If a 20th level artificer is attuned to five good luck stones, is it correct to assume that he would have a + 10 to all saving throws, which would include death saving throws?
If that is the case, when he has to roll death saving throws he would always succeed. Unless he rolled a nat 1 and did not take any damage.
Massive Damage and Instant Death Effects (catoblepas is one example) as well as power word kill bypass death saves. a Nat 1 still causes 2 failures, and it is certainly possible to roll two in a row, plus taking damage is an automatic failure, so Artificers can still very much die at any level
This isn't even getting into the fact that the DMG doesn't allow you to attune to more than one of the same object, so you would need 5 distinct objects that all grant the +1 for this to work, not 5 luckstones.
An item can be attuned to only one creature at a time, and a creature can be attuned to no more than three magic items at a time. Any attempt to attune to a fourth item fails; the creature must end its attunement to an item first. Additionally, a creature can't attune to more than one copy of an item. For example, a creature can't attune to more than one ring of protection at a time.
Now what you can do is attune to any of these items....
A Ring of Protection (+1 to all saves)
A Cloak of Protection (+1 to all saves)
A Luckstone (+1 to all saves)
A Robe of Stars (+1 to all saves)
A Staff of Power (+2 to all saves)
A Blackstaff (+2 to all saves)
Luck Blade (+1 to all saves)
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times to gain proficiency in all saving throws and take the best of these items to gain a max total of +20 to all your saving throws (+6 for proficiency bonus, +6 for being attuned to 6 items, and +8 for the total bonuses to saving throws from the best items), not including your ability score modifiers for each stat.
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
Ah, I thought it could be taken more than once so I stand corrected.
So then it would be +20 for three saves (Constitution and Intelligence and the one chosen by the Resilient feat) and a +14 for the other three saves, excluding stat mods.
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"Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
You also automatically fail a death save if you're hit by an attack while you're down, and you automatically fail 2 if it crits, and it automatically crits if you're incapacitated (which you are while you're unconscious).
So if you get hit while you're down at all, that's 2 automatic failed death saves. If you're attacked by a creature with multiattack while you're down, then you are straight dead, no saves.
You also automatically fail a death save if you're hit by an attack while you're down, and you automatically fail 2 if it crits, and it automatically crits if you're incapacitated (which you are while you're unconscious).
So if you get hit while you're down at all, that's 2 automatic failed death saves. If you're attacked by a creature with multiattack while you're down, then you are straight dead, no saves.
So yes, artificers at lv 20 can still die.
Technically the auto crit applies because you are unconcious if you are incapacitated but not unconcious, e.g. stunned you do not get the auto crit.
THE auto crit also only applies if the attacker is within 5 ft of you and you still have to hit. A creature with multi attack can kill you outright while you are down but if they hit using a reach or ranged attack they only cause a single death save fail and if their attack misses you do not take any.
That raises another question why is an unconcious unarmoured monk (Say AC20) so much harder to hit that an unconcious wizard (say AC12)?
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
Really? Where does it say that? The Character creator right here in DnDBeyond treats each kind of resilience as a different feat and thus allows what RoughCoronet0 proposes. It does the same with the magic initiate feat. I don't think there is just one Resilience Feat. I think there are six.
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
Really? Where does it say that? The Character creator right here in DnDBeyond treats each kind of resilience as a different feat and thus allows what RoughCoronet0 proposes. It does the same with the magic initiate feat. I don't think there is just one Resilience Feat. I think there are six.
There is just one Resilient feat and it says:
Choose one ability score. You gain the following benefits:
Increase the chosen ability score by 1, to a maximum of 20.
You gain proficiency in saving throws using the chosen ability.
DNDBeyond separates it out when you can choose them because of technical limitations. Note that it doesn't say you can take it more than once - while Elemental Adept does (which is also only one feat - and is separated out for the same reasons). You can see they're only one feat by looking at the feats list. Both of them are listed only once - and the same is true for Magic Initiate. https://www.dndbeyond.com/feats
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
Really? Where does it say that? The Character creator right here in DnDBeyond treats each kind of resilience as a different feat and thus allows what RoughCoronet0 proposes. It does the same with the magic initiate feat. I don't think there is just one Resilience Feat. I think there are six.
You can take each feat only once, unless the feat’s description says otherwise.
Just because DDB lets you do it, doesn't mean the rules let you.
The RAW wording of each feat can also be found in the book. The character sheet breaks feats with options into separate feats because they were too lazy to code it with option boxes with modifiers.
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
Really? Where does it say that? The Character creator right here in DnDBeyond treats each kind of resilience as a different feat and thus allows what RoughCoronet0 proposes. It does the same with the magic initiate feat. I don't think there is just one Resilience Feat. I think there are six.
There is just one Resilient feat and it says:
Choose one ability score. You gain the following benefits:
Increase the chosen ability score by 1, to a maximum of 20.
You gain proficiency in saving throws using the chosen ability.
DNDBeyond separates it out because of technical limitations. Note that it doesn't say you can take it more than once - while Elemental Adept does (which is also only one feat - and is separated out). You can see they're only one feat by looking at the feats list. Both of them are listed only once. https://www.dndbeyond.com/feats
No. It is not because of technical limitations. You are wrong. There are plenty of feats, like Athlete, that let you chose a stat to affect. And those can be taken only once. If they had meant to limit Resilience they could have set it up like they did with Athlete. The fact that they didn't make a specific observation like they did with Elemental Adept is an oversight. It's not like there is plenty of that in D&D. The fact that Resilience and Magic Initiate are set up the same as Elemental Adept is not due to any technical limitation.
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
Really? Where does it say that? The Character creator right here in DnDBeyond treats each kind of resilience as a different feat and thus allows what RoughCoronet0 proposes. It does the same with the magic initiate feat. I don't think there is just one Resilience Feat. I think there are six.
There is just one Resilient feat and it says:
Choose one ability score. You gain the following benefits:
Increase the chosen ability score by 1, to a maximum of 20.
You gain proficiency in saving throws using the chosen ability.
DNDBeyond separates it out because of technical limitations. Note that it doesn't say you can take it more than once - while Elemental Adept does (which is also only one feat - and is separated out). You can see they're only one feat by looking at the feats list. Both of them are listed only once. https://www.dndbeyond.com/feats
No. It is not because of technical limitations. You are wrong. There are plenty of feats, like Athlete, that let you chose a stat to affect. And those can be taken only once. If they had meant to limit Resilience they could have set it up like they did with Athlete. The fact that they didn't make a specific observation like they did with Elemental Adept is an oversight. It's not like there is plenty of that in D&D. The fact that Resilience and Magic Initiate are set up the same as Elemental Adept is not due to any technical limitation.
They can have a dropdown for the stat it gives you - but the backend won't do the same for the saving throw proficiency. They could have done - but they didn't. Try it with the homebrew tools (the tools the devs use the make the stuff we use) - it's not possible. They had to separate them out.
And as DxJxC said - just because DNDBeyond lets you do something - doesn't make it RAW.
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
Really? Where does it say that? The Character creator right here in DnDBeyond treats each kind of resilience as a different feat and thus allows what RoughCoronet0 proposes. It does the same with the magic initiate feat. I don't think there is just one Resilience Feat. I think there are six.
There is just one Resilient feat and it says:
Choose one ability score. You gain the following benefits:
Increase the chosen ability score by 1, to a maximum of 20.
You gain proficiency in saving throws using the chosen ability.
DNDBeyond separates it out because of technical limitations. Note that it doesn't say you can take it more than once - while Elemental Adept does (which is also only one feat - and is separated out). You can see they're only one feat by looking at the feats list. Both of them are listed only once. https://www.dndbeyond.com/feats
No. It is not because of technical limitations. You are wrong. There are plenty of feats, like Athlete, that let you chose a stat to affect. And those can be taken only once. If they had meant to limit Resilience they could have set it up like they did with Athlete. The fact that they didn't make a specific observation like they did with Elemental Adept is an oversight. It's not like there is plenty of that in D&D. The fact that Resilience and Magic Initiate are set up the same as Elemental Adept is not due to any technical limitation.
They can have a dropdown for the stat it gives you - but the backend won't do the same for the saving throw proficiency. They could have done - but they didn't. Try it with the homebrew tools (the tools the devs use the make the stuff we use) - it's not possible. They had to separate them out.
And as DxJxC said - just because DNDBeyond lets you do something - doesn't make it RAW.
"They can have a dropdown for the stat it gives you - but the backend won't do the same for the saving throw proficiency." <--- you have inside knowledge as to how the system is coded? I somehow doubt that they are as limited as you claim. Anyway, RAW takes back seat to Rule of Cool and Common sense. There is nothing stopping someone from having more than one kind of resilience just like there is no reason someone could be more than one kind of magic initiate or be more than one kind of ritual caster. It's not like Resilience (Con) in anyway duplicates the effects of Resilience (Int). Edit: the Prodigy feat lets you pick a skill and give the proficiency bonus to that (and also expertise) so somehow I think that they could have made it where the Resilient Feat could have granted proficiency to the chosen saving throw roll.
They can have a dropdown for the stat it gives you - but the backend won't do the same for the saving throw proficiency. They could have done - but they didn't. Try it with the homebrew tools (the tools the devs use the make the stuff we use) - it's not possible. They had to separate them out.
And as DxJxC said - just because DNDBeyond lets you do something - doesn't make it RAW.
"They can have a dropdown for the stat it gives you - but the backend won't do the same for the saving throw proficiency." <--- you have inside knowledge as to how the system is coded? I somehow doubt that they are as limited as you claim.
We all have insight into how the system is coded via the homebrew tools. The actual limitation with resilience in this case isn't having to choose a save or ability score improvement, it is having to pick 1 ability score to +1 AND get save proficiency in. They didn't code feats to have options for combined modifiers, only unbound modifiers. If you think it isn't a tech limitation, try homebrewing a feat yourself that works the way it is described in the book.
Anyway, RAW takes back seat to Rule of Cool and Common sense. There is nothing stopping someone from having more than one kind of resilience just like there is no reason someone could be more than one kind of magic initiate or be more than one kind of ritual caster. It's not like Resilience (Con) in anyway duplicates the effects of Resilience (Int).
If that is how you want to house rule, that is fine. I like it that way too. But this is the rules subforum, we talk about RAW here.
Edit: the Prodigy feat lets you pick a skill and give the proficiency bonus to that (and also expertise) so somehow I think that they could have made it where the Resilient Feat could have granted proficiency to the chosen saving throw roll.
That's different. They can make a modifier that gives proficiency in "choose a saving throw." But they can't make it be the same ability that gets a +1 from the bonus modifier.
Hmmm... I checked the feat creator. It is as you say. That is pathetic. If someone is going to put a kludge like that in the system, it should be documented.
Hmmm... I checked the feat creator. It is as you say. That is pathetic. If someone is going to put a kludge like that in the system, it should be documented.
Yeah, I don't know why feats are limited in this way when sub/races and subclasses aren't. Then again, items don't support dropdowns at all currently and those have also been needed since the beginning.
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If a 20th level artificer is attuned to five good luck stones, is it correct to assume that he would have a + 10 to all saving throws, which would include death saving throws?
If that is the case, when he has to roll death saving throws he would always succeed. Unless he rolled a nat 1 and did not take any damage.
Massive Damage and Instant Death Effects (catoblepas is one example) as well as power word kill bypass death saves. a Nat 1 still causes 2 failures, and it is certainly possible to roll two in a row, plus taking damage is an automatic failure, so Artificers can still very much die at any level
This isn't even getting into the fact that the DMG doesn't allow you to attune to more than one of the same object, so you would need 5 distinct objects that all grant the +1 for this to work, not 5 luckstones.
An item can be attuned to only one creature at a time, and a creature can be attuned to no more than three magic items at a time. Any attempt to attune to a fourth item fails; the creature must end its attunement to an item first. Additionally, a creature can't attune to more than one copy of an item. For example, a creature can't attune to more than one ring of protection at a time.
Its actually in the Basic Rules too.
Now what you can do is attune to any of these items....
Theoretically, you could take the resilient feat 4 times to gain proficiency in all saving throws and take the best of these items to gain a max total of +20 to all your saving throws (+6 for proficiency bonus, +6 for being attuned to 6 items, and +8 for the total bonuses to saving throws from the best items), not including your ability score modifiers for each stat.
Would be a bit overkill but it's possible.
"Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."
Characters for Tenebris Sine Fine
RoughCoronet's Greater Wills
Nope, you can't take the same feat more than once, and Resilient does not have an exception like Elemental Adept does.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Ah, I thought it could be taken more than once so I stand corrected.
So then it would be +20 for three saves (Constitution and Intelligence and the one chosen by the Resilient feat) and a +14 for the other three saves, excluding stat mods.
"Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup."
Characters for Tenebris Sine Fine
RoughCoronet's Greater Wills
Throw in a Paladin's aura while you're at it :P
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Everyone dies.
Kurgan is patient, but he is inevitable.
Anzio Faro. Protector Aasimar light cleric. Lvl 18.
Viktor Gavriil. White dragonborn grave cleric. Lvl 20.
Ikram Sahir ibn-Malik al-Sayyid Ra'ad. Brass dragonborn draconic sorcerer Lvl 9. Fire elemental devil.
Wrangler of cats.
You also automatically fail a death save if you're hit by an attack while you're down, and you automatically fail 2 if it crits, and it automatically crits if you're incapacitated (which you are while you're unconscious).
So if you get hit while you're down at all, that's 2 automatic failed death saves. If you're attacked by a creature with multiattack while you're down, then you are straight dead, no saves.
So yes, artificers at lv 20 can still die.
Technically the auto crit applies because you are unconcious if you are incapacitated but not unconcious, e.g. stunned you do not get the auto crit.
THE auto crit also only applies if the attacker is within 5 ft of you and you still have to hit. A creature with multi attack can kill you outright while you are down but if they hit using a reach or ranged attack they only cause a single death save fail and if their attack misses you do not take any.
That raises another question why is an unconcious unarmoured monk (Say AC20) so much harder to hit that an unconcious wizard (say AC12)?
Just an unfortunate side effect of 5e's simplicity. That said, if you are already attuned to a number of these items to boost your save bonuses:
That is a +4 to AC, not to mention shield and armor, and we are talking a minimum 22, or easily 26+ AC.
Really? Where does it say that?
The Character creator right here in DnDBeyond treats each kind of resilience as a different feat and thus allows what RoughCoronet0 proposes.
It does the same with the magic initiate feat. I don't think there is just one Resilience Feat. I think there are six.
There is just one Resilient feat and it says:
DNDBeyond separates it out when you can choose them because of technical limitations. Note that it doesn't say you can take it more than once - while Elemental Adept does (which is also only one feat - and is separated out for the same reasons). You can see they're only one feat by looking at the feats list. Both of them are listed only once - and the same is true for Magic Initiate. https://www.dndbeyond.com/feats
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
In the rulebook:
Just because DDB lets you do it, doesn't mean the rules let you.
The RAW wording of each feat can also be found in the book. The character sheet breaks feats with options into separate feats because they were too lazy to code it with option boxes with modifiers.
No. It is not because of technical limitations. You are wrong. There are plenty of feats, like Athlete, that let you chose a stat to affect. And those can be taken only once. If they had meant to limit Resilience they could have set it up like they did with Athlete.
The fact that they didn't make a specific observation like they did with Elemental Adept is an oversight. It's not like there is plenty of that in D&D.
The fact that Resilience and Magic Initiate are set up the same as Elemental Adept is not due to any technical limitation.
They can have a dropdown for the stat it gives you - but the backend won't do the same for the saving throw proficiency. They could have done - but they didn't. Try it with the homebrew tools (the tools the devs use the make the stuff we use) - it's not possible. They had to separate them out.
And as DxJxC said - just because DNDBeyond lets you do something - doesn't make it RAW.
Mega Yahtzee Thread:
Highest 41: brocker2001 (#11,285).
Yahtzee of 2's: Emmber (#36,161).
Lowest 9: JoeltheWalrus (#312), Emmber (#12,505) and Dertinus (#20,953).
"They can have a dropdown for the stat it gives you - but the backend won't do the same for the saving throw proficiency." <--- you have inside knowledge as to how the system is coded? I somehow doubt that they are as limited as you claim.
Anyway, RAW takes back seat to Rule of Cool and Common sense. There is nothing stopping someone from having more than one kind of resilience just like there is no reason someone could be more than one kind of magic initiate or be more than one kind of ritual caster. It's not like Resilience (Con) in anyway duplicates the effects of Resilience (Int).
Edit: the Prodigy feat lets you pick a skill and give the proficiency bonus to that (and also expertise) so somehow I think that they could have made it where the Resilient Feat could have granted proficiency to the chosen saving throw roll.
We all have insight into how the system is coded via the homebrew tools. The actual limitation with resilience in this case isn't having to choose a save or ability score improvement, it is having to pick 1 ability score to +1 AND get save proficiency in. They didn't code feats to have options for combined modifiers, only unbound modifiers. If you think it isn't a tech limitation, try homebrewing a feat yourself that works the way it is described in the book.
If that is how you want to house rule, that is fine. I like it that way too. But this is the rules subforum, we talk about RAW here.
That's different. They can make a modifier that gives proficiency in "choose a saving throw." But they can't make it be the same ability that gets a +1 from the bonus modifier.
Hmmm...
I checked the feat creator. It is as you say. That is pathetic.
If someone is going to put a kludge like that in the system, it should be documented.
Yeah, I don't know why feats are limited in this way when sub/races and subclasses aren't. Then again, items don't support dropdowns at all currently and those have also been needed since the beginning.