@MadSkullz - Re: 5.5E/6E, unless things have changed hugely, that can't be the issue. The DDB team have previously mentioned that they have no significant "forewarning" of products or their content, at least not beyond what the printer might get. I.e. they learn a product is upcoming at the same time we do, and they get the final draft at the same time the printer does (so a few weeks/months before release). 5.5E/6E hasn't been announced, and it certainly isn't with a printer (we'd have seen leaks already if it was), so the DDB team can't be working on that.
On top of that, there are two other factors which speak against 5.5E/6E being the issue:
1) D&D's 50th is coming up in 2024. This would be the ideal time for a new edition. If there is a 5.5E or 6E, this is likely when it hits, especially as D&D is riding high right now. I'd personally expect a 6E that's basically like the 1E AD&D to 2E AD&D transition - i.e. a fair amount of changes "player-side" and with specific rules, but largely backwards-compatible with 1E material like adventures, settings, monsters, and so on. Anyway, getting off-topic lol but 2024 is when to expect that.
2) I would expect WotC will develop their own digital offering for 6E. Currently, they must be taking a cut from DDB sales (probably a large one - they get 50% on DMsguild), but a cut, even a large one, is still only a cut, and the overheads involved in running a product like DDB are relatively low (having worked on similar products, functionality-wise, and recently). On top of that, digital is more important literally every day, as a part of the brand image and how consumers interact with the product. Currently, that is outside WotC's control, and I do not believe that situation can possibly be seen as fully acceptable by WotC leadership, not for the long-term.
I don't expect WotC will leave DDB/Roll20 etc. out in the cold, but I also don't expect they'll prioritise them. It is of course possible WotC will purchase DDB for this, but I'd have expected that to have happened already, and it hasn't.
But yeah, in the end, the problems here are the lack of transparency. Not only is transparency not present, the few modes of communication which previously existed are gradually being shut down.
DDB is a for-profit organization paying royalties to the rights holders.
Those 'other sites' are almost certainly unlicensed and not paying any royalties. They may well be taking Covid less seriously (or ignoring it completely) and they may be working on a purely volunteer basis, which means no salary cost limitations.
This isn't plausible as a cause of DDB's problems. At all.
D&D 5E has seen 33% year-on-year growth for a very long time. Some estimates put it at 50m players and DMs right now, maybe even higher. This is insanely higher than when DDB launched.
DDB should be making several times the profit it was in say, 2017. DDB should be capable of maintaining a far larger staff than then. We know the payments that Roll20 and the like make to WotC haven't increased significantly, if at all, so it's implausible to think DDB's ones have. Staff costs haven't increased.
But it looks like, if anything, DDB is getting smaller and less active, not larger and more active. Why? I've speculated above - historically when this happens with subscription-model software companies (both games and productivity software) it's because new ownership has decided not to invest at all, and just pocket the profits.
1) Players or paid subscriptions? There is a large difference. Massive growth for a site offering considerable free services is rarely evenly proportionate to revenue.
2) Reinvestment is not simply a matter of writing cheques.
a) Upwards scalability of services is not infinite, especially during an epidemic.
b) With more users comes greater bandwidth costs.
c) Not checked, but it is possible that WotC's publication rate has been faster than in the past.
d) Likewise the newest books have had new mechanics and that means they are likely proportionately more work than earlier supplements have been.
i) with each new such book having new mechanics coming so relatively hot on the heels of the last, the backlog just grows.
e) Possible legacy coding issues that the other newer sites do not have to deal with.
f) It is not a given that the other sites are as scrutinized for errors. DDB gets more attention so errors are proclaimed more loudly. Especially here (for obvious reasons)
1) Inevitably both. There's zero possibility they aren't making significantly more money. They may not have see 33% year-on-year growth, but it's likely that they've seen something similar.
2) I'm well aware of all of this. Probably more aware than you are. But the pattern we're seeing with communication and features speaks to the opposite of reinvestment.
a) Agree, but we've seen no evidence at all of attempting to scale up - only scale down.
b) You're really weakening your own argument here, because this is a point made from profound ignorance. The bandwidth/server/CDN/etc. costs are going to be vastly smaller than you think, relative to revenue. This hasn't been a serious concern since the mid-late '00s. The massive growth of cloud service providers is part of this. Staff costs are likely to dwarf these.
c) WotC plan to increase it, but have not yet increased it. If DDB can't keep up with the current rate, they're doomed.
d) The new mechanics simply haven't been implemented, for the most part, or implemented only as if they were old mechanics (Lineages implemented as a single race for race). What you're demonstrating here is their failures, which are inevitably a failure of investment of some kind.
e) Legacy code issues cannot be that deep as DDB simply isn't that old or that complex, nor is it a business-critical system which cannot afford downtime or errors.
f) Yes a paid site with a larger audience is going to get criticised more than something fan-run and obscure, but I work with a lot of products (mostly business-oriented) which are fundamentally similar to DDB (i.e. essentially databases with an attractive front end, some ability to input/create/share content, and so on), and of a similar age, and DDB is experiencing worse problems and engaging in weirder prioritization than any of them.
I mean, I'm really hoping this is just a tricky time, and soon will be this thing no-one even remembers, but the total lack of communication without any apparent sign of bringing new staff on board is usually a very bad sign.
Quick Reminder to everyone in this thread: This thread is for posting issues with the content, not discussing the relative merits of the perceived pace of development. Please try to keep this thread on topic.
This is still applicable and a great reminder. The rest of this discussion should be moved to its own thread, out of the bugs & support thread specifically for Tasha's.
I mean, I'm really hoping this is just a tricky time, and soon will be this thing no-one even remembers, but the total lack of communication without any apparent sign of bringing new staff on board is usually a very bad sign.
Some good points, which I've snipped only to save space.
Why on earth are the mods, who turned up briefly to warn me about ever mentioning the P-word in any context, not forwarding these concerns?
We've paid for TCoE, and darn it I want it to work. Aberrant Mind Sorc is currently not feature complete, and we've no expectation for resolution of any sort.
Telekinetic (Charisma) isn't listed as an option for a feat upgrade as of this week on my character sheet. There is Telekinetic, Telekinetic (Intelligence), and Telekinetic (Wisdom). Am I missing something?
Telekinetic (Charisma) isn't listed as an option for a feat upgrade as of this week on my character sheet. There is Telekinetic, Telekinetic (Intelligence), and Telekinetic (Wisdom). Am I missing something?
By that, do you mean it isn't listed in the Ability Score Improvement - Feat selection when you're editing a class in the Character Builder?
Check to see if you already have the feat Telekinetic (Charisma) in Features & Traits on your character sheet; that definitely makes the feat option go away from the ASI dropdown.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Helpful rewriter of Japanese->English translation and delver into software codebases (she/e/they)
THE GENIE - Expanded Spell List. Currently we are adding all of the spells in this feature to the spell list of your Genie warlock - please reference the rules for which spells you are allowed to select for your chosen genie patron. This is due to a limitation in the tools that prevents us from being able to specifically set the spells based on your choice of genie kind. It's something that is on the list for resolution however.
I’m curious how much longer this will take? Circle of the Land druids are handled correctly, this is no different.
Can anyone confirm if this is still being worked on at all or if it has been forgotten about? The last update was in February but the armorer class is still broken... There are tons of posts complaining about it but I don't see any answer from dndbeyond staff. I searched the thread, but didn't read through all 109 pages so apologies if I missed it somewhere.
As far as I can tell it's been awhile since the last update (Friday 12th February).
Any idea when sidekick options will be added?
The last time I heard it mentioned in a dev update, it sounded like it was going to be a while, as other things (including features from earlier books that aren't yet implemented) are higher priority. They also said the "generic" feature system is a (but not the only) pre-requisite for a sidekick system. The generic feature system is in progress, but there's a ways to go on it yet. I would guess (and it is only a guess--remember that I am not staff and have no insider knowledge) that we're looking at 2022 for sidekicks.
As far as I can tell it's been awhile since the last update (Friday 12th February).
Any idea when sidekick options will be added?
I really hope soon or at less before a player ask me to design a Caster sidekick... Expert and Warrior is already complex enough.
You can at least create a homebrew monster of a sidekick and add it to the Extras tab, that's not too difficult. Only challenge there is managing spell slot expenditure for a spellcaster sidekick.
As far as I can tell it's been awhile since the last update (Friday 12th February).
Any idea when sidekick options will be added?
The last time I heard it mentioned in a dev update, it sounded like it was going to be a while, as other things (including features from earlier books that aren't yet implemented) are higher priority. They also said the "generic" feature system is a (but not the only) pre-requisite for a sidekick system. The generic feature system is in progress, but there's a ways to go on it yet. I would guess (and it is only a guess--remember that I am not staff and have no insider knowledge) that we're looking at 2022 for sidekicks.
Wait, they are still missing features from books older than Tasha's?
I searched and couldn't find another post mentioning this: I've just built a character using custom lineage, and even though I've chosen medium size, it has my movement speed at 20, instead of 30. Can't seem to find anywhere on the character sheet builder to fix this. Screenshots here
As far as I can tell it's been awhile since the last update (Friday 12th February).
Any idea when sidekick options will be added?
The last time I heard it mentioned in a dev update, it sounded like it was going to be a while, as other things (including features from earlier books that aren't yet implemented) are higher priority. They also said the "generic" feature system is a (but not the only) pre-requisite for a sidekick system. The generic feature system is in progress, but there's a ways to go on it yet. I would guess (and it is only a guess--remember that I am not staff and have no insider knowledge) that we're looking at 2022 for sidekicks.
Wait, they are still missing features from books older than Tasha's?
I searched and couldn't find another post mentioning this: I've just built a character using custom lineage, and even though I've chosen medium size, it has my movement speed at 20, instead of 30. Can't seem to find anywhere on the character sheet builder to fix this. Screenshots here
As far as I can tell it's been awhile since the last update (Friday 12th February).
Any idea when sidekick options will be added?
The last time I heard it mentioned in a dev update, it sounded like it was going to be a while, as other things (including features from earlier books that aren't yet implemented) are higher priority. They also said the "generic" feature system is a (but not the only) pre-requisite for a sidekick system. The generic feature system is in progress, but there's a ways to go on it yet. I would guess (and it is only a guess--remember that I am not staff and have no insider knowledge) that we're looking at 2022 for sidekicks.
Wait, they are still missing features from books older than Tasha's?
Yep. The healing bonus for Life Domain Clerics (Basic Rules/PHB) only got implemented this year. Charms, Blessings, and Boons (among other things) aren't implemented from the DMG, Theros is missing some things (Divine gifts?? I'm not real up on Theros). I think they finally got the Eberron and Ravnica stuff sorted, but it's possible there's still some pieces of those missing. The Divine Soul sorcerer alignment related spell still can't be swapped out (similar problem to psionics and clockwork, I believe). There's quite a backlog. Addressing that backlog is one of the goals for this year.
The staff and mods do read this, and things get passed along. Things get fixed when the correct team has time from future stuff to work on it.
That sounds like infinitely progressive technical debt. "Keep adding new things and fix things later if we have time" I've seen that approach at another developer and they are absolutely losing the war with it.
A few recent dev updates talked about the tech debt, and they are fighting it currently. From what I can tell they are winning, but a lot is waiting on what's called the Generic Features System.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
// I am Arenlor Developers should read This Changelog Moderator for D&D Beyond's YouTube, Twitch, and Discord.
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@MadSkullz - Re: 5.5E/6E, unless things have changed hugely, that can't be the issue. The DDB team have previously mentioned that they have no significant "forewarning" of products or their content, at least not beyond what the printer might get. I.e. they learn a product is upcoming at the same time we do, and they get the final draft at the same time the printer does (so a few weeks/months before release). 5.5E/6E hasn't been announced, and it certainly isn't with a printer (we'd have seen leaks already if it was), so the DDB team can't be working on that.
On top of that, there are two other factors which speak against 5.5E/6E being the issue:
1) D&D's 50th is coming up in 2024. This would be the ideal time for a new edition. If there is a 5.5E or 6E, this is likely when it hits, especially as D&D is riding high right now. I'd personally expect a 6E that's basically like the 1E AD&D to 2E AD&D transition - i.e. a fair amount of changes "player-side" and with specific rules, but largely backwards-compatible with 1E material like adventures, settings, monsters, and so on. Anyway, getting off-topic lol but 2024 is when to expect that.
2) I would expect WotC will develop their own digital offering for 6E. Currently, they must be taking a cut from DDB sales (probably a large one - they get 50% on DMsguild), but a cut, even a large one, is still only a cut, and the overheads involved in running a product like DDB are relatively low (having worked on similar products, functionality-wise, and recently). On top of that, digital is more important literally every day, as a part of the brand image and how consumers interact with the product. Currently, that is outside WotC's control, and I do not believe that situation can possibly be seen as fully acceptable by WotC leadership, not for the long-term.
I don't expect WotC will leave DDB/Roll20 etc. out in the cold, but I also don't expect they'll prioritise them. It is of course possible WotC will purchase DDB for this, but I'd have expected that to have happened already, and it hasn't.
But yeah, in the end, the problems here are the lack of transparency. Not only is transparency not present, the few modes of communication which previously existed are gradually being shut down.
1) Inevitably both. There's zero possibility they aren't making significantly more money. They may not have see 33% year-on-year growth, but it's likely that they've seen something similar.
2) I'm well aware of all of this. Probably more aware than you are. But the pattern we're seeing with communication and features speaks to the opposite of reinvestment.
a) Agree, but we've seen no evidence at all of attempting to scale up - only scale down.
b) You're really weakening your own argument here, because this is a point made from profound ignorance. The bandwidth/server/CDN/etc. costs are going to be vastly smaller than you think, relative to revenue. This hasn't been a serious concern since the mid-late '00s. The massive growth of cloud service providers is part of this. Staff costs are likely to dwarf these.
c) WotC plan to increase it, but have not yet increased it. If DDB can't keep up with the current rate, they're doomed.
d) The new mechanics simply haven't been implemented, for the most part, or implemented only as if they were old mechanics (Lineages implemented as a single race for race). What you're demonstrating here is their failures, which are inevitably a failure of investment of some kind.
e) Legacy code issues cannot be that deep as DDB simply isn't that old or that complex, nor is it a business-critical system which cannot afford downtime or errors.
f) Yes a paid site with a larger audience is going to get criticised more than something fan-run and obscure, but I work with a lot of products (mostly business-oriented) which are fundamentally similar to DDB (i.e. essentially databases with an attractive front end, some ability to input/create/share content, and so on), and of a similar age, and DDB is experiencing worse problems and engaging in weirder prioritization than any of them.
I mean, I'm really hoping this is just a tricky time, and soon will be this thing no-one even remembers, but the total lack of communication without any apparent sign of bringing new staff on board is usually a very bad sign.
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AlumniThis is still applicable and a great reminder. The rest of this discussion should be moved to its own thread, out of the bugs & support thread specifically for Tasha's.
Some good points, which I've snipped only to save space.
Why on earth are the mods, who turned up briefly to warn me about ever mentioning the P-word in any context, not forwarding these concerns?
We've paid for TCoE, and darn it I want it to work. Aberrant Mind Sorc is currently not feature complete, and we've no expectation for resolution of any sort.
Telekinetic (Charisma) isn't listed as an option for a feat upgrade as of this week on my character sheet. There is Telekinetic, Telekinetic (Intelligence), and Telekinetic (Wisdom). Am I missing something?
By that, do you mean it isn't listed in the Ability Score Improvement - Feat selection when you're editing a class in the Character Builder?
Check to see if you already have the feat Telekinetic (Charisma) in Features & Traits on your character sheet; that definitely makes the feat option go away from the ASI dropdown.
Helpful rewriter of Japanese->English translation and delver into software codebases (she/e/they)
As far as I can tell it's been awhile since the last update (Friday 12th February).
Any idea when sidekick options will be added?
I’m curious how much longer this will take? Circle of the Land druids are handled correctly, this is no different.
Can anyone confirm if this is still being worked on at all or if it has been forgotten about? The last update was in February but the armorer class is still broken... There are tons of posts complaining about it but I don't see any answer from dndbeyond staff. I searched the thread, but didn't read through all 109 pages so apologies if I missed it somewhere.
I really hope soon or at less before a player ask me to design a Caster sidekick... Expert and Warrior is already complex enough.
The last time I heard it mentioned in a dev update, it sounded like it was going to be a while, as other things (including features from earlier books that aren't yet implemented) are higher priority. They also said the "generic" feature system is a (but not the only) pre-requisite for a sidekick system. The generic feature system is in progress, but there's a ways to go on it yet. I would guess (and it is only a guess--remember that I am not staff and have no insider knowledge) that we're looking at 2022 for sidekicks.
Trying to Decide if DDB is for you? A few helpful threads: A Buyer's Guide to DDB; What I/We Bought and Why; How some DMs use DDB; A Newer Thread on Using DDB to Play
Helpful threads on other topics: Homebrew FAQ by IamSposta; Accessing Content by ConalTheGreat;
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You can at least create a homebrew monster of a sidekick and add it to the Extras tab, that's not too difficult. Only challenge there is managing spell slot expenditure for a spellcaster sidekick.
I'm kinda worried that they are not going to be able to keep pace with releases at this point.
Wait, they are still missing features from books older than Tasha's?
I searched and couldn't find another post mentioning this: I've just built a character using custom lineage, and even though I've chosen medium size, it has my movement speed at 20, instead of 30. Can't seem to find anywhere on the character sheet builder to fix this. Screenshots here
*sad DMG noises*
Strength too low for your heavy armor.
Yep. The healing bonus for Life Domain Clerics (Basic Rules/PHB) only got implemented this year. Charms, Blessings, and Boons (among other things) aren't implemented from the DMG, Theros is missing some things (Divine gifts?? I'm not real up on Theros). I think they finally got the Eberron and Ravnica stuff sorted, but it's possible there's still some pieces of those missing. The Divine Soul sorcerer alignment related spell still can't be swapped out (similar problem to psionics and clockwork, I believe). There's quite a backlog. Addressing that backlog is one of the goals for this year.
Trying to Decide if DDB is for you? A few helpful threads: A Buyer's Guide to DDB; What I/We Bought and Why; How some DMs use DDB; A Newer Thread on Using DDB to Play
Helpful threads on other topics: Homebrew FAQ by IamSposta; Accessing Content by ConalTheGreat;
Check your entitlements here. | Support Ticket LInk
That sounds like infinitely progressive technical debt. "Keep adding new things and fix things later if we have time" I've seen that approach at another developer and they are absolutely losing the war with it.
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ModeratorA few recent dev updates talked about the tech debt, and they are fighting it currently. From what I can tell they are winning, but a lot is waiting on what's called the Generic Features System.
// I am Arenlor
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