I have a player who is part of a group that I DM for that is an artificer and the group level is lvl 5 (table of 3 players). I can tell my player is really excited to craft items/magic items and I want to facilitate for them so that they can get there through a reasonable progression path. The player wants to craft the Gauntlets of Ogre Power which is an uncommon item. For their first magic item crafted in the game, I think this is a really good place for their character to get their feet wet when it comes to crafting magic items and I want to set this up for them. Xanathar's lays out a fairly comprehensive progression system:
Magic Item Ingredients
Item Rarity
CR Range
Common
1–3
Uncommon
4–8
Rare
9–12
Very rare
13–18
Legendary
19+
If appropriate, pick a monster or a location that is a thematic fit for the item to be crafted. For example, creating mariner’s armor might require the essence of a water weird. Crafting a staff of charming might require the cooperation of a specific arcanaloth, who will help only if the characters complete a task for it. Making a staff of power might hinge on acquiring a piece of an ancient stone that was once touched by the god of magic — a stone now guarded by a suspicious androsphinx.
In addition to facing a specific creature, creating an item comes with a gold piece cost covering other materials, tools, and so on, based on the item’s rarity. Those values, as well as the time a character needs to work in order to complete the item, are shown on the Magic Item Crafting Time and Cost table. Halve the listed price and creation time for any consumable items.
Magic Item Crafting Time and Cost
Item Rarity
Workweeks*
Cost*
Common
1
50 gp
Uncommon
2
200 gp
Rare
10
2,000 gp
Very rare
25
20,000 gp
Legendary
50
100,000 gp
However, I just have one area where I'm a bit confused and I couldn't find any information RAW on: materials.
I couldn't find anything in the book about what kind of materials would be needed to craft a magic item let alone materials in general. If there is a list somewhere I must have missed it. I was thinking that there could be a side quest in which a construct is needed to be essentially defeated/harvested for the materials necessary to craft this.
Do you guys have any recommendations on what to do/ideas to point me in the right direction for the materials portion of this system?
There is no RAW on the materials. For one, any list would get really unwieldy really quickly. For 2, they want to leave it to the DM. In this care, for me the obvious choice would be to use ogre parts. Go kill on and say it skin makes the gloves, or it’s bones make reinforcements or it’s hair is used in the stitching. But it can’t be that easy. Ideally you find something else. Either something tangible like iron tempered on an ogre’s cookfire, or something abstract, the smile of the moon or what have you. One thing to remember is, if you let your players start crafting items, you should deduct that created item from the next treasure horde they find. It’s great if you want to let them craft, just don’t let that turn into them having too many items and then being overpowered for their level.
There is a monster loot series on DMSGuild that I bought into. While it may not have loot specifically with magical crafting in mind, it might help you work out what sorts of components you'd need to create an item.
I would lean toward they have to find the components for a potion of strength for the enchantment, then maybe the ribs of an ogre as the binding agent to actually construct the gauntlets or something along those lines.
Ultimately this is the sort of thing that the DMG just assumes you will come up with on your own, which I suppose is fair enough. Would be a huge portion of the book if they had bespoke rules for it.
I would lean toward they have to find the components for a potion of strength for the enchantment, then maybe the ribs of an ogre as the binding agent to actually construct the gauntlets or something along those lines.
I actually really like that. I didn't want there to just be one item that they needed to acquire. Maybe the physical component (ribs of an ogre, heart...could be anything) combined with the enchantment component like you suggested really makes this a bit more meaningful imo. My player(s) really love deep crafting mechanics in games so I'm letting them have it in this game. Might consider a third because of that, but if it was an average party that wasnt interested in crafting too much but just wanted to get it done one time I would just keep it at 2.
The materials required are entirely up to you as the DM. You could say it’s something like one (or any) of the following examples, or even a combination of them:
An expertly crafted (read very expensive) set of gauntlets, perhaps made of an exotic material such as Adamantine, that is then saturated in fresh ogre blood once every day for a week while enchantments are laid upon them. (The exact enchantment being whatever spell you deem most appropriate.) (The challenge there is to either find enough ogres to stab every day for a week, or keeping one ogre alive and captive so one can stab it every day for a week.)
A set of gauntlets made in part from materials crafted from ogre hide/bones that have been cured with holy water, and then blessed by a forge cleric. (The challenge there is to harvest enough usable material to craft the gauntlets. If the hide is all cut up and burned it’s useless, and it must be harvested and cured properly.)
A set of expertly crafted ($$$) gauntlets that have been blessed by a willing ogre shaman. (The challenge there is to 1. find an ogre shaman, and 2. convince it to willingly bless the gauntlets.)
Those are just three ideas off the top of my head that you can use or maybe get inspired by for your own ideas. I usually try to allow for multiple “recipes” for the crafting of any given magic item because I think it’s cool and makes sense that there would be more than one way to create any given magic item, but you can always go with the “one item:one recipe” rout instead. As I said, it’s all entirely up to you.
Just had an idea. What if one of the components of the item is a giant's rune? I know Ogres are on the bottom of the totem pole of the hierarchy of Giants, but this could somehow tie into the Giants that I have set up in the game.
The giant's rune of _____ (I'll have to make it up) is required to transfer the strength of a giant into a magic item and must be acquired by ______. Not only will they need to harvest physical components of the Ogre, but seek out some way (and another adventure hook for a side quest) to find a way to acquire this giant's rune and thus thrusting them into the exposure of the lowest portion of Giant's society that is more accessible in their region.
Just a quick idea, but some of your posts helped me get there
Sure, if a giants’ rune is the way you wanna go then rock socks with it. That’s why the RAW is so vague, so you can do it with a giants’ rune but not everyone else has to.
A 10th level Artificer can create Gauntlets of Ogre Power RAW though their infusions. I'm all for giving creative liberties to the players, but IMO it would feel a bit funny giving them essentially part of their 10th level feature at level 5. I know my comment isn't what you were asking but I wanted to point it out in case you hadn't checked up on the Infusions list.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
A 10th level Artificer can create Gauntlets of Ogre Power RAW though their infusions. I'm all for giving creative liberties to the players, but IMO it would feel a bit funny giving them essentially part of their 10th level feature at level 5. I know my comment isn't what you were asking but I wanted to point it out in case you hadn't checked up on the Infusions list.
The difference is that the Artificer is creating the gauntlets instantly, for free, with no special materials needed, and it's not permanent.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I think I would just go with this easy, but still engaging method:
1. Choose one or two specific ingredients that they need to get. Like powdered ogre teeth or a Black Gemstone or a specific metal found in the ogre lands. It can really be anything you want. Probably not too hard to get for an uncommon item. They could either get it themselves or try to find a merchant who can sell it.
2. The rest of the materials are included in the crafting cost, which is half the value of the item.
A 10th level Artificer can create Gauntlets of Ogre Power RAW though their infusions. I'm all for giving creative liberties to the players, but IMO it would feel a bit funny giving them essentially part of their 10th level feature at level 5. I know my comment isn't what you were asking but I wanted to point it out in case you hadn't checked up on the Infusions list.
The difference is that the Artificer is creating the gauntlets instantly, for free, with no special materials needed, and it's not permanent.
That's sorta my point. The Artificer progression is right there on the tin, so to speak. I understand wanting to give the magical tinkerer ways to tinker, magically; but giving them their own class feature early, especially making it a side quest/downtime activity, seems odd to me.
It'd be like if a Cleric PC was really good at roleplaying being pious and in servitude of their deity, and wanted to mechanically represent that. So you decide to give them the ability to use Divine Intervention at lvl 5 after a short Vision Quest or something.
This to say: it's not my cup of tea, and I was mainly making the first post just to ensure OP saw that there was a simple RAW way to do what they wanted - wait for a few more levels. But if they want to go through with it still, that's a perfectly fine and valid way to play too.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
You're missing the point. Crafting magic items has never been an ability exclusive to artificers, they're just strictly better at it. Going on a quest to retrieve rare components, then spending a bunch of time and money to make the item in question is how it works already. Artificers can use Replicate Magic Item to simulate the Gauntlets, but they've got a lot of other things they can use that Infusion slot for, it's hardly stepping on their toes. What you're saying is closer to declaring that paladins shouldn't be allowed to cast spells because it steps on the Cleric's Divine Intervention ability.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Fair enough. It's still not something I'd be comfortable with as DM, but I understand your argument. As always, it's up to the table OP plays at - and considering they're the DM, I'd say you're probably in the right here.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Hey everyone
I have a player who is part of a group that I DM for that is an artificer and the group level is lvl 5 (table of 3 players). I can tell my player is really excited to craft items/magic items and I want to facilitate for them so that they can get there through a reasonable progression path. The player wants to craft the Gauntlets of Ogre Power which is an uncommon item. For their first magic item crafted in the game, I think this is a really good place for their character to get their feet wet when it comes to crafting magic items and I want to set this up for them. Xanathar's lays out a fairly comprehensive progression system:
However, I just have one area where I'm a bit confused and I couldn't find any information RAW on: materials.
I couldn't find anything in the book about what kind of materials would be needed to craft a magic item let alone materials in general. If there is a list somewhere I must have missed it. I was thinking that there could be a side quest in which a construct is needed to be essentially defeated/harvested for the materials necessary to craft this.
Do you guys have any recommendations on what to do/ideas to point me in the right direction for the materials portion of this system?
There is no RAW on the materials. For one, any list would get really unwieldy really quickly. For 2, they want to leave it to the DM.
In this care, for me the obvious choice would be to use ogre parts. Go kill on and say it skin makes the gloves, or it’s bones make reinforcements or it’s hair is used in the stitching. But it can’t be that easy. Ideally you find something else. Either something tangible like iron tempered on an ogre’s cookfire, or something abstract, the smile of the moon or what have you.
One thing to remember is, if you let your players start crafting items, you should deduct that created item from the next treasure horde they find. It’s great if you want to let them craft, just don’t let that turn into them having too many items and then being overpowered for their level.
There is a monster loot series on DMSGuild that I bought into. While it may not have loot specifically with magical crafting in mind, it might help you work out what sorts of components you'd need to create an item.
I would lean toward they have to find the components for a potion of strength for the enchantment, then maybe the ribs of an ogre as the binding agent to actually construct the gauntlets or something along those lines.
Ultimately this is the sort of thing that the DMG just assumes you will come up with on your own, which I suppose is fair enough. Would be a huge portion of the book if they had bespoke rules for it.
I actually really like that. I didn't want there to just be one item that they needed to acquire. Maybe the physical component (ribs of an ogre, heart...could be anything) combined with the enchantment component like you suggested really makes this a bit more meaningful imo. My player(s) really love deep crafting mechanics in games so I'm letting them have it in this game. Might consider a third because of that, but if it was an average party that wasnt interested in crafting too much but just wanted to get it done one time I would just keep it at 2.
The materials required are entirely up to you as the DM. You could say it’s something like one (or any) of the following examples, or even a combination of them:
(The challenge there is to either find enough ogres to stab every day for a week, or keeping one ogre alive and captive so one can stab it every day for a week.)
(The challenge there is to harvest enough usable material to craft the gauntlets. If the hide is all cut up and burned it’s useless, and it must be harvested and cured properly.)
(The challenge there is to 1. find an ogre shaman, and 2. convince it to willingly bless the gauntlets.)
Those are just three ideas off the top of my head that you can use or maybe get inspired by for your own ideas. I usually try to allow for multiple “recipes” for the crafting of any given magic item because I think it’s cool and makes sense that there would be more than one way to create any given magic item, but you can always go with the “one item:one recipe” rout instead. As I said, it’s all entirely up to you.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Just had an idea. What if one of the components of the item is a giant's rune? I know Ogres are on the bottom of the totem pole of the hierarchy of Giants, but this could somehow tie into the Giants that I have set up in the game.
The giant's rune of _____ (I'll have to make it up) is required to transfer the strength of a giant into a magic item and must be acquired by ______. Not only will they need to harvest physical components of the Ogre, but seek out some way (and another adventure hook for a side quest) to find a way to acquire this giant's rune and thus thrusting them into the exposure of the lowest portion of Giant's society that is more accessible in their region.
Just a quick idea, but some of your posts helped me get there
Sure, if a giants’ rune is the way you wanna go then rock socks with it. That’s why the RAW is so vague, so you can do it with a giants’ rune but not everyone else has to.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
A 10th level Artificer can create Gauntlets of Ogre Power RAW though their infusions. I'm all for giving creative liberties to the players, but IMO it would feel a bit funny giving them essentially part of their 10th level feature at level 5. I know my comment isn't what you were asking but I wanted to point it out in case you hadn't checked up on the Infusions list.
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
The difference is that the Artificer is creating the gauntlets instantly, for free, with no special materials needed, and it's not permanent.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I think I would just go with this easy, but still engaging method:
1. Choose one or two specific ingredients that they need to get. Like powdered ogre teeth or a Black Gemstone or a specific metal found in the ogre lands. It can really be anything you want. Probably not too hard to get for an uncommon item. They could either get it themselves or try to find a merchant who can sell it.
2. The rest of the materials are included in the crafting cost, which is half the value of the item.
Finland GMT/UTC +2
That's sorta my point. The Artificer progression is right there on the tin, so to speak. I understand wanting to give the magical tinkerer ways to tinker, magically; but giving them their own class feature early, especially making it a side quest/downtime activity, seems odd to me.
It'd be like if a Cleric PC was really good at roleplaying being pious and in servitude of their deity, and wanted to mechanically represent that. So you decide to give them the ability to use Divine Intervention at lvl 5 after a short Vision Quest or something.
This to say: it's not my cup of tea, and I was mainly making the first post just to ensure OP saw that there was a simple RAW way to do what they wanted - wait for a few more levels. But if they want to go through with it still, that's a perfectly fine and valid way to play too.
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
You're missing the point. Crafting magic items has never been an ability exclusive to artificers, they're just strictly better at it. Going on a quest to retrieve rare components, then spending a bunch of time and money to make the item in question is how it works already. Artificers can use Replicate Magic Item to simulate the Gauntlets, but they've got a lot of other things they can use that Infusion slot for, it's hardly stepping on their toes. What you're saying is closer to declaring that paladins shouldn't be allowed to cast spells because it steps on the Cleric's Divine Intervention ability.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Fair enough. It's still not something I'd be comfortable with as DM, but I understand your argument. As always, it's up to the table OP plays at - and considering they're the DM, I'd say you're probably in the right here.
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?