Apparently one of the reasons Aarakocra aren't permitted in the Adventurer's League is the idea that flying is too powerful at lower levels. Having played one, I tend to agree. I remember Raptorians in 3.5 had wings that started out as gliding, then progressed to flying after they leveled up a bit. I was wondering what people thought would be an appropriate level to reach for flight in most people's opinions. Feel free to explain your reasoning, if you like, below the poll.
Not everyone agrees flight (winged or otherwise) needs a minimum or is too powerful for 1st level.
I've been in several campaigns (including one in 3.5) where people had flying characters from 1st level and it remained perfectly balanced.
It's an easy and very simple thing to balance too. It baffles me that it's not valid for adventure league or when people have problems with it. I personally just don't understand how.
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I don't really have a stake in this, but if you really needed a reference I think a few Sorcerer subclasses get wings at level 14 for one of their features. Or see when some classes are able to get the spell, Fly. So maybe that range? It's just so weird to make a winged creature lack the ability to fly so late into the game, when it might just be a group/setting issue.
I think the AL comes from it is hard to plan for a flying PC when you don't know you have a flying PC. Which with AL being a come and go based system makes it hard for DMs at the table that night to modify encounters. Sure DMs for home games it easy because they have the time to actually plan out the encounters to make sure the flyer doesn't just trounce everything.
But I don 't see it being so OP that a race with natural wings should wait more than maybe a level or two to get it. Because that would mean that the non PC members of that race would all need to be say level 3 in order to fly. Which would make that race the best race in any world due to all of its members being above level 1.
I think the AL comes from it is hard to plan for a flying PC when you don't know you have a flying PC. Which with AL being a come and go based system makes it hard for DMs at the table that night to modify encounters. Sure DMs for home games it easy because they have the time to actually plan out the encounters to make sure the flyer doesn't just trounce everything.
But I don 't see it being so OP that a race with natural wings should wait more than maybe a level or two to get it. Because that would mean that the non PC members of that race would all need to be say level 3 in order to fly. Which would make that race the best race in any world due to all of its members being above level 1.
These are very good points. I dont think having one PC who can fly does that much to break the game at level 1, but I do think that allowing new players to fly at level one can lead to some more accidental deaths. I like the idea of the wings growing with the player so level 1 could be no fall damage when the PC has movement, level 3 could be fly for 10 minutes per long rest and level 5 could be flying speed. The problem is that the Aarakocra doesn't get anything else, so you should probably give it something else if you are going to delay its flying until later levels
The better idea is to just disallow aarakocra because they're a poorly designed race and Wizards should feel bad for allowing them. Nrrgh.
Nevertheless. If the objective is 'when is it fair for a PC to have unlimited flight?', the Descent into Avernus season of AL said "level 5". That's when a tiefling or aasimar could trade their other racial abilities in to become the 'Winged' variant of their race. Given the existence of Winged Boots, an Uncommon magical item that may as well be "unlimited flight" for how often its limitations are actually meaningful, level 5 feels like it checks out. Of course, Winged Boots are ridiculous overpowered for an Uncommon item, but the fact remains that flight is in the hands of a given party by fifth level if they have an arcane spellcaster. And unless everybody in the party can fly, it's not really a problem. Which is why the AL ban happened - supposedly individual flying characters is fine, but entire parties of fliers who cheese the modules for Speed Leveling nonsense is why AL banned flight.
I posted this poll in 5 other places, and got essentially the same results. I kind of thought it was a non-issue or minor-issue, and I'm glad to see that a lot of people agree.
I guess I'm just too new to D&D to see this as game breaking or a poorly designed race. One of my PCs was considering Aarokocra for their race and I didn't see how much that would shatter a home game where I can just add ranged/flying to encounters balancing it out. I can definitely see in premade adventures how this would break the game and need some revamping.
I just can't see baring a race with distinct flight at first level because again than all NPCs would also not be able to fly, meaning that for example Aarokocra are either super high leveled as a race or completely do not follow what the book says about their nature.
There is always some difficulty getting a concept to work well in the rules. Logically a bird race would probably be able to fly before they are even fully adult, but unless they account for that in the lore they won't inherently work as intended. If you look closely you'll see that's vaguely analogous to every race. Exactly how important that is is a matter of opinion.
I agree that if you are running a typical game you just tailor encounters to your group.
Not everyone agrees flight (winged or otherwise) needs a minimum or is too powerful for 1st level.
I've been in several campaigns (including one in 3.5) where people had flying characters from 1st level and it remained perfectly balanced.
It's an easy and very simple thing to balance too. It baffles me that it's not valid for adventure league or when people have problems with it. I personally just don't understand how.
if you didn't see any problem with flying, then you ave players who never abused it... i did, every single group where there was a flying character, i was having all the problems in the world to keep it on the ground. he was flying even in dungeons never hitting ground. 10 feet height corridor, no problem... i fly above everyone, boom no more covers. no path, no problem, i fly above them cause 10 foot high ceilings.. yes i take attacks of opportunities but oh well. that is for inside... outside it becomes literally impossible to ever hit them. outside, ok... i take my bow, flight 50 feet above, shoot the bulette who can never reach me. oh right my bow can hit things 120 feet away, why not just fly 120 feet away and 50 feet high and be done with it.
the problem is that at lower levels there is next to nothing that can fly and do enough speed to follow an aarakocra at 50 feet speed. thus from level 1 to 5.. that aarakocra is just invincible unless you always fight in small dungeons. or start trying to involve the wing span which should be bigger then 10 feet. but who's really trying to maintain a rule for wing span ? not to mention there is no ruling for wing span thus byt he rules, that aarkocra can just fly everywhere there is at least enough space for the character to be in.
you don't understand why adventurers league bans it ? simple... flying bypasses every single thing the low level adventures do, thus the aarakocra literally finishes the adventure in less then a few minutes. thats why... if you think that having to think of aarakocra and having to make adventures with that in mind is a thing... its just better to ban it then it is to start balancing every single adventure with aarakocra in mind. there is a reason why flight speed on any creature is the equivalent of adding +2 to AC. its because they always keep out of range of anything. in 3rd edition, why was the wizard so powerfull... basically because of flying. as soon as the wizard was flying, even a tarrasque couldn'T hit him.
but when it comes to 5th edition... the official ruling says that if you are to gve flying to a creature, it should be beyond level 5. because thats when spells can allow you to fly. so level 5 is what you are seeking out.
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Apparently one of the reasons Aarakocra aren't permitted in the Adventurer's League is the idea that flying is too powerful at lower levels. Having played one, I tend to agree. I remember Raptorians in 3.5 had wings that started out as gliding, then progressed to flying after they leveled up a bit. I was wondering what people thought would be an appropriate level to reach for flight in most people's opinions. Feel free to explain your reasoning, if you like, below the poll.
Biased poll.
Not everyone agrees flight (winged or otherwise) needs a minimum or is too powerful for 1st level.
I've been in several campaigns (including one in 3.5) where people had flying characters from 1st level and it remained perfectly balanced.
It's an easy and very simple thing to balance too. It baffles me that it's not valid for adventure league or when people have problems with it. I personally just don't understand how.
Click ✨ HERE ✨ For My Youtube Videos featuring Guides, Tips & Tricks for using D&D Beyond.
Need help with Homebrew? Check out ✨ this FAQ/Guide thread ✨ by IamSposta.
I don't really have a stake in this, but if you really needed a reference I think a few Sorcerer subclasses get wings at level 14 for one of their features. Or see when some classes are able to get the spell, Fly. So maybe that range? It's just so weird to make a winged creature lack the ability to fly so late into the game, when it might just be a group/setting issue.
I think the AL comes from it is hard to plan for a flying PC when you don't know you have a flying PC. Which with AL being a come and go based system makes it hard for DMs at the table that night to modify encounters. Sure DMs for home games it easy because they have the time to actually plan out the encounters to make sure the flyer doesn't just trounce everything.
But I don 't see it being so OP that a race with natural wings should wait more than maybe a level or two to get it. Because that would mean that the non PC members of that race would all need to be say level 3 in order to fly. Which would make that race the best race in any world due to all of its members being above level 1.
These are very good points. I dont think having one PC who can fly does that much to break the game at level 1, but I do think that allowing new players to fly at level one can lead to some more accidental deaths. I like the idea of the wings growing with the player so level 1 could be no fall damage when the PC has movement, level 3 could be fly for 10 minutes per long rest and level 5 could be flying speed. The problem is that the Aarakocra doesn't get anything else, so you should probably give it something else if you are going to delay its flying until later levels
The better idea is to just disallow aarakocra because they're a poorly designed race and Wizards should feel bad for allowing them. Nrrgh.
Nevertheless. If the objective is 'when is it fair for a PC to have unlimited flight?', the Descent into Avernus season of AL said "level 5". That's when a tiefling or aasimar could trade their other racial abilities in to become the 'Winged' variant of their race. Given the existence of Winged Boots, an Uncommon magical item that may as well be "unlimited flight" for how often its limitations are actually meaningful, level 5 feels like it checks out. Of course, Winged Boots are ridiculous overpowered for an Uncommon item, but the fact remains that flight is in the hands of a given party by fifth level if they have an arcane spellcaster. And unless everybody in the party can fly, it's not really a problem. Which is why the AL ban happened - supposedly individual flying characters is fine, but entire parties of fliers who cheese the modules for Speed Leveling nonsense is why AL banned flight.
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I posted this poll in 5 other places, and got essentially the same results. I kind of thought it was a non-issue or minor-issue, and I'm glad to see that a lot of people agree.
I guess I'm just too new to D&D to see this as game breaking or a poorly designed race. One of my PCs was considering Aarokocra for their race and I didn't see how much that would shatter a home game where I can just add ranged/flying to encounters balancing it out. I can definitely see in premade adventures how this would break the game and need some revamping.
I just can't see baring a race with distinct flight at first level because again than all NPCs would also not be able to fly, meaning that for example Aarokocra are either super high leveled as a race or completely do not follow what the book says about their nature.
There is always some difficulty getting a concept to work well in the rules. Logically a bird race would probably be able to fly before they are even fully adult, but unless they account for that in the lore they won't inherently work as intended. If you look closely you'll see that's vaguely analogous to every race. Exactly how important that is is a matter of opinion.
I agree that if you are running a typical game you just tailor encounters to your group.
if you didn't see any problem with flying, then you ave players who never abused it... i did, every single group where there was a flying character, i was having all the problems in the world to keep it on the ground. he was flying even in dungeons never hitting ground. 10 feet height corridor, no problem... i fly above everyone, boom no more covers. no path, no problem, i fly above them cause 10 foot high ceilings.. yes i take attacks of opportunities but oh well. that is for inside... outside it becomes literally impossible to ever hit them. outside, ok... i take my bow, flight 50 feet above, shoot the bulette who can never reach me. oh right my bow can hit things 120 feet away, why not just fly 120 feet away and 50 feet high and be done with it.
the problem is that at lower levels there is next to nothing that can fly and do enough speed to follow an aarakocra at 50 feet speed.
thus from level 1 to 5.. that aarakocra is just invincible unless you always fight in small dungeons. or start trying to involve the wing span which should be bigger then 10 feet. but who's really trying to maintain a rule for wing span ? not to mention there is no ruling for wing span thus byt he rules, that aarkocra can just fly everywhere there is at least enough space for the character to be in.
you don't understand why adventurers league bans it ?
simple... flying bypasses every single thing the low level adventures do, thus the aarakocra literally finishes the adventure in less then a few minutes.
thats why... if you think that having to think of aarakocra and having to make adventures with that in mind is a thing... its just better to ban it then it is to start balancing every single adventure with aarakocra in mind.
there is a reason why flight speed on any creature is the equivalent of adding +2 to AC. its because they always keep out of range of anything.
in 3rd edition, why was the wizard so powerfull... basically because of flying. as soon as the wizard was flying, even a tarrasque couldn'T hit him.
but when it comes to 5th edition... the official ruling says that if you are to gve flying to a creature, it should be beyond level 5. because thats when spells can allow you to fly. so level 5 is what you are seeking out.
DM of two gaming groups.
Likes to create stuff.
Check out my homebrew --> Monsters --> Magical Items --> Races --> Subclasses
If you like --> Upvote, If you wanna comment --> Comment
Play by Post Games
--> One Shot Adventure - House of Artwood (DM) (Completed)