Sacred Weapon. As an action, you can imbue one weapon that you are holding with positive energy, using your Channel Divinity. For 1 minute, you add your Charisma modifier to attack rolls made with that weapon (with a minimum bonus of +1). The weapon also emits bright light in a 20-foot radius and dim light 20 feet beyond that. If the weapon is not already magical, it becomes magical for the duration.
So my Paladin (Cha +3) has a +2 Morningstar that he uses, will Sacred Weapon stack with the magical bonus to give me a +5?
I would say yes since the bonuses are different - magical and charisma. If you somehow could add your charisma bonus a second time, then I don't think they would stack.
"In general, bonuses stack, unless they’re from the same spell (see “Combining Magical Effects” in the Player’s Handbook, p. 205). You also can’t benefit from more than one ring of protection, for instance, since you can’t attune to more than one copy of an item at a time."
So, things stack. With the exception of same items (since you can't equip identical items) and spell effects (the same spell doesn't stack, regardless of source).
A question on the topic, would my strength bonus also stack? If my character has +3 from charisma and +1 from strength, with sacred weapon my total bonus would be +4 (from strength and charisma)?
A question on the topic, would my strength bonus also stack? If my character has +3 from charisma and +1 from strength, with sacred weapon my total bonus would be +4 (from strength and charisma)?
Yes. Contrast it with things like the wording for a Monk's Martial Arts attacks, or the Hexblade's Hex Warrior feature, where it says that you use one ability modifier "instead of" the usual one. Also contrast it with the Improved Pact Weapon invocation for Warlocks, where it says your Pact Weapon gets a +1 unless it's already a magic weapon that alread gets a +X to its rolls. As stated above, bonuses(adding a +X to a roll) coming from different sources generally stack, unless they include a condition that says when they don't.
Game Balance Question: Are the calculations below correct when using the Sacred Weapon feature with a character with the following applicable details: 5th level Paladin with a 20 Strength and 20 Charisma wielding a Longsword +1
Math Checking: +5 (STR) +5 (CHA) +3 (Proficiency) +1 (Magic Weapon) = +14 bonus to attack or +5 (STR) +5 (CHA as a Magic Bonus) +3 (Proficiency) +1 (Magic bonus of Sword superseded by Charisma) = +13 bonus to Attack
Either way, this is pretty powerful/overpowering feature, especially at lower levels; that said, this is a bonus related to two ability scores being so high, and very high ability scores that stack always grants huge advantages. If the DM states this is too over powered, what are some methods, or trade-offs or homebrew rule suggestions that can be implemented to help throttle the bonus. Perhaps, limit the Charisma Bonus stacking to be no higher than the proficiency bonus? That way the bonus is throttled down so that it's not fully effective until 13th level.
Game Balance Question: Are the calculations below correct when using the Sacred Weapon feature with a character with the following applicable details: 5th level Paladin with a 20 Strength and 20 Charisma wielding a Longsword +1
Yeah, the thing is a level 5 character doesn't have 20 in any attribute, let alone in two. Using any of the normal methods of attribute generation, a level 5 character just might have 18 in one important attribute and at best 16 in another. More likely it'd still be less than that.
So, at best we are talking about an extra +3 to attack for someone who is already getting +8. That's good but not overwhelming - and it has limited uses and uses the same pool of supply that would power other abilities.
Game Balance Question: Are the calculations below correct when using the Sacred Weapon feature with a character with the following applicable details: 5th level Paladin with a 20 Strength and 20 Charisma wielding a Longsword +1
Either way, this is pretty powerful/overpowering feature, especially at lower levels; that said, this is a bonus related to two ability scores being so high, and very high ability scores that stack always grants huge advantages. If the DM states this is too over powered, what are some methods, or trade-offs or homebrew rule suggestions that can be implemented to help throttle the bonus. Perhaps, limit the Charisma Bonus stacking to be no higher than the proficiency bonus? That way the bonus is throttled down so that it's not fully effective until 13th level.
If you are at level 5 with two maxed ability scores then everything will be overpowered. If you then add features that are meant to be short term boosts they will make you almost Godly.
Game Balance Question: Are the calculations below correct when using the Sacred Weapon feature with a character with the following applicable details: 5th level Paladin with a 20 Strength and 20 Charisma wielding a Longsword +1
Math Checking: +5 (STR) +5 (CHA) +3 (Proficiency) +1 (Magic Weapon) = +14 bonus to attack or +5 (STR) +5 (CHA as a Magic Bonus) +3 (Proficiency) +1 (Magic bonus of Sword superseded by Charisma) = +13 bonus to Attack
Either way, this is pretty powerful/overpowering feature, especially at lower levels; that said, this is a bonus related to two ability scores being so high, and very high ability scores that stack always grants huge advantages. If the DM states this is too over powered, what are some methods, or trade-offs or homebrew rule suggestions that can be implemented to help throttle the bonus. Perhaps, limit the Charisma Bonus stacking to be no higher than the proficiency bonus? That way the bonus is throttled down so that it's not fully effective until 13th level.
The correct answer is +14 since the charisma bonus is different from the magical sword bonus so they are cumulative. Different effects, magical or not, will generally stack unless they specifically say they don't.
As for whether or not a character can have two 20 stats at level 5 - that is up to the DM for the campaign and the method they decided to use for character stat generation. However, even with rolled stats as described in the PHB, 4d6k3, all it requires is rolling an 18 and a 17 and then any +2/+1 race could have 2x 20s by level 5 - so it is quite possible for tables using rolled stats. (Since I have seen folks roll that and better in the same set - luck does happen - I wouldn't be surprised at characters with 2x20s. Note also that 3x20's is even theoretically possible for a mountain dwarf that rolls 3x18. )
David42, you are exactly correct about the ability score generation.
For character generation I used 4d6, drop lowest die, six times and arrange to taste. I rolled very well; with my starting scores being 18, 17, 14, 11, 10, and 9; (I would say this is the highest stats I have ever rolled using this method since I starting playing Advanced Dungeons & Dragons in 1990—everybody gets lucky once in their life). I selected the Half-elf race, which grants a +2 to Charisma and a +1 to two other ability scores. Thus my character's stats are: 20—STR (17 base, +1 Halfelf Bonus, +2 level 4 Paladin ability boost) 14—DEX (14 base) 12—CON (11 base, +1 Halfelf Bonus) 9—INT (9 base) 10—WIS (10 base) 20—CHA (18 base, +2 Halfelf Bonus)
You can even stack Charisma to your attack more than once, so long as there is different abilities causing it. Like a hexblade paladin multiclass using sacred weapon on his hex weapon.
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I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Does Sacred Weapon work if the Paladin also took Monk levels and were to use unarm strike?
In 5e, abilities generally do what they say they do :
From the Devotion paladin: "Sacred Weapon. As an action, you can imbue one weapon that you are holding with positive energy, using your Channel Divinity. "
The ability imbues one weapon. An unarmed strike is not a weapon so Sacred Weapon doesn't apply. Unarmed Strikes include kicks, punches, elbow strikes, knee strikes, head butts ... and strikes with any other part of the body.
However, as another example, a vengeance paladin can use their channel divinity for Vow of Enmity which gives them advantage on all attack rolls. In this case, a paladin/monk could use the Vow of Enmity for their unarmed strikes.
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Sacred Weapon. As an action, you can imbue one weapon that you are holding with positive energy, using your Channel Divinity. For 1 minute, you add your Charisma modifier to attack rolls made with that weapon (with a minimum bonus of +1). The weapon also emits bright light in a 20-foot radius and dim light 20 feet beyond that. If the weapon is not already magical, it becomes magical for the duration.
So my Paladin (Cha +3) has a +2 Morningstar that he uses, will Sacred Weapon stack with the magical bonus to give me a +5?
I would say yes since the bonuses are different - magical and charisma. If you somehow could add your charisma bonus a second time, then I don't think they would stack.
As per the Sage Advice Compendium:
"In general, bonuses stack, unless they’re from the same spell (see “Combining Magical Effects” in the Player’s Handbook, p. 205). You also can’t benefit from more than one ring of protection, for instance, since you can’t attune to more than one copy of an item at a time."
So, things stack. With the exception of same items (since you can't equip identical items) and spell effects (the same spell doesn't stack, regardless of source).
A question on the topic, would my strength bonus also stack? If my character has +3 from charisma and +1 from strength, with sacred weapon my total bonus would be +4 (from strength and charisma)?
Yes. Contrast it with things like the wording for a Monk's Martial Arts attacks, or the Hexblade's Hex Warrior feature, where it says that you use one ability modifier "instead of" the usual one. Also contrast it with the Improved Pact Weapon invocation for Warlocks, where it says your Pact Weapon gets a +1 unless it's already a magic weapon that alread gets a +X to its rolls. As stated above, bonuses(adding a +X to a roll) coming from different sources generally stack, unless they include a condition that says when they don't.
Thanks!
Game Balance Question:
Are the calculations below correct when using the Sacred Weapon feature with a character with the following applicable details: 5th level Paladin with a 20 Strength and 20 Charisma wielding a Longsword +1
Math Checking:
+5 (STR) +5 (CHA) +3 (Proficiency) +1 (Magic Weapon) = +14 bonus to attack
or
+5 (STR) +5 (CHA as a Magic Bonus) +3 (Proficiency)
+1(Magic bonus of Sword superseded by Charisma) = +13 bonus to AttackEither way, this is pretty powerful/overpowering feature, especially at lower levels; that said, this is a bonus related to two ability scores being so high, and very high ability scores that stack always grants huge advantages. If the DM states this is too over powered, what are some methods, or trade-offs or homebrew rule suggestions that can be implemented to help throttle the bonus. Perhaps, limit the Charisma Bonus stacking to be no higher than the proficiency bonus? That way the bonus is throttled down so that it's not fully effective until 13th level.
Yeah, the thing is a level 5 character doesn't have 20 in any attribute, let alone in two. Using any of the normal methods of attribute generation, a level 5 character just might have 18 in one important attribute and at best 16 in another. More likely it'd still be less than that.
So, at best we are talking about an extra +3 to attack for someone who is already getting +8. That's good but not overwhelming - and it has limited uses and uses the same pool of supply that would power other abilities.
If you are at level 5 with two maxed ability scores then everything will be overpowered. If you then add features that are meant to be short term boosts they will make you almost Godly.
The correct answer is +14 since the charisma bonus is different from the magical sword bonus so they are cumulative. Different effects, magical or not, will generally stack unless they specifically say they don't.
As for whether or not a character can have two 20 stats at level 5 - that is up to the DM for the campaign and the method they decided to use for character stat generation. However, even with rolled stats as described in the PHB, 4d6k3, all it requires is rolling an 18 and a 17 and then any +2/+1 race could have 2x 20s by level 5 - so it is quite possible for tables using rolled stats. (Since I have seen folks roll that and better in the same set - luck does happen - I wouldn't be surprised at characters with 2x20s. Note also that 3x20's is even theoretically possible for a mountain dwarf that rolls 3x18. )
David42, you are exactly correct about the ability score generation.
For character generation I used 4d6, drop lowest die, six times and arrange to taste. I rolled very well; with my starting scores being 18, 17, 14, 11, 10, and 9; (I would say this is the highest stats I have ever rolled using this method since I starting playing Advanced Dungeons & Dragons in 1990—everybody gets lucky once in their life). I selected the Half-elf race, which grants a +2 to Charisma and a +1 to two other ability scores.
Thus my character's stats are:
20—STR (17 base, +1 Halfelf Bonus, +2 level 4 Paladin ability boost)
14—DEX (14 base)
12—CON (11 base, +1 Halfelf Bonus)
9—INT (9 base)
10—WIS (10 base)
20—CHA (18 base, +2 Halfelf Bonus)
You can even stack Charisma to your attack more than once, so long as there is different abilities causing it. Like a hexblade paladin multiclass using sacred weapon on his hex weapon.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Does Sacred Weapon work if the Paladin also took Monk levels and were to use unarm strike?
In 5e, abilities generally do what they say they do :
From the Devotion paladin: "Sacred Weapon. As an action, you can imbue one weapon that you are holding with positive energy, using your Channel Divinity. "
The ability imbues one weapon. An unarmed strike is not a weapon so Sacred Weapon doesn't apply. Unarmed Strikes include kicks, punches, elbow strikes, knee strikes, head butts ... and strikes with any other part of the body.
However, as another example, a vengeance paladin can use their channel divinity for Vow of Enmity which gives them advantage on all attack rolls. In this case, a paladin/monk could use the Vow of Enmity for their unarmed strikes.