I'm just getting around to actually playing with the new UA, rather than theorizing and making characters. One of the rogues in the group has the Alert feat from the first character origins UA. It's honestly amazing.
With his high dex and the feat bonus, he is consistently rolling the highest in initiative. It's even better if he can pull off a Hide for surprise advantage. So what does he do with it? Gives it to the tank. Then the tank can run in first, and the rogue is set up for Sneak Attacks.
In the rare cases this isn't the plan, he can give the high initiative to the character that needs to get off a control spell first, or a buff, or Hunter's Mark to start the fight with a big hit from the hidden ranger. It's a good feat. Try it out.
People are indeed sleeping on nuAlert. Players in 5e have never had a RAW way to muck with initiative order, so far as I know. Allowing a player to become better at Initiative and then share that being-better is extremely cool; it allows for a greater depth of tactical decision-making and encourages teamwork and actively thinking about your allies' abilities and game plans. Nothing but positive upswings in this rebuild, methinks.
Totally. It feels like a complete game changer in every fight. The rogue in my playtest group isn't having much luck, but this one feat is making such a difference for the party as a whole. It sets them up for success in every combat.
P.s. Thanks for making this post not feel so lonely :)
It's good, but I have playtested it in a game where two characters had it, and it bogged the game down somewhat when starting initiative, as the players start to discuss the various initiative swapping options.
I could see that. I think one of the issues is how few feat options we have at level 1. The fact that everyone gets at least one now means we really need a bigger list. It's already getting weird how many supernaturally 'lucky' or magically talented characters there are because of the limited pool. We need at least double the current amount.
A lot of DMs are too lenient with time during initiative - and rolling initiative is part of "during initiative." A DM can, and oftentimes should, say "You don't have time for this long-winded tactical planning. This is combat, you have seconds to act. What are you doing?"
In the case of multiple people with Alert, I'd step through them in order of their rolled init. "Alice, you rolled 19 - do you want to switch with someone? You switch with Carl? Cool. Bethany, you rolled 17 - do you want to switch with someone? Remember, a person can only switch initiative once, Carl and Alice have already switched." if the players want to set up complex plans for initiative manipulation, that's something to do outside of combat. Either during session as an in-character tactical discussion, or between sessions when the players are working through ideas.
Yeah I can see it taking a little pressure from the DM at first. Eventually it will probably become very quick as the group gets used to their typical tactics.
On a slight tangent, I've heard a number of people online say that initiative takes too much time to roll and they propose ways to quicken it. But I've never had that problem. I wonder what people are doing differently.
For monsters, I usually pre-roll their initiative during the game prep. Or I just use their Dex mod plus 10, sort of like a passive score. It rarely matters enough to worry too much about. Then I just go around the table asking for numbers and fill in the gaps.
I looked at Alert, and you're right, it's great. Proficiency in initiative is a very big deal, and especially being able to have that at first level is great. That being said, while "Initiative Swap" may be a cool ability, I don't see many situations where it can be very helpful. Not only that, but I do worry about "willing allies" who are new players agreeing to swap their turn, and then getting upset about it when they realize it means they go later in the initiative order. That being said, overall, 1DD's version of Alert is great, but its not super overpowered. In my mind at least, it works well as a slightly above average first level feat.
Yeah I don't think it is overpowered. Or underpowered. I think it is amazing because it's just a really solid option that opens up a new way to interact with the game.
Maybe. I guess as much as players sometimes try to tell clerics to heal and not damage. It didn't happen at our table. Either everyone saw the advantage of a swap right away, or someone said 'nah, I'm good,' there was a shrug, and we moved on. But I am aware that not all tables are the same, so it might be something to discuss early on with your players.
I've been playing it on my bard in our playtest group. I love it, and the group loves it. Being able to get a slow tank out of a doorway and up into battle is great. In most rounds I end up swapping with one of the other 5 players. And if I don't feel like swapping with someone, I don't...it's my ability. We've had zero issues with it, and it really does feel like a great enhancement for our party. Highly recommend. Would take again.
so, is this feat good enough that parties will consider it required? that's what i'm beginning to wonder after having played with it as fighter a bit. it seems to come up every single time (and good luck not blatantly table-talking about it). i can't help but wonder if they'll move it over from feats to class perk for some class that has lesser involvement in skill checks (investigation, tracking, stealth, persuasion, etc). some class like... fighter?
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Tactically great feat but as DM I will never ever allow it because it is an absurdly nonsensical non-magic feat that can’t be explained by duh “magic”.
The feat grants you the non-magic ability to swap turn order, how and by what mechanism has it suddenly gifted the recipient of the swap the advantage to increase in turn order?
Our fighter rolled terrible but I want him up front - so because I have a massive dexterity and naturally high initiative and rolled great and I want my sneak attack, I’m swapping turn order with the fighter. how is it the fighter gets my initiative roll you ask? Because well, um, I have this feat that grants me… me not the fighter, look - it’s just written here okay
if people want to play the game with cheat modes on, undying because we have all these re-rolls, taking their turns in the order they desire and not by random chance, then that’s fine.
why not just gift the fighter a high dex score (so as to not be MAD) and advantage on initiative rolls? Because it’s the same thing.
Well, the feat is called 'Alert.' So that's easy in my mind to fill in the gaps. I see this as the character that draws their weapons first the moment they sense danger. They are the one that calls to their friends "Look out!" just before the arrow hits them. They are the one that reads a battlefield so well that they know when it's best to wait a heartbeat before moving. They push the fighter forward, or pull the wizard back by the sleeve of his robes. They are always alert to their surroundings during dangerous situations.
Initiative order breaks down what is an already quick round into super small increments that amount to a fraction of a second. To me, an alert individual is just really good at timing their moves with the party. They are coordinators.
Mechanically, I see it as a much more elegant solution to 'holding your action.'
In the fantasy world, I find it much easier to process Alert as a mundane talent than feats like Musician or Crafter. None of these say they are 'magical,' but one let's you play a song to make your party feel so good they can turn a miss into a hit later that day. Another let's you haggle even the toughest merchant down 20% every time. I don't have a problem with those feats either. One of the most popular feats just plain gives you actual magic.
Everyone has their limits to what they consider 'realistic' in the game. That's totally okay. Alert just isn't close to breaking reality for me.
And that’s where it immediately starts to step on the feet of Fighter, Battle Master, Maneuvers; Commanding Strike & Maneuvering Attack, which a fighter can gain at level 3
Turning a Level 3 class ability into a functionally boosted Level 1 feat available to all comers
Each to their own, but it won’t be happening at my table
Which is fine. I get the hosility, and I'm not gonna try and convince you to run the feat at your table.
What I will say is that R5e's Alert is both busted and dogshit simultaneously and any tactical planning/coordination the players do is at least partially above the table/"metagame-y", because the character's brains exist above the table within the skulls of their players. That's fine. D&D is at its best when it's both an engaging and immersive story and a challenging and engrossing game, and sometimes that means tools the players get to use rather than the characters. At my table, 1DD Alert is much preferred to the busted/dogshit R5e version and is a definitive win of the redux so far.
Right. You gotta do you. I don't expect, nor want, to convince anyone to play in a way they don't enjoy. I only hope to show what I like about some of these changes, and encourage people that are on the fence to at least try them out first.
And that’s where it immediately starts to step on the feet of Fighter, Battle Master, Maneuvers; Commanding Strike & Maneuvering Attack, which a fighter can gain at level 3
Turning a Level 3 class ability into a functionally boosted Level 1 feat available to all comers
Each to their own, but it won’t be happening at my table
How does an ability which allows two players to swap initiative scores at the beginning of combat step on the toes of abilities that allow burning various actions for extra moves or swapping attacks in combat? (And let's be honest -- the mechanical ideas behind those abilities are waaaaaaaay harder to rationalize than someone directing the tank into action.)
Regarding flavor, I'm going to be playing a Circle of Twilight cleric with this feat. The flavor will be that I have "Starsight" which I can choose to gift an ally with. The ally's eyes then gleam with starlight and they can process the present--and perhaps the future--more rapidly.
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I'm just getting around to actually playing with the new UA, rather than theorizing and making characters. One of the rogues in the group has the Alert feat from the first character origins UA. It's honestly amazing.
With his high dex and the feat bonus, he is consistently rolling the highest in initiative. It's even better if he can pull off a Hide for surprise advantage. So what does he do with it? Gives it to the tank. Then the tank can run in first, and the rogue is set up for Sneak Attacks.
In the rare cases this isn't the plan, he can give the high initiative to the character that needs to get off a control spell first, or a buff, or Hunter's Mark to start the fight with a big hit from the hidden ranger. It's a good feat. Try it out.
People are indeed sleeping on nuAlert. Players in 5e have never had a RAW way to muck with initiative order, so far as I know. Allowing a player to become better at Initiative and then share that being-better is extremely cool; it allows for a greater depth of tactical decision-making and encourages teamwork and actively thinking about your allies' abilities and game plans. Nothing but positive upswings in this rebuild, methinks.
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Totally. It feels like a complete game changer in every fight. The rogue in my playtest group isn't having much luck, but this one feat is making such a difference for the party as a whole. It sets them up for success in every combat.
P.s. Thanks for making this post not feel so lonely :)
It's good, but I have playtested it in a game where two characters had it, and it bogged the game down somewhat when starting initiative, as the players start to discuss the various initiative swapping options.
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I could see that. I think one of the issues is how few feat options we have at level 1. The fact that everyone gets at least one now means we really need a bigger list. It's already getting weird how many supernaturally 'lucky' or magically talented characters there are because of the limited pool. We need at least double the current amount.
A lot of DMs are too lenient with time during initiative - and rolling initiative is part of "during initiative." A DM can, and oftentimes should, say "You don't have time for this long-winded tactical planning. This is combat, you have seconds to act. What are you doing?"
In the case of multiple people with Alert, I'd step through them in order of their rolled init. "Alice, you rolled 19 - do you want to switch with someone? You switch with Carl? Cool. Bethany, you rolled 17 - do you want to switch with someone? Remember, a person can only switch initiative once, Carl and Alice have already switched." if the players want to set up complex plans for initiative manipulation, that's something to do outside of combat. Either during session as an in-character tactical discussion, or between sessions when the players are working through ideas.
Please do not contact or message me.
Yeah I can see it taking a little pressure from the DM at first. Eventually it will probably become very quick as the group gets used to their typical tactics.
On a slight tangent, I've heard a number of people online say that initiative takes too much time to roll and they propose ways to quicken it. But I've never had that problem. I wonder what people are doing differently.
For monsters, I usually pre-roll their initiative during the game prep. Or I just use their Dex mod plus 10, sort of like a passive score. It rarely matters enough to worry too much about. Then I just go around the table asking for numbers and fill in the gaps.
I looked at Alert, and you're right, it's great. Proficiency in initiative is a very big deal, and especially being able to have that at first level is great. That being said, while "Initiative Swap" may be a cool ability, I don't see many situations where it can be very helpful. Not only that, but I do worry about "willing allies" who are new players agreeing to swap their turn, and then getting upset about it when they realize it means they go later in the initiative order. That being said, overall, 1DD's version of Alert is great, but its not super overpowered. In my mind at least, it works well as a slightly above average first level feat.
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HERE.Yeah I don't think it is overpowered. Or underpowered. I think it is amazing because it's just a really solid option that opens up a new way to interact with the game.
I can see people wanting to swap with the player with ALERT And the player with Alert NOT wanting to trade and tactical arguments start up.
Maybe. I guess as much as players sometimes try to tell clerics to heal and not damage. It didn't happen at our table. Either everyone saw the advantage of a swap right away, or someone said 'nah, I'm good,' there was a shrug, and we moved on. But I am aware that not all tables are the same, so it might be something to discuss early on with your players.
I've been playing it on my bard in our playtest group. I love it, and the group loves it. Being able to get a slow tank out of a doorway and up into battle is great. In most rounds I end up swapping with one of the other 5 players. And if I don't feel like swapping with someone, I don't...it's my ability. We've had zero issues with it, and it really does feel like a great enhancement for our party. Highly recommend. Would take again.
so, is this feat good enough that parties will consider it required? that's what i'm beginning to wonder after having played with it as fighter a bit. it seems to come up every single time (and good luck not blatantly table-talking about it). i can't help but wonder if they'll move it over from feats to class perk for some class that has lesser involvement in skill checks (investigation, tracking, stealth, persuasion, etc). some class like... fighter?
unhappy at the way in which we lost individual purchases for one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters?
tell them you don't like features disappeared quietly in the night: provide feedback!
Tactically great feat but as DM I will never ever allow it because it is an absurdly nonsensical non-magic feat that can’t be explained by duh “magic”.
The feat grants you the non-magic ability to swap turn order, how and by what mechanism has it suddenly gifted the recipient of the swap the advantage to increase in turn order?
Our fighter rolled terrible but I want him up front - so because I have a massive dexterity and naturally high initiative and rolled great and I want my sneak attack, I’m swapping turn order with the fighter. how is it the fighter gets my initiative roll you ask? Because well, um, I have this feat that grants me… me not the fighter, look - it’s just written here okay
if people want to play the game with cheat modes on, undying because we have all these re-rolls, taking their turns in the order they desire and not by random chance, then that’s fine.
why not just gift the fighter a high dex score (so as to not be MAD) and advantage on initiative rolls? Because it’s the same thing.
Well, the feat is called 'Alert.' So that's easy in my mind to fill in the gaps. I see this as the character that draws their weapons first the moment they sense danger. They are the one that calls to their friends "Look out!" just before the arrow hits them. They are the one that reads a battlefield so well that they know when it's best to wait a heartbeat before moving. They push the fighter forward, or pull the wizard back by the sleeve of his robes. They are always alert to their surroundings during dangerous situations.
Initiative order breaks down what is an already quick round into super small increments that amount to a fraction of a second. To me, an alert individual is just really good at timing their moves with the party. They are coordinators.
Mechanically, I see it as a much more elegant solution to 'holding your action.'
In the fantasy world, I find it much easier to process Alert as a mundane talent than feats like Musician or Crafter. None of these say they are 'magical,' but one let's you play a song to make your party feel so good they can turn a miss into a hit later that day. Another let's you haggle even the toughest merchant down 20% every time. I don't have a problem with those feats either. One of the most popular feats just plain gives you actual magic.
Everyone has their limits to what they consider 'realistic' in the game. That's totally okay. Alert just isn't close to breaking reality for me.
And that’s where it immediately starts to step on the feet of Fighter, Battle Master, Maneuvers; Commanding Strike & Maneuvering Attack, which a fighter can gain at level 3
Turning a Level 3 class ability into a functionally boosted Level 1 feat available to all comers
Each to their own, but it won’t be happening at my table
Which is fine. I get the hosility, and I'm not gonna try and convince you to run the feat at your table.
What I will say is that R5e's Alert is both busted and dogshit simultaneously and any tactical planning/coordination the players do is at least partially above the table/"metagame-y", because the character's brains exist above the table within the skulls of their players. That's fine. D&D is at its best when it's both an engaging and immersive story and a challenging and engrossing game, and sometimes that means tools the players get to use rather than the characters. At my table, 1DD Alert is much preferred to the busted/dogshit R5e version and is a definitive win of the redux so far.
Please do not contact or message me.
Right. You gotta do you. I don't expect, nor want, to convince anyone to play in a way they don't enjoy. I only hope to show what I like about some of these changes, and encourage people that are on the fence to at least try them out first.
How does an ability which allows two players to swap initiative scores at the beginning of combat step on the toes of abilities that allow burning various actions for extra moves or swapping attacks in combat? (And let's be honest -- the mechanical ideas behind those abilities are waaaaaaaay harder to rationalize than someone directing the tank into action.)
Regarding flavor, I'm going to be playing a Circle of Twilight cleric with this feat. The flavor will be that I have "Starsight" which I can choose to gift an ally with. The ally's eyes then gleam with starlight and they can process the present--and perhaps the future--more rapidly.