Maybe some of you know that Hasbro is releasing a new MTG set very soon. A lot of complaints have been made because of the growing price tag. I used to play MTG myself, but saw the growing costs of playing and jumped ship years ago. Actually I started playing D&D because I was looking for a much cheaper alternative to MTG.
I was wondering if you think this new set will be the straw that broke the camel's back for many players, and how the D&D community could use that to our advantage to get more players to the game.
Really, I see them as completely separate things. Thematically they're both fantasy, but mechanically they're different animals entirely. So I wouldn't think there'd be much cross-over because of this.
I agree -- they have nothing to do with each other except the "thematic" material, and the fact that one company (rather unfortunately, in my opinion) happens to own them both. They don't play anything like each other, and I see no reason why someone who likes D&D would necessarily want to play a competitive trading card game, or vice versa.
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WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
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one company (rather unfortunately, in my opinion) happens to own them both
MtG is what allowed WotC to buy the D&D IP, at a time when it was all but dead. I think it was pretty fortunate WotC saw fit to buy the D&D rights from TSR.
Other than that, there's not that much to the connection. Sure, we got a bunch of crossover MtG settings for D&D, but a cityscape setting like what we got with Ravnica would have been useful to me regardless of the IP context and setting books have always been a take them or leave them option (I picked up a bit of Dragonlance stuff in earlier editions but mostly that's a setting I left largely alone, for instance).
All that said though, I agree this isn't really a communicating vessels type situation. Players who grow bored or otherwise dissatisfied with one won't naturally gravitate towards the other.
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There's a sort of "MtG vs D&D" presumption in the OP where it's unclear whether the poster is aware the two brands are owned by the same company. They're not in competition so there isn't a "if MtG fans are dropping D&D can swoop in" logic to the respective brand's business plans. Rather, if anything, both brands try to make use of each other to grow their respective player base and ideally get folks who play both. That's why we have D&D content like Theros, Ravinica and Strgyxwhatever, as well as the Planeshift content. Magic is either producing or has forthcoming Forgotten Realms themed sets. The relationship is synergistic not antagonistic, at least form the businesses. Fans hard in one or the other camp can go as hard at each other as they want, but there's not actual fight.
When Magic first became a big thing, I actually remember it not hitting TTRPG so much as it did the comic book industry. I don't have any hard info to back it up, but I remember Magic was ascendent just around the time the comic book boom was busting (presses were closing and more dramatically shops were closing). A lot of armchair folks thought the money people used to be putting into comics were going to collectible card games. Dates are hazy but I remember comic shops shuttering while White Wolf's Storyteller system was ascendant I think Cypberpunk 2020 was in its heyday ... I don't know if MtG ever really hurt D&D.
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Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Magic's biggest impact was on game stores, and indirectly on other games being played there. Not poaching, just hogging the spotlight. MtG was (and presumably to a certain extent still is) the games stores' cash cow, and it's a game that gets played in stores as much as, if not more than, at home. You might pop in at the store over lunch or after work for a boardgame or a quick skirmish minis game and you'd find most of the tables taken by card players. FNM took over Fridays, but Magic was the dominant game at other times as well. That changed the atmosphere, and shop owners saw where their revenue was coming from and realized the table space they gave up in the store to attract customers made ten or twenty or more times as much money for them if they were used by MtG players than by boardgame fans, TTRPG groups or wargamers. But if you go into a store for something, either for yourself or for your kids or to get someone a present, and you notice that thing isn't actually played a lot (at least not in the store, which is where you'd get your first and most impactful impression) and that the owners all seem to be busy with something else and everyone who's playing at the store is also playing that other thing, that can shift where the interests of whoever you're there for will go. Magic certainly 'reformed' people who were into other hobbies prior, but mostly - insofar as my recollection is accurate - it diverted the flow of prospective new blood away from everything else.
Magic's biggest impact was on game stores, and indirectly on other games being played there. Not poaching, just hogging the spotlight. MtG was (and presumably to a certain extent still is) the games stores' cash cow, a
It's also interesting because MtG usually takes up a lot less retail floor real estate, by nature of its size in comparision to TTRPG and minis. In the game store I frequent I couldn't tell you where the cards are, but I'm sure there there as when they had in store gaming Magic took up a lot more table space than any other game.
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Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Magic's biggest impact was on game stores, and indirectly on other games being played there. Not poaching, just hogging the spotlight. MtG was (and presumably to a certain extent still is) the games stores' cash cow, a
It's also interesting because MtG usually takes up a lot less retail floor real estate, by nature of its size in comparision to TTRPG and minis. In the game store I frequent I couldn't tell you where the cards are, but I'm sure there there as when they had in store gaming Magic took up a lot more table space than any other game.
Yup. I hit Reply a little early, but that's where my post was headed. MtG is usually much more visible in terms of being played than anything else. Or was anyway, the last half decade or so I've mostly frequented stores and clubs with dedicated game room (via club fees) for the minis games - wargaming really thrives on clubs, playing the same less-than-a-handful of people at home just doesn't cut it if you're an enthusiast - so depending on where you go things might look differently. I'm sure it's still the most popular kid (in the cool kids club of CCGs to begin with) in stores though. Great for store owners that blister boxes take up next to no shelf space compared to everything else too.
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I am a dm, I don't have to buy the magic tie in books. I don't play magic. But I have players which do play magic. And I have gain players from Magic. Magic does pay the bills in my FLGS and it does let us play free do to being a piggy bank for the FLGS.
I do not think D&D and MTG directly compete with each other. TTRPGs is a very niche hobby, and while there is a lot of potential for growth, sitting around a table to play pretend is not exactly most people's idea of fun. It is far easier to get my friends to play the big three card games than D&D.
As for the increasing price tag of card games, i think that is due to people being stuck at home with nothing much to do, economic stimulus injecting a lot of cash into people's pockets, and there is an increasing interest in investing in nostalgia. The stock market's quick recovery and continued rise in price through out the pandemic is another outcome of that, with Reddit's attempt to send Gamestop to the moon being the prime example.
I do not think D&D and MTG directly compete with each other.
You can take it from someone who works in a LGS as a Community Manager and Tournament Organizer - they don't. I myself either play or DM with 13 others who also all play MtG, and I know around 15+ others in our community who play both MtG and other non-D&D RPGs.
If you can spend 20 - 30 bucks every week on MtG tournaments you can spend that much on dice and pen & paper ONCE to be a RPG player.
Money isn't the issue to get into RPGs - its time to play, space to play in, and people who you feel comfortable with.
I myself started playing MtG in 1999, and D&D in 2002, and in all that time I have NEVER, not even ONCE, played in any of the "official" WotC D&D settings, so any and all crossover products like CR and even MtG books are welcome to me because I only care about the mechanical additions and the design ideas anyway.
And regarding the OPs comments about the "rising prices of Magic sets" they are omitting key facts, so let me set this straight and lay it out for people who are unfamiliar with MtG:
every year WotC will put out 3 - 4 "standard" magic sets - those will be priced around about 100$
every year WotC will put out 1 "non-standard" magic set - those will be priced around about 150$
magic sets are produced far FAR in advance of their release - once the street date hits you need THOUSANDS upon THOUSANDS of boxes ready to be shipped
my store will order 200 boxes of every standard set upon release - and we are SMALL! I know stores that order 200 JUST FOR THEIR ONLINE SHOP!
due to COVID-19 production of cards is negativly effected - stuff that should be available this year was supposed to be produced from Q3 2019 into 2020, and because of work interruptions there are now shortages
because of the COVID-related interruptions the "non-standard" magic set production time were further shortened so they could guarantee a steady supply of the "standard" magic sets
this year there are 2 "non-standard" sets - the first one was 150$ on release but jumped to around 220$ later because of increased demand and lack of availability; the second one will release next week and is around 200$ to begin with - this price might increase because of the same issues as with the first set
the price difference between "standard" and "non-standard" sets is due to most cards in the former having more "new" cards (which seldom have single cards being worth more than 30$) and the latter having more "old and reprinted" cards (which will almost always include moderatley expensive and highly sought after cards, or a higher density of cards that are around 30$)
from what I have gathered in our community and online, the overwhelming majority of players is SUPER EXCITED for this 2nd "non-standard" set - not only because it includes powerful new cards and highly sought-after old cards, but because there are many nostalgic references to cards and expansions 15-20 years ago (for example, in 2004 there was a set of 3 artifact weapons that together summoned an avatar - then the world got corrupted in 2011 - and now, after 17 years, we get the corrupted version of those artifacts! Pure Nostalgia)
So no, magic sets DID NOT become much more expensive. In fact I believe - and I will check with my boss - in the last 22 years the price for a box of Magic cards went up by 10%.
I do not think D&D and MTG directly compete with each other.
You can take it from someone who works in a LGS as a Community Manager and Tournament Organizer - they don't. I myself either play or DM with 13 others who also all play MtG, and I know around 15+ others in our community who play both MtG and other non-D&D RPGs.
If you can spend 20 - 30 bucks every week on MtG tournaments you can spend that much on dice and pen & paper ONCE to be a RPG player.
Money isn't the issue to get into RPGs - its time to play, space to play in, and people who you feel comfortable with.
Yeah. You do not even need to spend money on dice, pen, and paper if you have a smartphone and go digital (you still have to pay for the smartphone, but most people have a smartphone whether or not they play D&D, so you might as well save a few trees). You can roll dice on Google, and you can download character sheets from Wizards and edit them in your smartphone. There is also Beyond right here if copying and pasting stuff from the BR/SRD to the PDF character sheet is too laborious. GMs do not even have to spend money on adventures either as Wizards have a ton of free official ones too.
Late to the party but I just wanted to point out Doomdrake is right. This Magic set isn’t a rise in price: it’s a special set with powerful cards that are only allowed in more expensive formats that can use cards from many years ago. So the premise of the thread is just not factual.
And as you can see, I do play both games…though Magic is definitely more of a cash sink than it needs to be!
this year there are 2 "non-standard" sets - the first one was 150$ on release but jumped to around 220$ later because of increased demand and lack of availability; the second one will release next week and is around 200$ to begin with - this price might increase because of the same issues as with the first set
the price difference between "standard" and "non-standard" sets is due to most cards in the former having more "new" cards (which seldom have single cards being worth more than 30$) and the latter having more "old and reprinted" cards (which will almost always include moderatley expensive and highly sought after cards, or a higher density of cards that are around 30$)
Very much. What the OP calls a "growing price tag" is (a) a symptom of pandemic related supply issues that has affected everything from fresh corn to high end video cards and (b) Modern Masters 2 is a premium set to begin with, for reasons quoted above, and anybody complaining about the price probably isn't very invested in the game to begin with or they would know this. I play both MtG and D&D and I can tell you that every time a premium set comes out (pandemic aside) my LGS has at least double the attendance for the regular Friday night draft tournament, which involves buying those premium packs, compared to the regular showing for the standard drafts.
And a lot of the regulars I've played with also either play D&D regularly or express interest in it if not complain about not being able to find time for a consistent game. Just before the quarantine hit I was part of a group scheduled to have a session zero the next week, in store, and most of us in that group found out about the DM looking to put a game together while in the shop to play Magic. The two games compliment each other and feed each other, and absolutely do not compete. That's why there are MtG based D&D sourcebooks and it's why there's a Forgotten Realms Magic set coming out imminently. The first crossover was Ravnica, which is arguably the most popular setting in MtG among players who are big on the lore that is literally printed on the cards to tell a story with each set (there have now been nine Ravnica sets and it's a given that there will be more sooner or later). Those lore junkies who like to build themed commander decks around their favorite Ravnican guild are exactly the kind of people that decide to take the plunge into D&D because it added their favorite setting to it's canon. I will admit surprise that they're going with Strixhaven for that next, as I think Kaldheim is much better suited to D&D with it's epic viking theme, but nobody from WotC has bothered to ask my opinion on the matter.
D&D and MtG pretty much are Wizards of the Coast, financially speaking.
this year there are 2 "non-standard" sets - the first one was 150$ on release but jumped to around 220$ later because of increased demand and lack of availability; the second one will release next week and is around 200$ to begin with - this price might increase because of the same issues as with the first set
the price difference between "standard" and "non-standard" sets is due to most cards in the former having more "new" cards (which seldom have single cards being worth more than 30$) and the latter having more "old and reprinted" cards (which will almost always include moderatley expensive and highly sought after cards, or a higher density of cards that are around 30$)
Very much. What the OP calls a "growing price tag" is (a) a symptom of pandemic related supply issues that has affected everything from fresh corn to high end video cards and (b) Modern Masters 2 is a premium set to begin with, for reasons quoted above, and anybody complaining about the price probably isn't very invested in the game to begin with or they would know this. I play both MtG and D&D and I can tell you that every time a premium set comes out (pandemic aside) my LGS has at least double the attendance for the regular Friday night draft tournament, which involves buying those premium packs, compared to the regular showing for the standard drafts.
And a lot of the regulars I've played with also either play D&D regularly or express interest in it if not complain about not being able to find time for a consistent game. Just before the quarantine hit I was part of a group scheduled to have a session zero the next week, in store, and most of us in that group found out about the DM looking to put a game together while in the shop to play Magic. The two games compliment each other and feed each other, and absolutely do not compete. That's why there are MtG based D&D sourcebooks and it's why there's a Forgotten Realms Magic set coming out imminently. The first crossover was Ravnica, which is arguably the most popular setting in MtG among players who are big on the lore that is literally printed on the cards to tell a story with each set (there have now been nine Ravnica sets and it's a given that there will be more sooner or later). Those lore junkies who like to build themed commander decks around their favorite Ravnican guild are exactly the kind of people that decide to take the plunge into D&D because it added their favorite setting to it's canon. I will admit surprise that they're going with Strixhaven for that next, as I think Kaldheim is much better suited to D&D with it's epic viking theme, but nobody from WotC has bothered to ask my opinion on the matter.
D&D and MtG pretty much are Wizards of the Coast, financially speaking.
Kaldheim being a more traditional old school D&D setting I'd agree
Strixhaven seems to fit the modern style of a bunch of friends getting up to hijinks(which works particularly well for streaming) much better though, also if it's not written in such a way as to be fairly easily adaptable to fulfil peoples Harry Potter/D&D fantasies I'll be shocked.
this year there are 2 "non-standard" sets - the first one was 150$ on release but jumped to around 220$ later because of increased demand and lack of availability; the second one will release next week and is around 200$ to begin with - this price might increase because of the same issues as with the first set
the price difference between "standard" and "non-standard" sets is due to most cards in the former having more "new" cards (which seldom have single cards being worth more than 30$) and the latter having more "old and reprinted" cards (which will almost always include moderatley expensive and highly sought after cards, or a higher density of cards that are around 30$)
Very much. What the OP calls a "growing price tag" is (a) a symptom of pandemic related supply issues that has affected everything from fresh corn to high end video cards and (b) Modern Masters 2 is a premium set to begin with, for reasons quoted above, and anybody complaining about the price probably isn't very invested in the game to begin with or they would know this. I play both MtG and D&D and I can tell you that every time a premium set comes out (pandemic aside) my LGS has at least double the attendance for the regular Friday night draft tournament, which involves buying those premium packs, compared to the regular showing for the standard drafts.
And a lot of the regulars I've played with also either play D&D regularly or express interest in it if not complain about not being able to find time for a consistent game. Just before the quarantine hit I was part of a group scheduled to have a session zero the next week, in store, and most of us in that group found out about the DM looking to put a game together while in the shop to play Magic. The two games compliment each other and feed each other, and absolutely do not compete. That's why there are MtG based D&D sourcebooks and it's why there's a Forgotten Realms Magic set coming out imminently. The first crossover was Ravnica, which is arguably the most popular setting in MtG among players who are big on the lore that is literally printed on the cards to tell a story with each set (there have now been nine Ravnica sets and it's a given that there will be more sooner or later). Those lore junkies who like to build themed commander decks around their favorite Ravnican guild are exactly the kind of people that decide to take the plunge into D&D because it added their favorite setting to it's canon. I will admit surprise that they're going with Strixhaven for that next, as I think Kaldheim is much better suited to D&D with it's epic viking theme, but nobody from WotC has bothered to ask my opinion on the matter.
D&D and MtG pretty much are Wizards of the Coast, financially speaking.
Kaldheim being a more traditional old school D&D setting I'd agree
Strixhaven seems to fit the modern style of a bunch of friends getting up to hijinks(which works particularly well for streaming) much better though, also if it's not written in such a way as to be fairly easily adaptable to fulfil peoples Harry Potter/D&D fantasies I'll be shocked.
Ravnica being a metropolis setting makes it a pretty handy source of info for anyone looking to add a similar context to their homebrew campaign as well. Strixhaven might have that same purpose in mind. Not that viking/Norse themes wouldn't be useful, but that seems more of an aesthetic overlay than anything else (and Norse settings have been done by third parties already). Not sure how well/poorly Theros sold, but I would be surprised if there was even half as much interest in that than in Ravnica even among D&D players/DMs who aren't into Magic at all.
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Yeah. You do not even need to spend money on dice, pen, and paper if you have a smartphone and go digital (you still have to pay for the smartphone, but most people have a smartphone whether or not they play D&D, so you might as well save a few trees). You can roll dice on Google, and you can download character sheets from Wizards and edit them in your smartphone. There is also Beyond right here if copying and pasting stuff from the BR/SRD to the PDF character sheet is too laborious. GMs do not even have to spend money on adventures either as Wizards have a ton of free official ones too.
This is a digression but let's not presume environmental virtue in tech when there isn't. I'm pretty sure the extractive costs of manufacturing and powering a smartphone and its network are at least a wash with just using pencil and paper and physical dice rather than "saving a few trees" (you don't need lithium for paper). If anything, I imagine the "tech" way of playing D&D is more environmentally problematic than the traditional paper mode. I'd even wonder if a player keeping current with physical MtG cards is actually more environmentally progressive than someone who plays on a digital platform. Costs of shipping in a globalized manufacturing model may push the needle one way or the other.
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Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
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Maybe some of you know that Hasbro is releasing a new MTG set very soon. A lot of complaints have been made because of the growing price tag. I used to play MTG myself, but saw the growing costs of playing and jumped ship years ago. Actually I started playing D&D because I was looking for a much cheaper alternative to MTG.
I was wondering if you think this new set will be the straw that broke the camel's back for many players, and how the D&D community could use that to our advantage to get more players to the game.
1 shot dungeon master
Really, I see them as completely separate things. Thematically they're both fantasy, but mechanically they're different animals entirely. So I wouldn't think there'd be much cross-over because of this.
I agree -- they have nothing to do with each other except the "thematic" material, and the fact that one company (rather unfortunately, in my opinion) happens to own them both. They don't play anything like each other, and I see no reason why someone who likes D&D would necessarily want to play a competitive trading card game, or vice versa.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
MtG is what allowed WotC to buy the D&D IP, at a time when it was all but dead. I think it was pretty fortunate WotC saw fit to buy the D&D rights from TSR.
Other than that, there's not that much to the connection. Sure, we got a bunch of crossover MtG settings for D&D, but a cityscape setting like what we got with Ravnica would have been useful to me regardless of the IP context and setting books have always been a take them or leave them option (I picked up a bit of Dragonlance stuff in earlier editions but mostly that's a setting I left largely alone, for instance).
All that said though, I agree this isn't really a communicating vessels type situation. Players who grow bored or otherwise dissatisfied with one won't naturally gravitate towards the other.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
There's a sort of "MtG vs D&D" presumption in the OP where it's unclear whether the poster is aware the two brands are owned by the same company. They're not in competition so there isn't a "if MtG fans are dropping D&D can swoop in" logic to the respective brand's business plans. Rather, if anything, both brands try to make use of each other to grow their respective player base and ideally get folks who play both. That's why we have D&D content like Theros, Ravinica and Strgyxwhatever, as well as the Planeshift content. Magic is either producing or has forthcoming Forgotten Realms themed sets. The relationship is synergistic not antagonistic, at least form the businesses. Fans hard in one or the other camp can go as hard at each other as they want, but there's not actual fight.
When Magic first became a big thing, I actually remember it not hitting TTRPG so much as it did the comic book industry. I don't have any hard info to back it up, but I remember Magic was ascendent just around the time the comic book boom was busting (presses were closing and more dramatically shops were closing). A lot of armchair folks thought the money people used to be putting into comics were going to collectible card games. Dates are hazy but I remember comic shops shuttering while White Wolf's Storyteller system was ascendant I think Cypberpunk 2020 was in its heyday ... I don't know if MtG ever really hurt D&D.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Magic's biggest impact was on game stores, and indirectly on other games being played there. Not poaching, just hogging the spotlight. MtG was (and presumably to a certain extent still is) the games stores' cash cow, and it's a game that gets played in stores as much as, if not more than, at home. You might pop in at the store over lunch or after work for a boardgame or a quick skirmish minis game and you'd find most of the tables taken by card players. FNM took over Fridays, but Magic was the dominant game at other times as well. That changed the atmosphere, and shop owners saw where their revenue was coming from and realized the table space they gave up in the store to attract customers made ten or twenty or more times as much money for them if they were used by MtG players than by boardgame fans, TTRPG groups or wargamers. But if you go into a store for something, either for yourself or for your kids or to get someone a present, and you notice that thing isn't actually played a lot (at least not in the store, which is where you'd get your first and most impactful impression) and that the owners all seem to be busy with something else and everyone who's playing at the store is also playing that other thing, that can shift where the interests of whoever you're there for will go. Magic certainly 'reformed' people who were into other hobbies prior, but mostly - insofar as my recollection is accurate - it diverted the flow of prospective new blood away from everything else.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
It's also interesting because MtG usually takes up a lot less retail floor real estate, by nature of its size in comparision to TTRPG and minis. In the game store I frequent I couldn't tell you where the cards are, but I'm sure there there as when they had in store gaming Magic took up a lot more table space than any other game.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Yup. I hit Reply a little early, but that's where my post was headed. MtG is usually much more visible in terms of being played than anything else. Or was anyway, the last half decade or so I've mostly frequented stores and clubs with dedicated game room (via club fees) for the minis games - wargaming really thrives on clubs, playing the same less-than-a-handful of people at home just doesn't cut it if you're an enthusiast - so depending on where you go things might look differently. I'm sure it's still the most popular kid (in the cool kids club of CCGs to begin with) in stores though. Great for store owners that blister boxes take up next to no shelf space compared to everything else too.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
I am a dm, I don't have to buy the magic tie in books. I don't play magic. But I have players which do play magic. And I have gain players from Magic. Magic does pay the bills in my FLGS and it does let us play free do to being a piggy bank for the FLGS.
No Gaming is Better than Bad Gaming.
D&D and Magic have always had considerable overlap in player base.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I do not think D&D and MTG directly compete with each other. TTRPGs is a very niche hobby, and while there is a lot of potential for growth, sitting around a table to play pretend is not exactly most people's idea of fun. It is far easier to get my friends to play the big three card games than D&D.
As for the increasing price tag of card games, i think that is due to people being stuck at home with nothing much to do, economic stimulus injecting a lot of cash into people's pockets, and there is an increasing interest in investing in nostalgia. The stock market's quick recovery and continued rise in price through out the pandemic is another outcome of that, with Reddit's attempt to send Gamestop to the moon being the prime example.
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You can take it from someone who works in a LGS as a Community Manager and Tournament Organizer - they don't. I myself either play or DM with 13 others who also all play MtG, and I know around 15+ others in our community who play both MtG and other non-D&D RPGs.
If you can spend 20 - 30 bucks every week on MtG tournaments you can spend that much on dice and pen & paper ONCE to be a RPG player.
Money isn't the issue to get into RPGs - its time to play, space to play in, and people who you feel comfortable with.
#OpenDnD
I myself started playing MtG in 1999, and D&D in 2002, and in all that time I have NEVER, not even ONCE, played in any of the "official" WotC D&D settings, so any and all crossover products like CR and even MtG books are welcome to me because I only care about the mechanical additions and the design ideas anyway.
And regarding the OPs comments about the "rising prices of Magic sets" they are omitting key facts, so let me set this straight and lay it out for people who are unfamiliar with MtG:
So no, magic sets DID NOT become much more expensive. In fact I believe - and I will check with my boss - in the last 22 years the price for a box of Magic cards went up by 10%.
#OpenDnD
There's a reason that CCGs spawned the "crack is cheaper" meme.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Yeah. You do not even need to spend money on dice, pen, and paper if you have a smartphone and go digital (you still have to pay for the smartphone, but most people have a smartphone whether or not they play D&D, so you might as well save a few trees). You can roll dice on Google, and you can download character sheets from Wizards and edit them in your smartphone. There is also Beyond right here if copying and pasting stuff from the BR/SRD to the PDF character sheet is too laborious. GMs do not even have to spend money on adventures either as Wizards have a ton of free official ones too.
Check Licenses and Resync Entitlements: < https://www.dndbeyond.com/account/licenses >
Running the Game by Matt Colville; Introduction: < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-YZvLUXcR8 >
D&D with High School Students by Bill Allen; Season 1 Episode 1: < https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52NJTUDokyk&t >
Late to the party but I just wanted to point out Doomdrake is right. This Magic set isn’t a rise in price: it’s a special set with powerful cards that are only allowed in more expensive formats that can use cards from many years ago. So the premise of the thread is just not factual.
And as you can see, I do play both games…though Magic is definitely more of a cash sink than it needs to be!
Wizard (Gandalf) of the Tolkien Club
Very much. What the OP calls a "growing price tag" is (a) a symptom of pandemic related supply issues that has affected everything from fresh corn to high end video cards and (b) Modern Masters 2 is a premium set to begin with, for reasons quoted above, and anybody complaining about the price probably isn't very invested in the game to begin with or they would know this. I play both MtG and D&D and I can tell you that every time a premium set comes out (pandemic aside) my LGS has at least double the attendance for the regular Friday night draft tournament, which involves buying those premium packs, compared to the regular showing for the standard drafts.
And a lot of the regulars I've played with also either play D&D regularly or express interest in it if not complain about not being able to find time for a consistent game. Just before the quarantine hit I was part of a group scheduled to have a session zero the next week, in store, and most of us in that group found out about the DM looking to put a game together while in the shop to play Magic. The two games compliment each other and feed each other, and absolutely do not compete. That's why there are MtG based D&D sourcebooks and it's why there's a Forgotten Realms Magic set coming out imminently. The first crossover was Ravnica, which is arguably the most popular setting in MtG among players who are big on the lore that is literally printed on the cards to tell a story with each set (there have now been nine Ravnica sets and it's a given that there will be more sooner or later). Those lore junkies who like to build themed commander decks around their favorite Ravnican guild are exactly the kind of people that decide to take the plunge into D&D because it added their favorite setting to it's canon. I will admit surprise that they're going with Strixhaven for that next, as I think Kaldheim is much better suited to D&D with it's epic viking theme, but nobody from WotC has bothered to ask my opinion on the matter.
D&D and MtG pretty much are Wizards of the Coast, financially speaking.
Kaldheim being a more traditional old school D&D setting I'd agree
Strixhaven seems to fit the modern style of a bunch of friends getting up to hijinks(which works particularly well for streaming) much better though, also if it's not written in such a way as to be fairly easily adaptable to fulfil peoples Harry Potter/D&D fantasies I'll be shocked.
Ravnica being a metropolis setting makes it a pretty handy source of info for anyone looking to add a similar context to their homebrew campaign as well. Strixhaven might have that same purpose in mind. Not that viking/Norse themes wouldn't be useful, but that seems more of an aesthetic overlay than anything else (and Norse settings have been done by third parties already). Not sure how well/poorly Theros sold, but I would be surprised if there was even half as much interest in that than in Ravnica even among D&D players/DMs who aren't into Magic at all.
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This is a digression but let's not presume environmental virtue in tech when there isn't. I'm pretty sure the extractive costs of manufacturing and powering a smartphone and its network are at least a wash with just using pencil and paper and physical dice rather than "saving a few trees" (you don't need lithium for paper). If anything, I imagine the "tech" way of playing D&D is more environmentally problematic than the traditional paper mode. I'd even wonder if a player keeping current with physical MtG cards is actually more environmentally progressive than someone who plays on a digital platform. Costs of shipping in a globalized manufacturing model may push the needle one way or the other.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.