After reading through your last post and this post, a lot of the problems you guys are having are really easy to solve by reading the Player's Handbook.
At the very least, read the basic rules which are on this site for free. As for the DM, since they are new they are going to make a lot of calls that don't make sense, and it really seems like they haven't read the PHB (or basic rules) either. Have a talk with your group and see what they think.
Also, keep in mind, if you are using D&D Beyond character sheets, you can click on the ability check and it gives you a basic rundown (like jumping across a 10ft. gap) of what you use those skills for. In fact, almost every part of the character sheet is somewhat clickable with descriptions of how things work. There's even a hidden wizard that shows up and dances if you click in the right place lol.
TLDR; Your party and the DM need to read the core rules contained in the Player's Handbook or the Basic Rules. Otherwise, you'll find yourself asking these types of questions after every session. The DM might benefit from reading the Dungeon Master's Guide also, but I don't think it's 100% necessary to run a game. Good luck!
Edit: I just wanted to add that it's perfectly ok for a new group to keep referring to the PHB whenever there is a question about a ruling. Just keep in mind, once the DM makes the ruling final, it's considered bad form or "Rules Lawyering" to argue against it during the game. If you have a problem with a DM's call, always bring it to their attention after the session is over so you aren't interrupting the other players time at the table. Again, good luck with your adventures!
Im a new player with a group of friends which are also all new to dnd, and so is the dm. and last time i had some issues with the way things were handled and got some really great feedback from the people here, and im hoping i can get some more help.
we ran another session today and i noticed that we had to do an ability check for pretty much everything we wanted to do.
- trying to cut up an shirt into smaller pieces (failed my sleight of hand check and couldnt cut through)
I would have just said you succeed assuming it is justa regular shirt and you had a knife, dagger or something similar.
- jumping a 10ft gap (failed my athletics check and fell down)
Probably need to know more about this one, as your DM may have been correct:
Jumping
Your Strength determines how far you can jump.
Long Jump. When you make a long jump, you cover a number of feet up to your Strength score if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When you make a standing long jump, you can leap only half that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement.
This rule assumes that the height of your jump doesn't matter, such as a jump across a stream or chasm. At your DM's option, you must succeed on a DC 10 Strength (Athletics) check to clear a low obstacle (no taller than a quarter of the jump's distance), such as a hedge or low wall. Otherwise, you hit it.
When you land in difficult terrain, you must succeed on a DC 10 Dexterity (Acrobatics) check to land on your feet. Otherwise, you land prone.
- using thaumaturgy to create the sound of rocks falling down to distract my party members (failed deception check and the sound failed)
The sound should have pretty much succeeded, but if you were trying to deceive or distract someone, that may have failed.
i just feel like some actions should be self explanatory and easy that they should not be able to fail, or is it the right thing to do and call a check for everything you wish to do?
also if we are forced to roll for perception and the roll is lower than the passive perception, i assume that the lowest outcome should always be equal to the passive?
- trying to cut up an shirt into smaller pieces (failed my sleight of hand check and couldnt cut through)
Unless it's a special shirt, it should be easy enough to cut it up that you don't need to roll.
- jumping a 10ft gap (failed my athletics check and fell down)
It depends.
Long Jump. When you make a long jump, you cover a number of feet up to your Strength score if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When you make a standing long jump, you can leap only half that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement.
So, if you had a run-up, and your Strength score is 10 or higher, and there wasn't anything especially difficult about the jump, you shouldn't need to roll anything.
- using thaumaturgy to create the sound of rocks falling down to distract my party members (failed deception check and the sound failed)
You shouldn't have to roll to do the thing that the spell says it does.
also if we are forced to roll for perception and the roll is lower than the passive perception, i assume that the lowest outcome should always be equal to the passive?
Nope. Different situations call for either a roll or a passive check. Your passive isn't a minimum roll or anything.
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Look at what you've done. You spoiled it. You have nobody to blame but yourself. Go sit and think about your actions.
Don't be mean. Rudeness is a vicious cycle, and it has to stop somewhere. Exceptions for things that are funny. Go to the current Competition of the Finest 'Brews! It's a cool place where cool people make cool things.
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According to the PHB, the Passive Scores are for two purposes.
The first is for repeated checks. The PHB gives the example of repeatedly looking for secret doors - rather than rolling a dozen times, you just take the average (10+modifiers) and take that.
The other is if the DM wants to do a check without alerting players. The example given is if there is a hidden monster - getting the players to roll Perception would tip them off that something is there, so using their Passive Perception instead allows you to account for their investments in skills while avoiding alerting them.
The 'passive' part of Passive Perception is a bit misleading.
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
There are a couple of basic rules to follow with ability checks as well:
1. If there is no reasonable chance that someone would fail at a task (such as cutting up a shirt), then there is no need to roll, they just succeed. However, if you were trying to cut the shirt up in some special pattern or in some special way, then you might fail at doing that.
2. If there is no reasonable chance that someone could succeed at a task (like jumping across a 100 foot ravine), then there is no need to roll, they just fail.
3. If there is a chance that someone could fail at a task, but they essentially have all the time in the world to complete it (such as a skilled lockpick having as much time as they want to pick a lock), they just succeed. You could still use a skill check for this, and decide from its level of success/failure how long the task takes.
So, in general an ability check is called for when there is both a chance of success and a chance of failure, and there is some consequence for the success or failure. Not every action needs a roll.
As DM i only ask for an ability check when some stress is present and there's meaningful consequence for failure, especially if the task is complex, difficult or time-pressure, as explained in the Dungeon Master’s Guide suggestion for Using Ability Scores.
I usually don't ask a check for moving outside combat or stress, characters just walk, fly, swim, climb, or jump the distance unless Strenght doesn't allow them, or when conditions such as environement or equipment adds difficulty somehow.
If the task involve another creature, i will usually ask for one, especially if a contest is involved.
Using Ability Scores: When a player wants to do something, it’s often appropriate to let the attempt succeed without a roll or a reference to the character’s ability scores. For example, a character doesn’t normally need to make a Dexterity check to walk across an empty room or a Charisma check to order a mug of ale. Only call for a roll if there is a meaningful consequence for failure.
When deciding whether to use a roll, ask yourself two questions:
Is a task so easy and so free of conflict and stress that there should be no chance of failure?
Is a task so inappropriate or impossible — such as hitting the moon with an arrow — that it can’t work?
If the answer to both of these questions is no, some kind of roll is appropriate. The following sections provide guidance on determining whether to call for an ability check, attack roll, or saving throw; how to assign DCs; when to use advantage and disadvantage; and other related topics.
As for Wisdom (Perception) check) while the game developper have been known to say Passive Perception can act as a minimum threshold for such check, it's not in the rules. Passive checks are normally used in place of active check to represent the average result for a task done repeatedly or when a DM wants to secretly determine whether the characters succeed at something without rolling dice, with no mention that your Passive score would be minimum. I know some DM do and some don't so it's up to your DM.
Passive Checks: A passive check is a special kind of ability check that doesn't involve any die rolls. Such a check can represent the average result for a task done repeatedly, such as searching for secret doors over and over again, or can be used when the DM wants to secretly determine whether the characters succeed at something without rolling dice, such as noticing a hidden monster.
Question has been answered, thanks!
After reading through your last post and this post, a lot of the problems you guys are having are really easy to solve by reading the Player's Handbook.
At the very least, read the basic rules which are on this site for free. As for the DM, since they are new they are going to make a lot of calls that don't make sense, and it really seems like they haven't read the PHB (or basic rules) either. Have a talk with your group and see what they think.
Also, keep in mind, if you are using D&D Beyond character sheets, you can click on the ability check and it gives you a basic rundown (like jumping across a 10ft. gap) of what you use those skills for. In fact, almost every part of the character sheet is somewhat clickable with descriptions of how things work. There's even a hidden wizard that shows up and dances if you click in the right place lol.
TLDR; Your party and the DM need to read the core rules contained in the Player's Handbook or the Basic Rules. Otherwise, you'll find yourself asking these types of questions after every session. The DM might benefit from reading the Dungeon Master's Guide also, but I don't think it's 100% necessary to run a game. Good luck!
Edit: I just wanted to add that it's perfectly ok for a new group to keep referring to the PHB whenever there is a question about a ruling. Just keep in mind, once the DM makes the ruling final, it's considered bad form or "Rules Lawyering" to argue against it during the game. If you have a problem with a DM's call, always bring it to their attention after the session is over so you aren't interrupting the other players time at the table. Again, good luck with your adventures!
Unless it's a special shirt, it should be easy enough to cut it up that you don't need to roll.
It depends.
So, if you had a run-up, and your Strength score is 10 or higher, and there wasn't anything especially difficult about the jump, you shouldn't need to roll anything.
You shouldn't have to roll to do the thing that the spell says it does.
Nope. Different situations call for either a roll or a passive check. Your passive isn't a minimum roll or anything.
Look at what you've done. You spoiled it. You have nobody to blame but yourself. Go sit and think about your actions.
Don't be mean. Rudeness is a vicious cycle, and it has to stop somewhere. Exceptions for things that are funny.
Go to the current Competition of the Finest 'Brews! It's a cool place where cool people make cool things.
How I'm posting based on text formatting: Mod Hat Off - Mod Hat Also Off (I'm not a mod)
According to the PHB, the Passive Scores are for two purposes.
The first is for repeated checks. The PHB gives the example of repeatedly looking for secret doors - rather than rolling a dozen times, you just take the average (10+modifiers) and take that.
The other is if the DM wants to do a check without alerting players. The example given is if there is a hidden monster - getting the players to roll Perception would tip them off that something is there, so using their Passive Perception instead allows you to account for their investments in skills while avoiding alerting them.
The 'passive' part of Passive Perception is a bit misleading.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
There are a couple of basic rules to follow with ability checks as well:
1. If there is no reasonable chance that someone would fail at a task (such as cutting up a shirt), then there is no need to roll, they just succeed. However, if you were trying to cut the shirt up in some special pattern or in some special way, then you might fail at doing that.
2. If there is no reasonable chance that someone could succeed at a task (like jumping across a 100 foot ravine), then there is no need to roll, they just fail.
3. If there is a chance that someone could fail at a task, but they essentially have all the time in the world to complete it (such as a skilled lockpick having as much time as they want to pick a lock), they just succeed. You could still use a skill check for this, and decide from its level of success/failure how long the task takes.
So, in general an ability check is called for when there is both a chance of success and a chance of failure, and there is some consequence for the success or failure. Not every action needs a roll.
As DM i only ask for an ability check when some stress is present and there's meaningful consequence for failure, especially if the task is complex, difficult or time-pressure, as explained in the Dungeon Master’s Guide suggestion for Using Ability Scores.
I usually don't ask a check for moving outside combat or stress, characters just walk, fly, swim, climb, or jump the distance unless Strenght doesn't allow them, or when conditions such as environement or equipment adds difficulty somehow.
If the task involve another creature, i will usually ask for one, especially if a contest is involved.
As for Wisdom (Perception) check) while the game developper have been known to say Passive Perception can act as a minimum threshold for such check, it's not in the rules. Passive checks are normally used in place of active check to represent the average result for a task done repeatedly or when a DM wants to secretly determine whether the characters succeed at something without rolling dice, with no mention that your Passive score would be minimum. I know some DM do and some don't so it's up to your DM.