groups.
at $14.99/MO you are dishing out $180/yr for content which is $30 more than the three core books. Which is totally fair given server upkeep and the convenience of searchable database. But subsequent years is where it begins to become a heavier financial burden because the books will last indefinitely (barring some tragedy) but you continue to pay nearly $180/yr (a lot more than Amazon Prime which consists of two different streaming services, free shipping, and reduced ebook prices.) There will be other books included in the full version I assume which will bring the overall HC equivalent cost up a bit but overall it will be rough to find $180/yr for it.
Hum... Getting a free book out of it, i.e. for a continued subscription to the service.... that would be fair. I mean, if we are already paying $180 a year for this service, why not? (yes, I know there is no price set ATM) That would entice the "Fence Sitters" to start paying. No other company does this, and again, I say, this company needs to do something that shakes up the market so they can dominate this medium.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
-There are no right or wrong answers, just difficult Choices.
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The way I understand this website, it's a huge searchable database. You don't have the option to "consult" a book per say, you just search for what you need. This makes finding material very fast and it also makes it very hard to copy since the format isn't readily view able all at once. Anyways that's the way I understand it.
Far more than it's worth, that's for sure.
If it's like $1 a month, I might be able to do that. Seems reasonable.
I'm going to assume it will be at least 6 bucks a month for the most basic stuff, and up to 20 a month for "everything" which is ludicrous. If anything, it should be like a flat 10 dollar fee once per year.
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You play D&D 4 times more than I do, and I would say that $10/month would be a fair price for everything I outlined in my post above ($15 would be pushing it, I don't think WotC's release cadence for hardbacks is swift enough to merit that price).
You can get the free SRD content on this site for free, or you can get it from dozens of other sites and apps for free. The subscription would ideally unlock all official content as well, meaning you get all of the non-SRD stuff that you can't find on other sites or apps, at least not legally or for free (for the ones that are legal, expect to re-buy all of the books again at full price).
I also think people are only focused on books. There are other great tools I'm really looking forward to and as a DM, if this tool makes managing my campaign much faster, I am totally willing to pay $10 a month for it. :)
Also...you play like 50 HOURS of D&D per month, $10 for a very very useful service (for you) amounts to 20 cents an hour in your case. It's not SO bad I'd say.
But hey, we don't know the pricing model yet, maybe they will come up with something great that satisfies everyone, who knows!
Here is the problem with speculating costs with what we would actually want to see for our money as consumers (I work for a cable company so I have the joy of getting yelled at once a year because the price changed for this reason as well). To be able to offer all materials there would have to be more than just a partnership to develop and release this as a full tool for everything. A few things would have to happen:
1. WotC would need to convince their parent company Hasbro, to allow them to set up the kind of partnership need to make that happen.
2. WotC and Curse would then need to get together and negotiate an annual licensing fee (in the cable industry this is usually the cable company paying X per subscriber, but I would hope it would be more reasonable with WotC). The other option of negotiation would either be investment (not likely) or profit sharing (i.e. WotC gets X% of profits).
With that in mind remember that the licensing prices are controlled by WotC who, in turn, does have to report to Hasbro. In spite of what people think WotC does care about us. That's why when they worked on developing 5e we were able to play test it and submit feedback. That's why they put out some material for us to play test and send feedback (like psionics).
Don't get me wrong I would love to see a monthly fee gets you free access to all of the content, but it won't happen. The best that would happen is that all hardcover books going forward would have a code that you can use to redeem for a digital library copy either here directly or that you can link to your Beyond account. I would also like to see it where if you already own a digital copy (regardless of where you purchased it from, drive thru, roll20, fantasy grounds, etc.) that you can link it to your Beyond account.
But we'll have to wait and see what the pricing will look like once Beyond officially goes live and is no longer in beta.
"Wisdom begins in wonder" - Socrates
It's worth mentioning that Wizards of the Coast and Curse already have a good working partnership with the Magic the Gathering IP.
Pun-loving nerd | Faith Elisabeth Lilley | She/Her/Hers | Profile art by Becca Golins
If you need help with homebrew, please post on the homebrew forums, where multiple staff and moderators can read your post and help you!
"We got this, no problem! I'll take the twenty on the left - you guys handle the one on the right!"🔊
I am always on the lookout for a better method to manage my campaigns (especially since I'm working on writing 3 level 1-20 campaigns. 1 of them is for 2e though, so I wouldn't be able to use Beyond for it (unless they have plans to expand into previous editions later). Our campaigns take a while longer since we get about 8 hours a month of game play. I would still pay $10 a month for a subscription as long as the character creator, homebrew, and campaign manager tools are spot on.
"Wisdom begins in wonder" - Socrates
That is actually good to know. I did not know that since I haven't played MtG since 2010 and am working on getting rid of my Magic cards.
"Wisdom begins in wonder" - Socrates
What if you are already paying for access to the 4th edition stuff like the character builder, would this set of tools be included or would it be an additional cost?
Pun-loving nerd | Faith Elisabeth Lilley | She/Her/Hers | Profile art by Becca Golins
If you need help with homebrew, please post on the homebrew forums, where multiple staff and moderators can read your post and help you!
"We got this, no problem! I'll take the twenty on the left - you guys handle the one on the right!"🔊
I don't have visibility on any commercial discussions that may be going on.
That's the main message really at this point - there are lots of questions and I really understand why - I have the same questions myself, but there just aren't answers available until the commercial discussions are completed.
I'm certain that a member of staff will let everyone know what the pricing will be when those discussions are complete.
In the meantime, let's please try not to assume the worst!
Pun-loving nerd | Faith Elisabeth Lilley | She/Her/Hers | Profile art by Becca Golins
If you need help with homebrew, please post on the homebrew forums, where multiple staff and moderators can read your post and help you!
"We got this, no problem! I'll take the twenty on the left - you guys handle the one on the right!"🔊
Stormknight, You are correct. We as the public, myself included, sometimes start a conversations that are all well and good... It then snowballs into something it wasn't intended to be. I can't speak for everyone but I can speak for myself and say that I apologize for any misgivings in my posts and the consequences it has lead to. We all can probably agree that we want a product that surpasses the competition and have a price is to shake up the market in the process. That would be our dream. (i.e. better quality at a cheaper price) We don't have a clue to what price this product will go for, but we do like to speculate, that is just human nature. So, if anything, this thread is our "rocking chair". (an old but effective analogy)
Until then, I can smile, dream and play D&D!! Isn't that why we are here in the first place?? :)
-There are no right or wrong answers, just difficult Choices.
I think the opposition to $14.99/MO is the the long term pricing and the fact that most groups meet twice a month tops. If you meet twice a month that comes down to $7.50/sit. That price per sit goes up overall after every missed session because of any number of reasons a session has to be canceled. It also goes down if you get a 3rd sit in but for ease of pricing we will assume 2sit/MO is average for most groups.
at $14.99/MO you are dishing out $180/yr for content which is $30 more than the three core books. Which is totally fair given server upkeep and the convenience of searchable database. But subsequent years is where it begins to become a heavier financial burden because the books will last indefinitely (barring some tragedy) but you continue to pay nearly $180/yr (a lot more than Amazon Prime which consists of two different streaming services, free shipping, and reduced ebook prices.) There will be other books included in the full version I assume which will bring the overall HC equivalent cost up a bit but overall it will be rough to find $180/yr for it.
Hum... Getting a free book out of it, i.e. for a continued subscription to the service.... that would be fair. I mean, if we are already paying $180 a year for this service, why not? (yes, I know there is no price set ATM) That would entice the "Fence Sitters" to start paying. No other company does this, and again, I say, this company needs to do something that shakes up the market so they can dominate this medium.
-There are no right or wrong answers, just difficult Choices.