As a workaround, you could potentially make a homebrew copy of the 2024 subclass to see how it was set up, then rebuild it as a 2014 subclass.
Thank you very much for the information.
Disappointing, to be sure, but also understandable as WOTC would want to push people towards 5e 2024.
Unfortunately that means I won't be purchasing anytime soon. :(
It would be Chaosium's decision as to what base classes their content is designed for, not WotCs. WotC isn't telling third parties what version of the core rules to use; the 5.1 SRD is still out there for people to make 2014 content (and people still are doing so)
Ah, thanks for the correction there! I didn't know how that would work with 3rd party companies, and it was incorrect of me to assume.
I wanted to give an update on bug quashing and typo hunting. I'll use this thread to collect issues and provide rules clarifications. This is Gen Con week, so bandwidth is a little tight, but I hope to stay on top of things.
First of all, a huge thank you to everyone who has taken the time to post a bug. It's hugely disappointing to ship a product with errors. The least I can do is correct them as they come up. I identified the fail point in our process (it came down to how I was tracking files and their current status), so we can avoid this in the future. To make this very clear, the folks who edited and developed the text did everything I asked of them. The mistake rests solely with me.
With that out of the way, here are issues that have been identified. I am going to focus on mechanics corrections. I am also tracking typos offline. I'll also address questions and thoughts in the thread.
Chapter 3: Subclasses
Wizard: Bibliomancy, Level 3: Edit Spell
Change the first bullet point to read: "The spell save DC of the chosen spell, if any, increases by 1."
Chapter 4: Spells
Body Warping of Gorgoroth: Strike "in range" from the first sentence.
Curse of the Putrid Husk: Replace the final paragraph with:
A creature becomes filled with spite as it tries to spread the disease to its enemies. It takes the Dash action and moves toward its nearest enemy by the safest route on each of its turns unless it is within 5 feet of a hostile creature.
Dust of Suleiman: Strike the words "when the Sphere moves into its space and" from the second to last sentence.
Feline Chaos: Insert the following at the start of the spell: "A horde of spectral cats rushes from your outstretched hands to swarm over an area. You target creatures of your choice in a 20-foot-radius Sphere centered on a point within range."
Fist of Yog-Sothoth: Strike "within the spell's range" from sentence three.
Shadowy Eruption: Under the Tomb of Shadows header, add "for 1 minute." to the end of the second sentence.
Chapter 6: Mythos Tomes
Under the Game Rules header, the Insight entry, delete the words "with a bonus".
The optional rule at the start of the spell listing gets to the heart of what the spells seek to do. They offer reliable power at the cost of your sanity, though obviously not every campaign is going to use that. The *intent* is that the spells are still balanced, but I can see how they look too good compared to similar spells.
For a spell that leans on concentration to deliver an effect over time, I'd recommend giving the target a save at the end of its turns, remove concentration, and set the duration to the max listed.
Call Deity - I assume this works on any Mythos deity you choose? (The wording in Contact Deity is like Contact Other Plane, and I always thought that was to an entity you choose.) So can I just summon Cthulhu for an hour (without concentration) with this level 8 spell then run away? If so it’s not even worth comparing to the level 7 Conjure Celestial or level 6 Summon Fiend… I hope cultists don’t know this one!
Call Deity does indeed work on the Mythos deity you choose. Yes, you do indeed have the chance to summon Cthulhu! It's a trademark of Call of Cthulhu that you can sometimes summon things that are maybe best left alone. Keep in mind that only the *caster* is safe from the deity. Cthulhu happily eats your friends, and turns on you if you try to stop him.
Don't know if this is is intended, but Wave of Oblivion only affecting Bloodied creatures only seems weaker than other 9th level spells like Weird or Meteor Swarm. Shouldn't it at least deal some damage to non-Bloodied creatures?
The idea is that you use this as a finishing spell, especially if you have used AoEs to soften up a bunch of monsters at once. It's a little all or nothing, but the intent is to make it narrow but devastating if you set things up just right. It's risky, but it can end an encounter in a single action if you set things up.
- In chapter 4, The spell Create Mist of R’lyeh Level 1 Conjuration (Sorcerer, Warlock, Wizard) does not specify if the caster would be affected in the area while the Red Sign Level 6 Conjuration (Sorcerer, Warlock, Wizard) explicitily says so. Why specify it in one but not in the other? By the general rules of spellcasting the caster could be affected by their own AOEs. Following this, the level 6 specification that the damage does not break concentration should stay but the précision that the caster suffer the damage is unecessary.
Red Sign is specifically designed to do auto damage at the cost of dealing damage to the caster. The trick to it is to feed the caster enough healing for the group to come out ahead of the bargain. The limited range and sight requirement serve to make it a challenge for the group to keep the caster up and emitting the damage each round.
Normally you don't need to specify if a spell affects the caster, but since this one is balanced around it the description calls it out and specifies how it works.
Small question about the Red Sign... It says that "each creature (including yourself) within 30 feet of you that can see you takes 5d8 Necrotic damage"... Does this mean that if the caster can't see themselves, they take no damage ?
The intent is that the sight stipulation applies only to other creatures, not the caster.
True Shadow, for example, says "It vanishes when reduced to 0 Hit Points", but it says nowhere how many hit points the Shadow has and previously it says "Your shadow disappears when it takes any damage, is the target of any effect, or if you have the Incapacitated condition". And when it says "Its Attack action uses your game statistics, including class features, feats, and weapons", that only refers to the attack, not the hit points. Or is this supposed to be covered by "As a Bonus Action, your Shadowy Reflection transforms into an exact duplicate of you"? If so, why was it considered necessary to clarify that the attack uses the characters game statistics, but not whether the Shadow also otherwise shares the characters statistics when it comes to hit points or saving throws? I also noticed that the spell list for the Hungering Dark Sorcerer links to the 2014 version of Black Tentacles instead of the 2024 version.
The second sentence, "... your Shadowy Reflection transforms into an exact duplicate of you." should give hit points and other game stats. Looking at my notes, at one point this effect worked differently. The Attack action stipulation is a holdover from that design, though it does remain accurate (if confusing).
I don't have anything useful to add, just wanted to thank Mike for interacting with people here. A lot of others, both at WotC and third party, seem to have forgotten the importance of communication with their customers.
The optional rule at the start of the spell listing gets to the heart of what the spells seek to do. They offer reliable power at the cost of your sanity, though obviously not every campaign is going to use that. The *intent* is that the spells are still balanced, but I can see how they look too good compared to similar spells.
For a spell that leans on concentration to deliver an effect over time, I'd recommend giving the target a save at the end of its turns, remove concentration, and set the duration to the max listed.
Thank you for answering my previous question. Regarding this specific optional rule, the text says "On a failed save, you gain the following Passion with a rating of +10." I could not find anything on either the Passion or Insight sections defining what rating means, so I assume this meant to say "bonus", and the +10 is the bonus to invoke the Passion/Insight?
The flavour text for the Feline Court warlock has a sentence in need of a verb: “Across the cosmos, a grand conspiracy consisting of the most unlikely of creatures.”
And in the final sentence it says “magical pact” in place of “magical pacts”.
I just read the article summary about this rulebook that was posted in DDB and it makes mention of Behemoth rules for Mythos monsters, yet I can't find such rules in the bestiary section. Was there supposed to be such rules or were they cut off by mistake?
True Shadow, for example, says "It vanishes when reduced to 0 Hit Points", but it says nowhere how many hit points the Shadow has and previously it says "Your shadow disappears when it takes any damage, is the target of any effect, or if you have the Incapacitated condition". And when it says "Its Attack action uses your game statistics, including class features, feats, and weapons", that only refers to the attack, not the hit points. Or is this supposed to be covered by "As a Bonus Action, your Shadowy Reflection transforms into an exact duplicate of you"? If so, why was it considered necessary to clarify that the attack uses the characters game statistics, but not whether the Shadow also otherwise shares the characters statistics when it comes to hit points or saving throws? I also noticed that the spell list for the Hungering Dark Sorcerer links to the 2014 version of Black Tentacles instead of the 2024 version.
The second sentence, "... your Shadowy Reflection transforms into an exact duplicate of you." should give hit points and other game stats. Looking at my notes, at one point this effect worked differently. The Attack action stipulation is a holdover from that design, though it does remain accurate (if confusing).
I'm a little confused on the wording for the spell "Clutch of Darkness", it says that you're rolling 2d6 and writing that down, and each turn you roll 2d6 again. But it's not point blank saying that this is all cumulative or each turn it's a new 4d6 total.
I'm always a huge fan of designers connecting with the players and making changes/errata to the product, even (or especially) if they need to do so post-release. Mr. Mearls' presence here has convinced me to purchase this product, despite my usual misgivings towards third-party. Thanks for being here!
I'm a little confused on the wording for the spell "Clutch of Darkness", it says that you're rolling 2d6 and writing that down, and each turn you roll 2d6 again. But it's not point blank saying that this is all cumulative or each turn it's a new 4d6 total.
I believe it's pretty clear it's cumulative: at the start of each turn, roll 2d6 and add it to the total rolled. It's a pretty devastating single target spell but more of a thematic choice due to it requiring multiple rounds to be effective. Many will just choose a damaging spell or another control spell over this to achieve similar results.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Ah, thanks for the correction there! I didn't know how that would work with 3rd party companies, and it was incorrect of me to assume.
Hey everyone!
I wanted to give an update on bug quashing and typo hunting. I'll use this thread to collect issues and provide rules clarifications. This is Gen Con week, so bandwidth is a little tight, but I hope to stay on top of things.
First of all, a huge thank you to everyone who has taken the time to post a bug. It's hugely disappointing to ship a product with errors. The least I can do is correct them as they come up. I identified the fail point in our process (it came down to how I was tracking files and their current status), so we can avoid this in the future. To make this very clear, the folks who edited and developed the text did everything I asked of them. The mistake rests solely with me.
With that out of the way, here are issues that have been identified. I am going to focus on mechanics corrections. I am also tracking typos offline. I'll also address questions and thoughts in the thread.
Chapter 3: Subclasses
Wizard: Bibliomancy, Level 3: Edit Spell
Change the first bullet point to read: "The spell save DC of the chosen spell, if any, increases by 1."
Chapter 4: Spells
Body Warping of Gorgoroth: Strike "in range" from the first sentence.
Curse of the Putrid Husk: Replace the final paragraph with:
A creature becomes filled with spite as it tries to spread the disease to its enemies. It takes the Dash action and moves toward its nearest enemy by the safest route on each of its turns unless it is within 5 feet of a hostile creature.
Dust of Suleiman: Strike the words "when the Sphere moves into its space and" from the second to last sentence.
Feline Chaos: Insert the following at the start of the spell: "A horde of spectral cats rushes from your outstretched hands to swarm over an area. You target creatures of your choice in a 20-foot-radius Sphere centered on a point within range."
Fist of Yog-Sothoth: Strike "within the spell's range" from sentence three.
Shadowy Eruption: Under the Tomb of Shadows header, add "for 1 minute." to the end of the second sentence.
Chapter 6: Mythos Tomes
Under the Game Rules header, the Insight entry, delete the words "with a bonus".
General note on spell power:
The optional rule at the start of the spell listing gets to the heart of what the spells seek to do. They offer reliable power at the cost of your sanity, though obviously not every campaign is going to use that. The *intent* is that the spells are still balanced, but I can see how they look too good compared to similar spells.
For a spell that leans on concentration to deliver an effect over time, I'd recommend giving the target a save at the end of its turns, remove concentration, and set the duration to the max listed.
Call Deity does indeed work on the Mythos deity you choose. Yes, you do indeed have the chance to summon Cthulhu! It's a trademark of Call of Cthulhu that you can sometimes summon things that are maybe best left alone. Keep in mind that only the *caster* is safe from the deity. Cthulhu happily eats your friends, and turns on you if you try to stop him.
The idea is that you use this as a finishing spell, especially if you have used AoEs to soften up a bunch of monsters at once. It's a little all or nothing, but the intent is to make it narrow but devastating if you set things up just right. It's risky, but it can end an encounter in a single action if you set things up.
Red Sign is specifically designed to do auto damage at the cost of dealing damage to the caster. The trick to it is to feed the caster enough healing for the group to come out ahead of the bargain. The limited range and sight requirement serve to make it a challenge for the group to keep the caster up and emitting the damage each round.
Normally you don't need to specify if a spell affects the caster, but since this one is balanced around it the description calls it out and specifies how it works.
The intent is that the sight stipulation applies only to other creatures, not the caster.
The second sentence, "... your Shadowy Reflection transforms into an exact duplicate of you." should give hit points and other game stats. Looking at my notes, at one point this effect worked differently. The Attack action stipulation is a holdover from that design, though it does remain accurate (if confusing).
I don't have anything useful to add, just wanted to thank Mike for interacting with people here. A lot of others, both at WotC and third party, seem to have forgotten the importance of communication with their customers.
Thank you for answering my previous question. Regarding this specific optional rule, the text says "On a failed save, you gain the following Passion with a rating of +10." I could not find anything on either the Passion or Insight sections defining what rating means, so I assume this meant to say "bonus", and the +10 is the bonus to invoke the Passion/Insight?
The flavour text for the Feline Court warlock has a sentence in need of a verb: “Across the cosmos, a grand conspiracy consisting of the most unlikely of creatures.”
And in the final sentence it says “magical pact” in place of “magical pacts”.
I just read the article summary about this rulebook that was posted in DDB and it makes mention of Behemoth rules for Mythos monsters, yet I can't find such rules in the bestiary section. Was there supposed to be such rules or were they cut off by mistake?
Thanks for clarifying!
I'm a little confused on the wording for the spell "Clutch of Darkness", it says that you're rolling 2d6 and writing that down, and each turn you roll 2d6 again. But it's not point blank saying that this is all cumulative or each turn it's a new 4d6 total.
I'm always a huge fan of designers connecting with the players and making changes/errata to the product, even (or especially) if they need to do so post-release. Mr. Mearls' presence here has convinced me to purchase this product, despite my usual misgivings towards third-party. Thanks for being here!
I believe it's pretty clear it's cumulative: at the start of each turn, roll 2d6 and add it to the total rolled. It's a pretty devastating single target spell but more of a thematic choice due to it requiring multiple rounds to be effective. Many will just choose a damaging spell or another control spell over this to achieve similar results.