About me: I'm a newbie 5e DM and played a short time as a PC during 3.5. I read all 3 standard manuals and Xanathar. My campaign is homebrew, but I started the campaign by editing in the module AtCotRG N1 (pushed them to 3rd level, I did a lot of tweaking to make it work). I watched all Colville, Mercer, etc vids about DMing to know the tricks to make my game fun. I already made some mistakes (railroaded them once, they hated it; giving out too much magic items low level, although I can handle that [minor magic items, wanted to feel them special early on] and killed a PC once where I didn't intended it. The great old one of my warlock resurrected him [for a hefty price tho, created a great side quest]). So, I'm not without flaw, but I think I'm doing alright for my very first time.
My group consists of 6 players, with whom I started 5e. They all are new to the game as well. We are now 3rd - 4th level. To sum the players up, we have:
- A human fighter, who is very engaged with the game, one of the few who really try to RP. He is a bit quiet, but I think he really enjoys my world. - A tiefling rogue, who get's frustrated, if we play for too long (since we only meet like 1-2 times / month, we play for 4-8 hours). - A half-elf wizard, who likes the game and does some prep, if I ask him to (like if he get's new spells to look them up before we start the next time so he doesn't slow us down if he levels up). - An elven druid. It's my GF, she only occasionally joins us. She enjoys it, but invests no time between the games whatsoever. - A human ranger. I think he likes the game as well, is very quiet too, but I think he is preparing his stuff. - A halfling warlock. He really RPs his character, but can be a problem player sometimes (getting frustrated, if other players don't do the optimal thing and often comes unprepared [he borrowed my rulebook to look things up for his level up, but he returned it without even looking into it)
So, I have the only copies of the book (I gifted a second copy of the rulebook to by best friend for christmas, because he will be absent for months and maybe we can skype game his character during this time to keep him up to date). No one bothers to get the core rulebook, looking up rules or spells between the adventures. It slows the game down and if we level up everyone rushes and after 1-2 levels they realize that they didn't pick the spell or feat they wanted/would have been better.
Second, they don't seem to engage with my campaign that much. We have a What's App group. If asked, they say I'm a good DM and they know I'm trying my best, they look forward to the next gaming night, but there is no discussion between the adventures whatsoever. I was looking for flaws I made that kept them from engaging (see first paragraph), but I realize that they don't even try to make it better (see last paragraph).
They show up to the gaming night without knowledge of the game, without their own dice, rulebook, character sheet (I needed to print them out for them), expect me to know all their rules, remind them if they forget the something and this is starting to frustrate me. I invest 8-12 hours of prep before a 4-8 hours gaming session (including food and smoking breaks).
We play together, because we were friends before DnD, so I wouldn't dump the group instantly to pick another. Plus, I really enjoy our game, in session it's great. It's only this "not preparing anything" that annoys me. Therefore, I hope you can help me how to address the issue without them feeling forced to do "labour". I don't want them to feel it like "work", since it's still a game.
PS: Sorry for my grammar, english not my native tongue.
PS2: Sorry if this topic has been discussed 100 times. If so, please just send me the link and close thread. Thank you!
I would recommend that you stop carrying your Players.
They don't know their abilities? They'll forget to use them, and that's on them. Don't remind them. Make it clear that you have enough to do running the world, you're not going to run their Characters for them as well.
They don't show up with their stuff? They don't get to play that time. You'll run them as an NPC. If that's the whole party - play a different game. Make that clear up front, moving forward.
Either they'll pull up their socks and start taking responsibility for their characters, or they'll stop playing - and it sounds like that's a win for you either way.
As for not engaging with your campaign, there are two possibilities here:
You have a group of casual players. All they want to do is show up, roll dice, kill monsters, and collect loot. There's nothing wrong with that style of play - but it sounds like it doesn't match what you want out of the game.
Your campaign isn't engaging for the players. If this is the case, you need to touch base with your Players and find out the things they enjoy, and want to do in the game. If it turns out they and you want completely different things, then maybe this groups isn't meant to be.
In any case, it sounds like your group needs a retroactive session zero where all the expectations, wants, and agreements are hammered out. This typically should have happened before you started your campaign, but it's never to late to have that conversation - or have it again.
One final point: you absolutely can drop this group. If they and you are not happy playing together, you should. I know you are friends - but it doesn't help if you and they are increasingly unhappy with your game. Being angry and frustrated with each other over the game can damage that friendship; find some other game that you both like playing the same way to keep socializing with these friends, but find other friends to play D&D with.
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It's just plain hard, usually, to get player to interact with homebrew material or give constructive criticism to the DM.
Don't expect too much there but you should ask for feedback repeatedly, like at the end of each session.
The great news is, you have no rules lawyers or power gamers to deal with!
You may need to force the group to take longer when you level up. It doesn't seem like most of your players are going to plan ahead or buy their own books (although a lot is free online). You can remind them, as they approach a session where you think they will level up, to be planning ahead. Then you need to review their character sheets before they are called good.
With long sessions, make sure your are offering a couple of breaks.
If you really want a more engaged game, maybe let your girl friend out of it. If she's not into it you guys can spend time together doing something else and your game will improve.
Ask them to buy dice, tell them where a local store is. Or, better yet, buy them each 1 dice set as a holiday present. One or more will get the bug and start buying their own. Tell them WHY you want them to have their own dice. Be direct.
DnD Is great since its collective story telling, which is why when groups tend to want different things complications can occur. I totally get where your coming from but the first piece of advice I have to offer (Oh hi btw , almost a decade under my belt as a DM of various TTRPG's. Last four of which has been pretty much exclusively call of cthulu and DnD 5e) is sometimes certain players just dont work well together. Thats not to say you have to kick them out if they want to still play and you still want them just recognize that will be something you have to deal with session by session. I find it a little less intimidating if I actively know before hand to be a mediator between certain players rather then expecting them to someday patch things up and be a cohesive unit. That being said as DM your god of your world essentially so long as they are invested in playing with you , you can use your almight powers to maybe help steer them together a bit. But before that the biggest issue you mention seems to be players unready-ness. While I dont condone unlicensed or torrented use by any means (espically on wizards own website of all places) I will say looking up "DnD 5E PDF" on google may or may not give a PC and Phone Friendly PDF of the PHB as some of the first options of that search.
Beyond that perhaps ask them to at very least have a free copy of the slimmed down version of the PHB that wizards offer for free or if ease of a copy machine is around simply take relevant sections to their character print them out stapple it together and boom theyl have a quick ease access to everything and anything related to their class/race.
As for spells theres several apps around on phones free and not alike that act as spellbooks for players I highly recommend you suggesting it to your spell caster party members.
As for inside the world itself heres some things you can try and do to encourage more engagement from your group. 1. At a appropiate time before the session or during ask them all what their favorite aspect of playing DnD is and if theres anything you can do more that they would like, within reason of course (dont give into their puppy dog eyes begging for bags of holdings and wish rings). 2. Theres tons of random generators on the internet for just about everything , got some spare time? RNG up a unique NPC to come busting into the scene , this could lead anywhere from funny encounters and antics to perhaps a chain of events leading to a huge story element quest. 3. Make traveling fun and rewarding , one thing I picked up from some DM's in the forums here is creating a engaging risk and reward mechanic for long travels. Basically if at any point the group has to spend a day traveling before it begins ask the players if they would like to throw in something they hope to find on the adventure. Have it be abstract and ask to avoid super specific scenarios in order to let you creatively come up with stuff. EX. I as a player might want some nice new shoes to go with my sword of bad assery. So on a slip of paper I write Loot with the chance of it being magical. The player next to me had to fund the partys drinking endeavors the night prior and is hurting hard for some coin so they write Currency. Etc , Etc. But heres the kicker let them know for every single "Good" encounter they suggest they have to make up a bad encounter to the journeys que. These can be anything from a terrible storm interupting a days journey early to bandits blocking the road and demanding the partys goods. In general before asking for the partys desire to add events you should have some random events yourself picked out a healthy mix or good and bad (I tend to do 2 bad 1 good or 2 good and 1 bad depending how rewarding I feel towards my group as they adventure). When the journey begins take your slips and the partys slips toss them in a hat and as the journey progress each day randomly pick one.
This will help not only make them feel they have more of a voice alongside yours in the story but also overtime will give you an idea on what that player or their character prefers in terms of adversity and reward.
You now have your carrot on a stick.
4. As I mentioned a bit at the end of that last point most players get really engaged with your world when they feel they have a voice to help shape the story and its not just a DM reading a how to choose your adventure book to them. In that regard give the character some creative freedom to help them immerse themselves into your world, ask them to create a backstory for their character and giving them some free liberties to craft places and things into your world. Ask them specifically how they envision their character and ask them if theres anything flavor wise that they dislike , offer them something the Core PHB dosent specifcally have by just reflavoring it , got a ninja or wants throwing stars but the PHB dosent list them? No problem just use the stats of daggers and reskin them to be throwing stars.
5. Character arcs , in further enthralling people into your world try and have a healthy balance between main story and character progression. This dosent really apply as much if the group tends to be of the one shot nature but can still slightly have what id call small arcs in even one shots if you want. Look at a characters background and their story and have at times something come by that dirrectly links or conflicts to them and that backstory. In the end when that short arc is concluded maybe give them a level apropiate award that not only makes that specific character feel unique from say another persons same level character but also adds more flavor to them. Your DM you can essentially gift your player however you chose with whatever your mind can make up.
As an example a recent campaign of Mine had a PC overcome a life long fear and doubt of his so now anything concerning that I give him advantage rolls on.
6. Character progression as part of the world and not the system, by this I mean when they level up dont just be like "Congrats you got new powers" offer an explanation in the world as to why they got what they got. Spellcasters apon returning to town get a vision or visit from their deity whom teaches them new abilities or perhaps they discover a teacher or tome that contains them and learns them. A fighter after a long hard fought battle contemplates in his room afterwords , it being a close call for him and his allies he becomes determined to practice new maneuvers and tactics that might help them in the future. A rogue visits the local shady guilds and trains in his ways , a warlock has a vision involving their patron and they bestow apon them a gift, etc. The less in your face you are about the mechanics you are and the more part of the world they become the more organic it begins to feel and can help immersion alot.
7. Final tip find your own way. Everything I suggest works great for me and most people I deal with but the worlds a large place and people vary from the smallest to largest details. The most important thing I can suggest is communication and confidence in yourself and your players. Talk to them ask them what they expect or would like out of a session and the game , convey to them concerns you might have or things you expect or would like. Get creative , come up with your own ideas or mechanics to help fix issues your facing with players. DnD is a game where storytelling and fun trumps rules, go nuts.
Great tips everyone, thank you! I already spoke to some players and it seems some players see the same problems that I do (with particular players).
@Vedexant: I believe I have a mix of casual players and players who want some RP out of it. They however are reserved and can get overwhelmed by the more casual/hack&slay players.
@Mael: Yeah, I tried that. Like I said, I even lent my warlock the PHB so that he could look up the spells and eldritch incantations, but he did not look into the book. For my wizard, I photographed all the 2nd level spells (quite some work) and sent him these, so he could choose some. He read them all, but couldn't decide until our party played again. Regarding breaks, we usually make a 5 min break every 60 min and 1-2 long breaks (30 min) with food, if we play for 6-8 hours. That works quite well, but it still can sometimes be exhausting in the end. Since we all work at different days and times, smaller regular dates are sadly not an option :( , we're glad if we find a date every 2-4 weeks.
@Oximas: Thank you for the elaborate answer. Many things that you suggest I'm already applying. I don't think my campaign is lacking interaction with the players or focus on their background. The current side quest is dealing with stuff the fighter and warlock did. And if they can stop the villain they created, I already have a hook for the ranger with his long lost mentor. I'll try the idea with the travel, that sounds fun and a good way to seed creativity (as long as they don't put in ridiculous encounters that derail the campaign or give them unappropiate powers).
Furthermore, we will try "campfire stories", something Kingsmill stole from another DM. Everyone aggreed that could help the RP element. We had a session zero, but only briefly, since everyone was eager to start, was new to the game and everyone wanted to see, what is fun and what's not first (and everyone said they want a mix of RP and fights, just differently balanced, even the current hack&slay dudes). If the characters can get to know each other and may sympathize with other PCs, maybe everyone will RP a bit more.
Maybe I photograph the pages of the book for the players, so they have at least their own rules ready on the phone. I thought about DnD Beyond, but since some players are not fluent in English and need a German copy that's not the best option for us. Everyone already got dice from me each as a gift, because we were passing around my D20s far too often, dragging out every combat.
TL;DR: I think my players want to engage with the world more and some players want to hack&slash more. Maybe I need to balance both better (I don't think a player dislikes one aspect entirely). I will try campfire stories and random encounters made by the players as Oximas suggested. If they get more invested, maybe one will finally pick up another PHB :D .
I'd like to add my bit in here, though it seems you have a solid idea on how you're moving forward as it is.
I made some huge mistakes starting my homebrew, it's been going for 3 years now and those mistakes have made some aspects of my game difficult as time went on. I started my players off with no back stories, something I thought would be a unique thing that my players would embrace. I I had a lot of world information to drop on the players, to the point that players ended up relying on me to tell them what to do. I had forgotten to do a true session 0 with the group so a number of the house rules that were in play hadn't been elaborated on well enough. There was a lot of things I could have done better at the beginning of the game, but as the last year has passed I've finally managed to adjust and repair most of those mistakes in a way that the players are now happier with what's going on in the game.
By not giving my players the ability to create backstories I took a large amount of "passive agency" from them and made character growth stunted for a long time. This was a point of contention between my players and me for a while, and I had a lot of explaining to do. I chose this beginning because I wanted their character arcs to be something more fantastic, more meaningful. I wanted their characters to make decisions and watch as those decisions changed the world and their personal journey, but I didn't want some preconceived idea of beginning and end to influence them. I asked them to bear with me, trust me, and be patient as the stories unfolded, and, bless them all, they did. One of my players had to wait close to 2 years before his opportunity came, but when it did, his excitement was well worth the wait. I could have handled it much better, and I realize that now, explaining my expectations and getting their feedback could have made this much, much more enjoyable.
An old adage goes: "too many irons in the fire" and that perfectly sums up what I did with my stories in the game's beginning. I wanted the players to know how big the world was, how many stories, people and events were moving at the same time. I also wanted them to feel like they were influencing the world in ways that went far beyond their starting town. So, I spent close to 2 years dropping plots, stories, npcs, and more on them in unavoidable ways. It wasn't railroading in the strictest sense, but there was a clear implication that what they were told was important and they should probably handle it. It's been 3 years now that we've played the game, and the last few sessions have been suffering growing pains in a way I hadn't expected. With nothing left, no more major information dumps, the players are floundering to figure out what to do next. I had created decision paralysis by giving them so many things to potentially work toward. They're realizing now that they have all the power, I'm simply waiting for them to say "we do this", but it's been a struggle. In the end, had I focused more on simply resolving one story arc and implying more information, I'd have let them create their own priorities rather than artificially providing that information.
That brings me to session 0, what I have come to realize is probably more important than handing out the first character sheet. Every group is different, every DM is different, and every player is different, these differences must be addressed. No amount of experience as DM can replace this, believe me as I have over 30 years under my belt already. Take the time to explain any changes you're making to rules and any variants you're making. Explain any unique mechanics that are going into your world, like my arcane magic being a limited resource. Get an idea of what each player wants, this will help you design sessions so that they can touch on 2-3 of your players' likes. It also allows you to change up the sessions so that each one is slightly different even though the story remains the same. Lastly, it also helps your players understand who they're working with, the first steps toward group cohesion and the seeds of RP. A session 0 is, by far, the most integral piece of starting a game as it sets the framework for the adventure you're about to embark on.
My final thoughts address your current plight as it's something that I'm working on currently as well. It's never too late to correct your mistakes, add more story elements for the RPers, add more combat for the Hack&Slashers, and give your quiet players a time where they are the one the spotlight shines on solely. Talk to your players individually and as a group, whenever there's a question about the DM or players' enjoyment. The more information you can give them, and the more information they can give you, will all come together to make a memorable game. Find ways to incorporate the missing elements in game in a way that feels natural, abruptly changing how the game plays will cause more confusion than incrementally adding the elements that are missing. As well, admit your mistakes, the players feel like you are the absolute authority and they will appreciate your human side. I've had many players feel like they can't address me because my word is law, once I admit I've made a mistake they are much more willing to talk to me about the things on their mind.
Here's to many happy sessions and some epic memories!
By not giving my players the ability to create backstories I took a large amount of "passive agency" from them and made character growth stunted for a long time. This was a point of contention between my players and me for a while, and I had a lot of explaining to do. I chose this beginning because I wanted their character arcs to be something more fantastic, more meaningful. I wanted their characters to make decisions and watch as those decisions changed the world and their personal journey, but I didn't want some preconceived idea of beginning and end to influence them. I asked them to bear with me, trust me, and be patient as the stories unfolded, and, bless them all, they did. One of my players had to wait close to 2 years before his opportunity came, but when it did, his excitement was well worth the wait. I could have handled it much better, and I realize that now, explaining my expectations and getting their feedback could have made this much, much more enjoyable.
This. I had them think of a little bit of backstory after session zero and wanted them to give 3-5 notes about the origin of their characters that I can web into my homebrew campaign. Some wrote a whole paragraph, some only made 0-3 keywords (most did nothing to 3 keywords), but I need to web it into my story faster. You are so right about the players can get bored if too much explanation about the world is happening. The stories that seem to be directly connected with the players appear to engage them more than the stories that are connected with the BBG. I often read the advice "players need to be reactive, because villains are proactive", but I want to add "players need to be reactive to villains, that are proactive against the players!". If the villain tries to take over the world or all dogs, the players may not even care. But if the villain abducted/killed the dog one player lost a year ago, that's where they engage (arbitrary example, please don't harm animals!). In my coming adventures in my campaign, every encounter will have at least some indirect connection to the players.
It's never too late to correct your mistakes, add more story elements for the RPers, add more combat for the Hack&Slashers, and give your quiet players a time where they are the one the spotlight shines on solely. Talk to your players individually and as a group, whenever there's a question about the DM or players' enjoyment.
And that will be mostly what I need to practise. I feel I throw in too much random combat for now (too much obstacles) and not encounters with many decision points. Saturday is our next game night, I will try to balance RP and combat, spotlight the quieter players more and create more player-focussed problems rather than "world-focussed problems".
Best, Chicken
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About me: I'm a newbie 5e DM and played a short time as a PC during 3.5. I read all 3 standard manuals and Xanathar. My campaign is homebrew, but I started the campaign by editing in the module AtCotRG N1 (pushed them to 3rd level, I did a lot of tweaking to make it work). I watched all Colville, Mercer, etc vids about DMing to know the tricks to make my game fun. I already made some mistakes (railroaded them once, they hated it; giving out too much magic items low level, although I can handle that [minor magic items, wanted to feel them special early on] and killed a PC once where I didn't intended it. The great old one of my warlock resurrected him [for a hefty price tho, created a great side quest]). So, I'm not without flaw, but I think I'm doing alright for my very first time.
My group consists of 6 players, with whom I started 5e. They all are new to the game as well. We are now 3rd - 4th level. To sum the players up, we have:
- A human fighter, who is very engaged with the game, one of the few who really try to RP. He is a bit quiet, but I think he really enjoys my world.
- A tiefling rogue, who get's frustrated, if we play for too long (since we only meet like 1-2 times / month, we play for 4-8 hours).
- A half-elf wizard, who likes the game and does some prep, if I ask him to (like if he get's new spells to look them up before we start the next time so he doesn't slow us down if he levels up).
- An elven druid. It's my GF, she only occasionally joins us. She enjoys it, but invests no time between the games whatsoever.
- A human ranger. I think he likes the game as well, is very quiet too, but I think he is preparing his stuff.
- A halfling warlock. He really RPs his character, but can be a problem player sometimes (getting frustrated, if other players don't do the optimal thing and often comes unprepared [he borrowed my rulebook to look things up for his level up, but he returned it without even looking into it)
So, I have the only copies of the book (I gifted a second copy of the rulebook to by best friend for christmas, because he will be absent for months and maybe we can skype game his character during this time to keep him up to date). No one bothers to get the core rulebook, looking up rules or spells between the adventures. It slows the game down and if we level up everyone rushes and after 1-2 levels they realize that they didn't pick the spell or feat they wanted/would have been better.
Second, they don't seem to engage with my campaign that much. We have a What's App group. If asked, they say I'm a good DM and they know I'm trying my best, they look forward to the next gaming night, but there is no discussion between the adventures whatsoever. I was looking for flaws I made that kept them from engaging (see first paragraph), but I realize that they don't even try to make it better (see last paragraph).
They show up to the gaming night without knowledge of the game, without their own dice, rulebook, character sheet (I needed to print them out for them), expect me to know all their rules, remind them if they forget the something and this is starting to frustrate me. I invest 8-12 hours of prep before a 4-8 hours gaming session (including food and smoking breaks).
We play together, because we were friends before DnD, so I wouldn't dump the group instantly to pick another. Plus, I really enjoy our game, in session it's great. It's only this "not preparing anything" that annoys me. Therefore, I hope you can help me how to address the issue without them feeling forced to do "labour". I don't want them to feel it like "work", since it's still a game.
PS: Sorry for my grammar, english not my native tongue.
PS2: Sorry if this topic has been discussed 100 times. If so, please just send me the link and close thread. Thank you!
I would recommend that you stop carrying your Players.
They don't know their abilities? They'll forget to use them, and that's on them. Don't remind them. Make it clear that you have enough to do running the world, you're not going to run their Characters for them as well.
They don't show up with their stuff? They don't get to play that time. You'll run them as an NPC. If that's the whole party - play a different game. Make that clear up front, moving forward.
Either they'll pull up their socks and start taking responsibility for their characters, or they'll stop playing - and it sounds like that's a win for you either way.
As for not engaging with your campaign, there are two possibilities here:
In any case, it sounds like your group needs a retroactive session zero where all the expectations, wants, and agreements are hammered out. This typically should have happened before you started your campaign, but it's never to late to have that conversation - or have it again.
One final point: you absolutely can drop this group. If they and you are not happy playing together, you should. I know you are friends - but it doesn't help if you and they are increasingly unhappy with your game. Being angry and frustrated with each other over the game can damage that friendship; find some other game that you both like playing the same way to keep socializing with these friends, but find other friends to play D&D with.
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
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It's just plain hard, usually, to get player to interact with homebrew material or give constructive criticism to the DM.
Don't expect too much there but you should ask for feedback repeatedly, like at the end of each session.
The great news is, you have no rules lawyers or power gamers to deal with!
You may need to force the group to take longer when you level up. It doesn't seem like most of your players are going to plan ahead or buy their own books (although a lot is free online). You can remind them, as they approach a session where you think they will level up, to be planning ahead. Then you need to review their character sheets before they are called good.
With long sessions, make sure your are offering a couple of breaks.
If you really want a more engaged game, maybe let your girl friend out of it. If she's not into it you guys can spend time together doing something else and your game will improve.
Ask them to buy dice, tell them where a local store is. Or, better yet, buy them each 1 dice set as a holiday present. One or more will get the bug and start buying their own. Tell them WHY you want them to have their own dice. Be direct.
DnD Is great since its collective story telling, which is why when groups tend to want different things complications can occur. I totally get where your coming from but the first piece of advice I have to offer (Oh hi btw , almost a decade under my belt as a DM of various TTRPG's. Last four of which has been pretty much exclusively call of cthulu and DnD 5e) is sometimes certain players just dont work well together. Thats not to say you have to kick them out if they want to still play and you still want them just recognize that will be something you have to deal with session by session. I find it a little less intimidating if I actively know before hand to be a mediator between certain players rather then expecting them to someday patch things up and be a cohesive unit. That being said as DM your god of your world essentially so long as they are invested in playing with you , you can use your almight powers to maybe help steer them together a bit. But before that the biggest issue you mention seems to be players unready-ness. While I dont condone unlicensed or torrented use by any means (espically on wizards own website of all places) I will say looking up "DnD 5E PDF" on google may or may not give a PC and Phone Friendly PDF of the PHB as some of the first options of that search.
Beyond that perhaps ask them to at very least have a free copy of the slimmed down version of the PHB that wizards offer for free or if ease of a copy machine is around simply take relevant sections to their character print them out stapple it together and boom theyl have a quick ease access to everything and anything related to their class/race.
As for spells theres several apps around on phones free and not alike that act as spellbooks for players I highly recommend you suggesting it to your spell caster party members.
As for inside the world itself heres some things you can try and do to encourage more engagement from your group.
1. At a appropiate time before the session or during ask them all what their favorite aspect of playing DnD is and if theres anything you can do more that they would like, within reason of course (dont give into their puppy dog eyes begging for bags of holdings and wish rings).
2. Theres tons of random generators on the internet for just about everything , got some spare time? RNG up a unique NPC to come busting into the scene , this could lead anywhere from funny encounters and antics to perhaps a chain of events leading to a huge story element quest.
3. Make traveling fun and rewarding , one thing I picked up from some DM's in the forums here is creating a engaging risk and reward mechanic for long travels. Basically if at any point the group has to spend a day traveling before it begins ask the players if they would like to throw in something they hope to find on the adventure. Have it be abstract and ask to avoid super specific scenarios in order to let you creatively come up with stuff. EX. I as a player might want some nice new shoes to go with my sword of bad assery. So on a slip of paper I write Loot with the chance of it being magical. The player next to me had to fund the partys drinking endeavors the night prior and is hurting hard for some coin so they write Currency. Etc , Etc.
But heres the kicker let them know for every single "Good" encounter they suggest they have to make up a bad encounter to the journeys que. These can be anything from a terrible storm interupting a days journey early to bandits blocking the road and demanding the partys goods. In general before asking for the partys desire to add events you should have some random events yourself picked out a healthy mix or good and bad (I tend to do 2 bad 1 good or 2 good and 1 bad depending how rewarding I feel towards my group as they adventure).
When the journey begins take your slips and the partys slips toss them in a hat and as the journey progress each day randomly pick one.
This will help not only make them feel they have more of a voice alongside yours in the story but also overtime will give you an idea on what that player or their character prefers in terms of adversity and reward.
You now have your carrot on a stick.
4. As I mentioned a bit at the end of that last point most players get really engaged with your world when they feel they have a voice to help shape the story and its not just a DM reading a how to choose your adventure book to them. In that regard give the character some creative freedom to help them immerse themselves into your world, ask them to create a backstory for their character and giving them some free liberties to craft places and things into your world. Ask them specifically how they envision their character and ask them if theres anything flavor wise that they dislike , offer them something the Core PHB dosent specifcally have by just reflavoring it , got a ninja or wants throwing stars but the PHB dosent list them? No problem just use the stats of daggers and reskin them to be throwing stars.
5. Character arcs , in further enthralling people into your world try and have a healthy balance between main story and character progression. This dosent really apply as much if the group tends to be of the one shot nature but can still slightly have what id call small arcs in even one shots if you want. Look at a characters background and their story and have at times something come by that dirrectly links or conflicts to them and that backstory. In the end when that short arc is concluded maybe give them a level apropiate award that not only makes that specific character feel unique from say another persons same level character but also adds more flavor to them. Your DM you can essentially gift your player however you chose with whatever your mind can make up.
As an example a recent campaign of Mine had a PC overcome a life long fear and doubt of his so now anything concerning that I give him advantage rolls on.
6. Character progression as part of the world and not the system, by this I mean when they level up dont just be like "Congrats you got new powers" offer an explanation in the world as to why they got what they got. Spellcasters apon returning to town get a vision or visit from their deity whom teaches them new abilities or perhaps they discover a teacher or tome that contains them and learns them. A fighter after a long hard fought battle contemplates in his room afterwords , it being a close call for him and his allies he becomes determined to practice new maneuvers and tactics that might help them in the future. A rogue visits the local shady guilds and trains in his ways , a warlock has a vision involving their patron and they bestow apon them a gift, etc. The less in your face you are about the mechanics you are and the more part of the world they become the more organic it begins to feel and can help immersion alot.
7. Final tip find your own way. Everything I suggest works great for me and most people I deal with but the worlds a large place and people vary from the smallest to largest details. The most important thing I can suggest is communication and confidence in yourself and your players. Talk to them ask them what they expect or would like out of a session and the game , convey to them concerns you might have or things you expect or would like. Get creative , come up with your own ideas or mechanics to help fix issues your facing with players. DnD is a game where storytelling and fun trumps rules, go nuts.
Algrenon Deadbreeze - Dragonlance. "Rokem Sokem" - Eternal Warfare WarParty B.
Ogresh Thunderclan - Ultimate Adventure Tazla Swong - Cave of Ordeals
Great tips everyone, thank you! I already spoke to some players and it seems some players see the same problems that I do (with particular players).
@Vedexant: I believe I have a mix of casual players and players who want some RP out of it. They however are reserved and can get overwhelmed by the more casual/hack&slay players.
@Mael: Yeah, I tried that. Like I said, I even lent my warlock the PHB so that he could look up the spells and eldritch incantations, but he did not look into the book. For my wizard, I photographed all the 2nd level spells (quite some work) and sent him these, so he could choose some. He read them all, but couldn't decide until our party played again. Regarding breaks, we usually make a 5 min break every 60 min and 1-2 long breaks (30 min) with food, if we play for 6-8 hours. That works quite well, but it still can sometimes be exhausting in the end. Since we all work at different days and times, smaller regular dates are sadly not an option :( , we're glad if we find a date every 2-4 weeks.
@Oximas: Thank you for the elaborate answer. Many things that you suggest I'm already applying. I don't think my campaign is lacking interaction with the players or focus on their background. The current side quest is dealing with stuff the fighter and warlock did. And if they can stop the villain they created, I already have a hook for the ranger with his long lost mentor. I'll try the idea with the travel, that sounds fun and a good way to seed creativity (as long as they don't put in ridiculous encounters that derail the campaign or give them unappropiate powers).
Furthermore, we will try "campfire stories", something Kingsmill stole from another DM. Everyone aggreed that could help the RP element. We had a session zero, but only briefly, since everyone was eager to start, was new to the game and everyone wanted to see, what is fun and what's not first (and everyone said they want a mix of RP and fights, just differently balanced, even the current hack&slay dudes). If the characters can get to know each other and may sympathize with other PCs, maybe everyone will RP a bit more.
Maybe I photograph the pages of the book for the players, so they have at least their own rules ready on the phone. I thought about DnD Beyond, but since some players are not fluent in English and need a German copy that's not the best option for us. Everyone already got dice from me each as a gift, because we were passing around my D20s far too often, dragging out every combat.
TL;DR: I think my players want to engage with the world more and some players want to hack&slash more. Maybe I need to balance both better (I don't think a player dislikes one aspect entirely). I will try campfire stories and random encounters made by the players as Oximas suggested. If they get more invested, maybe one will finally pick up another PHB :D .
I'd like to add my bit in here, though it seems you have a solid idea on how you're moving forward as it is.
I made some huge mistakes starting my homebrew, it's been going for 3 years now and those mistakes have made some aspects of my game difficult as time went on. I started my players off with no back stories, something I thought would be a unique thing that my players would embrace. I I had a lot of world information to drop on the players, to the point that players ended up relying on me to tell them what to do. I had forgotten to do a true session 0 with the group so a number of the house rules that were in play hadn't been elaborated on well enough. There was a lot of things I could have done better at the beginning of the game, but as the last year has passed I've finally managed to adjust and repair most of those mistakes in a way that the players are now happier with what's going on in the game.
By not giving my players the ability to create backstories I took a large amount of "passive agency" from them and made character growth stunted for a long time. This was a point of contention between my players and me for a while, and I had a lot of explaining to do. I chose this beginning because I wanted their character arcs to be something more fantastic, more meaningful. I wanted their characters to make decisions and watch as those decisions changed the world and their personal journey, but I didn't want some preconceived idea of beginning and end to influence them. I asked them to bear with me, trust me, and be patient as the stories unfolded, and, bless them all, they did. One of my players had to wait close to 2 years before his opportunity came, but when it did, his excitement was well worth the wait. I could have handled it much better, and I realize that now, explaining my expectations and getting their feedback could have made this much, much more enjoyable.
An old adage goes: "too many irons in the fire" and that perfectly sums up what I did with my stories in the game's beginning. I wanted the players to know how big the world was, how many stories, people and events were moving at the same time. I also wanted them to feel like they were influencing the world in ways that went far beyond their starting town. So, I spent close to 2 years dropping plots, stories, npcs, and more on them in unavoidable ways. It wasn't railroading in the strictest sense, but there was a clear implication that what they were told was important and they should probably handle it. It's been 3 years now that we've played the game, and the last few sessions have been suffering growing pains in a way I hadn't expected. With nothing left, no more major information dumps, the players are floundering to figure out what to do next. I had created decision paralysis by giving them so many things to potentially work toward. They're realizing now that they have all the power, I'm simply waiting for them to say "we do this", but it's been a struggle. In the end, had I focused more on simply resolving one story arc and implying more information, I'd have let them create their own priorities rather than artificially providing that information.
That brings me to session 0, what I have come to realize is probably more important than handing out the first character sheet. Every group is different, every DM is different, and every player is different, these differences must be addressed. No amount of experience as DM can replace this, believe me as I have over 30 years under my belt already. Take the time to explain any changes you're making to rules and any variants you're making. Explain any unique mechanics that are going into your world, like my arcane magic being a limited resource. Get an idea of what each player wants, this will help you design sessions so that they can touch on 2-3 of your players' likes. It also allows you to change up the sessions so that each one is slightly different even though the story remains the same. Lastly, it also helps your players understand who they're working with, the first steps toward group cohesion and the seeds of RP. A session 0 is, by far, the most integral piece of starting a game as it sets the framework for the adventure you're about to embark on.
My final thoughts address your current plight as it's something that I'm working on currently as well. It's never too late to correct your mistakes, add more story elements for the RPers, add more combat for the Hack&Slashers, and give your quiet players a time where they are the one the spotlight shines on solely. Talk to your players individually and as a group, whenever there's a question about the DM or players' enjoyment. The more information you can give them, and the more information they can give you, will all come together to make a memorable game. Find ways to incorporate the missing elements in game in a way that feels natural, abruptly changing how the game plays will cause more confusion than incrementally adding the elements that are missing. As well, admit your mistakes, the players feel like you are the absolute authority and they will appreciate your human side. I've had many players feel like they can't address me because my word is law, once I admit I've made a mistake they are much more willing to talk to me about the things on their mind.
Here's to many happy sessions and some epic memories!
This. I had them think of a little bit of backstory after session zero and wanted them to give 3-5 notes about the origin of their characters that I can web into my homebrew campaign. Some wrote a whole paragraph, some only made 0-3 keywords (most did nothing to 3 keywords), but I need to web it into my story faster. You are so right about the players can get bored if too much explanation about the world is happening. The stories that seem to be directly connected with the players appear to engage them more than the stories that are connected with the BBG. I often read the advice "players need to be reactive, because villains are proactive", but I want to add "players need to be reactive to villains, that are proactive against the players!". If the villain tries to take over the world or all dogs, the players may not even care. But if the villain abducted/killed the dog one player lost a year ago, that's where they engage (arbitrary example, please don't harm animals!). In my coming adventures in my campaign, every encounter will have at least some indirect connection to the players.
And that will be mostly what I need to practise. I feel I throw in too much random combat for now (too much obstacles) and not encounters with many decision points. Saturday is our next game night, I will try to balance RP and combat, spotlight the quieter players more and create more player-focussed problems rather than "world-focussed problems".
Best, Chicken