Hi all! Name's Doug and I'm a new DM, new to D&D, and new to the forum. Just an all round newbie, really, so be gentle and please excuse any missteps I may make.
I'd love to some advice from seasoned DMs to improve party cohesion, and get players to consider their interactions with other party members and not just play two dimensional versions of their character's flavor text. Maybe the best advice is to just let it play out, and let the party find its own solution, but I fear collapse of the game altogether. Everyone enjoys the game, they're just having a hard time playing together.
I'm running the Lost Mine of Phandalver campaign for my family. We've played about 5 sessions. The issue I'm having is that the family all have very different ways of playing, and my 18yo son in particular is grating on the nerves of another player. Said player loves to play reckless, disruptive characters, and tends to play them to the extreme. He finds it amusing to go off 'half-cocked', before the party can formulate a plan. He's even said in the past that he likes the idea of having a character that forces other players to rein him in. Which is all well and good - if the other players are on board with that and would also have fun with it. Unfortunately, this party is not. And if anyone mentions it, he gets defensive that he's "just role playing the character!"
Here are some things I've tried, and some things I plan to try.
What I've tried:
1. Before we even started the game, and knowing precisely how he likes to play *every* game, I had a private chat. We talked about how he likes reckless characters that must be reined in, and how he enjoys 'messing with other players'. I pointed out that that's fine, but that you have to read the room if you're to play like that. Personally, I might quite enjoy playing the mage alongside a reckless barbarian who has to be magically restrained while we formulate a plan, before pointing him at the enemy and letting him loose. But his actual party members are categorically not that. Further more, he's a halfling rogue, not a barbarian, so it's not like he's equipped to run in and tank hits.
2. I tried giving the party something of a back story, pointing out that although they have very distinct personalities, they've been together for a while prior to the campaign, and it's reasonable to assume they have found some way to work together, and they should consider incorporating that into their role play. Just smooth the edges off a little, you know? The Rogue can still be reckless, especially in a particular situation where you can deem that his reckless nature has been triggered by circumstance, but the character has evolved a little to understand that if you're pursuing the primary goal of one of the other party members, let them take the lead, and don't force the party's hand by running in unprepared. No one who lives to be a hero runs into *every* situation unprepared.
3. Actions have consequences. Running in half-cocked gets him *hurt*. Unfortunately, this is simply adding to the aggravation, as the party then feels obliged to bail him out and feels forced down a sub-optimal path they would not have chosen.
4. Coaching the other players to roleplay out their frustrations within the game as characters, not as players. If his character has a right to act reckless, their characters have a right to react accordingly. I tried to lead by example on this one when his character out of the blue threatened to kill(!) Sildar Hallwinter if he revealed his (the rogue's) shady past.
If nothing else works:
5. Pointing out, privately and individually, to all the players that loyalty has limits and it's a valid role playing option to *not* run to his rescue. If a level 1 halfling wants to storm the dragon's lair, it pretty reasonable for the party members to say 'sod that'. Player death really isn't how I'd like to resolve this, but it may be the only thing that gets him to engage a lower gear.
"Just roleplaying the character" isn't an excuse for playing a chaotic stupid character. If he's running headlong into every situation then it's going to spoil everyone else's fun. It's not every other player and the dm's job to reign his character in! Roleplaying is interacting with the other players and allowing your character to grow.
I think a quiet word to advise that sure, his character can perhaps start off being reckless like this, but to actually roleplay the character would see him quickly learn that action have consequences and no-one will keep him in a party if he's going to put them all at risk. It'd be more fun for him and everyone else to play the halfling just itching to go into beserker mode but having to hold himself back for the good of the party.
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Sir, the possibility of successfully navigating an asteroid field is approximately 3,720 to 1!
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You might try an out of character discussing with everyone at the table. Be blunt. Tell him that what he’s doing is making things less fun for everyone else, and it’s quite selfish. Then talk with the other people and explain that this is the way he likes to play. Find the compromise point where he can play how he wants but before it starts annoying the others. There’s ways to play a reckless character without going full Leroy Jenkins. Make him realize there might come a time when he pushes too far and the others won’t bail him out.
And I’d say your point 5 is perfectly fine (assuming you meant character death, not player death, which would be pretty extreme 😄). Character death happens all the time, and it’s fine, it’s what gives the game tension. Especially in a published module where things are pretty on rails no matter what characters you use. Actions in D&D have consequences and you don’t get to fix them by re-loading a previous save. It’s not a bad lesson to learn.
Vedexent, I think the video you should have posted is "The Wangrod Defense" - in that one he specifically talks about players being wangrods and then claiming "but I'm just roleplaying my character!"
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It'll be a self correcting problem when the rest of the party realise they don't have to bail the rogue out of self inflicted certain death. Keep reminding the rest of the players that their characters are allowed to be fed up with some idiot putting their lives at risks and even the most patient and loyal character will eventually snap.
Hi all! Name's Doug and I'm a new DM, new to D&D, and new to the forum. Just an all round newbie, really, so be gentle and please excuse any missteps I may make.
I'd love to some advice from seasoned DMs to improve party cohesion, and get players to consider their interactions with other party members and not just play two dimensional versions of their character's flavor text. Maybe the best advice is to just let it play out, and let the party find its own solution, but I fear collapse of the game altogether. Everyone enjoys the game, they're just having a hard time playing together.
I'm running the Lost Mine of Phandalver campaign for my family. We've played about 5 sessions. The issue I'm having is that the family all have very different ways of playing, and my 18yo son in particular is grating on the nerves of another player. Said player loves to play reckless, disruptive characters, and tends to play them to the extreme. He finds it amusing to go off 'half-cocked', before the party can formulate a plan. He's even said in the past that he likes the idea of having a character that forces other players to rein him in. Which is all well and good - if the other players are on board with that and would also have fun with it. Unfortunately, this party is not. And if anyone mentions it, he gets defensive that he's "just role playing the character!"
Here are some things I've tried, and some things I plan to try.
What I've tried:
1. Before we even started the game, and knowing precisely how he likes to play *every* game, I had a private chat. We talked about how he likes reckless characters that must be reined in, and how he enjoys 'messing with other players'. I pointed out that that's fine, but that you have to read the room if you're to play like that. Personally, I might quite enjoy playing the mage alongside a reckless barbarian who has to be magically restrained while we formulate a plan, before pointing him at the enemy and letting him loose. But his actual party members are categorically not that. Further more, he's a halfling rogue, not a barbarian, so it's not like he's equipped to run in and tank hits.
2. I tried giving the party something of a back story, pointing out that although they have very distinct personalities, they've been together for a while prior to the campaign, and it's reasonable to assume they have found some way to work together, and they should consider incorporating that into their role play. Just smooth the edges off a little, you know? The Rogue can still be reckless, especially in a particular situation where you can deem that his reckless nature has been triggered by circumstance, but the character has evolved a little to understand that if you're pursuing the primary goal of one of the other party members, let them take the lead, and don't force the party's hand by running in unprepared. No one who lives to be a hero runs into *every* situation unprepared.
3. Actions have consequences. Running in half-cocked gets him *hurt*. Unfortunately, this is simply adding to the aggravation, as the party then feels obliged to bail him out and feels forced down a sub-optimal path they would not have chosen.
4. Coaching the other players to roleplay out their frustrations within the game as characters, not as players. If his character has a right to act reckless, their characters have a right to react accordingly. I tried to lead by example on this one when his character out of the blue threatened to kill(!) Sildar Hallwinter if he revealed his (the rogue's) shady past.
If nothing else works:
5. Pointing out, privately and individually, to all the players that loyalty has limits and it's a valid role playing option to *not* run to his rescue. If a level 1 halfling wants to storm the dragon's lair, it pretty reasonable for the party members to say 'sod that'. Player death really isn't how I'd like to resolve this, but it may be the only thing that gets him to engage a lower gear.
"Just roleplaying the character" isn't an excuse for playing a chaotic stupid character. If he's running headlong into every situation then it's going to spoil everyone else's fun. It's not every other player and the dm's job to reign his character in! Roleplaying is interacting with the other players and allowing your character to grow.
I think a quiet word to advise that sure, his character can perhaps start off being reckless like this, but to actually roleplay the character would see him quickly learn that action have consequences and no-one will keep him in a party if he's going to put them all at risk. It'd be more fun for him and everyone else to play the halfling just itching to go into beserker mode but having to hold himself back for the good of the party.
Sir, the possibility of successfully navigating an asteroid field is approximately 3,720 to 1!
Never tell me the DC.
Here's some excellent advice on the various types of Players, and how to deal with them.
You may notice some similarities with your situation.
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
You might try an out of character discussing with everyone at the table. Be blunt. Tell him that what he’s doing is making things less fun for everyone else, and it’s quite selfish. Then talk with the other people and explain that this is the way he likes to play. Find the compromise point where he can play how he wants but before it starts annoying the others. There’s ways to play a reckless character without going full Leroy Jenkins. Make him realize there might come a time when he pushes too far and the others won’t bail him out.
And I’d say your point 5 is perfectly fine (assuming you meant character death, not player death, which would be pretty extreme 😄). Character death happens all the time, and it’s fine, it’s what gives the game tension. Especially in a published module where things are pretty on rails no matter what characters you use. Actions in D&D have consequences and you don’t get to fix them by re-loading a previous save. It’s not a bad lesson to learn.
Thank you all for the advice. I shall put it into practice in our next session.
I noticed this after posting, couldn't be bothered to edit. Definitely meant character death - but there are days, there are days....
Vedexent, I think the video you should have posted is "The Wangrod Defense" - in that one he specifically talks about players being wangrods and then claiming "but I'm just roleplaying my character!"
:)
I had considered it :)
However, the Wangrod - and how to deal with them - is mentioned in there. Plus, it's got a lot of other good advice in there, as well.
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
Kill their player. Have Tiamat swoop forth, eat ONLY that player, and fly away.
I am an Arachpriest, Cat Cultist, Sauce Monk, Angel of Death, and First Spinjitzu Master.
I play Thirteen the necromancer elf, Timber the tabaxi child, and more at the tavern. Hope you like yams!
Oh yeah, don't forget to be kind and loving and stuff. Not on during weekends.
Ah the scene stealing immaturity of youth.
It'll be a self correcting problem when the rest of the party realise they don't have to bail the rogue out of self inflicted certain death. Keep reminding the rest of the players that their characters are allowed to be fed up with some idiot putting their lives at risks and even the most patient and loyal character will eventually snap.
This thread is over two years old. The OP no longer needs help.