Regarding Rust Monsters and other things (Black Pudding, etc) that can damage non-magical stuff, would they damage Adamantine weapons as they are not listed as magical?
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
One is a magic item. The other is an item made out of nonmagical ore which (unfortunately) shares the same name. I don't believe that simply making armor out of adamantine material automatically makes it magic or else the same situation would be true for weapons or other objects made of adamantine. That's just my take and I'm certainly no authority. The magic item should really have a better name. It would be like if there was a magic item called "Gold Ring," which would not mean that all rings made of gold are magic.
My basis for saying so are this comment and particularly this comment. That second link specifically deals with adamantine weapons and rust monsters, which ties back to your original question. I went off on a tangent, as I tend to do.
One is a magic item. The other is an item made out of nonmagical ore which (unfortunately) shares the same name.
5E does not differentiate. I'm guessing that it's intended that adamantine does not corrode therefore is immune to rust monsters. I would rule it that way.
Correct me if I'm wrong, there is magic adamantite armor, which is magic so immune to rust monsters. There is non-magical adamantine armor which IS subject to rust monster feeding; and there is NO adamantine weapon that is immune to rust monster antennae?
So what kind of adamantine weapon is needed to defeat monsters that have the Damage Immunity "Bludgeoning, Piercing, and Slashing from Nonmagical Attacks that aren't Adamantine"
So what kind of adamantine weapon is needed to defeat monsters that have the Damage Immunity "Bludgeoning, Piercing, and Slashing from Nonmagical Attacks that aren't Adamantine"
This kind of damage reduction is overcome by a weapon that is either "magical" or "non-magical, but made of adamantine".
The creature resists damage that is made by weapons that are both non-magical and non-adamantine.
Also keep in mind that adamantine is a material (a metal, at that). It can be used to make anything usually made of metal, including things that can be turned into magic items. There are no printed examples of such items, but no one says that you can't have a longsword +1 that is made of adamantine (and thus has the metal's properties as well).
"the rust monster corrodes non magical ferrous metals." thus it only corrodes it if you rule that adamant is a ferrous substance (and if you did you'd be wrong) . i rule it's not personally. as it's not an alloy of iron thus by the definition of ferrous in the engilsh language it is non ferrous. this only applies to weapons or armour which are constructed completely from adamantine, a sword with an iron spine but an adamantine cutting edge is going to end up being an embarrasing mess quite quickly. similarly mithral armour is unaffected by rust monsters as mithril is not a ferrous metal, i.e. it's not iron. as far as other forms of damage is concerned i give both metals a pretty hefty damage resistance against damage by fire/acid and suchlike this then allows for interesting mining concepts such as herding your tamed rust monster down the seam and picking up the nuggets of adamant ore that it leaves behind
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All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled
The ferrous metal detail is a real mess. While the description of the Rust Monster Antennae action mentions ferrous metal, the Rust Metal feature makes no such requirement. It simply says "Any nonmagical weapon made of metal that hits the rust monster corrodes." so as long as you consider adamantine to be metal, it applies. I suppose if you wanted to be pedantic (and let's be honest, that's what this forum is all about), you could make the bizarre argument that weapons made of any nonmagical metal are affected, whereas the rust monster's antennae only affect ferrous metal, unless it's a weapon.
WTF?
The rust monster closes in and lashes out with its antenna toward the paladin's adamantine longsword. Just when all hope seems gone and the paladin's family heirloom will be lost to the ages, the paladin reaches out with his adamantine-clad gauntlet and grabs the antenna. "Not today, foul beast! This gauntlet is no weapon. It is ARMOR!" But, alas, little did the paladin know that he actually did 1 hit point of damage with his gauntlet, thereby turning it into a weapon and it corrodes away to dust. "Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo!" his agonized cries echo down the halls of the dungeon.
my other question would be aren't adamantine and mithril considered as magical metals in the first place. i seem to remember something along those lines from the past but i may be getting mixed up with rolemaster on that one
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All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled
As for admantine, the rules never explicitly say one way or the other. I feel it is strongly implied that adamantine is not inherently magical. Let's look at the Gargoyle and its damage resistance. "Damage ResistancesBludgeoning, Piercing, and Slashing from Nonmagical Attacks that aren't Adamantine." That makes me think that the gargoyle has resistance to attacks that are not magical and also attacks that are not adamantine. If adamantine was magical, they could have just said "Damage ResistancesBludgeoning, Piercing, and Slashing from Nonmagical Attacks" but instead, they treat it like silvered weapons against a Wight. If we can agree that all silvered weapons are not inherently magical, then I think it's fair to apply to same standard to adamantine weapons.
Mithral is also never explicitly defined as a magical material, but the case for it being inherently magical is a lot stronger in my opinion. Let's look at the description for Mithral Armor. "If the armor normally imposes disadvantage on Dexterity (Stealth) checks or has a Strength requirement, the mithral version of the armor doesn't." That sounds to me like they are saying that any armor, simply by virtue of being made of mithral, becomes Mithral Armor which is an uncommon magic item. Compare this with the far more specific description of Adamantine Armor which says, "This suit of armor is reinforced with adamantine, one of the hardest substances in existence. While you're wearing it, any critical hit against you becomes a normal hit." To me, that reads like they are talking about a specific suit of magic armor as opposed to anything made of the material adamantine being magical.
This post is all speculation and my attempt to apply logic to things that are not specifically laid out. What do you think?
i have it the other way personally, always have, so if you make a suit from the metal it has the properties as described in the magical items description. but that is simply a function of the materials inherent special properties. to be considered magical armour, an armour has to have a magical addition to the armour class of the person wearing it. Thus it can turn the person invisible give them shapeshift abilities make them fly, float on water, or move between the planes, but if it doesn't give them at least +1 to AC through magical enchantment it's not magical armour.
same with weapons, if it doesn't give them at least a magic derived +1 to hit and damage, then it's not a magical weapon. irrespective of what other magical effects it has the other problem with mithril is it might just be titanium :) thus it doesn't require the strength requirement because it's just a lighter metal so it's not as heavy and cumbersome as iron or steel. i do now suspect it was the rolemaster descriptions that specifically stated they were magical.
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All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled
Given that the magic item Adamantine Armor has an additional effect beyond just being a suit of armor, I would say that there is a difference between Adamantine Armor and armor which just so happens to have adamantine in it, although why you would pay that much money for the latter I have no idea. As for weapons, yeah, given that rock creatures can have their resistance bypassed by magic weapons or adamantine weapons suggest that there is a distinction.
Given that the magic item Adamantine Armor has an additional effect beyond just being a suit of armor, I would say that there is a difference between Adamantine Armor and armor which just so happens to have adamantine in it,
the DMG description of adamantine armour states categorically otherwise though, that states categorically that the armour is reinforced with adamantine one of the hardest substances known, and as a result it negates crits.
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All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled
same with weapons, if it doesn't give them at least a magic derived +1 to hit and damage, then it's not a magical weapon. irrespective of what other magical effects it has
same with weapons, if it doesn't give them at least a magic derived +1 to hit and damage, then it's not a magical weapon. irrespective of what other magical effects it has
Regarding Rust Monsters and other things (Black Pudding, etc) that can damage non-magical stuff, would they damage Adamantine weapons as they are not listed as magical?
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
I believe that a Rust Monster would damage adamantine weapons or armor.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Adamantine armor is listed as uncommon magic item so it is immune to the rust monster rust.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Oh my bad. I meant weapons and armor made of the material adamantine, not Adamantine Armor.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
What's the difference?
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
One is a magic item. The other is an item made out of nonmagical ore which (unfortunately) shares the same name. I don't believe that simply making armor out of adamantine material automatically makes it magic or else the same situation would be true for weapons or other objects made of adamantine. That's just my take and I'm certainly no authority. The magic item should really have a better name. It would be like if there was a magic item called "Gold Ring," which would not mean that all rings made of gold are magic.
My basis for saying so are this comment and particularly this comment. That second link specifically deals with adamantine weapons and rust monsters, which ties back to your original question. I went off on a tangent, as I tend to do.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
5E does not differentiate. I'm guessing that it's intended that adamantine does not corrode therefore is immune to rust monsters. I would rule it that way.
Subclass: Dwarven Defender - Dragonborn Paragon
Feats: Artificer Apprentice
Monsters: Sheep - Spellbreaker Warforged Titan
Magic Items: Whipier - Ring of Secret Storage - Collar of the Guardian
Monster template: Skeletal Creature
Correct me if I'm wrong, there is magic adamantite armor, which is magic so immune to rust monsters. There is non-magical adamantine armor which IS subject to rust monster feeding; and there is NO adamantine weapon that is immune to rust monster antennae?
So what kind of adamantine weapon is needed to defeat monsters that have the Damage Immunity "Bludgeoning, Piercing, and Slashing from Nonmagical Attacks that aren't Adamantine"
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Sounds right to me.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
This kind of damage reduction is overcome by a weapon that is either "magical" or "non-magical, but made of adamantine".
The creature resists damage that is made by weapons that are both non-magical and non-adamantine.
Also keep in mind that adamantine is a material (a metal, at that). It can be used to make anything usually made of metal, including things that can be turned into magic items. There are no printed examples of such items, but no one says that you can't have a longsword +1 that is made of adamantine (and thus has the metal's properties as well).
"the rust monster corrodes non magical ferrous metals."
thus it only corrodes it if you rule that adamant is a ferrous substance (and if you did you'd be wrong) . i rule it's not personally. as it's not an alloy of iron thus by the definition of ferrous in the engilsh language it is non ferrous.
this only applies to weapons or armour which are constructed completely from adamantine, a sword with an iron spine but an adamantine cutting edge is going to end up being an embarrasing mess quite quickly.
similarly mithral armour is unaffected by rust monsters as mithril is not a ferrous metal, i.e. it's not iron.
as far as other forms of damage is concerned i give both metals a pretty hefty damage resistance against damage by fire/acid and suchlike
this then allows for interesting mining concepts such as herding your tamed rust monster down the seam and picking up the nuggets of adamant ore that it leaves behind
All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled
The ferrous metal detail is a real mess. While the description of the Rust Monster Antennae action mentions ferrous metal, the Rust Metal feature makes no such requirement. It simply says "Any nonmagical weapon made of metal that hits the rust monster corrodes." so as long as you consider adamantine to be metal, it applies. I suppose if you wanted to be pedantic (and let's be honest, that's what this forum is all about), you could make the bizarre argument that weapons made of any nonmagical metal are affected, whereas the rust monster's antennae only affect ferrous metal, unless it's a weapon.
WTF?
The rust monster closes in and lashes out with its antenna toward the paladin's adamantine longsword. Just when all hope seems gone and the paladin's family heirloom will be lost to the ages, the paladin reaches out with his adamantine-clad gauntlet and grabs the antenna. "Not today, foul beast! This gauntlet is no weapon. It is ARMOR!" But, alas, little did the paladin know that he actually did 1 hit point of damage with his gauntlet, thereby turning it into a weapon and it corrodes away to dust. "Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo!" his agonized cries echo down the halls of the dungeon.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
my other question would be aren't adamantine and mithril considered as magical metals in the first place. i seem to remember something along those lines from the past but i may be getting mixed up with rolemaster on that one
All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled
Oh boy. You just had to go and mention mithral...
As for admantine, the rules never explicitly say one way or the other. I feel it is strongly implied that adamantine is not inherently magical. Let's look at the Gargoyle and its damage resistance. "Damage Resistances Bludgeoning, Piercing, and Slashing from Nonmagical Attacks that aren't Adamantine." That makes me think that the gargoyle has resistance to attacks that are not magical and also attacks that are not adamantine. If adamantine was magical, they could have just said "Damage Resistances Bludgeoning, Piercing, and Slashing from Nonmagical Attacks" but instead, they treat it like silvered weapons against a Wight. If we can agree that all silvered weapons are not inherently magical, then I think it's fair to apply to same standard to adamantine weapons.
Mithral is also never explicitly defined as a magical material, but the case for it being inherently magical is a lot stronger in my opinion. Let's look at the description for Mithral Armor. "If the armor normally imposes disadvantage on Dexterity (Stealth) checks or has a Strength requirement, the mithral version of the armor doesn't." That sounds to me like they are saying that any armor, simply by virtue of being made of mithral, becomes Mithral Armor which is an uncommon magic item. Compare this with the far more specific description of Adamantine Armor which says, "This suit of armor is reinforced with adamantine, one of the hardest substances in existence. While you're wearing it, any critical hit against you becomes a normal hit." To me, that reads like they are talking about a specific suit of magic armor as opposed to anything made of the material adamantine being magical.
This post is all speculation and my attempt to apply logic to things that are not specifically laid out. What do you think?
"Not all those who wander are lost"
i have it the other way personally, always have, so if you make a suit from the metal it has the properties as described in the magical items description. but that is simply a function of the materials inherent special properties.
to be considered magical armour, an armour has to have a magical addition to the armour class of the person wearing it. Thus it can turn the person invisible give them shapeshift abilities make them fly, float on water, or move between the planes, but if it doesn't give them at least +1 to AC through magical enchantment it's not magical armour.
same with weapons, if it doesn't give them at least a magic derived +1 to hit and damage, then it's not a magical weapon. irrespective of what other magical effects it has
the other problem with mithril is it might just be titanium :) thus it doesn't require the strength requirement because it's just a lighter metal so it's not as heavy and cumbersome as iron or steel.
i do now suspect it was the rolemaster descriptions that specifically stated they were magical.
All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled
Given that the magic item Adamantine Armor has an additional effect beyond just being a suit of armor, I would say that there is a difference between Adamantine Armor and armor which just so happens to have adamantine in it, although why you would pay that much money for the latter I have no idea. As for weapons, yeah, given that rock creatures can have their resistance bypassed by magic weapons or adamantine weapons suggest that there is a distinction.
Sorry about your weapons.
This is good stuff :)
"Not all those who wander are lost"
the DMG description of adamantine armour states categorically otherwise though, that states categorically that the armour is reinforced with adamantine one of the hardest substances known, and as a result it negates crits.
All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled
FWIW JC rules the other way
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2017/01/13/can-i-use-a-staff-of-frost-as-quarterstaff/
aye but my personal ruling has served me fine since 1983 i'm unlikely to be changing it ;)
All plans turn into, run into the room waving a sword and see what happens from there, once the first die gets rolled