Hello! I would like to clarify the interpretation of the Assassin's Assassinate feature. Rules as written (RAW) states:
Starting at 3rd level, you are at your deadliest when you get the drop on your enemies. You have advantage on attack rolls against any creature that hasn’t taken a turn in the combat yet. In addition, any hit you score against a creature that is surprised is a critical hit.
The part under question is the underlined portion. Does this mean that the PC has advantage at the start of combat (1st round only), or does this apply for each round of combat?
this means that the assassin only has advantage until such time as the creature they are attacking takes a turn. From that point onwards, for the rest of the combat, this assassin class feature doesn't activate again.
Typically, as you mention, this is 1st turn, however it can also apply when new combatants become part of an ongoing combat.
One last thing, in the surprise round, if I have multiple attacks, do they all crit? I'm running a fighter 8, rouge 3 build, and am considering my options.
The concept of a "surprise round" from previous editions of D&D has gone now with 5e - there's no such thing, it's just the first round of combat and some of the participants may be surprised, based on how combat started.
To answer the question though, yes - using the assassinate subclass feature, all of your attacks against any surprised creature are automatic critical hits.
The concept of a "surprise round" from previous editions of D&D has gone now with 5e - there's no such thing, it's just the first round of combat and some of the participants may be surprised, based on how combat started.
To answer the question though, yes - using the assassinate subclass feature, all of your attacks against any surprised creature are automatic critical hits.
Assuming a rogue gets behind the target and passes a hide check, does this allow the rogue to use the assassinate feature??
Assuming the rogue stands in a copse of trees and bonus action hides, does that enable them to use the assassinate feature?
Assuming the rogue stands at range and uses "body blocking" to gain partial coverage, then successfully hides as a bonus action, does that enable the rogue to use the assassinate feature?
Assuming a rogue gets behind the target and passes a hide check, does this allow the rogue to use the assassinate feature??
Assuming the rogue stands in a copse of trees and bonus action hides, does that enable them to use the assassinate feature?
Assuming the rogue stands at range and uses "body blocking" to gain partial coverage, then successfully hides as a bonus action, does that enable the rogue to use the assassinate feature?
Or is this literally "first turn only"?
It's the first round of combat the opponent is in that matters. If no initiative has been rolled specifically for combat, nothing before that moment matters.
Though if your target has no idea that you are even there, and you open combat by shooting them with your bow, most DMs would probably allow you to use Assassinate regardless of how the dice fall for Initiative. Because even if your target goes first in initiative order, they still have no idea you are there(this has been discussed on another forum, so we don't need to hash it out here).
If your DM does not allow this, it makes Assassin Rogue an even weaker subclass than it already is.
But that isn't one of the requirements of the feature though.
I think it is a pretty poorly designed subclass as the benefits of the Assassinate feature are very situational. And while they are strong they are nowhere near as strong as I think the designers thought they where when they wrote the PHB (which I think is the reason for those strict requirements). I do think that the subclass can play well but you would need a table that is OK with players going off solo (or in very small/specialized groups).
Assuming a rogue gets behind the target and passes a hide check, does this allow the rogue to use the assassinate feature??
Assuming the rogue stands in a copse of trees and bonus action hides, does that enable them to use the assassinate feature?
Assuming the rogue stands at range and uses "body blocking" to gain partial coverage, then successfully hides as a bonus action, does that enable the rogue to use the assassinate feature?
Or is this literally "first turn only"?
It is literally first turn only since it is only against a target that is surprised AND only against a target that has not yet taken a turn in the initiative order. (The first turn only is a bit redundant since a creature can't be surprised any other time than in the first round).
P.S. NO attacks should ever be made out of initiative ... there are no rules in 5e covering attacks when combat isn't occurring and combat occurs in initiative order. A DM that uses attacks outside of initiative is creating their own house rules and it is then up to them how they want to adjudicate the interaction of character features with their house rules. So, whether the assassinate feature would work in such a circumstance is entirely up to the DM.
"Starting at 3rd level, you are at your deadliest when you get the drop on your enemies. You have advantage on attack rolls against any creature that hasn’t taken a turn in the combat yet. In addition, any hit you score against a creature that is surprised is a critical hit."
"If you’re surprised, you can’t move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can’t take a reaction until that turn ends."
A creature is no longer surprised after their first turn ends.
P.P.S. Auto crit combined with auto sneak attack due to attacking with advantage is pretty impressive if a character can manage to surprise a target. Given that rogues often have expertise in stealth then there is a very good chance they won't be noticed when combat starts. However, since a creature isn't surprised if they notice ANY attacker, the assassin is usually forced to be in front of the party and initiate combat on their own in order to surprise the opposing creature(s) and thus be able to auto-crit. The ability is very situational which is what balances an otherwise quite powerful ability.
Hello! I would like to clarify the interpretation of the Assassin's Assassinate feature. Rules as written (RAW) states:
Starting at 3rd level, you are at your deadliest when you get the drop on your enemies. You have advantage on attack rolls against any creature that hasn’t taken a turn in the combat yet. In addition, any hit you score against a creature that is surprised is a critical hit.
The part under question is the underlined portion. Does this mean that the PC has advantage at the start of combat (1st round only), or does this apply for each round of combat?
I have found if the underlined section is reset each new round, minus the surprise crit, it makes the feature feel more like a medieval version of a hitman.
Bring in the sneak damage to add, and player has greater combat options and strats.
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Hello! I would like to clarify the interpretation of the Assassin's Assassinate feature. Rules as written (RAW) states:
Starting at 3rd level, you are at your deadliest when you get the drop on your enemies. You have advantage on attack rolls against any creature that hasn’t taken a turn in the combat yet. In addition, any hit you score against a creature that is surprised is a critical hit.
The part under question is the underlined portion. Does this mean that the PC has advantage at the start of combat (1st round only), or does this apply for each round of combat?
Hi there Assaulter6,
this means that the assassin only has advantage until such time as the creature they are attacking takes a turn. From that point onwards, for the rest of the combat, this assassin class feature doesn't activate again.
Typically, as you mention, this is 1st turn, however it can also apply when new combatants become part of an ongoing combat.
Pun-loving nerd | Faith Elisabeth Lilley | She/Her/Hers | Profile art by Becca Golins
If you need help with homebrew, please post on the homebrew forums, where multiple staff and moderators can read your post and help you!
"We got this, no problem! I'll take the twenty on the left - you guys handle the one on the right!"🔊
First round only
Should also be mentioned that assassinate only works if you've rolled a higher initiative than your target - whether they're surprised or not.
Thank you all for the inputs. That clears things up.
One last thing, in the surprise round, if I have multiple attacks, do they all crit? I'm running a fighter 8, rouge 3 build, and am considering my options.
The concept of a "surprise round" from previous editions of D&D has gone now with 5e - there's no such thing, it's just the first round of combat and some of the participants may be surprised, based on how combat started.
To answer the question though, yes - using the assassinate subclass feature, all of your attacks against any surprised creature are automatic critical hits.
Pun-loving nerd | Faith Elisabeth Lilley | She/Her/Hers | Profile art by Becca Golins
If you need help with homebrew, please post on the homebrew forums, where multiple staff and moderators can read your post and help you!
"We got this, no problem! I'll take the twenty on the left - you guys handle the one on the right!"🔊
Thank you, this makes my choice an easy one! =)
Assuming a rogue gets behind the target and passes a hide check, does this allow the rogue to use the assassinate feature??
Assuming the rogue stands in a copse of trees and bonus action hides, does that enable them to use the assassinate feature?
Assuming the rogue stands at range and uses "body blocking" to gain partial coverage, then successfully hides as a bonus action, does that enable the rogue to use the assassinate feature?
Or is this literally "first turn only"?
It's the first round of combat the opponent is in that matters. If no initiative has been rolled specifically for combat, nothing before that moment matters.
But that isn't one of the requirements of the feature though.
I think it is a pretty poorly designed subclass as the benefits of the Assassinate feature are very situational. And while they are strong they are nowhere near as strong as I think the designers thought they where when they wrote the PHB (which I think is the reason for those strict requirements). I do think that the subclass can play well but you would need a table that is OK with players going off solo (or in very small/specialized groups).
It is literally first turn only since it is only against a target that is surprised AND only against a target that has not yet taken a turn in the initiative order. (The first turn only is a bit redundant since a creature can't be surprised any other time than in the first round).
P.S. NO attacks should ever be made out of initiative ... there are no rules in 5e covering attacks when combat isn't occurring and combat occurs in initiative order. A DM that uses attacks outside of initiative is creating their own house rules and it is then up to them how they want to adjudicate the interaction of character features with their house rules. So, whether the assassinate feature would work in such a circumstance is entirely up to the DM.
"Starting at 3rd level, you are at your deadliest when you get the drop on your enemies. You have advantage on attack rolls against any creature that hasn’t taken a turn in the combat yet. In addition, any hit you score against a creature that is surprised is a critical hit."
"If you’re surprised, you can’t move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can’t take a reaction until that turn ends."
A creature is no longer surprised after their first turn ends.
P.P.S. Auto crit combined with auto sneak attack due to attacking with advantage is pretty impressive if a character can manage to surprise a target. Given that rogues often have expertise in stealth then there is a very good chance they won't be noticed when combat starts. However, since a creature isn't surprised if they notice ANY attacker, the assassin is usually forced to be in front of the party and initiate combat on their own in order to surprise the opposing creature(s) and thus be able to auto-crit. The ability is very situational which is what balances an otherwise quite powerful ability.
I have found if the underlined section is reset each new round, minus the surprise crit, it makes the feature feel more like a medieval version of a hitman.
Bring in the sneak damage to add, and player has greater combat options and strats.