I have not run or even played very much DnD. My wife is making a male Bard that she wants him to have an advantage when persuading women (only women), one of the biggest takeaways from watchign numerous youtube channels on DMing was "say yes as often as possible." So I decided to give her +1 persuasion against women, and -1 intimidation against men and I called this trait womanizer.
My question is, is a +/-1 an effective way to convey this trait, or would advantage/disadvantage or an alternative be better?
My thinking of doing a +/- was that I didn't want to get bogged down in dice rolls. It's nice to be able to go off the base scores without rolling sometimes.
My thinking of doing advantage/disadvantage is sometimes newer players like rolling, and overcoming the odds.
I'd go with advantage/disadvantage; 5th edition avoids numerical bonuses/penalties as often as possible when writing features. Also, it's much more impactful!
The real question is, does his ability work on gay women? :-)
… and why would being able to persuade women easily come at a cost against intimidating men? It seems likely to me the same things that intimidate other men cause favorable notice with women.
… and why would being able to persuade women easily come at a cost against intimidating men? It seems likely to me the same things that intimidate other men cause favorable notice with women.
I don't want to give a straight up bonus, it feels hollow and doesn't really tell his (the bard's) story.
The idea is that men hate him/jealous of him, because all the women swoon over him. Since he is a womanizer, and very flirtatious with woman, he sort of gives men the cold shoulder, or just isn't nearly as warm with other men as he is with women.
As far as with gay women; No, he would not have a bonus with gay women, and it would be situational if the disadvantage would apply, similar to with gay men.
The idea of being flirtatious with gay women, he could either annoy them (disadvantage), or amuse them (trait just doesn't take effect/fails). And the idea of gay men being attracted to him, they may find him charming and be attracted to him (advantage) or be annoyed that he is not returning their advances (Trait doesn't take effect).
She wanted him to be a character that has an advantage specifically toward women and not men. She wants him to unintentionally cause trouble wherever he goes because of his flirtatious/womanizer qualities.
To clarify, he is a metrosexual man (her character is based off of The Artist Formerly Known as Prince). So while women might find him attractive, men would not find him very intimidating.
But, everybody likes Prince Dude was just straight up charming, so get rid of the gendered aspect of it. Maybe give a bonus to persuade for everyone: women want him and men want to be him. Then a minus to intimidate for everyone: he’s so friendly and cool, but people don’t find him threatening at all. It will also make it easier when cross-species interactions come up, what a human woman and a dwarf woman and a kobold woman and an orc woman find attractive won’t necessarily be the same thing. How the character chooses to use the bonus is what will make him a womanizer or not.
And, not to belabor the point, but if you just make it a flat bonus, you don’t have to decide the sexual orientation of every NPC you meet (which aside from this would largely be irrelevant) to determine if the trait will come into effect.
Does this bonus apply to all females, or just human women? Like would the PC get advantage on seducing a female dragon?
I kid, but I would say a +1 wouldn't be game breaking and is better than a blanket advantage against women. I have to ask, though, are you giving similar bonuses to all of your players? Wife or not, treating all of your players fairly is more important to "saying yes as often as possible." I would also request that they provide a plausible explanation with why this bonus should exist, beyond "I want to be good with the ladies." Rolling high on CHA already gives a lot of social bonuses. And not every woman is going to be attracted to a metrosexual Prince-like guy.
Now that I think about it (I realize I'm rambling at this point), you could account for that by working it on a percentage roll. For example, when talking to a woman you (the DM) roll percentage, and if it is 50% or greater, the bard would get advantage or the bonus. Otherwise it's just a straight Persuasion roll. That way there's more chance involved.
If you wanted it be just to bed women. Its easily justifiable just based on high charisma and doesn't even need a numerical thing at all base it on charisma and how he interacts with women. After all is charisma is force of self and likability.
If you wanted to make it a more broad advantage where women tend to give them things and they are charmed by him and like treating him well. Older women shopkeepers tend to give them deals, and "sonny you need to eat better here is a pie". Young girls pick him flowers. Then I would go with a feat. Maybe call it Charmer and combine the effects of give skill expertise persuasion, +1 to charisma and the advantages of the guild merchant background "that gives you hospitality from others but limit it to women"
Just to clarify, it was her that wanted an advantage to women only, not me. She is the one that wants to be loved by women and men to be jealous of the bard/dislike him. I am just trying to find the best way to illustrate this without harming overall gameplay. I think having an advantage toward women, with a disadvantage toward men of +/- 1 or advantage/disadvantage roll will illustrate this story plot she wants to tell without breaking the game. Giving the advantage across the board to men and women does not tell the story that my wife wants to tell.
its my job as they DM to find ways to make my players fantasy a reality.
As far as giving my other players similar advantages, they are not yet done creating their characters, and if they asked for similar types of traits, I would find a way to build it.
After hearing your description that she wants her character to create acrimony because the women will desire her character and the men will become jealous, it really sounds like a disadvantage because you will constantly be trying to overcome the difficulty that come with the former and the latter.
After hearing your description that she wants her character to create acrimony because the women will desire her character and the men will become jealous, it really sounds like a disadvantage because you will constantly be trying to overcome the difficulty that come with the former and the latter.
Right, but she wants to play it like her character is clueless that he’s even causing problems. I don’t plan on just straight up punishing her, it’s just a trait that will help stimulate roll play, and potentially create funny situations. I don’t plan on having characters run up and attacking her, but maybe giving her a slight disadvantage when roll playing in taverns and inns and such.
It also seems like she, and you, could just do it through her role playing choices without any game mechanics needed. If you, the DM, are on board, just have NPCs treat the character that way. It’s going to be a more reliable way than just dice rolls. The dice will screw you.
If you do give her a dice bonus, you should tell the other players they have this option, instead of waiting for them to ask. It wouldn’t occur to me as a player to ask about it, and even though you’re are willing to work them, it would be some bad optics when the DM’s wife is getting what appear to be special favors. Even if they’re not special favors, that could easily be the perception.
I think you should just remember you can always modify the way any rule works. If you start with a ×/-, you can always change it to an advantage/disadvantage roll. Or do something else. Try it and see how you, your wife and the other players like it.
You'll be fine. Your the DM. But the "say yes as often as possible" doesn't work all the time. DMs, especially new ones, have a problem with saying no. There's a balance in it all.
I wouldn't give a player a bonus in what your doing unless they're back story had a fair reason for it.
You don’t have to give her character any bonus/advantage. You could simply lower the difficulty by 1 whenever appropriate. It comes out the same, but then your wife doesn’t have to track anything extra, nor do you have to invent anything for it.
Another possible way to work within the mechanics of the game is to allow her to double her proficiency bonus on CHA checks to persuade or deceive women, including to the DC to save against spells like Charm Person. That way it scales as she levels. Conversely, you could withhold the proficiency bonus when making checks on men. It should be declared up front that you will be the sole arbiter of when jiggering with the proficiency bonus applies.
I hope your other players feel as free to give themselves mechanical quirks as your wife does. Enjoy your game.
Also, calling the feature “womanizer” evokes in me a sense of intentional manipulation. However, your description makes it seem more of a passive trait. More of what I’d call Ladies’ Man.
If you actually are going for more active meddling with women, you could use a simpler mechanic within the bard class and say she’s allowed to spend a bardic inspiration die on herself to interact with women. This doesn’t give the flaw of penalties to interact with men, but it does make the ability come at a cost.
Alternatively, for a more passive two-edged sword, you could always make her roll (not spend like above) her bardic inspiration die as a bonus to women, and a penalty to men.
Just a few more ideas to tie the class flavor to what you’re going for.
Also, calling the feature “womanizer” evokes in me a sense of intentional manipulation. However, your description makes it seem more of a passive trait. More of what I’d call Ladies’ Man.
Alternatively, for a more passive two-edged sword, you could always make her roll (not spend like above) her bardic inspiration die as a bonus to women, and a penalty to men.
I agree, ladies man is a more accurate description.
I really like the idea of using bardic inspiration, but this skill is only for flavor, a d6 seems like a huge advantage/disadvantage that I feel would significantly impact the game. I don’t feel that a +1 is game breaking.
I hope your other players feel as free to give themselves mechanical quirks as your wife does. Enjoy your game.
If they create backstories that can tie into the game and give the game direction, then of course I will. My wife has created her backstory with a green dragon as an enemy that the only identifying feature is a talon cut from his foot that he carries about his neck. A family heirloom, bejeweled lute, that the dragon killed his family and ‘soon to be’ to take. Now he has a flaw where he flirts with all women and unintentionally leads them on because it helps him cope with his loss. He plays off like he just wants to get his family heirloom back, but even he doesn’t know what he’ll do when he finds the dragon. He has a distrust of even the metallic dragons, and a a deep hated of chromatic dragons, especially green dragons.
so she obviously gave me a ton of material to work with. I am more than happy to encourage that by giving her a special trait, especially one so flavorful to her character and RP.
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I have not run or even played very much DnD.
My wife is making a male Bard that she wants him to have an advantage when persuading women (only women), one of the biggest takeaways from watchign numerous youtube channels on DMing was "say yes as often as possible." So I decided to give her +1 persuasion against women, and -1 intimidation against men and I called this trait womanizer.
My question is, is a +/-1 an effective way to convey this trait, or would advantage/disadvantage or an alternative be better?
My thinking of doing a +/- was that I didn't want to get bogged down in dice rolls. It's nice to be able to go off the base scores without rolling sometimes.
My thinking of doing advantage/disadvantage is sometimes newer players like rolling, and overcoming the odds.
I'd go with advantage/disadvantage; 5th edition avoids numerical bonuses/penalties as often as possible when writing features. Also, it's much more impactful!
The real question is, does his ability work on gay women? :-)
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… and why would being able to persuade women easily come at a cost against intimidating men? It seems likely to me the same things that intimidate other men cause favorable notice with women.
I don't want to give a straight up bonus, it feels hollow and doesn't really tell his (the bard's) story.
The idea is that men hate him/jealous of him, because all the women swoon over him. Since he is a womanizer, and very flirtatious with woman, he sort of gives men the cold shoulder, or just isn't nearly as warm with other men as he is with women.
As far as with gay women; No, he would not have a bonus with gay women, and it would be situational if the disadvantage would apply, similar to with gay men.
The idea of being flirtatious with gay women, he could either annoy them (disadvantage), or amuse them (trait just doesn't take effect/fails). And the idea of gay men being attracted to him, they may find him charming and be attracted to him (advantage) or be annoyed that he is not returning their advances (Trait doesn't take effect).
She wanted him to be a character that has an advantage specifically toward women and not men. She wants him to unintentionally cause trouble wherever he goes because of his flirtatious/womanizer qualities.
To clarify, he is a metrosexual man (her character is based off of The Artist Formerly Known as Prince). So while women might find him attractive, men would not find him very intimidating.
But, everybody likes Prince Dude was just straight up charming, so get rid of the gendered aspect of it. Maybe give a bonus to persuade for everyone: women want him and men want to be him. Then a minus to intimidate for everyone: he’s so friendly and cool, but people don’t find him threatening at all. It will also make it easier when cross-species interactions come up, what a human woman and a dwarf woman and a kobold woman and an orc woman find attractive won’t necessarily be the same thing.
How the character chooses to use the bonus is what will make him a womanizer or not.
And, not to belabor the point, but if you just make it a flat bonus, you don’t have to decide the sexual orientation of every NPC you meet (which aside from this would largely be irrelevant) to determine if the trait will come into effect.
Does this bonus apply to all females, or just human women? Like would the PC get advantage on seducing a female dragon?
I kid, but I would say a +1 wouldn't be game breaking and is better than a blanket advantage against women. I have to ask, though, are you giving similar bonuses to all of your players? Wife or not, treating all of your players fairly is more important to "saying yes as often as possible." I would also request that they provide a plausible explanation with why this bonus should exist, beyond "I want to be good with the ladies." Rolling high on CHA already gives a lot of social bonuses. And not every woman is going to be attracted to a metrosexual Prince-like guy.
Now that I think about it (I realize I'm rambling at this point), you could account for that by working it on a percentage roll. For example, when talking to a woman you (the DM) roll percentage, and if it is 50% or greater, the bard would get advantage or the bonus. Otherwise it's just a straight Persuasion roll. That way there's more chance involved.
If you wanted it be just to bed women. Its easily justifiable just based on high charisma and doesn't even need a numerical thing at all base it on charisma and how he interacts with women. After all is charisma is force of self and likability.
If you wanted to make it a more broad advantage where women tend to give them things and they are charmed by him and like treating him well. Older women shopkeepers tend to give them deals, and "sonny you need to eat better here is a pie". Young girls pick him flowers. Then I would go with a feat. Maybe call it Charmer and combine the effects of give skill expertise persuasion, +1 to charisma and the advantages of the guild merchant background "that gives you hospitality from others but limit it to women"
I have this vision of the guy kicking a bunch of orcs asses and then taking them into the house and serving them pancakes, like in Chappelle.
Just to clarify, it was her that wanted an advantage to women only, not me. She is the one that wants to be loved by women and men to be jealous of the bard/dislike him. I am just trying to find the best way to illustrate this without harming overall gameplay. I think having an advantage toward women, with a disadvantage toward men of +/- 1 or advantage/disadvantage roll will illustrate this story plot she wants to tell without breaking the game. Giving the advantage across the board to men and women does not tell the story that my wife wants to tell.
its my job as they DM to find ways to make my players fantasy a reality.
As far as giving my other players similar advantages, they are not yet done creating their characters, and if they asked for similar types of traits, I would find a way to build it.
After hearing your description that she wants her character to create acrimony because the women will desire her character and the men will become jealous, it really sounds like a disadvantage because you will constantly be trying to overcome the difficulty that come with the former and the latter.
Right, but she wants to play it like her character is clueless that he’s even causing problems. I don’t plan on just straight up punishing her, it’s just a trait that will help stimulate roll play, and potentially create funny situations. I don’t plan on having characters run up and attacking her, but maybe giving her a slight disadvantage when roll playing in taverns and inns and such.
It also seems like she, and you, could just do it through her role playing choices without any game mechanics needed. If you, the DM, are on board, just have NPCs treat the character that way. It’s going to be a more reliable way than just dice rolls. The dice will screw you.
If you do give her a dice bonus, you should tell the other players they have this option, instead of waiting for them to ask. It wouldn’t occur to me as a player to ask about it, and even though you’re are willing to work them, it would be some bad optics when the DM’s wife is getting what appear to be special favors. Even if they’re not special favors, that could easily be the perception.
I think you should just remember you can always modify the way any rule works. If you start with a ×/-, you can always change it to an advantage/disadvantage roll. Or do something else. Try it and see how you, your wife and the other players like it.
If it works for your game , go for it.
You'll be fine. Your the DM. But the "say yes as often as possible" doesn't work all the time. DMs, especially new ones, have a problem with saying no. There's a balance in it all.
I wouldn't give a player a bonus in what your doing unless they're back story had a fair reason for it.
Just let the dice roll as intended.
That is one reason I want to say yes, because she is taking the time to flesh out a backstory that will fit into the campaign and stimulate RP.
You don’t have to give her character any bonus/advantage. You could simply lower the difficulty by 1 whenever appropriate. It comes out the same, but then your wife doesn’t have to track anything extra, nor do you have to invent anything for it.
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Another possible way to work within the mechanics of the game is to allow her to double her proficiency bonus on CHA checks to persuade or deceive women, including to the DC to save against spells like Charm Person. That way it scales as she levels. Conversely, you could withhold the proficiency bonus when making checks on men. It should be declared up front that you will be the sole arbiter of when jiggering with the proficiency bonus applies.
I hope your other players feel as free to give themselves mechanical quirks as your wife does. Enjoy your game.
Also, calling the feature “womanizer” evokes in me a sense of intentional manipulation. However, your description makes it seem more of a passive trait. More of what I’d call Ladies’ Man.
If you actually are going for more active meddling with women, you could use a simpler mechanic within the bard class and say she’s allowed to spend a bardic inspiration die on herself to interact with women. This doesn’t give the flaw of penalties to interact with men, but it does make the ability come at a cost.
Alternatively, for a more passive two-edged sword, you could always make her roll (not spend like above) her bardic inspiration die as a bonus to women, and a penalty to men.
Just a few more ideas to tie the class flavor to what you’re going for.
I agree, ladies man is a more accurate description.
I really like the idea of using bardic inspiration, but this skill is only for flavor, a d6 seems like a huge advantage/disadvantage that I feel would significantly impact the game. I don’t feel that a +1 is game breaking.
If they create backstories that can tie into the game and give the game direction, then of course I will. My wife has created her backstory with a green dragon as an enemy that the only identifying feature is a talon cut from his foot that he carries about his neck. A family heirloom, bejeweled lute, that the dragon killed his family and ‘soon to be’ to take. Now he has a flaw where he flirts with all women and unintentionally leads them on because it helps him cope with his loss. He plays off like he just wants to get his family heirloom back, but even he doesn’t know what he’ll do when he finds the dragon. He has a distrust of even the metallic dragons, and a a deep hated of chromatic dragons, especially green dragons.
so she obviously gave me a ton of material to work with. I am more than happy to encourage that by giving her a special trait, especially one so flavorful to her character and RP.