No, he has not, you have not been listening to what I have written which I have highlighted above. You should also be listening to the podcast on stealth by JC, which explains it clearly. The passive perception is the minimum that you get on an active perception, because it represents your general awareness and yo benefit from it before you even start being active, so if you would have detected it using the passive, you have, even before making the active check, which can only improve on your passive.
Absolutely not. A Passive Skill is absolutely not the guaranteed minimum for an Active Check under RAW. Using passive as a guaranteed minimum makes so there is no possibility for failure the vast majority of the time. Which is not only pointless, and boring, but not consistent with RAW whatsoever.
Agree 100%, and I’m going to hazard a guess that, since Crawford is speaking in the context of stealth, what he actually means is what the rules on hiding describe: in order to become successfully hidden, one must first overcome the passive perception of potential observers. In this sense, it’s a “floor” for active perception: if an observer must make an active check, it’s only because the hider has already beaten their passive score.
I highly doubt Crawford is at all speaking about passive skill scores in general, or indeed even about passive perception in general. Stealth rules, threadbare as they are, do actually have an explicit use for passive perception, and taking Crawford’s assertions out of this specific context is inappropriate.
Agree 100%, and I’m going to hazard a guess that, since Crawford is speaking in the context of stealth, what he actually means is what the rules on hiding describe: in order to become successfully hidden, one must first overcome the passive perception of potential observers. In this sense, it’s a “floor” for active perception: if an observer must make an active check, it’s only because the hider has already beaten their passive score.
I highly doubt Crawford is at all speaking about passive skill scores in general, or indeed even about passive perception in general. Stealth rules, threadbare as they are, do actually have an explicit use for passive perception, and taking Crawford’s assertions out of this specific context is inappropriate.
I was obviously speaking in the context of perception and stealth, wasn't it obvious ?
But, as discussed before, I also use it (and there is no RAW against it either) for insight vs. deception for example. Or for investigation vs. the DC of noticing thing in a cluttered room.
But I very very rarely use passives for anything else anyway.
Nothing you’ve said has suggested you’ve been speaking only in the context of creatures attempting to hide, so no, it wasn’t obvious. Even in your immediately prior post, you say someone will get their passive perception “absolutely all the time,” so I must assume you’re being sarcastic.
Ok well I'm certainly open to more discussion but I don't think anyone has come close to furnishing a working version of this mechanic and it seems most people don't agree on how its implemented.
It seems most tables either:
1. Don't use it. 2. DM applies it here and there and mostly obscured from players so rarely stumble on the degenerate outcomes. 3. That's it? Does anyone use passive checks in a regular, consistent manner?
But then why even have a mechanic? Just say "DM can do whatever they want" which is already the case, and then suggest "if you don't want them to know there is a check, just add 10 or whatever you want". But if a rule is in a book, I expect I should be able to apply it regularly, consistently, and for it to work sensibly with the other mechanics. It seems to me passive checks don't satisfy this.
I don't consider passive scores in general a floor, but in the specific case of stealth passive perception is functionally a floor, because the way it works is:
Attempt stealth. Your target is the target's passive perception. If you fail, you are spotted.
Other character attempts active perception. Target is the first character's stealth check. If you succeed, you spot them.
If you fail at the first roll, you are never stealthy. If you succeed at the first roll but the watcher succeeds at the second roll, the watcher loses track of you for a moment but finds you again on their next turn. Basically, passive perception might as well be a floor on any roll that passive perception even applies to, because if the DC is less than or equal to your passive perception, you don't even need to roll -- you spot it before you attempt the roll.
Agree 100%, and I’m going to hazard a guess that, since Crawford is speaking in the context of stealth, what he actually means is what the rules on hiding describe: in order to become successfully hidden, one must first overcome the passive perception of potential observers. In this sense, it’s a “floor” for active perception: if an observer must make an active check, it’s only because the hider has already beaten their passive score.
I highly doubt Crawford is at all speaking about passive skill scores in general, or indeed even about passive perception in general. Stealth rules, threadbare as they are, do actually have an explicit use for passive perception, and taking Crawford’s assertions out of this specific context is inappropriate.
Nothing you’ve said has suggested you’ve been speaking only in the context of creatures attempting to hide, so no, it wasn’t obvious. Even in your immediately prior post, you say someone will get their passive perception “absolutely all the time,” so I must assume you’re being sarcastic.
You are absolutely entitled to your own opinion.
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I don't consider passive scores in general a floor, but in the specific case of stealth passive perception is functionally a floor, because the way it works is:
If you fail at the first roll, you are never stealthy. If you succeed at the first roll but the watcher succeeds at the second roll, the watcher loses track of you for a moment but finds you again on their next turn. Basically, passive perception might as well be a floor on any roll that passive perception even applies to, because if the DC is less than or equal to your passive perception, you don't even need to roll -- you spot it before you attempt the roll.