We all know that mechanically, Dual-Wielding sucks. A player in my campaign is a ranger with two-weapon fighting and I'm trying to solve two problems at once (Them not ever having a bonus action, and giving them two special weapons without making them terribly overpowered. I could use some constructive criticism if y'all don't mind
The DaiShō of the Winter Wolf:
Uses the greatsword as a base (2d6 Slashing)
Dai and Shō seem to attack together as one weapon. If the wielder would normally be able to make a an additional attack using their bonus action, they can instead use both blades on each attack roll: On a hit, the damage dice are rolled once and any effect(s) on the blades are triggered individually. For example, Enlarge/Reduce uses 2d4 instead of 1d4, or poison damage on the blades triggers twice (Or once each if there are two different types being used).
I don't believe "we all" know anything of the sort about TWF. Frankly? This is too OP for a mundane weapon and probably at least a rare quality attuned magic weapon (you'd be making Hunter's Mark 2d6 per hit, among other issues), and TWF is for people who intend to commit their bonus action to making the additional attack. If they have other stuff they'd rather be doing with the bonus action, they should swap to a different fighting style. Plus I assume this will be a finesse weapon, and there's a reason the PHB finesse weapons stop at a d8.
Honestly, given 5e's weapon attack setup, it's difficult to design paired weapons as a single unit. Is this supposed to be an actual magic weapon, or are you just looking to create some fancy paired weapon mechanic?
I have to disagree on the sentiment that dual wielding sucks. getting another means to deal damage as a bonus action is a good use of a bonus action.
The way I see this, were I to try and abuse it, you have basically said "if you have both of these weapons in hand, you can attack twice each time you attack". The wording is a bit hard to fully distinguish - I'm not sure if the sole effect is to allow things which trigger on a hit to trigger twice?
But anyway, to abuse this I would have an Echo Knight (yes, my favourite fighter class at the moment) and at level 5 have 2 attacks, plus one for the offhand attack bonus action, plus one from the echo, then action surge to get 3 more attacks, for 7 attacks which all double the effects on them! Also consider things like smite, does it double that?
Here's an alternative you may appreciate instead:
"Uncommon magic weapon (Pair of swords), finesse, 1d8 slashing damage, requires attunement. Once on each of your turns, when you hit with a melee attack with one of these weapons, if you are wielding the other in your off hand you can deal additional damage equal to 1d8 plus your strength or dexterity modifier to the attack. If you choose to do so, you cannot make an offhand attack. This additional damage is applied after the doubling from a critical hit."
Fluffwise, the second weapon is drawn in magically by the first, basically allowing you to ignore your other arm. It effectively counts one of the attacks as being two hits, and frees up the bonus action. It also prevents them from just adding to their damage and still using the offhand attack, and stipulates that they need to be holding it, preventing somatic components to bonus action spells.
T-WF doesn’t “suck,” it’s a trade off. Do I make an additional attack, or do I use my bonus action for something else?
And you can give them two special weapons without them being a paired set. Give them a +1 shortsword and a scimitar that does an additional 1d4 fire damage or something. They get to choose which one they use as their main and which as their secondary every round. That’s cool. The weapons don’t have to specifically fit together.
If they want the fun of dual-wielding with something other than just Extra Attack, then definitely make them use their Bonus Action to do it. Giving them anything else to allow extra attacks will just make them OP compared to the other PCs.
I'm curious though, why don't they have their Bonus Action available?
LIGHT [WEAPON PROPERTY] When you take the Attack action on your turn and attack with a Light weapon, you can make one extra attack as part of the same action. That extra attack must be made with a different Light weapon, and you don’t add your ability modifier to the extra attack’s damage. You can make this extra attack only once on each of your turns. For example, if you take the Attack action on your turn and have a Shortsword in one hand and a Dagger in the other—each of which has the Light property—you can make one attack with each weapon, but you don’t add your Strength or Dexterity modifier to the damage roll of the second weapon.
Andnif they have the fighting style they add their modifier to the second attack
I had seen a suggestion about a homebrew feat Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, where the attack with the bonus action changed to a flat out extra attack. I didn't want to go that far, so I'm trying to make it more exclusive to this character.
Regarding enlarge reduce, I'll try to be more clear on the wording, as I was trying to make the point that the normal 1d4 is now 2d4 since there's two blades.
The reason for this strong of a weapon is that the story takes place in a world where adventurers have been collected by an evil entity and have basically been bred for the last few decades, and the party is the result of this. So the island nation that they're in is saturated with magic. The BBEG is giving all of them these super strong Ancestral Weapon (Tools that can only be used by blood relatives of the previous wielders) that will grow in power in tandem with the players. They are still unaware of all this and are just blindly enjoying the unusually abundant magic items in the realm.
As you can imagine, the monsters of this campaign are buffed so that they don't just walk through everything.
Watching them play out combats, I've noticed that they either need to use hunter's mark, or attack and they barely get to fight to their fullest potential, and they are getting outshined in terms of effectiveness in battle. Plus they will need to stay relevant when the fighter and rogue get their Ancestral Weapons. With the way this campaign is structured, not giving them item's like this is just condemning them to death
Regardless of all this, they will get to have their bonus action freed up after receiving this item. Basically I'm looking for critiques of the weapon itself, not the rule change I'm making
Hunter’s mark only needs to be cast once, not every round. It only uses additional bonus actions to move it if the current target dies. It adds 1d6 to every attack they get. With 2 attacks per Attack action, that potentially another 2d6 per turn, possibly more depending on their subclass, plus another 1d6 if they make an opportunity attack. That’s without using their bonus action to attack, on the turns they do that’s yet another 1d6 on top of all of that. That’s worth giving up a bonus attack every once in a while. That’s just game balance.
Now, to maximize their hunter’s mark, it’s better to cast it on the biggest baddy in the fight so they won’t have to move it around much if at all. If they keep placing it on the weenies and having to move it around turn after turn, that’s on them, not you.
I had seen a suggestion about a homebrew feat Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, where the attack with the bonus action changed to a flat out extra attack. I didn't want to go that far, so I'm trying to make it more exclusive to this character.
Regarding enlarge reduce, I'll try to be more clear on the wording, as I was trying to make the point that the normal 1d4 is now 2d4 since there's two blades.
The reason for this strong of a weapon is that the story takes place in a world where adventurers have been collected by an evil entity and have basically been bred for the last few decades, and the party is the result of this. So the island nation that they're in is saturated with magic. The BBEG is giving all of them these super strong Ancestral Weapon (Tools that can only be used by blood relatives of the previous wielders) that will grow in power in tandem with the players. They are still unaware of all this and are just blindly enjoying the unusually abundant magic items in the realm.
As you can imagine, the monsters of this campaign are buffed so that they don't just walk through everything.
You did not really answer what level characters this is for. Knowing helps us give more meaningful feedback.
Regardless of all this, they will get to have their bonus action freed up after receiving this item. Basically I'm looking for critiques of the weapon itself, not the rule change I'm making
So everyone dual wielding gets both attacks with any given attack? How does that work with things like extra attack?
Oh sorry, they're level 5 right now, but they are still waiting on the weapons to arrive and they'll find out soon that the shipment was attacked by pirates, so i'm expecting them to be about level 10 before they actually get them.
But no not everyone can get the extra attack from dual wielding, it's just these blades that grant the rule change
Ok, so I think that the effect you're after is that if these are used as a paired weapon, every attack doubles the effect of additional dice?
Something like:
"Each of these weapons deals 1d6 slashing damage. You can instead elect to wield both, counting as a single, two-handed weapon. When you do so, the damage increases to 2d6, and any effects which add damage dice to an attack (such as enlarge/reduce, hunters mark, sneak attack, or smite) can be applied twice to the attack. If such an ability would cost resources to apply, such as smite costing a spell slot, then this resource must be spent once for each application. If an ability can only be used once per turn (eg hunters mark), then it can be applied twice, but only to one attack per turn."
This is one of those things which could be very powerful, or very underwhelming. If they do stack a load of modifiers on there, they could deal huge amounts of damage, but if they don't then they would fall flat. An "off the top of my head" one would be stacking thunderous smite with eldritch smite using these weapons to get 12d8 additional damage on an attack, which is enormous.
Ok, so I think that the effect you're after is that if these are used as a paired weapon, every attack doubles the effect of additional dice?
Something like:
"Each of these weapons deals 1d6 slashing damage. You can instead elect to wield both, counting as a single, two-handed weapon. When you do so, the damage increases to 2d6, and any effects which add damage dice to an attack (such as enlarge/reduce, hunters mark, sneak attack, or smite) can be applied twice to the attack. If such an ability would cost resources to apply, such as smite costing a spell slot, then this resource must be spent once for each application. If an ability can only be used once per turn (eg hunters mark), then it can be applied twice, but only to one attack per turn."
This is one of those things which could be very powerful, or very underwhelming. If they do stack a load of modifiers on there, they could deal huge amounts of damage, but if they don't then they would fall flat. An "off the top of my head" one would be stacking thunderous smite with eldritch smite using these weapons to get 12d8 additional damage on an attack, which is enormous.
Yeah I do like the caveat of explicitly stating that spells applied (Like Holy Weapon) would need to be cast twice, since this item "Counts" as two weapons.
I would like to point out that hunter's mark isn't just once per turn: "Until the spell ends, you deal an extra 1d6 damage to the target whenever you hit it with a weapon attack"
I forgot to note that this weapon requires attunement, and if this character dies then the weapon is permanently unuseable, since the character has no children
Here's another question and for some reason I can't figure out how to start a new thread;
I'm making a homebrew monster that has flat damage (Similar to Armor of Agathys) but I can't figure out how to make the code to send this, like you can with roller tags. Coding is outside my field of knowledge, so I'm just copy/pasting similar abilities from other monsters...
The best I can do is
1/day each: [-spell]Armor of Agathys[/spell] [-rollable]45;{"diceNotation":"5d4kl1+44","rollType":"damage","rollAction":"Innate Armor of Agathys","rollDamageType":"cold"}[/rollable]
We all know that mechanically, Dual-Wielding sucks. A player in my campaign is a ranger with two-weapon fighting and I'm trying to solve two problems at once (Them not ever having a bonus action, and giving them two special weapons without making them terribly overpowered. I could use some constructive criticism if y'all don't mind
The DaiShō of the Winter Wolf:
Uses the greatsword as a base (2d6 Slashing)
Dai and Shō seem to attack together as one weapon. If the wielder would normally be able to make a an additional attack using their bonus action, they can instead use both blades on each attack roll: On a hit, the damage dice are rolled once and any effect(s) on the blades are triggered individually. For example, Enlarge/Reduce uses 2d4 instead of 1d4, or poison damage on the blades triggers twice (Or once each if there are two different types being used).
I don't believe "we all" know anything of the sort about TWF. Frankly? This is too OP for a mundane weapon and probably at least a rare quality attuned magic weapon (you'd be making Hunter's Mark 2d6 per hit, among other issues), and TWF is for people who intend to commit their bonus action to making the additional attack. If they have other stuff they'd rather be doing with the bonus action, they should swap to a different fighting style. Plus I assume this will be a finesse weapon, and there's a reason the PHB finesse weapons stop at a d8.
Honestly, given 5e's weapon attack setup, it's difficult to design paired weapons as a single unit. Is this supposed to be an actual magic weapon, or are you just looking to create some fancy paired weapon mechanic?
I have to disagree on the sentiment that dual wielding sucks. getting another means to deal damage as a bonus action is a good use of a bonus action.
The way I see this, were I to try and abuse it, you have basically said "if you have both of these weapons in hand, you can attack twice each time you attack". The wording is a bit hard to fully distinguish - I'm not sure if the sole effect is to allow things which trigger on a hit to trigger twice?
But anyway, to abuse this I would have an Echo Knight (yes, my favourite fighter class at the moment) and at level 5 have 2 attacks, plus one for the offhand attack bonus action, plus one from the echo, then action surge to get 3 more attacks, for 7 attacks which all double the effects on them! Also consider things like smite, does it double that?
Here's an alternative you may appreciate instead:
"Uncommon magic weapon (Pair of swords), finesse, 1d8 slashing damage, requires attunement. Once on each of your turns, when you hit with a melee attack with one of these weapons, if you are wielding the other in your off hand you can deal additional damage equal to 1d8 plus your strength or dexterity modifier to the attack. If you choose to do so, you cannot make an offhand attack. This additional damage is applied after the doubling from a critical hit."
Fluffwise, the second weapon is drawn in magically by the first, basically allowing you to ignore your other arm. It effectively counts one of the attacks as being two hits, and frees up the bonus action. It also prevents them from just adding to their damage and still using the offhand attack, and stipulates that they need to be holding it, preventing somatic components to bonus action spells.
Make your Artificer work with any other class with 174 Multiclassing Feats for your Artificer Multiclass Character!
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I have started discussing/reviewing 3rd party D&D content on Substack - stay tuned for semi-regular posts!
T-WF doesn’t “suck,” it’s a trade off. Do I make an additional attack, or do I use my bonus action for something else?
And you can give them two special weapons without them being a paired set. Give them a +1 shortsword and a scimitar that does an additional 1d4 fire damage or something. They get to choose which one they use as their main and which as their secondary every round. That’s cool. The weapons don’t have to specifically fit together.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
If they want the fun of dual-wielding with something other than just Extra Attack, then definitely make them use their Bonus Action to do it. Giving them anything else to allow extra attacks will just make them OP compared to the other PCs.
I'm curious though, why don't they have their Bonus Action available?
Or use the 1D&D UA version of the light property:
Andnif they have the fighting style they add their modifier to the second attack
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
I had seen a suggestion about a homebrew feat Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, where the attack with the bonus action changed to a flat out extra attack. I didn't want to go that far, so I'm trying to make it more exclusive to this character.
Regarding enlarge reduce, I'll try to be more clear on the wording, as I was trying to make the point that the normal 1d4 is now 2d4 since there's two blades.
The reason for this strong of a weapon is that the story takes place in a world where adventurers have been collected by an evil entity and have basically been bred for the last few decades, and the party is the result of this. So the island nation that they're in is saturated with magic. The BBEG is giving all of them these super strong Ancestral Weapon (Tools that can only be used by blood relatives of the previous wielders) that will grow in power in tandem with the players. They are still unaware of all this and are just blindly enjoying the unusually abundant magic items in the realm.
As you can imagine, the monsters of this campaign are buffed so that they don't just walk through everything.
Watching them play out combats, I've noticed that they either need to use hunter's mark, or attack and they barely get to fight to their fullest potential, and they are getting outshined in terms of effectiveness in battle. Plus they will need to stay relevant when the fighter and rogue get their Ancestral Weapons. With the way this campaign is structured, not giving them item's like this is just condemning them to death
Regardless of all this, they will get to have their bonus action freed up after receiving this item. Basically I'm looking for critiques of the weapon itself, not the rule change I'm making
Hunter’s mark only needs to be cast once, not every round. It only uses additional bonus actions to move it if the current target dies. It adds 1d6 to every attack they get. With 2 attacks per Attack action, that potentially another 2d6 per turn, possibly more depending on their subclass, plus another 1d6 if they make an opportunity attack. That’s without using their bonus action to attack, on the turns they do that’s yet another 1d6 on top of all of that. That’s worth giving up a bonus attack every once in a while. That’s just game balance.
Now, to maximize their hunter’s mark, it’s better to cast it on the biggest baddy in the fight so they won’t have to move it around much if at all. If they keep placing it on the weenies and having to move it around turn after turn, that’s on them, not you.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Oh sorry, they're level 5 right now, but they are still waiting on the weapons to arrive and they'll find out soon that the shipment was attacked by pirates, so i'm expecting them to be about level 10 before they actually get them.
But no not everyone can get the extra attack from dual wielding, it's just these blades that grant the rule change
Ok, so I think that the effect you're after is that if these are used as a paired weapon, every attack doubles the effect of additional dice?
Something like:
"Each of these weapons deals 1d6 slashing damage. You can instead elect to wield both, counting as a single, two-handed weapon. When you do so, the damage increases to 2d6, and any effects which add damage dice to an attack (such as enlarge/reduce, hunters mark, sneak attack, or smite) can be applied twice to the attack. If such an ability would cost resources to apply, such as smite costing a spell slot, then this resource must be spent once for each application. If an ability can only be used once per turn (eg hunters mark), then it can be applied twice, but only to one attack per turn."
This is one of those things which could be very powerful, or very underwhelming. If they do stack a load of modifiers on there, they could deal huge amounts of damage, but if they don't then they would fall flat. An "off the top of my head" one would be stacking thunderous smite with eldritch smite using these weapons to get 12d8 additional damage on an attack, which is enormous.
Make your Artificer work with any other class with 174 Multiclassing Feats for your Artificer Multiclass Character!
DM's Guild Releases on This Thread Or check them all out on DMs Guild!
DrivethruRPG Releases on This Thread - latest release: My Character is a Werewolf: balanced rules for Lycanthropy!
I have started discussing/reviewing 3rd party D&D content on Substack - stay tuned for semi-regular posts!
Yeah I do like the caveat of explicitly stating that spells applied (Like Holy Weapon) would need to be cast twice, since this item "Counts" as two weapons.
I would like to point out that hunter's mark isn't just once per turn: "Until the spell ends, you deal an extra 1d6 damage to the target whenever you hit it with a weapon attack"
I forgot to note that this weapon requires attunement, and if this character dies then the weapon is permanently unuseable, since the character has no children
Here's another question and for some reason I can't figure out how to start a new thread;
I'm making a homebrew monster that has flat damage (Similar to Armor of Agathys) but I can't figure out how to make the code to send this, like you can with roller tags. Coding is outside my field of knowledge, so I'm just copy/pasting similar abilities from other monsters...
The best I can do is
1/day each: [-spell]Armor of Agathys[/spell] [-rollable]45;{"diceNotation":"5d4kl1+44","rollType":"damage","rollAction":"Innate Armor of Agathys","rollDamageType":"cold"}[/rollable]