So, now that WoTC and DDB are under the same corporation, it'd be really nice to see WoTC show some appreciation and respect to players and enthusiasts by providing the option to access character sheet relevant content on DDB through purchasing the hardcover. Otherwise, I believe this is a strong indication of where we can expect WoTC is taking the game and it's ultimate fate.
Being "old school," I like having hardcover sourcebooks and adventure books. In my opinion, I've noticed there can be quite the knowledge and gap between players who rely exclusively on DDB digital content versus players who have the hard copies, and it makes sense - books are generally easier to spend time with. So, I'll always work with others and share my books not only to help new players understand the mechanics but also because all the lore is ever so fascinating and fun! Nonetheless, in attempting to provide the tables with the full experience, I end up purchasing 2 copies of just about every book simply so players at the table can access character sheet relevant content on DDB. The costs add up...
Considering a lot of players, especially those new to the game, defer to using DDB character sheets rather than hand-jamming their own, I have no issue justifying the expense for the sake of somebody being able to access information while building their character and during play. However, now that DDB and WoTC are no longer competing in the market, how about some love WoTC? I'm feeling a bit punished whenever I DM simply for trying to help players understand the game while having fun?
One explanation for WoTC to not provide such an option would validate my worst fears - "McD&D." I'd really hope to see some love from WoTC rather than watch them fall into the ever familiar habit of extorting the D&D community for evermore profit.
If you disagree, please comment and explain why otherwise it doesn't really contribute to the topic.
EDIT
This is clearly a charged topic, please feel free to describe how this issue and the concern surrounding it may be a potential indication of where you think WoTC is taking D&D!
I have reviewed that thread, and unfortunately, those explanations don't address the issue and underlying sentiment of the question. Actually, it provides the blanket "corporate" responses and redirects from the issue - practices in which I am very familiar in my given profession.
So, has it been "discussed to death?" Yes. But has the issue and underlying concern been addressed? No.
Surely you voted "No" on the poll. Although I appreciate you commenting, your explanation was "see this thread..." I'd wish you'd elaborate (formulate) on your own opinion rather than defer to others because I don't think your 3k+ posts are all just "here's a link and what this guy said."
It is incredibly likely that there are a decent percentage of players who only want one or the other and they will increase the price for books for something a decent percentage won't use.
Also what about products sold thru other entities. Roll20, Fantasy Grounds, should they get their product for free as well with the code? (the maps the VTT processes)
This would also
1. an incredibly complex infrastructure to track the codes,
2. making books that can't be opened and browsed since the code would have to be hidden in some way likely by shrink wrapping them all.
3. they would have to increase the price of the books to pay for the extra things that DnD Beyond does (the programming). I'm saying maybe about $30 seems like a decent additional cost for all the extra products.
Given the timing of 5.5e and given the conflict your encouragement that WotC "show some appreciation and respect to players and enthusiasts by providing the option to access character sheet relevant content on DDB through purchasing the hardcover" has with the disrespect and lack of appreciation such a move would show for the many players who did in fact buy both, thereby actually providing the revenue to build D&D Beyond and not snidely sideline for years asking for a break, I just don't see this happening for 5e. To get at the real issue, since the "different companies" thing I don't feel was ever a real barrier (it seems pretty clear the WotC and DDB do confer regularly or pricing models prior to the sale)
1. print editions and D&D Beyond tools are different products,
2. WotC didn't spend $40 million to give D&D players a freebie other players have been paying for
3. Again there's a new edition of sorts coming out 2024. Maybe they'll have a different sales model and products more directly integrated with DDB (and priced accordingly). Between now and then I don't think you're going to see any changes in the present practice aside from maybe a few experiments like they did when Theros first came out. It's pretty apparent that WotC bought D&D Beyond to intergrate it closer to WotC D&D, and we're seeing some of that now through some of the neat previews membership grants us, but the move is forward thinking into 5.5, not "let's change the way we sell 5e."
I think when it comes down to it these debates are common sense from a business perspective vs magical thinking from a consumer (but definitely not all consumer given DDB's sucess story) perspective.
And if you don't think this debate hasn't been had since the sale, including responses from DDB staff in the wake of the sale, you're not looking hard enough to the point I don't think you looked at all.
I have reviewed that thread, and unfortunately, those explanations don't address the issue and underlying sentiment of the question. Actually, it provides the blanket "corporate" responses and redirects from the issue - practices in which I am very familiar in my given profession.
So, has it been "discussed to death?" Yes. But has the issue and underlying concern been addressed? No.
Surely you voted "No" on the poll. Although I appreciate you commenting, your explanation was "see this thread..." I'd wish you'd elaborate (formulate) on your own opinion rather than defer to others because I don't think your 3k+ posts are all just "here's a link and what this guy said."
Sorry if I came off as dismissive, that was uncool. But the topic literally comes up every couple weeks, and it's just, ugh. There is nothing new under the sun, here. For more reference, I've linked other threads on the topic going back only about a month. If you flip through them all, you'll see all the arguments for and against, have already been made. Including those exact same arguments getting revived when wizards bought dndbeyond.
I have reviewed that thread, and unfortunately, those explanations don't address the issue and underlying sentiment of the question. Actually, it provides the blanket "corporate" responses and redirects from the issue - practices in which I am very familiar in my given profession.
So, has it been "discussed to death?" Yes. But has the issue and underlying concern been addressed? No.
Surely you voted "No" on the poll. Although I appreciate you commenting, your explanation was "see this thread..." I'd wish you'd elaborate (formulate) on your own opinion rather than defer to others because I don't think your 3k+ posts are all just "here's a link and what this guy said."
Sorry if I came off as dismissive, that was uncool. But the topic literally comes up every couple weeks, and it's just, ugh. There is nothing new under the sun, here. For more reference, I've linked other threads on the topic going back only about a month. If you flip through them all, you'll see all the arguments for and against, have already been made. Including those exact same arguments getting revived when wizards bought dndbeyond.
I'd really like to try and cut through the emotional turmoil of this topic and explore its implications in terms of the direction WoTC intends to take the game i.e. will the community continue to enjoy the revival of D&D or will WoTC effectively franchise it.
Given the timing of 5.5e and given the conflict your encouragement that WotC "show some appreciation and respect to players and enthusiasts by providing the option to access character sheet relevant content on DDB through purchasing the hardcover" has with the disrespect and lack of appreciation such a move would show for the many players who did in fact buy both, thereby actually providing the revenue to build D&D Beyond and not snidely sideline for years asking for a break, I just don't see this happening for 5e. To get at the real issue, since the "different companies" thing I don't feel was ever a real barrier (it seems pretty clear the WotC and DDB do confer regularly or pricing models prior to the sale)
1. print editions and D&D Beyond tools are different products,
2. WotC didn't spend $40 million to give D&D players a freebie other players have been paying for
3. Again there's a new edition of sorts coming out 2024. Maybe they'll have a different sales model and products more directly integrated with DDB (and priced accordingly). Between now and then I don't think you're going to see any changes in the present practice aside from maybe a few experiments like they did when Theros first came out. It's pretty apparent that WotC bought D&D Beyond to intergrate it closer to WotC D&D, and we're seeing some of that now through some of the neat previews membership grants us, but the move is forward thinking into 5.5, not "let's change the way we sell 5e."
I think when it comes down to it these debates are common sense from a business perspective vs magical thinking from a consumer (but definitely not all consumer given DDB's sucess story) perspective.
And if you don't think this debate hasn't been had since the sale, including responses from DDB staff in the wake of the sale, you're not looking hard enough to the point I don't think you looked at all.
Ouch. Well argued and showed some fangs. I appreciate your response all the same and will certainly do some more digging.
However, I ensure you this isn't about me "getting a break" from a consumer perspective. Moreso, and again, it's about the underlying sentiment and aversion the community has to the notion of "McD&D." The theoretical business perspective is definitely more input that I'd very much be interested to hear considering my lack of business acumen (like Mehrkat's insight on the technical side).
I don't really understand what you mean by "McD&D" could you explain that, and how keeping hard copy D&D and DDB's digital tools separate products exacerbates that concern?
No fangs, it's just that your rhetoric lacks a lot of self awareness. As noted you didn't seem to realize that the post sale to WotC ramifications is a constant on this board, despite staff statements. Your notion that WotC should honor fans who haven't bought into it clearly gets challenged by the fact that many fans did buy in. And this "McD&D" thing is such an obvious perjorative, but that's it, it's some sort of inchoate evocation of McDonalds poetics as a way to diss D&D ownership by large publicly traded corporation. What do you mean "franchise?"
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
I don't really understand what you mean by "McD&D" could you explain that, and how keeping hard copy D&D and DDB's digital tools separate products exacerbates that concern?
No fangs, it's just that your rhetoric lacks a lot of self awareness. As noted you didn't seem to realize that the post sale to WotC ramifications is a constant on this board, despite staff statements. Your notion that WotC should honor fans who haven't bought into it clearly gets challenged by the fact that many fans did buy in. And this "McD&D" thing is such an obvious perjorative, but that's it, it's some sort of inchoate evocation of McDonalds poetics as a way to diss D&D ownership by large publicly traded corporation. What do you mean "franchise?"
So, in your seemingly constructive responses that imply your vast understanding of this matter and correlating issues (which are all still deliberately insulting), you're unfamiliar with the concern of WoTC abandoning the community for sake of profit, which foreshadows the ultimate concern of killing the game, again? Yes, "McD&D" is derogatory. Apologies, that's a common word in my online and local D&D communities, and it's meant to draw the analogy of corporate greed a/k/a profits at the expense of the community.
The issue of buying the books twice is simply an easily identifiable instance that would lend credibility to the fear that WoTC doesn't care about the community but rather profits. Considering the game has recently been revived after the 4e schism, I believe members of the community who played prior to 5e are extremely apprehensive of this direction.
I am aware of post-sale discussions but not enlightened as to the business principles of the matter. There's always something I haven't seen so maybe there's one you could refer? Additionally, I am aware of staff responses and bulletins, hence my response to Xalthu, "... those explanations don't address the issue and underlying sentiment of the question. Actually, it provides the blanket "corporate" responses and redirects from the issue - practices in which I am very familiar in my given profession..."
Please try to be more informative in your next response rather than focus on reading my mind? It helps not to make baseless assumptions when insulting the awareness one has over their words while simultaneously failing to fully understand the content. Rather than assume what I'm thinking, why not ask for clarification in a non-rhetorical manner? It seems you may have some insight concerning the business principles that should be taken into consideration on the matter. The very broad and packaged response the community has received is basically "it's like this because businesses work like this and we can't help it," but perhaps you'd be able to offer a better explanation that would assuage the community?
I don't want physical books. I don't have the space for them, nor the need.
Why should I have to pay for them?
DDB sells me what I want. If I wanted physical books I'd go to my local shop and buy them. I don't want to have to sink eighty dollars into a book to get what I used to get for thirty, and then have to crate up the physical book in the garage.
If you want both? Get both. If you only want one or the other? Get one or the other. Don't make people pay for junk they don't want or need.
If Wizards were to give you free books digitally just because you bought the physical copy it would decrease a significant amount of the profit WotC made from people who bought both versions, and it would make the digital product cost a lot less since people would no longer buy it if they could just get a version by buying a physical book.
Not to mention, it would introduce problems with people stealing the code to the physical book and getting it digitally.
WotC didn't buy DDB just to decrease the profit the website made, so why would they make such a major financial investment just to cut how much money they made off it?
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BoringBard's long and tedious posts somehow manage to enrapture audiences. How? Because he used Charm Person, the #1 bard spell!
He/him pronouns. Call me Bard. PROUD NERD!
Ever wanted to talk about your parties' worst mistakes? Do so HERE. What's your favorite class, why? Share & explainHERE.
I don't want physical books. I don't have the space for them, nor the need.
Why should I have to pay for them?
DDB sells me what I want. If I wanted physical books I'd go to my local shop and buy them. I don't want to have to sink eighty dollars into a book to get what I used to get for thirty, and then have to crate up the physical book in the garage.
If you want both? Get both. If you only want one or the other? Get one or the other. Don't make people pay for junk they don't want or need.
Thanks Yurei! I understand that stance lol!
To clarify, the topic addresses why people who buy the physical books have to purchase the digital books as well just to access the content that's immediately relevant for character creation in DDB. Personally, the only reason I'm on here is to facilitate play for any and all players, especially players like yourself who prefer having digital content! So, when someone joins a campaign I'm DMing and prefers to use Dndbeyond for their character sheet, I'd like them to have access to all the material the game has to offer! So, for people who prefer hardcover, why not provide that option?
Ultimately, this issue is like a bad omen for the game. It's reminiscent of the last falling out the community had with the game, only this time it's not because of less than desirable game mechanics lol.
The answer is because the product on DDB is materially different than the product as a physical book.
Yes, the raw information contained within DDB books is the same as the physical editions, but a piece of paper does not have the functionality of a DDB sheet, nor can I search/lookup in a physical book. There's value-added service aplenty in DDB's digital ecosystem, and people who want access to it should pay for that access. People who want the benefits of a physical book should have to pay for those benefits.
Your stance is that the physical books have primacy over the digital service - that someone who bought physical books deserves free access to DDB in its entirety because they bought the "real" game. I disagree, fiercely. The digital product is every bit as 'real' as the physical product, and the one does not have primacy over the other. Frankly, D&D would be a better game if the digital version had primacy and physical books were considered uncontrolled-copy collectibles rather than Definitive Rules that have to always be valid no matter what.
If Wizards were to give you free books digitally just because you bought the physical copy it would decrease a significant amount of the profit WotC made from people who bought both versions, and it would make the digital product cost a lot less since people would no longer buy it if they could just get a version by buying a physical book.
Not to mention, it would introduce problems with people stealing the code to the physical book and getting it digitally.
WotC didn't buy DDB just to decrease the profit the website made, so why would they make such a major financial investment just to cut how much money they made off it?
Totally get it. Why not offer the option through Dndbeyond though to ensure both profits and (possibly) mitigate the concern of "stealing the code?" Rather than digital copy + content access in character sheets, why not also hardcover + content access in character sheets? I am not addressing this issue from a consumer perspective because I don't use DDB, and only started using it during Covid to accommodate players because unfortunately I couldn't slide my book across the table to them and look at everything together. I get that's what was part of the service DDB provided - ease of access, but that's not the story anymore.
The answer is because the product on DDB is materially different than the product as a physical book.
Yes, the raw information contained within DDB books is the same as the physical editions, but a piece of paper does not have the functionality of a DDB sheet, nor can I search/lookup in a physical book. There's value-added service aplenty in DDB's digital ecosystem, and people who want access to it should pay for that access. People who want the benefits of a physical book should have to pay for those benefits.
Your stance is that the physical books have primacy over the digital service - that someone who bought physical books deserves free access to DDB in its entirety because they bought the "real" game. I disagree, fiercely. The digital product is every bit as 'real' as the physical product, and the one does not have primacy over the other. Frankly, D&D would be a better game if the digital version had primacy and physical books were considered uncontrolled-copy collectibles rather than Definitive Rules that have to always be valid no matter what.
The benefits of the digital product is definitely an unmistakable perk! It's nice to parse RAW when in a jam! What if I only want the hardcover though but also access to the content that's immediately relevant to creating the character sheet in DDB?
Unfortunately, I've seen how relying solely on digital content can become quite the hindrance in other significant aspects of the game as well, but none of which concern the topic or issue and definitely part of the meta-game discussion lol. You're definitely not in my camp as far as hardcopy versus digital though, but that's a whole 'nother debate brother lol!
The reality is that D&D Beyond’s current monetisation system is working - despite all the threads complaining about it, the financial numbers clearly indicate the silent majority is more than satisfied with how D&D Beyond works. Hasbro reports that Beyond’s fandom license was incredibly profitable - profitable enough to justify dropping $140 million to ensure they got the whole slice of the pie, instead of sharing it with Fandom.
There are always going to be threads like this, but I would be quite surprised if Hasbro made a massive change to how they monetise Beyond. You do not kill the golden egg, just because some players might think it is more “fair.”
Totally get it. Why not offer the option through Dndbeyond though to ensure both profits and (possibly) mitigate the concern of "stealing the code?"
It would be feasible for D&D Beyond to sell a combined product (both digital and paper) but it would require them to set up the (not small) infrastructure for book delivery, the actual savings would probably be underwhelming because behind the scenes they're actually very different products with different costs, and it would hurt hobby gaming stores which for a number of reasons Hasbro has an interest in supporting.
Totally get it. Why not offer the option through Dndbeyond though to ensure both profits and (possibly) mitigate the concern of "stealing the code?"
It would be feasible for D&D Beyond to sell a combined product (both digital and paper) but it would require them to set up the (not small) infrastructure for book delivery, the actual savings would probably be underwhelming because behind the scenes they're actually very different products with different costs, and it would hurt hobby gaming stores which for a number of reasons Hasbro has an interest in supporting.
Thanks Pantagruel! I'm not in logistics, but I'm more than familiar with the headaches involved in supply train operations so I'd imagine establishing the infrastructure would be tantamount to setting up yet another corporation to oversee it. Great point!
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So, now that WoTC and DDB are under the same corporation, it'd be really nice to see WoTC show some appreciation and respect to players and enthusiasts by providing the option to access character sheet relevant content on DDB through purchasing the hardcover. Otherwise, I believe this is a strong indication of where we can expect WoTC is taking the game and it's ultimate fate.
Being "old school," I like having hardcover sourcebooks and adventure books. In my opinion, I've noticed there can be quite the knowledge and gap between players who rely exclusively on DDB digital content versus players who have the hard copies, and it makes sense - books are generally easier to spend time with. So, I'll always work with others and share my books not only to help new players understand the mechanics but also because all the lore is ever so fascinating and fun! Nonetheless, in attempting to provide the tables with the full experience, I end up purchasing 2 copies of just about every book simply so players at the table can access character sheet relevant content on DDB. The costs add up...
Considering a lot of players, especially those new to the game, defer to using DDB character sheets rather than hand-jamming their own, I have no issue justifying the expense for the sake of somebody being able to access information while building their character and during play. However, now that DDB and WoTC are no longer competing in the market, how about some love WoTC? I'm feeling a bit punished whenever I DM simply for trying to help players understand the game while having fun?
One explanation for WoTC to not provide such an option would validate my worst fears - "McD&D." I'd really hope to see some love from WoTC rather than watch them fall into the ever familiar habit of extorting the D&D community for evermore profit.
If you disagree, please comment and explain why otherwise it doesn't really contribute to the topic.
EDIT
This is clearly a charged topic, please feel free to describe how this issue and the concern surrounding it may be a potential indication of where you think WoTC is taking D&D!
This has been discussed to death. Repeatedly.
Here’s a thread to get you started
https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/d-d-beyond-general/d-d-beyond-feedback/96069-hardcover-books-d-d-beyond-and-you-faq
But something very important has changed between then and now, which OP mentioned - can you guess what it is?
Thanks Xalthu.
I have reviewed that thread, and unfortunately, those explanations don't address the issue and underlying sentiment of the question. Actually, it provides the blanket "corporate" responses and redirects from the issue - practices in which I am very familiar in my given profession.
So, has it been "discussed to death?" Yes. But has the issue and underlying concern been addressed? No.
Surely you voted "No" on the poll. Although I appreciate you commenting, your explanation was "see this thread..." I'd wish you'd elaborate (formulate) on your own opinion rather than defer to others because I don't think your 3k+ posts are all just "here's a link and what this guy said."
It is incredibly likely that there are a decent percentage of players who only want one or the other and they will increase the price for books for something a decent percentage won't use.
Also what about products sold thru other entities. Roll20, Fantasy Grounds, should they get their product for free as well with the code? (the maps the VTT processes)
This would also
1. an incredibly complex infrastructure to track the codes,
2. making books that can't be opened and browsed since the code would have to be hidden in some way likely by shrink wrapping them all.
3. they would have to increase the price of the books to pay for the extra things that DnD Beyond does (the programming). I'm saying maybe about $30 seems like a decent additional cost for all the extra products.
Given the timing of 5.5e and given the conflict your encouragement that WotC "show some appreciation and respect to players and enthusiasts by providing the option to access character sheet relevant content on DDB through purchasing the hardcover" has with the disrespect and lack of appreciation such a move would show for the many players who did in fact buy both, thereby actually providing the revenue to build D&D Beyond and not snidely sideline for years asking for a break, I just don't see this happening for 5e. To get at the real issue, since the "different companies" thing I don't feel was ever a real barrier (it seems pretty clear the WotC and DDB do confer regularly or pricing models prior to the sale)
1. print editions and D&D Beyond tools are different products,
2. WotC didn't spend $40 million to give D&D players a freebie other players have been paying for
3. Again there's a new edition of sorts coming out 2024. Maybe they'll have a different sales model and products more directly integrated with DDB (and priced accordingly). Between now and then I don't think you're going to see any changes in the present practice aside from maybe a few experiments like they did when Theros first came out. It's pretty apparent that WotC bought D&D Beyond to intergrate it closer to WotC D&D, and we're seeing some of that now through some of the neat previews membership grants us, but the move is forward thinking into 5.5, not "let's change the way we sell 5e."
I think when it comes down to it these debates are common sense from a business perspective vs magical thinking from a consumer (but definitely not all consumer given DDB's sucess story) perspective.
And if you don't think this debate hasn't been had since the sale, including responses from DDB staff in the wake of the sale, you're not looking hard enough to the point I don't think you looked at all.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Sorry if I came off as dismissive, that was uncool. But the topic literally comes up every couple weeks, and it's just, ugh. There is nothing new under the sun, here. For more reference, I've linked other threads on the topic going back only about a month. If you flip through them all, you'll see all the arguments for and against, have already been made. Including those exact same arguments getting revived when wizards bought dndbeyond.
D&D Beyond key in physical book - General Discussion - D&D Beyond General - D&D Beyond Forums - D&D Beyond (dndbeyond.com)
Physical vs Digital RANT - General Discussion - D&D Beyond General - D&D Beyond Forums - D&D Beyond (dndbeyond.com)
I'm done with this scam - General Discussion - D&D Beyond General - D&D Beyond Forums - D&D Beyond (dndbeyond.com)
Can I buy a physical book and get it online? - General Discussion - D&D Beyond General - D&D Beyond Forums - D&D Beyond (dndbeyond.com)
D&D Beyond vs Physical Books: An Explanation - General Discussion - D&D Beyond General - D&D Beyond Forums - D&D Beyond (dndbeyond.com)
Thank you and much appreciated!
I'd really like to try and cut through the emotional turmoil of this topic and explore its implications in terms of the direction WoTC intends to take the game i.e. will the community continue to enjoy the revival of D&D or will WoTC effectively franchise it.
Ouch. Well argued and showed some fangs. I appreciate your response all the same and will certainly do some more digging.
However, I ensure you this isn't about me "getting a break" from a consumer perspective. Moreso, and again, it's about the underlying sentiment and aversion the community has to the notion of "McD&D." The theoretical business perspective is definitely more input that I'd very much be interested to hear considering my lack of business acumen (like Mehrkat's insight on the technical side).
I don't really understand what you mean by "McD&D" could you explain that, and how keeping hard copy D&D and DDB's digital tools separate products exacerbates that concern?
No fangs, it's just that your rhetoric lacks a lot of self awareness. As noted you didn't seem to realize that the post sale to WotC ramifications is a constant on this board, despite staff statements. Your notion that WotC should honor fans who haven't bought into it clearly gets challenged by the fact that many fans did buy in. And this "McD&D" thing is such an obvious perjorative, but that's it, it's some sort of inchoate evocation of McDonalds poetics as a way to diss D&D ownership by large publicly traded corporation. What do you mean "franchise?"
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
So, in your seemingly constructive responses that imply your vast understanding of this matter and correlating issues (which are all still deliberately insulting), you're unfamiliar with the concern of WoTC abandoning the community for sake of profit, which foreshadows the ultimate concern of killing the game, again? Yes, "McD&D" is derogatory. Apologies, that's a common word in my online and local D&D communities, and it's meant to draw the analogy of corporate greed a/k/a profits at the expense of the community.
The issue of buying the books twice is simply an easily identifiable instance that would lend credibility to the fear that WoTC doesn't care about the community but rather profits. Considering the game has recently been revived after the 4e schism, I believe members of the community who played prior to 5e are extremely apprehensive of this direction.
I am aware of post-sale discussions but not enlightened as to the business principles of the matter. There's always something I haven't seen so maybe there's one you could refer? Additionally, I am aware of staff responses and bulletins, hence my response to Xalthu, "... those explanations don't address the issue and underlying sentiment of the question. Actually, it provides the blanket "corporate" responses and redirects from the issue - practices in which I am very familiar in my given profession..."
Please try to be more informative in your next response rather than focus on reading my mind? It helps not to make baseless assumptions when insulting the awareness one has over their words while simultaneously failing to fully understand the content. Rather than assume what I'm thinking, why not ask for clarification in a non-rhetorical manner? It seems you may have some insight concerning the business principles that should be taken into consideration on the matter. The very broad and packaged response the community has received is basically "it's like this because businesses work like this and we can't help it," but perhaps you'd be able to offer a better explanation that would assuage the community?
I don't want physical books. I don't have the space for them, nor the need.
Why should I have to pay for them?
DDB sells me what I want. If I wanted physical books I'd go to my local shop and buy them. I don't want to have to sink eighty dollars into a book to get what I used to get for thirty, and then have to crate up the physical book in the garage.
If you want both? Get both. If you only want one or the other? Get one or the other. Don't make people pay for junk they don't want or need.
Please do not contact or message me.
If Wizards were to give you free books digitally just because you bought the physical copy it would decrease a significant amount of the profit WotC made from people who bought both versions, and it would make the digital product cost a lot less since people would no longer buy it if they could just get a version by buying a physical book.
Not to mention, it would introduce problems with people stealing the code to the physical book and getting it digitally.
WotC didn't buy DDB just to decrease the profit the website made, so why would they make such a major financial investment just to cut how much money they made off it?
BoringBard's long and tedious posts somehow manage to enrapture audiences. How? Because he used Charm Person, the #1 bard spell!
He/him pronouns. Call me Bard. PROUD NERD!
Ever wanted to talk about your parties' worst mistakes? Do so HERE. What's your favorite class, why? Share & explain
HERE.Thanks Yurei! I understand that stance lol!
To clarify, the topic addresses why people who buy the physical books have to purchase the digital books as well just to access the content that's immediately relevant for character creation in DDB. Personally, the only reason I'm on here is to facilitate play for any and all players, especially players like yourself who prefer having digital content! So, when someone joins a campaign I'm DMing and prefers to use Dndbeyond for their character sheet, I'd like them to have access to all the material the game has to offer! So, for people who prefer hardcover, why not provide that option?
Ultimately, this issue is like a bad omen for the game. It's reminiscent of the last falling out the community had with the game, only this time it's not because of less than desirable game mechanics lol.
The answer is because the product on DDB is materially different than the product as a physical book.
Yes, the raw information contained within DDB books is the same as the physical editions, but a piece of paper does not have the functionality of a DDB sheet, nor can I search/lookup in a physical book. There's value-added service aplenty in DDB's digital ecosystem, and people who want access to it should pay for that access. People who want the benefits of a physical book should have to pay for those benefits.
Your stance is that the physical books have primacy over the digital service - that someone who bought physical books deserves free access to DDB in its entirety because they bought the "real" game. I disagree, fiercely. The digital product is every bit as 'real' as the physical product, and the one does not have primacy over the other. Frankly, D&D would be a better game if the digital version had primacy and physical books were considered uncontrolled-copy collectibles rather than Definitive Rules that have to always be valid no matter what.
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Totally get it. Why not offer the option through Dndbeyond though to ensure both profits and (possibly) mitigate the concern of "stealing the code?" Rather than digital copy + content access in character sheets, why not also hardcover + content access in character sheets? I am not addressing this issue from a consumer perspective because I don't use DDB, and only started using it during Covid to accommodate players because unfortunately I couldn't slide my book across the table to them and look at everything together. I get that's what was part of the service DDB provided - ease of access, but that's not the story anymore.
The benefits of the digital product is definitely an unmistakable perk! It's nice to parse RAW when in a jam! What if I only want the hardcover though but also access to the content that's immediately relevant to creating the character sheet in DDB?
Unfortunately, I've seen how relying solely on digital content can become quite the hindrance in other significant aspects of the game as well, but none of which concern the topic or issue and definitely part of the meta-game discussion lol. You're definitely not in my camp as far as hardcopy versus digital though, but that's a whole 'nother debate brother lol!
Sincere thanks for your input!
D&D Beyond already has a link you can use to upload content purchased physically Beyond.
The reality is that D&D Beyond’s current monetisation system is working - despite all the threads complaining about it, the financial numbers clearly indicate the silent majority is more than satisfied with how D&D Beyond works. Hasbro reports that Beyond’s fandom license was incredibly profitable - profitable enough to justify dropping $140 million to ensure they got the whole slice of the pie, instead of sharing it with Fandom.
There are always going to be threads like this, but I would be quite surprised if Hasbro made a massive change to how they monetise Beyond. You do not kill the golden egg, just because some players might think it is more “fair.”
It would be feasible for D&D Beyond to sell a combined product (both digital and paper) but it would require them to set up the (not small) infrastructure for book delivery, the actual savings would probably be underwhelming because behind the scenes they're actually very different products with different costs, and it would hurt hobby gaming stores which for a number of reasons Hasbro has an interest in supporting.
Thanks Pantagruel! I'm not in logistics, but I'm more than familiar with the headaches involved in supply train operations so I'd imagine establishing the infrastructure would be tantamount to setting up yet another corporation to oversee it. Great point!