Okay, so my first thought as I approached DMing for the first time - and not having played since I was a kid - was that I wouldn't be working too hard to keep track of things like ammunition (within reason) or provisions or things like that. My group of first-timers is starting up Lost Mines of Phandelver this week, and I've been reading a bunch in preparation. It seems like maybe I ought to expend the extra effort. Is there a good balance here? I don't want to get bogged down in the weeds. I'd welcome advice on where to draw the line on this stuff.
As a related issue, is there a rule on how to handle recovering ammunition? If a PC fires off 7 or 8 arrows or bolts in an encounter, and wants to go grab them afterwardds, is there a DC for that?
My DM doesn't track ammo or carry limits, unless things get out of hand. It works well for us, since we have a teenager in the group who has a tough time staying focused. Do what you feel works for you and your group.
I'd welcome advice on where to draw the line on this stuff.
I'd like to second what was already stated by Firehawk, draw the line wherever works for you and your group. I'd also like to add to that by saying that my group draws our line on that matter like this: every in-game month the players decide what quality of lifestyle to purchase for their characters over the next month and they pay for 30 days as priced on the lifestyle expense chart. The characters are still role-played as spending those coins during the course of the month, rather than all at once at some kind of Lifestyle store.
That purchase covers food, lodging, clothing, and any equipment which is not assigned a specific mechanical trait of worth (so most of the adventuring gear the party might want, but things like spare flasks of oil to throw or crowbars have to be specifically purchased). And to supplement that: or encumbrance rule is that sometimes I'll ask for an explanation how something is being carried/transported, but no math is ever done on the matter; and characters are assumed to have plenty of normal ammunition unless plot dictates otherwise.
The reason being that when it comes to the effort I expend as DM and my players expend as players, I want for the effort to be getting us the real good stuff (the stuff that'd be on screen if you were watching a tv show or movie that told the same tale), not the book-keeping parts that feel like not quite playing (the equivalent being all the stuff that is totally done on every tv show or movie, but is done behind the scenes rather than on camera).
I'd welcome advice on where to draw the line on this stuff.
The reason being that when it comes to the effort I expend as DM and my players expend as players, I want for the effort to be getting us the real good stuff (the stuff that'd be on screen if you were watching a tv show or movie that told the same tale), not the book-keeping parts that feel like not quite playing (the equivalent being all the stuff that is totally done on every tv show or movie, but is done behind the scenes rather than on camera).
This is essentially what I'm looking to get to. Your solution is interesting, I may put that to my players and see if they want to do something like that. I was thinking of those mechanics also though as being a type of cost. For example, if there's an action that someone in the party wants to do that is connected to a short or long rest.
You're going to find something in the middle of what works for you. You can have your players keep track of the ammo and it can be fun when they run out and makes for an interesting role play scene if you track it.
After a long session of fighting and you think about the 5th level fighter with archery that is firing 2 arrows around it will add up really quick and BOOM! "you are out of arrows what do you do now?" I'm not saying you should quick track of ammo but once in a while it can fun.
As far as weight I only check when I think it's getting out of hand as already mentioned.
The same can be said for spell components. Those are tricky and sometimes, hard to find and extremely expensive. Some DM's don't track these and some do. In some groups I've asked for a flat rate of gold for spells casts. Rather than trying to figure out how many Magic missiles spell components you. But like ammo it can be fun to watch the wizard run out of the things that keep them in the fight. You'll be glad you got that dagger at level 1.
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JT "You will find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view."
A 5th level fighter probably has a bag of holding and enough gold to buy like a million arrows (especially retrieving them from battles). In other words unless a player isn't planning ahead at all, they can easily buy so much ammo it doesn't matter, so best to not track it.
To contrast all the fantastic advice here (that I thoroughly agree with), I'd like to add a note about when to actually track ammunition, food, water, etc.
When the Characters are in an environment that makes these things difficult to replace.
In the more populated areas this kind of bookkeeping does not add any tension, challenge, or fun. It's just a paper trail as other's have noted.
When your characters are exploring the Ice Glaciers of Xalthaxis and they don't have access to a town/inn/etc. to rest and restock you can consider calling out that people should absolutely buy and track supplies (before they leave society), as part of the challenge of the ice glaciers is just raw survival. Can they find the lost city of Xalthaxis before they run out of food? Can they hunt creatures like caribou for food? Should they eat that yeti they just fought or risk starvation? How are they staying warm?
This becomes a contextually relevant opportunity for characters who have survival skills to showcase themselves. Success means they find Xalthaxis and are healthy, still supplied, and ready to explore. Failure means they are likely making exhaustion checks after the effects of cold, starvation, etc. and hope to find a place to rest, restock, and prepare for whatever lies within this lost, frozen, city.
It becomes part of the story, the backdrop. Cold, exhaustion, starvation, etc. all help frame whatever they find and the challenges they face. It also makes getting back to civilized lands refreshing and rewarding. "Oh thank goodness. I take a long rest, then restock, and vow to never leave populated lands again!" (accounting stops).
Most rules and systems have a time and place where they are interesting and add to the game. The key is to only focus on them in that appropriate context and to let them go when they no longer make sense!
Like many have said, don't worry about book-keeping the details - it just detracts from the fun stuff. :)
Think about it logically though - if you know that your party are setting off into the wilderness and you expect them to get lost and supplies might be an issue, then check with them what supplies they're taking and update them periodically on what's left. Under normal circumstances though, you can assume they're relatively competent at packing sufficient food to get to where they're going and back.
Ammunition - again, probably not worth it if they only use missile weapons periodically. If a character(s) use a bow all the time, then maybe track it or just forget it and roll with it.
Does a rule or feature add to fun? If so, do it. If not, don't.
I have played in games where people wanted to do gritty realism and challenge. In that kind of game, tracking ammo is awesome!
I'm currently playing a game focused on the story and RP etc, tracking ammo is just a burden for us and no one wants to really bother with it. So we don't do it.
Lots of great advice here, thanks everyone! I love all the help I’m getting here, you guys are awesome.
So, I’m running Lost Mines of Phandelver starting tomorrow night. It seems like the best way to run this for my group - at least until I get a better idea - is I’ll just bring up the notion of supplies and rations for section 3 when they go out on the long trek to Thundertree. I think I’ll wait on the ammunition until I see how it plays out. I was always planning on staying reasonable. If a player treats his arrows like Arnold Schwarzenegger in Commando, I’ll reign him in and keep track.
I actually homebrewed a few rules regarding ammunition and food/drink (and likewise encumbrance -- which I want to enforce but I think the default weights/rules start almost every character encumbered so I made a few adjustments). As far as encumbrance, we are playing online so the character sheet calculates your total weight carried as long as you enter the values for your items.
Ammunition -- Everyone with a ranged weapon has 20 of that ammunition. It is assumed that ammunition is replenished at a negligible cost when you visit a town (unless otherwise specified). If you are a class in which the main fighting ability is ranged (i.e. Ranger:Hunter), you start with 40 ammunition and your ammunition does not have a weight.
Food/Water -- I was asked if this needed to be tracked, and my answer is "kind of". You aren't going to have to specify eating/drinking. You aren't going to starve or die of dehydration. So in this sense, no food is not required to be tracked (unless otherwise specified/in a situation where it is scarce). You don't even need it in your inventory. However: If you don't have any food or water in your inventory, you cannot do something that would require food or water. An example would be encountering a wild beast and wanting to throw it some meat to calm it down/distract it. Great idea, it might help the encounter (it might not if the beast isn't actually hungry); but if you have no rations or food in your bag, you cannot do this. The same goes for water, if you have to use water for something while out on an adventure, and you aren't carrying any, you can't use it.
Encumbrance -- I use the variant encumbrance rule (5x STR-9x STR is encumbered, 10x STR-14x STR is heavily encumbered).
Worn equipment (armor, clothes) does not have a weight while being worn (carrying an extra plate mail does count the weight)
Your weapons do have a weight.
Ammunition for ranged based classes (i.e. Ranger:Hunter) does not have a weight -- for all others it has the normal weight listed.
Your backpack does not have a weight (the contents inside of it do)
Rations do not have a weight, but have a limit of 10
Anything that weighs 1lb or less does not have a weight, but there will be a limit to the things you can carry (don't get ridiculous, you aren't carrying 40 daggers around).
I run it similar to AaronofBarbaria and Agile_DM - I don't track ammo, rations, water, etc. unless it's in an environment where survival is part of the encounter/story. I also use the lifestyle expenses paid at the beginning of each in game month rather than copper and silvering them every time they are in town. If you haven't seen it, it's on p.157 of the PHB. I find it to be much more streamlined than charging for inn stays, armor repair, etc. Like Aaron, I also don't treat this as a "Lifestyle Store" (I love that by the way). The players deduct it at the beginning of the month and we just roleplay those scenes out as they occur. The only time I veer from this is if they are specifically looking to spend more than their lifestyle would typically allow (the chart explains each of the levels quite well, so it's easy to determine). For example, the bard and rogue wanted to get the deluxe treatment at a bath house, potentially running into some well heeled/powerful people whom they could make friends with, so they ponied up the extra gold.
The encumbrance rule I use is "Don't be ridiculous.", meaning we all know it's 15x STR so try and stay reasonably around that. I do this because I trust the people I play with and showing them that I trust them makes the group cohesion even stronger. Also, it's a few less things for me to keep track of during the session. I would rather have the extra mental overhead to improvise things and get more into the character of the NPCs than keep track of how many arrows someone shot.
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Okay, so my first thought as I approached DMing for the first time - and not having played since I was a kid - was that I wouldn't be working too hard to keep track of things like ammunition (within reason) or provisions or things like that. My group of first-timers is starting up Lost Mines of Phandelver this week, and I've been reading a bunch in preparation. It seems like maybe I ought to expend the extra effort. Is there a good balance here? I don't want to get bogged down in the weeds. I'd welcome advice on where to draw the line on this stuff.
As a related issue, is there a rule on how to handle recovering ammunition? If a PC fires off 7 or 8 arrows or bolts in an encounter, and wants to go grab them afterwardds, is there a DC for that?
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
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InsidersMy DM doesn't track ammo or carry limits, unless things get out of hand. It works well for us, since we have a teenager in the group who has a tough time staying focused. Do what you feel works for you and your group.
A dwarf with a canoe on his back? What could go wrong?
That seems like good advice. We have a couple young players, so I think I'll stay away from living expenses and such as well.
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
The official rule says that you can recover half the expended ammunition, taking a minute to search the battlefield:
https://www.dndbeyond.com/compendium/rules/basic-rules/equipment#WeaponProperties
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
Rule Zero: Have fun...get to know what your group likes...don't sweat the small stuff.
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe....
You're going to find something in the middle of what works for you. You can have your players keep track of the ammo and it can be fun when they run out and makes for an interesting role play scene if you track it.
After a long session of fighting and you think about the 5th level fighter with archery that is firing 2 arrows around it will add up really quick and BOOM! "you are out of arrows what do you do now?" I'm not saying you should quick track of ammo but once in a while it can fun.
As far as weight I only check when I think it's getting out of hand as already mentioned.
The same can be said for spell components. Those are tricky and sometimes, hard to find and extremely expensive. Some DM's don't track these and some do. In some groups I've asked for a flat rate of gold for spells casts. Rather than trying to figure out how many Magic missiles spell components you. But like ammo it can be fun to watch the wizard run out of the things that keep them in the fight. You'll be glad you got that dagger at level 1.
JT " You will find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view."
A 5th level fighter probably has a bag of holding and enough gold to buy like a million arrows (especially retrieving them from battles). In other words unless a player isn't planning ahead at all, they can easily buy so much ammo it doesn't matter, so best to not track it.
To contrast all the fantastic advice here (that I thoroughly agree with), I'd like to add a note about when to actually track ammunition, food, water, etc.
When the Characters are in an environment that makes these things difficult to replace.
In the more populated areas this kind of bookkeeping does not add any tension, challenge, or fun. It's just a paper trail as other's have noted.
When your characters are exploring the Ice Glaciers of Xalthaxis and they don't have access to a town/inn/etc. to rest and restock you can consider calling out that people should absolutely buy and track supplies (before they leave society), as part of the challenge of the ice glaciers is just raw survival. Can they find the lost city of Xalthaxis before they run out of food? Can they hunt creatures like caribou for food? Should they eat that yeti they just fought or risk starvation? How are they staying warm?
This becomes a contextually relevant opportunity for characters who have survival skills to showcase themselves. Success means they find Xalthaxis and are healthy, still supplied, and ready to explore. Failure means they are likely making exhaustion checks after the effects of cold, starvation, etc. and hope to find a place to rest, restock, and prepare for whatever lies within this lost, frozen, city.
It becomes part of the story, the backdrop. Cold, exhaustion, starvation, etc. all help frame whatever they find and the challenges they face. It also makes getting back to civilized lands refreshing and rewarding. "Oh thank goodness. I take a long rest, then restock, and vow to never leave populated lands again!" (accounting stops).
Most rules and systems have a time and place where they are interesting and add to the game. The key is to only focus on them in that appropriate context and to let them go when they no longer make sense!
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D&D Beyond FoundersLike many have said, don't worry about book-keeping the details - it just detracts from the fun stuff. :)
Think about it logically though - if you know that your party are setting off into the wilderness and you expect them to get lost and supplies might be an issue, then check with them what supplies they're taking and update them periodically on what's left. Under normal circumstances though, you can assume they're relatively competent at packing sufficient food to get to where they're going and back.
Ammunition - again, probably not worth it if they only use missile weapons periodically. If a character(s) use a bow all the time, then maybe track it or just forget it and roll with it.
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Does a rule or feature add to fun? If so, do it. If not, don't.
I have played in games where people wanted to do gritty realism and challenge. In that kind of game, tracking ammo is awesome!
I'm currently playing a game focused on the story and RP etc, tracking ammo is just a burden for us and no one wants to really bother with it. So we don't do it.
Depends on the type of game.
Lots of great advice here, thanks everyone! I love all the help I’m getting here, you guys are awesome.
So, I’m running Lost Mines of Phandelver starting tomorrow night. It seems like the best way to run this for my group - at least until I get a better idea - is I’ll just bring up the notion of supplies and rations for section 3 when they go out on the long trek to Thundertree. I think I’ll wait on the ammunition until I see how it plays out. I was always planning on staying reasonable. If a player treats his arrows like Arnold Schwarzenegger in Commando, I’ll reign him in and keep track.
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
I actually homebrewed a few rules regarding ammunition and food/drink (and likewise encumbrance -- which I want to enforce but I think the default weights/rules start almost every character encumbered so I made a few adjustments). As far as encumbrance, we are playing online so the character sheet calculates your total weight carried as long as you enter the values for your items.
How do you get a one-armed goblin out of a tree?
Wave!
I run it similar to AaronofBarbaria and Agile_DM - I don't track ammo, rations, water, etc. unless it's in an environment where survival is part of the encounter/story. I also use the lifestyle expenses paid at the beginning of each in game month rather than copper and silvering them every time they are in town. If you haven't seen it, it's on p.157 of the PHB. I find it to be much more streamlined than charging for inn stays, armor repair, etc. Like Aaron, I also don't treat this as a "Lifestyle Store" (I love that by the way). The players deduct it at the beginning of the month and we just roleplay those scenes out as they occur. The only time I veer from this is if they are specifically looking to spend more than their lifestyle would typically allow (the chart explains each of the levels quite well, so it's easy to determine). For example, the bard and rogue wanted to get the deluxe treatment at a bath house, potentially running into some well heeled/powerful people whom they could make friends with, so they ponied up the extra gold.
The encumbrance rule I use is "Don't be ridiculous.", meaning we all know it's 15x STR so try and stay reasonably around that. I do this because I trust the people I play with and showing them that I trust them makes the group cohesion even stronger. Also, it's a few less things for me to keep track of during the session. I would rather have the extra mental overhead to improvise things and get more into the character of the NPCs than keep track of how many arrows someone shot.