I'm confused about wizard spells, I use a character generator to create my characters. Now I have a level 5 wizard, this only gives him X amount of known spells per level. However, the program allows me to choose higher level spells even though I have 0 slots for them. Why does this happen? A 5th level wizard only has spots for levels 1 -3, no 4th or higher slots. What I want to know, is, at level 5 can I choose spells from level 4 an up but cast them using a spell slot from a lower level such as level 3. In other words, can I cast a level 4 spell at level 2 using a level 2 spell slot? If not, why does the generator allow me to even choose higher level spells. It only does this for wizards, it does not do it for any other class.
The bit in DDB when editing a character to add spells sometimes doesn't update right away when you change the characters level. You will often need to refresh the page for it to update.
Wizards cannot learn or prepare spells for which they do not have spell slots for and spells cannot be cast at lower levels than their base level.
As to the generator I'm pretty sure there are a number of options that you could choose that are inappropriate, such as multiple proficiencies that you don't have access to normally. The reason for this is to allow the character sheet to be manipulated during game play to allow for such things to be a possibility due to rewards and DM perks.
I'm using PcGen to create my characters. I've been confused about why it allows lower level wizards to sellect spells from higher levels even if they have no slots for it. It even lets you learn them and prepare them, which is useless since you cannot cast them until you reach the appropriate levels. The only reason I can think of why they made it that way, is so you can go ahead and learn the spells, and have them already prepared for when you do reach the appropriate level to be able to cast them, I guess they did this because once you create the PDF file for your character, you cannot edit it without some sort of PDF editor. Like I said, it only allows this with wizards and no other mage.
(I've never used PcGen so I'm only going off of the information I am familiar with)
I view it this way: A wizard can obtain spells by finding new ones from scrolls, spell books, and other medium that can allow them to write/transfer those spells into their own book. Let's say, for argument's sake, your party finds themselves in the abandoned tower of an archmage. Through their investigations they find the remains of a burnt pile of papers, in this pile are 3 scrolls, two of 1st level and one of 4th, which are intact enough to actually decipher. The wizard could then attempt to transfer those spells into their book, assuming they rolled amazingly for all three scrolls the wizard now has access to those three spells along with the list they already have.
Now this Wizard is only level 3, which means they have the ability to cast 2nd level spells. Even though they have transfered that 4th level spell into their book they are incapable of actually casting it, it's currently a gold star saying "Look I did the nearly impossible!".
No other class is capable of obtaining spells in this nature, hence the oddity you've come across. This situation is also very much up to the DM being generous enough to allow it since, as stated above, you normally cannot decipher/transcribe a spell higher than the level you can currently cast.
Also, scrolls of a higher level than you can cast are special. You can cast a higher level spell from a scroll, but you need to make a spell casting ability check first of 10+spell level or the magic is wasted. So, a 1st level wizard could, in theory, use a scroll of fireball, but would have to make a dc 13 INT check first.
A wizard can not learn, prepare, or cast spells that are higher level than the wizard has according to its class chart (not counting magic items or some other feature).
So even if I can prepare a level 4 spell, if I don't have a level 4 slot, I cannot cast it until I reach level 6 or higher?
1) You can't prepare a spell of a level for which you do not have spell slots. In addition, the spells you can prepare are limited by your wizard class level. Thus a level 5 wizard can have up to 3rd level spells prepared and can copy level 3rd spells to their spell book. They can not copy or prepare spells greater than the level that they can currently cast "AS A WIZARD".
"Copying a Spell into the Book. When you find a wizard spell of 1st level or higher, you can add it to your spellbook if it is of a level for which you have spell slots (errata: The spells copied into a spellbook must be of a spell level the wizard can prepare.)" PHB 114
So ... a wizard can not copy higher level spells into their spell book. They have to save them until they can cast them.
3) "AS A WIZARD" is important since a multi-class wizard/cleric with 5 levels in each has the spell slots of a 10th level spell caster including 2 5th level spell slots. However, they can only prepare and cast up to 3rd level wizard or 3rd level cleric spells. They do not know any spells of 4th or 5th level even though they have 4th and 5th level spell slots. These spell slots CAN be used to cast the spells they do know at a higher level (e.g. fireball or spirit guardians)
4) A caster doesn't receive level 4 spell slots (and spells) until 7th level. (For full casters, new spell levels are received on the odd numbered levels with the level 9 spells starting at 17th level)
I'm using PcGen to create my characters. I've been confused about why it allows lower level wizards to sellect spells from higher levels even if they have no slots for it. It even lets you learn them and prepare them, which is useless since you cannot cast them until you reach the appropriate levels. The only reason I can think of why they made it that way, is so you can go ahead and learn the spells, and have them already prepared for when you do reach the appropriate level to be able to cast them, I guess they did this because once you create the PDF file for your character, you cannot edit it without some sort of PDF editor. Like I said, it only allows this with wizards and no other mage.
There are two main reasons they would do it this way.
1) Flexibility. In many games very strange things can happen. In some of those games a wizard might, through an extraordinary event in the game, learn to be able to cast a spell of a higher level than they are capable of casting. If the sheet designer made it impossible to make changes like this to the character sheet for exceptional circumstances then folks might find it hard to use when this kind of thing does happen. The easy way out is to allow people to fill in the spells as they wish.
2) Planning. By allowing a user to fill out whatever spells they like they can plan what spells they want to take at each level. They do NOT have them in their spell book. They can't cast them. This is just for hypothetical planning purposes. Other than the 2 spells they receive each level for leveling up they will have to go out and find the spells in the world .. they don't just appear in the spell book.
Finally, character sheets aren't the best way to pick up the rules since they don't always follow them. The character sheets aid in character creation but they have to be designed to allow for customization and exceptions since that is what the game is all about and each character is usually unique. The character sheets will usually take care of a lot of the math, applying stats and proficiencies, but they will not typically even try to enforce every rule since D&D is often about the exceptions.
I think I understand now, thanks. We do use the rule of allowing wizards to "find" new spells of higher levels and even write them in their spellbook, but we don't let them prepare or cast it until the appropriate level is reached to give them a slot to cast it in. We only allow this for wizards since they seem to be the most versatile class. There are cases where the DM does allow the use of a higher level "learned" spell, but it requires some very specific things and requires a ritual to cast it and it can only be done once whenever the DM allows it. Which is pretty rare as it can easily tip the ballance of the game. She uses this rule very rarely and with very much descretion. Thanks to all of you for explaining this, now I have a better understanding of the rules and how magic works.
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I'm confused about wizard spells, I use a character generator to create my characters. Now I have a level 5 wizard, this only gives him X amount of known spells per level. However, the program allows me to choose higher level spells even though I have 0 slots for them. Why does this happen? A 5th level wizard only has spots for levels 1 -3, no 4th or higher slots. What I want to know, is, at level 5 can I choose spells from level 4 an up but cast them using a spell slot from a lower level such as level 3. In other words, can I cast a level 4 spell at level 2 using a level 2 spell slot? If not, why does the generator allow me to even choose higher level spells. It only does this for wizards, it does not do it for any other class.
The bit in DDB when editing a character to add spells sometimes doesn't update right away when you change the characters level. You will often need to refresh the page for it to update.
Wizards cannot learn or prepare spells for which they do not have spell slots for and spells cannot be cast at lower levels than their base level.
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You cannot down cast a spell.
As to the generator I'm pretty sure there are a number of options that you could choose that are inappropriate, such as multiple proficiencies that you don't have access to normally. The reason for this is to allow the character sheet to be manipulated during game play to allow for such things to be a possibility due to rewards and DM perks.
So even if I can prepare a level 4 spell, if I don't have a level 4 slot, I cannot cast it until I reach level 6 or higher?
I'm using PcGen to create my characters. I've been confused about why it allows lower level wizards to sellect spells from higher levels even if they have no slots for it. It even lets you learn them and prepare them, which is useless since you cannot cast them until you reach the appropriate levels. The only reason I can think of why they made it that way, is so you can go ahead and learn the spells, and have them already prepared for when you do reach the appropriate level to be able to cast them, I guess they did this because once you create the PDF file for your character, you cannot edit it without some sort of PDF editor. Like I said, it only allows this with wizards and no other mage.
(I've never used PcGen so I'm only going off of the information I am familiar with)
I view it this way:
A wizard can obtain spells by finding new ones from scrolls, spell books, and other medium that can allow them to write/transfer those spells into their own book. Let's say, for argument's sake, your party finds themselves in the abandoned tower of an archmage. Through their investigations they find the remains of a burnt pile of papers, in this pile are 3 scrolls, two of 1st level and one of 4th, which are intact enough to actually decipher. The wizard could then attempt to transfer those spells into their book, assuming they rolled amazingly for all three scrolls the wizard now has access to those three spells along with the list they already have.
Now this Wizard is only level 3, which means they have the ability to cast 2nd level spells. Even though they have transfered that 4th level spell into their book they are incapable of actually casting it, it's currently a gold star saying "Look I did the nearly impossible!".
No other class is capable of obtaining spells in this nature, hence the oddity you've come across. This situation is also very much up to the DM being generous enough to allow it since, as stated above, you normally cannot decipher/transcribe a spell higher than the level you can currently cast.
Also, scrolls of a higher level than you can cast are special. You can cast a higher level spell from a scroll, but you need to make a spell casting ability check first of 10+spell level or the magic is wasted. So, a 1st level wizard could, in theory, use a scroll of fireball, but would have to make a dc 13 INT check first.
A wizard can not learn, prepare, or cast spells that are higher level than the wizard has according to its class chart (not counting magic items or some other feature).
1) You can't prepare a spell of a level for which you do not have spell slots. In addition, the spells you can prepare are limited by your wizard class level. Thus a level 5 wizard can have up to 3rd level spells prepared and can copy level 3rd spells to their spell book. They can not copy or prepare spells greater than the level that they can currently cast "AS A WIZARD".
"Copying a Spell into the Book. When you find a wizard spell of 1st level or higher, you can add it to your spellbook if it is of a level for which you have spell slots (errata: The spells copied into a spellbook must be of a spell level the wizard can prepare.)" PHB 114
So ... a wizard can not copy higher level spells into their spell book. They have to save them until they can cast them.
3) "AS A WIZARD" is important since a multi-class wizard/cleric with 5 levels in each has the spell slots of a 10th level spell caster including 2 5th level spell slots. However, they can only prepare and cast up to 3rd level wizard or 3rd level cleric spells. They do not know any spells of 4th or 5th level even though they have 4th and 5th level spell slots. These spell slots CAN be used to cast the spells they do know at a higher level (e.g. fireball or spirit guardians)
4) A caster doesn't receive level 4 spell slots (and spells) until 7th level. (For full casters, new spell levels are received on the odd numbered levels with the level 9 spells starting at 17th level)
There are two main reasons they would do it this way.
1) Flexibility. In many games very strange things can happen. In some of those games a wizard might, through an extraordinary event in the game, learn to be able to cast a spell of a higher level than they are capable of casting. If the sheet designer made it impossible to make changes like this to the character sheet for exceptional circumstances then folks might find it hard to use when this kind of thing does happen. The easy way out is to allow people to fill in the spells as they wish.
2) Planning. By allowing a user to fill out whatever spells they like they can plan what spells they want to take at each level. They do NOT have them in their spell book. They can't cast them. This is just for hypothetical planning purposes. Other than the 2 spells they receive each level for leveling up they will have to go out and find the spells in the world .. they don't just appear in the spell book.
Finally, character sheets aren't the best way to pick up the rules since they don't always follow them. The character sheets aid in character creation but they have to be designed to allow for customization and exceptions since that is what the game is all about and each character is usually unique. The character sheets will usually take care of a lot of the math, applying stats and proficiencies, but they will not typically even try to enforce every rule since D&D is often about the exceptions.
I think I understand now, thanks. We do use the rule of allowing wizards to "find" new spells of higher levels and even write them in their spellbook, but we don't let them prepare or cast it until the appropriate level is reached to give them a slot to cast it in. We only allow this for wizards since they seem to be the most versatile class. There are cases where the DM does allow the use of a higher level "learned" spell, but it requires some very specific things and requires a ritual to cast it and it can only be done once whenever the DM allows it. Which is pretty rare as it can easily tip the ballance of the game. She uses this rule very rarely and with very much descretion. Thanks to all of you for explaining this, now I have a better understanding of the rules and how magic works.