Yes. On a turn you get a movement, action, bonus action. You can move through a healing spirit as part of a turn and get healed. Then holding an action to DASH is STILL part of that turn.
If you use your reaction to activate your held action on the same turn, it doesn't work. If you use your reaction on the next turn, then the movement on the next turn won't trigger a heal from the spirit.
No matter how you split hairs, you get 1 heal per turn.
1 turn = 6 seconds.
Healing Spirit lasts 1 minute.
The most one character can heal from a single casting of Healing Spirit at level 2, is 10d6.
On this one I think they're right. You set your held action to go off on the person after your turn, so that you can do it when your turn ends, giving you two in a round.
I will add though, that that sounds a little metagamey. The Hold action is meant to respond to actions in the world, so I don't think I as a DM I would allow someone to set the condition of their Held action for "the end of my turn." Rather, I'd require they cited some action that triggers it, like "if my ally attacks the beast I run to get healed" or "if they move away."
It might seem a little hair splitting, but it's more in the spirit of the game and is less open to be exploited in that way.
Neither of which are available to Rangers at all. Both require a full action or bonus action to reproduce the effect on subsequent turns. Healing Spirit requires noaction to continue the effect on subsequent turns. Keep trying.
The spells I cited require bonus actions on classes that don't have a ton of demands on their bonus action, so it may as well be action less. As for the Ranger, we were speaking hypothetically about clerics, so for that example, rangers aren't pertinent.
Thank you for showing that you do not understand the magnitude of the problem.
The Ranger is absolutely pertinent. The Ranger is a martialhalf-caster with access to a spell which allows them to outperform a non-martial full-caster devoted to healing. There is no trade-off for the Ranger to accomplish this. They all have access to the spell no matter what their actual class specialization is. It is 100% superior to the actually-exclusive devoted healing spell Prayer of Healing in every possible way. **** that.
This doesn't happen anywhere else. There are no instances of a non-martial base class having a feature that lets them completely--in every conceivable manner--outperform a Fighter in melee combat. Let's give all Rogues Extra Attack (5). That's what Healing Spirit is to everyone else.
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Neither of which are available to Rangers at all. Both require a full action or bonus action to reproduce the effect on subsequent turns. Healing Spirit requires noaction to continue the effect on subsequent turns. Keep trying.
The spells I cited require bonus actions on classes that don't have a ton of demands on their bonus action, so it may as well be action less. As for the Ranger, we were speaking hypothetically about clerics, so for that example, rangers aren't pertinent.
Thank you for showing that you do not understand the magnitude of the problem.
The Ranger is absolutely pertinent. The Ranger is a martialhalf-caster with access to a spell which allows them to outperform a non-martial full-caster devoted to healing. There is no trade-off for the Ranger to accomplish this. They all have access to the spell no matter what their actual class specialization is. It is 100% superior to the actually-exclusive devoted healing spell Prayer of Healing in every possible way. **** that.
This doesn't happen anywhere else. There are no instances of a non-martial base class having a feature that lets them completely--in every conceivable manner--outperform a Fighter in melee combat. Let's give all Rogues Extra Attack (5). That's what Healing Spirit is to everyone else.
But that's still only out of combat. It only lets you skip the occasional short rest, if you didn't use all your spell slots during the fight, or if you don't wanna hang onto them for the next fight, or if you don't need to recover short rest abilities.
I still don't see the big deal and nobody will address those points I am making.
On this one I think they're right. You set your held action to go off on the person after your turn, so that you can do it when your turn ends, giving you two in a round.
I will add though, that that sounds a little metagamey. The Hold action is meant to respond to actions in the world, so I don't think I as a DM I would allow someone to set the condition of their Held action for "the end of my turn." Rather, I'd require they cited some action that triggers it, like "if my ally attacks the beast I run to get healed" or "if they move away."
It might seem a little hair splitting, but it's more in the spirit of the game and is less open to be exploited in that way.
No. It is your turn, then every one else's turn. Then it's your turn again. (When several characters each get their turn, that's a round).
You get to heal once per turn. It doesn't matter if you ready action dash and move through it again, until it is your turn again, you can't benefit from the healing spirit. It is very specific in the spell description.
But it doesn't say it has to be on YOUR turn. Once it's no longer the turn it was when you first did it, I believe you're able to do it again. Just like how sneak attack is once per turn but you can still trigger it on reactions.
Neither of which are available to Rangers at all. Both require a full action or bonus action to reproduce the effect on subsequent turns. Healing Spirit requires noaction to continue the effect on subsequent turns. Keep trying.
The spells I cited require bonus actions on classes that don't have a ton of demands on their bonus action, so it may as well be action less. As for the Ranger, we were speaking hypothetically about clerics, so for that example, rangers aren't pertinent.
Thank you for showing that you do not understand the magnitude of the problem.
The Ranger is absolutely pertinent. The Ranger is a martialhalf-caster with access to a spell which allows them to outperform a non-martial full-caster devoted to healing. There is no trade-off for the Ranger to accomplish this. They all have access to the spell no matter what their actual class specialization is. It is 100% superior to the actually-exclusive devoted healing spell Prayer of Healing in every possible way. **** that.
This doesn't happen anywhere else. There are no instances of a non-martial base class having a feature that lets them completely--in every conceivable manner--outperform a Fighter in melee combat. Let's give all Rogues Extra Attack (5). That's what Healing Spirit is to everyone else.
But that's still only out of combat. It only lets you skip the occasional short rest, if you didn't use all your spell slots during the fight, or if you don't wanna hang onto them for the next fight, or if you don't need to recover short rest abilities.
I still don't see the big deal and nobody will address those points I am making.
No dude, it is infinitely better than all other healing spells. In-or-out of combat. Full Stop.
One spell slot -> multiple targets. Check.
One spell slot -> multi-round effect. Check.
One bonus action -> multiple targets. Check.
No action -> multi-round effect. Check.
Moveable effect. Check.
Revives downed creatures at 0 HP. Check.
Can heal the same target more than once per round. Check.
[edit]
@Kerrec Dude, also no. Healing from the spirit can occur whenever a creature enters the space on a turn, not only their turn. The spell explicitly states this. The spell absolutely allows people to use a readied action to move and be healed again on another creature's turn.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
On this one I think they're right. You set your held action to go off on the person after your turn, so that you can do it when your turn ends, giving you two in a round.
I will add though, that that sounds a little metagamey. The Hold action is meant to respond to actions in the world, so I don't think I as a DM I would allow someone to set the condition of their Held action for "the end of my turn." Rather, I'd require they cited some action that triggers it, like "if my ally attacks the beast I run to get healed" or "if they move away."
It might seem a little hair splitting, but it's more in the spirit of the game and is less open to be exploited in that way.
No. It is your turn, then every one else's turn. Then it's your turn again. (When several characters each get their turn, that's a round).
You get to heal once per turn. It doesn't matter if you ready action dash and move through it again, until it is your turn again, you can't benefit from the healing spirit. It is very specific in the spell description.
The description IS very specific. A creature gets the healing when it enters the spirit’s square for the first time on A turn, not the first time on ITS turn. If a creature somehow is able to move through the spirit on someone else’s turn, that’s “for the first time on a turn,” so it would be healed again.
It's 20d6 if you understand how turns work. On your turn you move through the Healing Spirit (get healed for 1d6) and then take the Ready action and hold your movement until the next person's turn starts. Then you use your reaction to move through the Healing Spirit on their turn - not yours - and scoop up another 1d6 healing.
NO. Per the spell:
Until the spell ends, whenever you or a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space for the first time on a turn or starts its turn there, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required). The spirit can’t heal constructs or undead.
By RAW, you can only benefit from the spirit once per turn.
Moving through then holding action Dash to move through again should not be allowed.
You can use the Ready action to hold your movement until another player's turn starts. Then you ARE moving through on another turn during the same round. There are as many turns per round as there are players.
The wording of the spell allows it to be massively exploited. Even without exploiting turn mechanics a 3rd level spell slot gets you 20d6 per person in the party. It is massive multiples of all other healing options.
I feel confident that the goal of the spell was not to make 9th level rangers better healers than 9th level life clerics.
Even if you were correct - and you're not - this would mean 420 points of healing for a 6 man party in a single minute. This is 6x what you can get from Aura of Vitality and many times more than what Prayer of Healing can do with a TEN MINUTE cast time.
Jeremy Crawford himself said the intention was WIS MOD x2 in d6's of healing for the spell. That's 10d6 max. Not 10d6 per person. And certainly not the 40d6 per person you can get using a 3rd level spell slot and the Ready action.
Neither of which are available to Rangers at all. Both require a full action or bonus action to reproduce the effect on subsequent turns. Healing Spirit requires noaction to continue the effect on subsequent turns. Keep trying.
The spells I cited require bonus actions on classes that don't have a ton of demands on their bonus action, so it may as well be action less. As for the Ranger, we were speaking hypothetically about clerics, so for that example, rangers aren't pertinent.
Thank you for showing that you do not understand the magnitude of the problem.
The Ranger is absolutely pertinent. The Ranger is a martialhalf-caster with access to a spell which allows them to outperform a non-martial full-caster devoted to healing. There is no trade-off for the Ranger to accomplish this. They all have access to the spell no matter what their actual class specialization is. It is 100% superior to the actually-exclusive devoted healing spell Prayer of Healing in every possible way. **** that.
This doesn't happen anywhere else. There are no instances of a non-martial base class having a feature that lets them completely--in every conceivable manner--outperform a Fighter in melee combat. Let's give all Rogues Extra Attack (5). That's what Healing Spirit is to everyone else.
But that's still only out of combat. It only lets you skip the occasional short rest, if you didn't use all your spell slots during the fight, or if you don't wanna hang onto them for the next fight, or if you don't need to recover short rest abilities.
I still don't see the big deal and nobody will address those points I am making.
No dude, it is infinitely better than all other healing spells. In-or-out of combat. Full Stop.
One spell slot -> multiple targets. Check.
One spell slot -> multi-round effect. Check.
One bonus action -> multiple targets. Check.
No action -> multi-round effect. Check.
Moveable effect. Check.
Revives downed creatures at 0 HP. Check.
Can heal the same target more than once per round. Check.
[edit]
@Kerrec Dude, also no. Healing from the spirit can occur whenever a creature enters the space on a turn, not only their turn. The spell explicitly states this. The spell absolutely allows people to use a readied action to move and be healed again on another creature's turn.
First of all thank you for addressing this, I've been repeating myself for like 2 pages.
But I still think this spell is riddled with flaws for in-combat use.
Firstly it's very vulnerable for multiple reasons. It's concentration, so its caster has to worry about losing concentration during fights, especially if the enemy is intelligent to gang up on the person casting it. It's also susceptible to dispel magic for if you're fighting casters, or anti magic effects.
It's also confined to a space on the battlefield, and that makes it susceptible to area denial. This again leaves it *very* vulnerable to caster enemies who can restrict your access to the area in any number of ways, from putting a wall spell around it or just fireballing the whole party for all being near the same 5 ft square. Even non casters can position themselves to provoke opportunity attacks if a player makes a break for it, or they could just pick off the person with the lowest health and attempt to grapple to keep them away.
Yes you can move it, but 30 feet doesn't give you a lot to work with, especially when your party is spread out like they should be. Also the bonus action movement requirement is a pretty steep cost for rangers, who have a lot that they need their bonus action for already.
Again, when you lay it out on paper it sounds broken, but if that translates into practice, then your DM is not allowing the bad guys to think tactically enough
For this reason, I'm of the impression that it's main function is for out of combat healing.
Ok, Sigred? Take a deep breath, and sit down. You might be getting a little to heated about this.
In my opinion, it's not broken. If you're going to spend 3 different actions and movement, just to get a bunch of healing, fine on me. Since everyone's used their reactions, Kobolds now jump from the bushes and attack, then fly away with their wings as they put on a Ring of Invisibility. Sorry, you couldn't fight back, you spent all your Reactions, Actions, and Movement getting healed.
But it doesn't say it has to be on YOUR turn. Once it's no longer the turn it was when you first did it, I believe you're able to do it again. Just like how sneak attack is once per turn but you can still trigger it on reactions.
Until the spell ends, whenever you or a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space for the first time on a turn or starts its turn there, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required). The spirit can’t heal constructs or undead.
There's two ways I look at this. If it worked the way you all think it does, then "for the first time on a turn" is completely pointless in the paragraph. IE:
Until the spell ends, whenever you or a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space or starts its turn there, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required). The spirit can’t heal constructs or undead.
The above achieves the exact same mechanics you all describe above (which I believe is wrong).
The other way to look at this is by replacing the options provided with the "OR" clauses into separate paragraphs for each scenario:
Until the spell ends, whenever you move into the spirit’s space for the first time on a turn, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to yourself (no action required).
Until the spell ends, whenever a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space for the first time on a turn, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required).
OR
Until the spell ends, whenever you start your turn in the spirit’s space, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to yourself (no action required).
Until the spell ends, whenever a creature you can see starts its turn in the spirit’s space, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required).
Because of the OR clause between "once on a turn" and "when you start your turn there", the two options have to be equivalent, or else the paragraph doesn't make sense.
If you start your turn in the spirit's square, you get 1 heal until it is your turn again and that's it. If you move into the spirit's square you get two heals because you can ready action and move into it again on someone else's turn? That's not equivalent. It goes counter to the purpose of the paragraph.
ALSO, Sneak Attack very specifically states "Once per turn". That's literal, there's no way to interpret it any other way. If you're doing sneak attack twice in a round, you're not RAW.
I think the spell is quite well balanced for in-combat scenarios.
It has very low action economy and can be very useful. However, it is also very vulnerable (Concentration) to being cut off early and requires - in combat - other players to potentially sacrifice optimal positioning just to get 1d6 healing.
I have zero complaints about how it works in combat. Is it better than a 2nd level Healing Word? Yep!
It's out of combat where it rapidly scales to out heal the 9th level spell Mass Heal that everyone has an issue with it.
Resource management is a real part of how some campaigns are run as well as Adventure League Epics. This spell single-handedly removes resource issues unless you crank up the difficulty or encounter count so high that all parties without it are utterly destroyed.
You spend a 2nd level spell healing everyone. Nothing Else. No slots back, no Ki or special features, no bonus from a Bard's Song of Rest.
Rather, even if it's very good at healing, did you stop to think that it might be that the Mass Heal is underpowered, instead of Healing Spirit being overpowered?
ALSO, Sneak Attack very specifically states "Once per turn". That's literal, there's no way to interpret it any other way. If you're doing sneak attack twice in a round, you're not RAW.
Bro, you’re contradicting yourself here. A turn is not the same thing as a round. Something that happens twice in a round can absolutely happen once a turn if the round has at least two turns. An attack of opportunity necessarily happens on someone else’s turn, i.e. a new, different turn. If the intent were to limit it to once a round, it would say once a round.
But it doesn't say it has to be on YOUR turn. Once it's no longer the turn it was when you first did it, I believe you're able to do it again. Just like how sneak attack is once per turn but you can still trigger it on reactions.
Until the spell ends, whenever you or a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space for the first time on a turn or starts its turn there, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required). The spirit can’t heal constructs or undead.
There's two ways I look at this. If it worked the way you all think it does, then "for the first time on a turn" is completely pointless in the paragraph. IE:
Until the spell ends, whenever you or a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space or starts its turn there, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required). The spirit can’t heal constructs or undead.
The above achieves the exact same mechanics you all describe above (which I believe is wrong).
The other way to look at this is by replacing the options provided with the "OR" clauses into separate paragraphs for each scenario:
Until the spell ends, whenever you move into the spirit’s space for the first time on a turn, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to yourself (no action required).
Until the spell ends, whenever a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space for the first time on a turn, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required).
OR
Until the spell ends, whenever you start your turn in the spirit’s space, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to yourself (no action required).
Until the spell ends, whenever a creature you can see starts its turn in the spirit’s space, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required).
Because of the OR clause between "once on a turn" and "when you start your turn there", the two options have to be equivalent, or else the paragraph doesn't make sense.
If you start your turn in the spirit's square, you get 1 heal until it is your turn again and that's it. If you move into the spirit's square you get two heals because you can ready action and move into it again on someone else's turn? That's not equivalent. It goes counter to the purpose of the paragraph.
ALSO, Sneak Attack very specifically states "Once per turn". That's literal, there's no way to interpret it any other way. If you're doing sneak attack twice in a round, you're not RAW.
Ok, Sigred? Take a deep breath, and sit down. You might be getting a little to heated about this.
In my opinion, it's not broken. If you're going to spend 3 different actions and movement, just to get a bunch of healing, fine on me. Since everyone's used their reactions, Kobolds now jump from the bushes and attack, then fly away with their wings as they put on a Ring of Invisibility. Sorry, you couldn't fight back, you spent all your Reactions, Actions, and Movement getting healed.
For probably the 500th time in this thread, no-one is saying that the spell is broken in combat. In combat, it works just fine. The problem is outside of combat, where an entire party can heal for 20d6 each at the cost of a 2nd level spell.
Neither of which are available to Rangers at all. Both require a full action or bonus action to reproduce the effect on subsequent turns. Healing Spirit requires noaction to continue the effect on subsequent turns. Keep trying.
The spells I cited require bonus actions on classes that don't have a ton of demands on their bonus action, so it may as well be action less. As for the Ranger, we were speaking hypothetically about clerics, so for that example, rangers aren't pertinent.
Thank you for showing that you do not understand the magnitude of the problem.
The Ranger is absolutely pertinent. The Ranger is a martialhalf-caster with access to a spell which allows them to outperform a non-martial full-caster devoted to healing. There is no trade-off for the Ranger to accomplish this. They all have access to the spell no matter what their actual class specialization is. It is 100% superior to the actually-exclusive devoted healing spell Prayer of Healing in every possible way. **** that.
This doesn't happen anywhere else. There are no instances of a non-martial base class having a feature that lets them completely--in every conceivable manner--outperform a Fighter in melee combat. Let's give all Rogues Extra Attack (5). That's what Healing Spirit is to everyone else.
But that's still only out of combat. It only lets you skip the occasional short rest, if you didn't use all your spell slots during the fight, or if you don't wanna hang onto them for the next fight, or if you don't need to recover short rest abilities.
I still don't see the big deal and nobody will address those points I am making.
Jaysburn, that brings me back to my above point. When I said this about out of combat healing, the person who responded made the point that they thought it was broken because of in combat healing, which got that whole train rolling again...
You spend a 2nd level spell healing everyone. Nothing Else. No slots back, no Ki or special features, no bonus from a Bard's Song of Rest.
Rather, even if it's very good at healing, did you stop to think that it might be that the Mass Heal is underpowered, instead of Healing Spirit being overpowered?
Bard's Song of Rest provides a single die of extra hit points IF you using hit dice to heal during the short rest. This is laughable to even bring up.
Also, consider the pressure taken off of all other resources once healing becomes virtually infinite. No need to waste spell slots unless you're at risk of being killed. Instead of balancing health, consumables, spell slots, ki points, etc. - all you have to do is get out of the fight alive and watch your health bars rocket to full like a video game.
It is stupidly overpowered.
Consider this - You can with a single 3rd level spell slot and a minute of free time reverse the damage of 4 consecutive fireball hits using 5th level slots where all party members fail all saving throws.
Compare that to all other out-of-combat healing options.
Prayer of Healing gets you (assuming 20 WIS) 14 x 6 = 84 points. Make that 18 x 6 if you're a Life Cleric = 108 points. Using a 3rd level slot gets you all the way up to 24 x 6 for a massive 144 points. That takes 10x longer to complete at 10 minutes.
Aura of Vitality gets you 70 points - 120 points if you've dipped into life cleric.
Healing Spirit gets you 840 points - basically 6x the next best out of combat option. SIX TIMES.
What if the crafty ranger takes a level of Life Cleric as well? The spell ramps up to (20d6 + 5) x 20 for a hot 40d6 + 100: 940 points of healing.
If that doesn't bother you then I'd like to sit at your table and have my fireballs do 64d6 damage per cast.
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Also I didn't think you could ready a movement. I thought you could just ready actions.
Yes. On a turn you get a movement, action, bonus action. You can move through a healing spirit as part of a turn and get healed. Then holding an action to DASH is STILL part of that turn.
If you use your reaction to activate your held action on the same turn, it doesn't work. If you use your reaction on the next turn, then the movement on the next turn won't trigger a heal from the spirit.
No matter how you split hairs, you get 1 heal per turn.
1 turn = 6 seconds.
Healing Spirit lasts 1 minute.
The most one character can heal from a single casting of Healing Spirit at level 2, is 10d6.
On this one I think they're right. You set your held action to go off on the person after your turn, so that you can do it when your turn ends, giving you two in a round.
I will add though, that that sounds a little metagamey. The Hold action is meant to respond to actions in the world, so I don't think I as a DM I would allow someone to set the condition of their Held action for "the end of my turn." Rather, I'd require they cited some action that triggers it, like "if my ally attacks the beast I run to get healed" or "if they move away."
It might seem a little hair splitting, but it's more in the spirit of the game and is less open to be exploited in that way.
Thank you for showing that you do not understand the magnitude of the problem.
The Ranger is absolutely pertinent. The Ranger is a martial half-caster with access to a spell which allows them to outperform a non-martial full-caster devoted to healing. There is no trade-off for the Ranger to accomplish this. They all have access to the spell no matter what their actual class specialization is. It is 100% superior to the actually-exclusive devoted healing spell Prayer of Healing in every possible way. **** that.
This doesn't happen anywhere else. There are no instances of a non-martial base class having a feature that lets them completely--in every conceivable manner--outperform a Fighter in melee combat. Let's give all Rogues Extra Attack (5). That's what Healing Spirit is to everyone else.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
But that's still only out of combat. It only lets you skip the occasional short rest, if you didn't use all your spell slots during the fight, or if you don't wanna hang onto them for the next fight, or if you don't need to recover short rest abilities.
I still don't see the big deal and nobody will address those points I am making.
No. It is your turn, then every one else's turn. Then it's your turn again. (When several characters each get their turn, that's a round).
You get to heal once per turn. It doesn't matter if you ready action dash and move through it again, until it is your turn again, you can't benefit from the healing spirit. It is very specific in the spell description.
But it doesn't say it has to be on YOUR turn. Once it's no longer the turn it was when you first did it, I believe you're able to do it again. Just like how sneak attack is once per turn but you can still trigger it on reactions.
No dude, it is infinitely better than all other healing spells. In-or-out of combat. Full Stop.
[edit]
@Kerrec Dude, also no. Healing from the spirit can occur whenever a creature enters the space on a turn, not only their turn. The spell explicitly states this. The spell absolutely allows people to use a readied action to move and be healed again on another creature's turn.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
The description IS very specific. A creature gets the healing when it enters the spirit’s square for the first time on A turn, not the first time on ITS turn. If a creature somehow is able to move through the spirit on someone else’s turn, that’s “for the first time on a turn,” so it would be healed again.
You can use the Ready action to hold your movement until another player's turn starts. Then you ARE moving through on another turn during the same round. There are as many turns per round as there are players.
The wording of the spell allows it to be massively exploited. Even without exploiting turn mechanics a 3rd level spell slot gets you 20d6 per person in the party. It is massive multiples of all other healing options.
I feel confident that the goal of the spell was not to make 9th level rangers better healers than 9th level life clerics.
Even if you were correct - and you're not - this would mean 420 points of healing for a 6 man party in a single minute. This is 6x what you can get from Aura of Vitality and many times more than what Prayer of Healing can do with a TEN MINUTE cast time.
Jeremy Crawford himself said the intention was WIS MOD x2 in d6's of healing for the spell. That's 10d6 max. Not 10d6 per person. And certainly not the 40d6 per person you can get using a 3rd level spell slot and the Ready action.
First of all thank you for addressing this, I've been repeating myself for like 2 pages.
But I still think this spell is riddled with flaws for in-combat use.
Firstly it's very vulnerable for multiple reasons. It's concentration, so its caster has to worry about losing concentration during fights, especially if the enemy is intelligent to gang up on the person casting it. It's also susceptible to dispel magic for if you're fighting casters, or anti magic effects.
It's also confined to a space on the battlefield, and that makes it susceptible to area denial. This again leaves it *very* vulnerable to caster enemies who can restrict your access to the area in any number of ways, from putting a wall spell around it or just fireballing the whole party for all being near the same 5 ft square. Even non casters can position themselves to provoke opportunity attacks if a player makes a break for it, or they could just pick off the person with the lowest health and attempt to grapple to keep them away.
Yes you can move it, but 30 feet doesn't give you a lot to work with, especially when your party is spread out like they should be. Also the bonus action movement requirement is a pretty steep cost for rangers, who have a lot that they need their bonus action for already.
Again, when you lay it out on paper it sounds broken, but if that translates into practice, then your DM is not allowing the bad guys to think tactically enough
For this reason, I'm of the impression that it's main function is for out of combat healing.
Ok, Sigred? Take a deep breath, and sit down. You might be getting a little to heated about this.
In my opinion, it's not broken. If you're going to spend 3 different actions and movement, just to get a bunch of healing, fine on me. Since everyone's used their reactions, Kobolds now jump from the bushes and attack, then fly away with their wings as they put on a Ring of Invisibility. Sorry, you couldn't fight back, you spent all your Reactions, Actions, and Movement getting healed.
Extended Signature! Yay! https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/off-topic/adohands-kitchen/3153-extended-signature-thread?page=2#c21
Haven’t used this account in forever. Still a big fan of crawling claws.
Until the spell ends, whenever you or a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space for the first time on a turn or starts its turn there, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required). The spirit can’t heal constructs or undead.
Until the spell ends, whenever you or a creature you can see moves into the spirit’s space or starts its turn there, you can cause the spirit to restore 1d6 hit points to that creature (no action required). The spirit can’t heal constructs or undead.
The above achieves the exact same mechanics you all describe above (which I believe is wrong).
OR
Because of the OR clause between "once on a turn" and "when you start your turn there", the two options have to be equivalent, or else the paragraph doesn't make sense.
If you start your turn in the spirit's square, you get 1 heal until it is your turn again and that's it. If you move into the spirit's square you get two heals because you can ready action and move into it again on someone else's turn? That's not equivalent. It goes counter to the purpose of the paragraph.
ALSO, Sneak Attack very specifically states "Once per turn". That's literal, there's no way to interpret it any other way. If you're doing sneak attack twice in a round, you're not RAW.
I think the spell is quite well balanced for in-combat scenarios.
It has very low action economy and can be very useful. However, it is also very vulnerable (Concentration) to being cut off early and requires - in combat - other players to potentially sacrifice optimal positioning just to get 1d6 healing.
I have zero complaints about how it works in combat. Is it better than a 2nd level Healing Word? Yep!
It's out of combat where it rapidly scales to out heal the 9th level spell Mass Heal that everyone has an issue with it.
Resource management is a real part of how some campaigns are run as well as Adventure League Epics. This spell single-handedly removes resource issues unless you crank up the difficulty or encounter count so high that all parties without it are utterly destroyed.
I still see no need for concern.
You spend a 2nd level spell healing everyone. Nothing Else. No slots back, no Ki or special features, no bonus from a Bard's Song of Rest.
Rather, even if it's very good at healing, did you stop to think that it might be that the Mass Heal is underpowered, instead of Healing Spirit being overpowered?
Extended Signature! Yay! https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/off-topic/adohands-kitchen/3153-extended-signature-thread?page=2#c21
Haven’t used this account in forever. Still a big fan of crawling claws.
Bro, you’re contradicting yourself here. A turn is not the same thing as a round. Something that happens twice in a round can absolutely happen once a turn if the round has at least two turns. An attack of opportunity necessarily happens on someone else’s turn, i.e. a new, different turn. If the intent were to limit it to once a round, it would say once a round.
Off topic I know, but please see the sage advice and clarification on sneak attack. You can totally use it on an attack of opportunity: https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/06/18/sneak-once-per-turn/
JC confirms that "Yes. The Sneak Attack restriction is once per turn, not once per round."
For probably the 500th time in this thread, no-one is saying that the spell is broken in combat. In combat, it works just fine. The problem is outside of combat, where an entire party can heal for 20d6 each at the cost of a 2nd level spell.
Jaysburn, that brings me back to my above point. When I said this about out of combat healing, the person who responded made the point that they thought it was broken because of in combat healing, which got that whole train rolling again...
Bard's Song of Rest provides a single die of extra hit points IF you using hit dice to heal during the short rest. This is laughable to even bring up.
Also, consider the pressure taken off of all other resources once healing becomes virtually infinite. No need to waste spell slots unless you're at risk of being killed. Instead of balancing health, consumables, spell slots, ki points, etc. - all you have to do is get out of the fight alive and watch your health bars rocket to full like a video game.
It is stupidly overpowered.
Consider this - You can with a single 3rd level spell slot and a minute of free time reverse the damage of 4 consecutive fireball hits using 5th level slots where all party members fail all saving throws.
Compare that to all other out-of-combat healing options.
Prayer of Healing gets you (assuming 20 WIS) 14 x 6 = 84 points. Make that 18 x 6 if you're a Life Cleric = 108 points. Using a 3rd level slot gets you all the way up to 24 x 6 for a massive 144 points. That takes 10x longer to complete at 10 minutes.
Aura of Vitality gets you 70 points - 120 points if you've dipped into life cleric.
Healing Spirit gets you 840 points - basically 6x the next best out of combat option. SIX TIMES.
What if the crafty ranger takes a level of Life Cleric as well? The spell ramps up to (20d6 + 5) x 20 for a hot 40d6 + 100: 940 points of healing.
If that doesn't bother you then I'd like to sit at your table and have my fireballs do 64d6 damage per cast.