Hello everyone, looking for some advice again. I have a Wizard in our campaign that has access to the wall of force spell, in the last session they were after a magical artifact being protected by a Walking Statue of Waterdeep. I just left out the "of water deep" part.
My issue is the wizard basically made a box with an open side and placed over the creature leaving it enclosed in on all sides except the bottom, which is only 3 feet from the ground. The group then just chipped away at the creature without any threat, as it was too large to squeeze out. I let it happen as the creativity was nice but it is kind of a encounter breaker in my books so unsure how to deal with it when he eventually uses it again.
Well, first of all, I'd say that RAW that wasn't a valid use of Wall of Force because the spell says you can form a flat plane of 10X10 panels, not a geometric shape. Also, he's basically trying to make it be Forcecage but better. Upstaging a spell of a higher level is one of my cardinal no-nos.
Beyond this, there should be a saving throw of some kind. Probably Dex. Trapping an enemy inside a spell effect where they can freely be pecked to death and there's no action they can take to prevent it or escape is definitely not something that should be allowed.
Overall, I'd take the player aside and give them props for thinking outside the box, but explain why this particular instance is not going to be something they're allowed to repeat. Encourage them to keep looking for creative uses of spellcasting, that they're doing that is fantastic. But explain why you're not going to let them just keep using the invincible Wall of Force epic capture plan.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I would probably change "If the wall cuts through a creature's space when it appears, the creature is pushed to one side of the wall (your choice which side)." to "If the wall cuts through a creature's space when it appears, the creature is pushed to one side of the wall (your choice which side, as long as there is sufficient space. If there is no sufficient space the creature can be pushed to, the spell fails)." Once that's fixed, the spell is generally not usable to trap anything larger than Large, because it will intersect their space (you can use the ten 10'x10' panels option to contain a creature up to 4x4, but it's only 10' high at that point and they'll climb out).
As written, you can cast a wall of force 1" above the ground, observe that it intersects a creature's space, and shove the creature under the wall. This is probably not intended...
My wizard knows all three and almost always ends up casting either Animate Objects or Bigby's Hand. All three are concentration, all three totally screw with the enemy.
But Wall of Force, can not be re-targeted. Once you do it, you are done. As others stated, it has environmental issues - can't use it is a lot of places. It also has less non-combat uses. Yeah, you can make a bridge as well as a wall, prison, or protective barrier, but that is about it. Animate Object and Bigby can act as offensive or defensive. Both can let you fly or carry heavy objects. Animate Objects can act as messengers.
Wall of Force's main advantage is the longer duration. Otherwise, it's only the 3rd best 5th level spell.
Thanks for the input everyone, much appreciated. I will be having a video chat with this player before the next session to discuss the use of this spell.
If you think this is bad, wait until they get Forcecage. Not only can they create a cage of force that traps creatures inside - no save, but lets you shoot and target inside AND makes it difficult to teleport out AND no concentration, so the wizard is free to also target inside with something like Sickening Radiance.
By the time players get these spells, you need to consider the value of what they're after and how well known magic is. If magic is well known then things may have defences against magic like repeating glyphs of counterspell or golems with an antimagic cone effect similar to a beholder. Or perhaps a Disintegrate option. And so on.
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Hello everyone, looking for some advice again. I have a Wizard in our campaign that has access to the wall of force spell, in the last session they were after a magical artifact being protected by a Walking Statue of Waterdeep. I just left out the "of water deep" part.
My issue is the wizard basically made a box with an open side and placed over the creature leaving it enclosed in on all sides except the bottom, which is only 3 feet from the ground. The group then just chipped away at the creature without any threat, as it was too large to squeeze out. I let it happen as the creativity was nice but it is kind of a encounter breaker in my books so unsure how to deal with it when he eventually uses it again.
Thanks for any input.
-Jon
Well, first of all, I'd say that RAW that wasn't a valid use of Wall of Force because the spell says you can form a flat plane of 10X10 panels, not a geometric shape. Also, he's basically trying to make it be Forcecage but better. Upstaging a spell of a higher level is one of my cardinal no-nos.
Beyond this, there should be a saving throw of some kind. Probably Dex. Trapping an enemy inside a spell effect where they can freely be pecked to death and there's no action they can take to prevent it or escape is definitely not something that should be allowed.
Overall, I'd take the player aside and give them props for thinking outside the box, but explain why this particular instance is not going to be something they're allowed to repeat. Encourage them to keep looking for creative uses of spellcasting, that they're doing that is fantastic. But explain why you're not going to let them just keep using the invincible Wall of Force epic capture plan.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I would probably change "If the wall cuts through a creature's space when it appears, the creature is pushed to one side of the wall (your choice which side)." to "If the wall cuts through a creature's space when it appears, the creature is pushed to one side of the wall (your choice which side, as long as there is sufficient space. If there is no sufficient space the creature can be pushed to, the spell fails)." Once that's fixed, the spell is generally not usable to trap anything larger than Large, because it will intersect their space (you can use the ten 10'x10' panels option to contain a creature up to 4x4, but it's only 10' high at that point and they'll climb out).
As written, you can cast a wall of force 1" above the ground, observe that it intersects a creature's space, and shove the creature under the wall. This is probably not intended...
Three best 5th level spells:
My wizard knows all three and almost always ends up casting either Animate Objects or Bigby's Hand. All three are concentration, all three totally screw with the enemy.
But Wall of Force, can not be re-targeted. Once you do it, you are done. As others stated, it has environmental issues - can't use it is a lot of places. It also has less non-combat uses. Yeah, you can make a bridge as well as a wall, prison, or protective barrier, but that is about it. Animate Object and Bigby can act as offensive or defensive. Both can let you fly or carry heavy objects. Animate Objects can act as messengers.
Wall of Force's main advantage is the longer duration. Otherwise, it's only the 3rd best 5th level spell.
QFT. The spell cannot create boxes or grids or walls with little holes in them.
It's useful but the overpowered nature often comes from GMs letting it do things that higher spells do.
Thanks for the input everyone, much appreciated. I will be having a video chat with this player before the next session to discuss the use of this spell.
-Jon
If you think this is bad, wait until they get Forcecage. Not only can they create a cage of force that traps creatures inside - no save, but lets you shoot and target inside AND makes it difficult to teleport out AND no concentration, so the wizard is free to also target inside with something like Sickening Radiance.
By the time players get these spells, you need to consider the value of what they're after and how well known magic is. If magic is well known then things may have defences against magic like repeating glyphs of counterspell or golems with an antimagic cone effect similar to a beholder. Or perhaps a Disintegrate option. And so on.
Click ✨ HERE ✨ For My Youtube Videos featuring Guides, Tips & Tricks for using D&D Beyond.
Need help with Homebrew? Check out ✨ this FAQ/Guide thread ✨ by IamSposta.