I spend a lot of time trying to think of the best possible way to present my players with sense of excitement and reward with exploration, but one of the biggest areas I have problems with is in how I handle the revealing of the map as they move through a dungeon or mansion. I've experimented with a lot of different methods trying to find what works best, but nothing has ever quite been satisfying due to the different cons. Just to list what I've tried so far, and my findings:
Taping one inch grid paper together and pre-drawing the map from reference material together with oil pastels. Then taking the huge map and cutting it up into 'rooms' like a giant jigsaw puzzle. The think I liked about this was no one had any idea how big or small the map would be, and it left little in the way for spoilers for secret rooms and the like. It also allowed my players to use their minis (when it was a one inch to 5 foot scale.. Wave Echo Cave map was HUGE, and even then they had to use small tokens). The issue was it took a lot of my time to make these maps, and assembling it could be a little tedious.
'Theater of the Mind' narration, letting them map it as they went, and a blank grid for combat space. I wanted this to work better than it did, hoping people would hang on more to the descriptions of the rooms and find it all a lot more immersive. Unfortunately I spent a lot of time repeating myself and having people confused about where things were. Plus I suspect they just thought I hadn't prepared.
Hand drawing the map for them as they go from my notes onto 10mm grid paper. It's a little like my first method, but involves me standing up and sitting down a lot. The pros are that it feels like I'm getting my daily squats in, but the negatives is that I hate it. Also the 10mm grid is too small for miniatures.
Laying my hand drawn maps onto the table, and covering the areas they haven't explored with sheets of paper which they move. What we are currently doing right now, and it doesn't feel particularly elegant. Especially when the book is bumped, and the whole map is revealed anyway. Same issue with the minis.
I was interested to hear how other DM's manage this part of the game, and if there is anything I could do differently I haven't thought of yet.
Just as a note on the style of maps I use: I enjoy making large and detailed places to explore with a high number of rooms and multiple possible ways to get from place to place. I deliberately try to make more than is reasonable to explore to make the players feel the decision to venture into another part of the map is a costly risk. So far they've left every map with rooms they never even went into, and it's satisfying hearing them talk OOC about really wishing they knew what the might have found had they not been in a rush to get in and out.
I have a box of the D&D dungeons tiles, but there are so many blocky pieces I don't find them particularity useful - I'm mostly trying to find ways to speed up the game that bog it down with looking for the right bits. If it matters for the advice, my campaign maps are mostly mansions and caves, so the angular 'set of rectangular rooms separated by 5 foot of stone wall' you see in randomly generated isn't my style. I was looking at running Strahd too, and the maps of the castle gave me a headache just thinking about it.
I haven't used it myself yet, but there's a cool digital tool called Dungeon Scrawl. You can draw out super intricate maps, even have multiple layers that isometrically line up. Multiple tools options for pretty and perfect, or natural and misshapen, to any combination. Doors, stairwells, etc. You can import already created things, and export as a multi-page print project. Claims to have easy compatibility with VTT systems. There's probably a way to use the drawing layers to put fog of war over parts of your map, then remove it as the party explores.
As a player, my immediate thought was not to use it to create dungeons, but as a tool for mapping myself while playing.
So it sounds like spatial awareness is really important to you, and mapmaking is a favorite creative outlet for you. Awesome!
It also sounds like a big problem is map reveal for a massive, massive map...and maybe space on the table!
The digital idea drag0n_77 suggested sounds cool.
One way to potentially do massive maps (probably less work digitally, because copy/paste) is to make a small "master map" on a single sheet of paper, that you can gradually reveal using something like post-its. Then it can be on the table, and there for an overall reference of where everyone has been. You can have (or make on the spot) single page individual rooms, labeled with their room number, like a "zoomed in" element on a map.
(I don't worry about whether tokens are to scale with the map. Life's short. I actually just hold up a mechanical pencil (or something) and declare "this is 10 feet" or "this is about 30 feet," and we estimate from there.)
As they move room to room in the pretty "master map," you could just loosely diagram the "zoom in" room they are in on a piece of paper, along with its room number (unpretty-like, but enough to label where stuff is).
I really would minimize time spent on less important rooms (like a 30 second ugly sketch/diagram on the spot--this square is a desk, this circle is a pit, this blob is a pile of skeletons, etc), and devote more to an important room. Make that your fancy piece of art. Plus, it imbues extra significance on your best rooms.
If they don't make it to one of your favorite rooms that you drew up all nice, save it for the next dungeon--no one will ever know!
In fine art paintings, detail is often devoted to the most important parts (such as the face), and other areas left sketchy. You can do the same with maps.
I ran Wave Echo Cave on Roll20 (due to the current circumstances), and it was surprisingly satisfying. Getting fog-of-war and lines-of-sight 'right' for each player was easy and accurate.
However, if you have the option to run your game on an actual table, I used a bunch of 2.75 inch circle cutouts to cover the map as fog-of-war. The picture shows how that looked (the squares are only because I didn't make enough rounds to cover the map and I had to add more on the spot).
I also tried covering the map with acrylic sheet and covering it up with dry erase chalk pens, but that ended up just being messy.
Currently, I use Roll20 which I import my maps into the VTT. From there I can turn on Fog Of War which blackouts the map to the players and I can slowly reveal the map as progression is made.
When it comes to pencil and paper maps in a live environment what I've done is create two maps on is the 1/2 scale map that is more for location purposes and update is as again progress is made by the players. When it comes to combat I'll take the room or territory-specific for that encounter and draw it out to proper scale and use it as a battle map. You could apply this same theory on VTT's as well, create one map to reveal progress, and then when combat comes up go to another map for the encounter.
When it comes to pencil and paper maps in a live environment what I've done is create two maps on is the 1/2 scale map that is more for location purposes and update is as again progress is made by the players. When it comes to combat I'll take the room or territory-specific for that encounter and draw it out to proper scale and use it as a battle map. You could apply this same theory on VTT's as well, create one map to reveal progress, and then when combat comes up go to another map for the encounter.
Man, thank you for saying what I was trying to convey, but way more succinctly! I had the idea in mind, but just couldn't get it into writing quite right. Also, I'm glad to see you've actually tried it out and it worked.
When it comes to pencil and paper maps in a live environment what I've done is create two maps on is the 1/2 scale map that is more for location purposes and update is as again progress is made by the players. When it comes to combat I'll take the room or territory-specific for that encounter and draw it out to proper scale and use it as a battle map. You could apply this same theory on VTT's as well, create one map to reveal progress, and then when combat comes up go to another map for the encounter.
Man, thank you for saying what I was trying to convey, but way more succinctly! I had the idea in mind, but just couldn't get it into writing quite right. Also, I'm glad to see you've actually tried it out and it worked.
Thank you. BTW, I thought you did a good job explaining your similar theory as well.
Cover the map with modelling sand or flock or something similar. As the characters explore, use a soft brush to reveal the map. This works best if you have a large table, or a tray or something to put the map in. If you pick something dry, like flock, cleanup is not an issue. Don't use beach sand. :-)
Cut the map up like a jigsaw puzzle and place pieces as they are explored.
I'm THAT guy who will take a snippet of that particular section of the dungeon and paste it onto a new blank photo file that I have open on a TV that I'm wirelessly connected to with my laptop. The group can see just where they are and also the creatures they battle in real time. It's also how I've been streaming (screen share) now that we've been having to play online.
Cover the map with modelling sand or flock or something similar. As the characters explore, use a soft brush to reveal the map. This works best if you have a large table, or a tray or something to put the map in. If you pick something dry, like flock, cleanup is not an issue. Don't use beach sand. :-)
I really like that idea :) I don't know how well that'd go down in my dining room - but I love the flexibility of that.
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I spend a lot of time trying to think of the best possible way to present my players with sense of excitement and reward with exploration, but one of the biggest areas I have problems with is in how I handle the revealing of the map as they move through a dungeon or mansion. I've experimented with a lot of different methods trying to find what works best, but nothing has ever quite been satisfying due to the different cons. Just to list what I've tried so far, and my findings:
I was interested to hear how other DM's manage this part of the game, and if there is anything I could do differently I haven't thought of yet.
Just as a note on the style of maps I use: I enjoy making large and detailed places to explore with a high number of rooms and multiple possible ways to get from place to place. I deliberately try to make more than is reasonable to explore to make the players feel the decision to venture into another part of the map is a costly risk. So far they've left every map with rooms they never even went into, and it's satisfying hearing them talk OOC about really wishing they knew what the might have found had they not been in a rush to get in and out.
I have a box of the D&D dungeons tiles, but there are so many blocky pieces I don't find them particularity useful - I'm mostly trying to find ways to speed up the game that bog it down with looking for the right bits. If it matters for the advice, my campaign maps are mostly mansions and caves, so the angular 'set of rectangular rooms separated by 5 foot of stone wall' you see in randomly generated isn't my style. I was looking at running Strahd too, and the maps of the castle gave me a headache just thinking about it.
I haven't used it myself yet, but there's a cool digital tool called Dungeon Scrawl. You can draw out super intricate maps, even have multiple layers that isometrically line up. Multiple tools options for pretty and perfect, or natural and misshapen, to any combination. Doors, stairwells, etc. You can import already created things, and export as a multi-page print project. Claims to have easy compatibility with VTT systems. There's probably a way to use the drawing layers to put fog of war over parts of your map, then remove it as the party explores.
As a player, my immediate thought was not to use it to create dungeons, but as a tool for mapping myself while playing.
https://dungeonscrawl.com/
So it sounds like spatial awareness is really important to you, and mapmaking is a favorite creative outlet for you. Awesome!
It also sounds like a big problem is map reveal for a massive, massive map...and maybe space on the table!
The digital idea drag0n_77 suggested sounds cool.
One way to potentially do massive maps (probably less work digitally, because copy/paste) is to make a small "master map" on a single sheet of paper, that you can gradually reveal using something like post-its. Then it can be on the table, and there for an overall reference of where everyone has been. You can have (or make on the spot) single page individual rooms, labeled with their room number, like a "zoomed in" element on a map.
(I don't worry about whether tokens are to scale with the map. Life's short. I actually just hold up a mechanical pencil (or something) and declare "this is 10 feet" or "this is about 30 feet," and we estimate from there.)
As they move room to room in the pretty "master map," you could just loosely diagram the "zoom in" room they are in on a piece of paper, along with its room number (unpretty-like, but enough to label where stuff is).
I really would minimize time spent on less important rooms (like a 30 second ugly sketch/diagram on the spot--this square is a desk, this circle is a pit, this blob is a pile of skeletons, etc), and devote more to an important room. Make that your fancy piece of art. Plus, it imbues extra significance on your best rooms.
If they don't make it to one of your favorite rooms that you drew up all nice, save it for the next dungeon--no one will ever know!
In fine art paintings, detail is often devoted to the most important parts (such as the face), and other areas left sketchy. You can do the same with maps.
I ran Wave Echo Cave on Roll20 (due to the current circumstances), and it was surprisingly satisfying. Getting fog-of-war and lines-of-sight 'right' for each player was easy and accurate.
However, if you have the option to run your game on an actual table, I used a bunch of 2.75 inch circle cutouts to cover the map as fog-of-war. The picture shows how that looked (the squares are only because I didn't make enough rounds to cover the map and I had to add more on the spot).
I also tried covering the map with acrylic sheet and covering it up with dry erase chalk pens, but that ended up just being messy.
More Interesting Lock Picking Rules
Wow! Thank you for the suggestion of Dungeonscrawl. That is a great tool.
Currently, I use Roll20 which I import my maps into the VTT. From there I can turn on Fog Of War which blackouts the map to the players and I can slowly reveal the map as progression is made.
When it comes to pencil and paper maps in a live environment what I've done is create two maps on is the 1/2 scale map that is more for location purposes and update is as again progress is made by the players. When it comes to combat I'll take the room or territory-specific for that encounter and draw it out to proper scale and use it as a battle map. You could apply this same theory on VTT's as well, create one map to reveal progress, and then when combat comes up go to another map for the encounter.
Man, thank you for saying what I was trying to convey, but way more succinctly! I had the idea in mind, but just couldn't get it into writing quite right. Also, I'm glad to see you've actually tried it out and it worked.
Thank you. BTW, I thought you did a good job explaining your similar theory as well.
Cover the map with modelling sand or flock or something similar. As the characters explore, use a soft brush to reveal the map. This works best if you have a large table, or a tray or something to put the map in. If you pick something dry, like flock, cleanup is not an issue. Don't use beach sand. :-)
Cut the map up like a jigsaw puzzle and place pieces as they are explored.
I'm THAT guy who will take a snippet of that particular section of the dungeon and paste it onto a new blank photo file that I have open on a TV that I'm wirelessly connected to with my laptop. The group can see just where they are and also the creatures they battle in real time. It's also how I've been streaming (screen share) now that we've been having to play online.
If in person I use a laptop which has the maps and stream them to the big screen TV.
In discord since we are not meeting because of Corona is stream the PC monitor through discord.
I really like that idea :) I don't know how well that'd go down in my dining room - but I love the flexibility of that.
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.