I am surprised they chose to tie alignment into some of the feat prerequisites. Maybe alignment is going to play a larger role in the Dragonlance setting material than in base 5e
It makes sense for the lore of the three orders, but at the same time it would only make sense if you intend to use the Feats strictly within the Dragonlance setting. I would drop the alignment prereqs if were going to add them to my own campaign world.
Well, if WotC is dead-set on bringing back kender, at least they're going to heavily retcon them and not include the very problematic elements of the original version. It wasn't just the kleptomania that was an issue: as portrayed in the original books kender were a fairly insulting take on certain mental conditions. Makes me wonder if they're going to try to bring back gully dwarves or not, since they were at least as bad.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I mean…yeah, it requires adjusting to a new way of thinking, in accordance with the different “phases”…but I find that to be a very exciting aspect to find in a Sorcerer subclass.
It is, in a way, similar to the “preparation” mechanic of the Wizard, Druid & Cleric…except your “phases” are fixed spell lists, so it’s more like ordering off a preset fast-food menu, rather than meticulously listing each and every ingredient to a recipe each day.
Plus…and this is just me…I seriously LOVE cosmic-themed subclasses.
The “Circle of Stars” Druid hooked me immediately; and this Lunar Sorcerer entices me much in the same way…especially since each “phase” is vastly different in their utility…you could really create some fascinating character concepts with these mechanics.
Naturally, I love the “New Moon” phase creepiness…it evokes an ethereal, eldritch feeling…but the spells and mannerisms of the other two phases will naturally see some gameplay, simply because they offer much utility.
The Sorcery Point saving & the free single-use of each spell might need some smoother wording; but I’m hearing the intended message, and I gotta say, it’s a breathe of fresh air.
I think, on reflection, the thing that makes Lunar Sorcerer so good is that they've finally made a Sorcerer who's superpower is being really really good at magic. They're not just a wizard that doesn't worry about preparing spells and has some extra abilities to build off of. The Lunar Sorc actually taps into the Sorcerer fantasy of being innately good at magic and being able to cast flexibly on the fly in a way that other subclasses really haven't. Having abilities that can give you limited free castings of spells, having abilities that interact and enhance metamagic, having the different spell lists that you can rotate through depending on the situation, all this really speaks to someone who's greatest strength is just a bonkers natural aptitude for magic.
That and the fact that the Lunar theme fits so well with the phases of the moon mechanics makes it unique feeling, compared to the Tasha's subclasses that, while they get expanded spell lists that are good and thematic, the theme and mechanics don't quite join to give the subclass as unique a feel.
I think this is how Sorcerer subclasses should be going forward.
Yeah, I'm digging the Lunar Sorcerer too. Having different modes based on moon phases is a neat idea, with a low-ish cost way to switch between them on the fly. The discounts on metamagic costs if the spell school matches your current phase is also a neat idea, one I wish we could graft onto the existing PHB Sorcerers somehow. One thing I need cleared up though, is the free cast of the spells on the extra spell lists. The UA states: "While in the chosen phase, spells of the associated phase in the Lunar Spells table can be cast once without expending a spell slot." which makes me think it's supposed to be once per extra spell, which is nice, but it also says "Once you cast a spell in this way, you can’t do so again until you finish a long rest." which seems to imply that you only get one free cast of any spell on the extra spell list.
That's exactly what it is, you get a single free cast a day, not a free casting of each spell in the phase you pick, just a single spell overall. Useful for sure but not the insanity people think it is
Lunar sorcerer is going to be hell for DnD beyond to make work lol....
Why? Your Lunar phase just determines your free daily cast and what spells you get a discount on casting metamagic through. Those aren't things the character generator deals with to start with, the only one I can think of that might get missed by players is the advantage on saves if they are in full moon with the lvl 14 ability since DnDB won't be tracking it
Honestly I think that a kender lunar sorcerer with the mage of high sorcery(black robes) could be a crazy build, once they show up in homebrew I think it'll be insane. Lol.
Especially with a twinned sacred flame as a go to spell (if it's allowed) could be hella fun.
DMs might have to consider to allow some proficiency trades on martial characters that are already have the weapon and armor proficiency. They seem to not quite hit the mark with feats that are not variations of magical initiate.
@MidnightPlat I think Kender Ace is a great way to move forward with kender, and it's a bit of a cartoonish ability that meshes really well with them. I'm not as much a fan of taunt, but only because it feels like something that should be a nonmagical generic ability tied to a feat that anyone can access.
3E-era Dragonlance introduced sorcerers and mystics to the novels, but they had no ties to the moons or gods (respectively). Lunar Magic sorcerers don't change phase with the moon(s), but when they finish a long rest. It's essentially a redesign of cosmic sorcerers from 4E.
You don't necessarily need to be "cultured" to know how to use a musical instrument (also, a reminder that Outlander gets it too).
The distribution of schools for the Mages of High Sorcery feels a bit off, only because in 3E Black Robes were enchantment/necromancy, Red Robes were illusion/transmutation, and White Robes were abjuration/divination. Can't really compare it to 2E, since we now have a fraction of the schools that used to exist (White Robes supposedly used to get Conjuration but not Summoning, etc).
I'm curious if the Dragonlance setting will default to "here's what is currently happening in Krynn," since there's a lot that changes with the War of the Lance and Age of Mortals - I don't think we'll see siphoning spell slots from magic items, for example.
I'm really pleased to see WotC actually utilizing HD with mechanics.
Squire is pretty much a garbage Feat for the the type character that it is meant to be taken by.
For Crown I will likely recommend that it grant the ability for an ally to re-roll a failed attack roll instead of advantage. It works out to pretty much the same thing, but without wasting your reaction should they roll well on both dice.
Sword is pretty good as it allows you to help your party members that might be struggling to shake off Fear or Charm effects. Not bad as a Half Feat.
Rose is a good substitute for Inspiring Leader and can use Con instead of Cha which the "Knight" is likely going to have a decent score in. It is also a Half Feat so it helps boost itself either way you go.
Kender in AD&D Dragonlance had Infravision 30 feet. This is missing in this UA. Taunt seems to be good in the hands of a Swashbuckler Rogue. It can save him. Even a caster can benefit from Taunt if used before he casts on a target.
At least the Kenders has no longer to sabotage the group if played correctly.
@MidnightPlat I think Kender Ace is a great way to move forward with kender, and it's a bit of a cartoonish ability that meshes really well with them. I'm not as much a fan of taunt, but only because it feels like something that should be a nonmagical generic ability tied to a feat that anyone can access.
I dunno, I think somewhere between kleptomania and magical wonder pocket, ace could have been more worldly and less magically grounded. I believe Ace is referring to the old "nothing up my sleeves" declarations used by stage magicians and card sharks (when in fact their sleeves and garments were anything but empty). So the feature itself already does have a sort of "cheat" connotation to it if I'm reading the inspiration behind the language used to name the feature right. Basically make the Kender a sort of Radar O'Reilley from MASH, or a sorta MacGuyver trait. There's this race called Mapach, basically Raccoon folk in the 3rd party Humblewood setting who have this feature called "Scroungecraft" that Ace reminds me of a bit ... Ace would work well/better if they both decriminalized and demystified it.
3E-era Dragonlance introduced sorcerers and mystics to the novels, but they had no ties to the moons or gods (respectively). Lunar Magic sorcerers don't change phase with the moon(s), but when they finish a long rest. It's essentially a redesign of cosmic sorcerers from 4E.
Cool, sounds like a neat multi class with Circle of Stars Druids.
You don't necessarily need to be "cultured" to know how to use a musical instrument (also, a reminder that Outlander gets it too).
Yeah, I sort of misspoke my objection there. I know music has degrees of registers from folk to courtly ... in either case I think the all knights are proficient in instruments seems reflective of some IRL historical courtly standards, however the Knights of Solamnia, while themselves revered in song and tale in Krynn ... well one of the cool things about the original DL books, and even the Huma back story, was that the Knights of Solamnia were not by and large a cultured or artistic lot. Rather they were a pretty uncouth set that had a set of legalistic traditions to maintain an exaggerated sense of organizational tradition and integrity. I just don't picture the Knights in any era of Krynn joining together in song. I do picture them gaming, hence my preference to seeing a different proficiency.
The distribution of schools for the Mages of High Sorcery feels a bit off, only because in 3E Black Robes were enchantment/necromancy, Red Robes were illusion/transmutation, and White Robes were abjuration/divination. Can't really compare it to 2E, since we now have a fraction of the schools that used to exist (White Robes supposedly used to get Conjuration but not Summoning, etc).
I think I see what you're saying. I think what I'm recognizing there as well as the feats in general is that while they can say it's a Dragonlance book with setting specific features, the way they've set up the schools I think balances more to setting agnostic associations of the schools of magic, if that makes sense.
I'm curious if the Dragonlance setting will default to "here's what is currently happening in Krynn," since there's a lot that changes with the War of the Lance and Age of Mortals - I don't think we'll see siphoning spell slots from magic items, for example.
I think a lot of the book will be aligned with whatever's presented in the new novels. I am curious how rich the lore/chronology presented will be. Forgotten Realms lore has been largely nerfed. There's no need to know much about what happened before 5e to play in that world. I think all other settings are presented in a general "evergreen" format, where it's really on the DM to pick up whatever thread the book teases them with and develop it. Dragonlance is loved for its lore, I think, and it's a much tighter lore than the Forgotten Realms (much less books, stays within a limited set of family trees etc) so I am curious how the setting will be "revisted" in 5e ... still likely to only buy the character options though I'm not _that_ curious to want to know beyond some story that will be leaked a few weeks before release.
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Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
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That is quite interesting. I can't say I'd follow that prerequisite in my own game, but I do find it rather intriguing.
P.S.
KEEEEEEEEEEEEENDEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEER!!!!!!!!!! *shakes fist*
It makes sense for the lore of the three orders, but at the same time it would only make sense if you intend to use the Feats strictly within the Dragonlance setting. I would drop the alignment prereqs if were going to add them to my own campaign world.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
Well, if WotC is dead-set on bringing back kender, at least they're going to heavily retcon them and not include the very problematic elements of the original version. It wasn't just the kleptomania that was an issue: as portrayed in the original books kender were a fairly insulting take on certain mental conditions. Makes me wonder if they're going to try to bring back gully dwarves or not, since they were at least as bad.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Lunar Sorcerer is fantastic.
I mean…yeah, it requires adjusting to a new way of thinking, in accordance with the different “phases”…but I find that to be a very exciting aspect to find in a Sorcerer subclass.
It is, in a way, similar to the “preparation” mechanic of the Wizard, Druid & Cleric…except your “phases” are fixed spell lists, so it’s more like ordering off a preset fast-food menu, rather than meticulously listing each and every ingredient to a recipe each day.
Plus…and this is just me…I seriously LOVE cosmic-themed subclasses.
The “Circle of Stars” Druid hooked me immediately; and this Lunar Sorcerer entices me much in the same way…especially since each “phase” is vastly different in their utility…you could really create some fascinating character concepts with these mechanics.
Naturally, I love the “New Moon” phase creepiness…it evokes an ethereal, eldritch feeling…but the spells and mannerisms of the other two phases will naturally see some gameplay, simply because they offer much utility.
The Sorcery Point saving & the free single-use of each spell might need some smoother wording; but I’m hearing the intended message, and I gotta say, it’s a breathe of fresh air.
I’m ready to Praise the Moon.
I think, on reflection, the thing that makes Lunar Sorcerer so good is that they've finally made a Sorcerer who's superpower is being really really good at magic. They're not just a wizard that doesn't worry about preparing spells and has some extra abilities to build off of. The Lunar Sorc actually taps into the Sorcerer fantasy of being innately good at magic and being able to cast flexibly on the fly in a way that other subclasses really haven't. Having abilities that can give you limited free castings of spells, having abilities that interact and enhance metamagic, having the different spell lists that you can rotate through depending on the situation, all this really speaks to someone who's greatest strength is just a bonkers natural aptitude for magic.
That and the fact that the Lunar theme fits so well with the phases of the moon mechanics makes it unique feeling, compared to the Tasha's subclasses that, while they get expanded spell lists that are good and thematic, the theme and mechanics don't quite join to give the subclass as unique a feel.
I think this is how Sorcerer subclasses should be going forward.
That's exactly what it is, you get a single free cast a day, not a free casting of each spell in the phase you pick, just a single spell overall. Useful for sure but not the insanity people think it is
Why? Your Lunar phase just determines your free daily cast and what spells you get a discount on casting metamagic through. Those aren't things the character generator deals with to start with, the only one I can think of that might get missed by players is the advantage on saves if they are in full moon with the lvl 14 ability since DnDB won't be tracking it
Honestly I think that a kender lunar sorcerer with the mage of high sorcery(black robes) could be a crazy build, once they show up in homebrew I think it'll be insane. Lol.
Especially with a twinned sacred flame as a go to spell (if it's allowed) could be hella fun.
Since the version of Sacred Flame lunar sorcerers get changes it to a multi-target spell, it's not eligible for Twinning.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
DMs might have to consider to allow some proficiency trades on martial characters that are already have the weapon and armor proficiency. They seem to not quite hit the mark with feats that are not variations of magical initiate.
I don't expect Squire of Salami to make it to print as is. I'm trying to wrap my head around what class would actually benefit most from taking it.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Maybe strength rogue, you could have a custom lineage start with 18 str via heavily armored with that background.
I think that they'll go Order of the Lycan. Were you need to go into the character builder when you want to change phase.
Probably the best call
The classes that benefit the most from it are...Sorcerer and Wizard, who now have access to medium armor...
Yeah....
@MidnightPlat I think Kender Ace is a great way to move forward with kender, and it's a bit of a cartoonish ability that meshes really well with them. I'm not as much a fan of taunt, but only because it feels like something that should be a nonmagical generic ability tied to a feat that anyone can access.
3E-era Dragonlance introduced sorcerers and mystics to the novels, but they had no ties to the moons or gods (respectively). Lunar Magic sorcerers don't change phase with the moon(s), but when they finish a long rest. It's essentially a redesign of cosmic sorcerers from 4E.
You don't necessarily need to be "cultured" to know how to use a musical instrument (also, a reminder that Outlander gets it too).
The distribution of schools for the Mages of High Sorcery feels a bit off, only because in 3E Black Robes were enchantment/necromancy, Red Robes were illusion/transmutation, and White Robes were abjuration/divination. Can't really compare it to 2E, since we now have a fraction of the schools that used to exist (White Robes supposedly used to get Conjuration but not Summoning, etc).
I'm curious if the Dragonlance setting will default to "here's what is currently happening in Krynn," since there's a lot that changes with the War of the Lance and Age of Mortals - I don't think we'll see siphoning spell slots from magic items, for example.
I'm really pleased to see WotC actually utilizing HD with mechanics.
Squire is pretty much a garbage Feat for the the type character that it is meant to be taken by.
For Crown I will likely recommend that it grant the ability for an ally to re-roll a failed attack roll instead of advantage. It works out to pretty much the same thing, but without wasting your reaction should they roll well on both dice.
Sword is pretty good as it allows you to help your party members that might be struggling to shake off Fear or Charm effects. Not bad as a Half Feat.
Rose is a good substitute for Inspiring Leader and can use Con instead of Cha which the "Knight" is likely going to have a decent score in. It is also a Half Feat so it helps boost itself either way you go.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
Kender in AD&D Dragonlance had Infravision 30 feet. This is missing in this UA. Taunt seems to be good in the hands of a Swashbuckler Rogue. It can save him. Even a caster can benefit from Taunt if used before he casts on a target.
At least the Kenders has no longer to sabotage the group if played correctly.
Infravision stopped being a thing in D&D in 1999. And Kender don't have darkvision because baseline halflings don't anymore, either.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Knight is better as done, as it stacks well with Fighter, Paladin, several Cleric builds and can even qork woth Rogues, Rangers and Barbarians.
Take the background then the 3 feats as 4/8/12 and you efdectively have 2 subclasses
I dunno, I think somewhere between kleptomania and magical wonder pocket, ace could have been more worldly and less magically grounded. I believe Ace is referring to the old "nothing up my sleeves" declarations used by stage magicians and card sharks (when in fact their sleeves and garments were anything but empty). So the feature itself already does have a sort of "cheat" connotation to it if I'm reading the inspiration behind the language used to name the feature right. Basically make the Kender a sort of Radar O'Reilley from MASH, or a sorta MacGuyver trait. There's this race called Mapach, basically Raccoon folk in the 3rd party Humblewood setting who have this feature called "Scroungecraft" that Ace reminds me of a bit ... Ace would work well/better if they both decriminalized and demystified it.
Cool, sounds like a neat multi class with Circle of Stars Druids.
Yeah, I sort of misspoke my objection there. I know music has degrees of registers from folk to courtly ... in either case I think the all knights are proficient in instruments seems reflective of some IRL historical courtly standards, however the Knights of Solamnia, while themselves revered in song and tale in Krynn ... well one of the cool things about the original DL books, and even the Huma back story, was that the Knights of Solamnia were not by and large a cultured or artistic lot. Rather they were a pretty uncouth set that had a set of legalistic traditions to maintain an exaggerated sense of organizational tradition and integrity. I just don't picture the Knights in any era of Krynn joining together in song. I do picture them gaming, hence my preference to seeing a different proficiency.
I think I see what you're saying. I think what I'm recognizing there as well as the feats in general is that while they can say it's a Dragonlance book with setting specific features, the way they've set up the schools I think balances more to setting agnostic associations of the schools of magic, if that makes sense.
I think a lot of the book will be aligned with whatever's presented in the new novels. I am curious how rich the lore/chronology presented will be. Forgotten Realms lore has been largely nerfed. There's no need to know much about what happened before 5e to play in that world. I think all other settings are presented in a general "evergreen" format, where it's really on the DM to pick up whatever thread the book teases them with and develop it. Dragonlance is loved for its lore, I think, and it's a much tighter lore than the Forgotten Realms (much less books, stays within a limited set of family trees etc) so I am curious how the setting will be "revisted" in 5e ... still likely to only buy the character options though I'm not _that_ curious to want to know beyond some story that will be leaked a few weeks before release.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.