This is something I realized when reading through the Unearthed Arcanas for One D&D, and thinking back to a recent game I played, due to running into an enemy that couldn't be stunned.
The OneD&D Monk gets a change to their Stunning Strike that deals damage if the target passes their save against the stun. But what strikes me about this is that with the Paladins' and Rogues' options for Smites and Cunning Strikes respectively, both of those classes can choose their pure-damage option instead of the added effect. So...why doesn't the Monk get a simple "one DP = 1dMA+Wis force damage" as an alternate option instead of the pass rider on Stunning Strike? That way you have the certain option with a reliable outcome.
The other problem I foresee is that enemies can be immune to stunning, so in such cases a player would want the enemy to pass their save in order for Stunning Strike to have any added effect. Except the UAs also stated that a creature can choose to fail a saving throw if they wish, so any creature with immunity to being stunned can do so and receive no effect from the DP spent.
This ties into a suggestion I have regarding the Monk, where it seems very disappointing for Stunning Strike to be so limited in usage, but the Rogue and Barbarian get the ability to use two Cunning or Brutal Strike options in one turn. Taking inspiration from the Way of Mercy's 11th-level feature: Why not, instead of 10th level giving a third Flurry of Blows attack for Heightened Discipline, have it give a use of Stunning Strike or other options given by the base class or subclasses with one of your Flurry of Blows hits for no added cost? It gives the Monk a way to use multiple such abilities per turn, and if an option that does straight damage is added, that gives the same impact as the extra hit anyway.
These occurred to me while I was reading the UAs, and while I've heard the new Monk has gotten a lot of approval, this seems like an odd design choice and poor limitation compared to other classes. I imagine the designers read through the official forums, so I hope they do notice this.
So...why doesn't the Monk get a simple "one DP = 1dMA+Wis force damage" as an alternate option instead of the pass rider on Stunning Strike?
Well it kind of is this way. You could look at it as SS is a damage feature with a Stunned rider
I believe immunity to stun is rare so wouldn’t be an issue most of the time.
Edit: I would be more than happy if they gave monks additional options like Cunning/Brutal Strikes as part of Stunning Strike that they could choose from.
Part is that Mercy is supposed to be included in the new release as a Monk subclass, so giving their main feature to the base class is pretty redundant and leaves Mercy in a weird place like Open Hand is with Weapon Mastery.
I also agree that more options for stunning strike should have been included rather than just buffing stunning strike, but it is what it is...
The thing is that Stunning Strike isn’t an independent feature, it’s basically an extension of the level 2 Ki feature, which does have a decent suite of options and some upgrades. Plus Monks tend to get a wider array of extra active features from their subclasses than Rogues do, so working in future options might just oversaturate the class. Honestly, I think they should just roll an unmodified Martial Arts die or just use the DEX mod on a passed save so there’s a trade-off for using a Ki on it rather than saving it for another FoB.
Part is that Mercy is supposed to be included in the new release as a Monk subclass, so giving their main feature to the base class is pretty redundant and leaves Mercy in a weird place like Open Hand is with Weapon Mastery.
I also agree that more options for stunning strike should have been included rather than just buffing stunning strike, but it is what it is...
It's the shift in concept. In 2014, Monk was THE martial controller class, now arguably all the other martial classes are better controllers and Monk is now more of a DPR class. It's not that Monk is bad now, it isn't. It's better than it was in 2014, but it doesn't really fulfill the same niche as it use to.
This is something I realized when reading through the Unearthed Arcanas for One D&D, and thinking back to a recent game I played, due to running into an enemy that couldn't be stunned.
The OneD&D Monk gets a change to their Stunning Strike that deals damage if the target passes their save against the stun. But what strikes me about this is that with the Paladins' and Rogues' options for Smites and Cunning Strikes respectively, both of those classes can choose their pure-damage option instead of the added effect. So...why doesn't the Monk get a simple "one DP = 1dMA+Wis force damage" as an alternate option instead of the pass rider on Stunning Strike? That way you have the certain option with a reliable outcome.
The other problem I foresee is that enemies can be immune to stunning, so in such cases a player would want the enemy to pass their save in order for Stunning Strike to have any added effect. Except the UAs also stated that a creature can choose to fail a saving throw if they wish, so any creature with immunity to being stunned can do so and receive no effect from the DP spent.
This ties into a suggestion I have regarding the Monk, where it seems very disappointing for Stunning Strike to be so limited in usage, but the Rogue and Barbarian get the ability to use two Cunning or Brutal Strike options in one turn. Taking inspiration from the Way of Mercy's 11th-level feature: Why not, instead of 10th level giving a third Flurry of Blows attack for Heightened Discipline, have it give a use of Stunning Strike or other options given by the base class or subclasses with one of your Flurry of Blows hits for no added cost? It gives the Monk a way to use multiple such abilities per turn, and if an option that does straight damage is added, that gives the same impact as the extra hit anyway.
These occurred to me while I was reading the UAs, and while I've heard the new Monk has gotten a lot of approval, this seems like an odd design choice and poor limitation compared to other classes. I imagine the designers read through the official forums, so I hope they do notice this.
Well I don't love the new Stun, but at least you get to keep trying and still do damage if they save. Now as far as a creature volunteering to save. I think the intent for that is when it helps you. Like telekinesis: you don't want to save if it means keeping your from falling into a chasm.
I would rule that if the target is immune to stun, you get the damage rider instead of getting nothing. Though you could easily rule that a stun immune creature is also immune to whatever the monk is doing (hitting a pressure point etc) that would have resulted in a stun in the first place.
I agree with ThriKreenWarrior though - outright stun immunity is so rare (especially below CR 16) that it's really not a big deal no matter which way you rule.
I agree but have been playing with the below in my games which has gone down ok, I should also note my monks instead of the extra attacks get 2martial arts dice equal to their PB (PB2 = d4, pb3= d6 and so on) but this is also tied to a longer story for how I deal with two weapon fighting. Please excuse the writing im sure it could be better worded.
Once per turn when you hit a creature (upto one size bigger than you) with a monk weapon or Unarmed Strike, you can spend 1 Discipline Point to attempt a Stunning strike! The target takes 1 extra Martial arts die in force damage and must make a constitution Saving throw, on a failed save you can choose to forfeit the extra damage and cause the target to have the stunned condition until the end of your next turn.
You can spend extra DP upto a maximum of 3, for every extra DP spent you receive the following benefits.
one level increase in effected target size
1 extra martial art dice in extra force damage
+1 to save DC
If you score a critical hit you can attempt a stunning strike even if you already have during the turn and the first initial DP is free
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
This is something I realized when reading through the Unearthed Arcanas for One D&D, and thinking back to a recent game I played, due to running into an enemy that couldn't be stunned.
The OneD&D Monk gets a change to their Stunning Strike that deals damage if the target passes their save against the stun. But what strikes me about this is that with the Paladins' and Rogues' options for Smites and Cunning Strikes respectively, both of those classes can choose their pure-damage option instead of the added effect. So...why doesn't the Monk get a simple "one DP = 1dMA+Wis force damage" as an alternate option instead of the pass rider on Stunning Strike? That way you have the certain option with a reliable outcome.
The other problem I foresee is that enemies can be immune to stunning, so in such cases a player would want the enemy to pass their save in order for Stunning Strike to have any added effect. Except the UAs also stated that a creature can choose to fail a saving throw if they wish, so any creature with immunity to being stunned can do so and receive no effect from the DP spent.
This ties into a suggestion I have regarding the Monk, where it seems very disappointing for Stunning Strike to be so limited in usage, but the Rogue and Barbarian get the ability to use two Cunning or Brutal Strike options in one turn. Taking inspiration from the Way of Mercy's 11th-level feature: Why not, instead of 10th level giving a third Flurry of Blows attack for Heightened Discipline, have it give a use of Stunning Strike or other options given by the base class or subclasses with one of your Flurry of Blows hits for no added cost? It gives the Monk a way to use multiple such abilities per turn, and if an option that does straight damage is added, that gives the same impact as the extra hit anyway.
These occurred to me while I was reading the UAs, and while I've heard the new Monk has gotten a lot of approval, this seems like an odd design choice and poor limitation compared to other classes. I imagine the designers read through the official forums, so I hope they do notice this.
Well it kind of is this way. You could look at it as SS is a damage feature with a Stunned rider
I believe immunity to stun is rare so wouldn’t be an issue most of the time.
Edit: I would be more than happy if they gave monks additional options like Cunning/Brutal Strikes as part of Stunning Strike that they could choose from.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
Part is that Mercy is supposed to be included in the new release as a Monk subclass, so giving their main feature to the base class is pretty redundant and leaves Mercy in a weird place like Open Hand is with Weapon Mastery.
I also agree that more options for stunning strike should have been included rather than just buffing stunning strike, but it is what it is...
The thing is that Stunning Strike isn’t an independent feature, it’s basically an extension of the level 2 Ki feature, which does have a decent suite of options and some upgrades. Plus Monks tend to get a wider array of extra active features from their subclasses than Rogues do, so working in future options might just oversaturate the class. Honestly, I think they should just roll an unmodified Martial Arts die or just use the DEX mod on a passed save so there’s a trade-off for using a Ki on it rather than saving it for another FoB.
It's the shift in concept. In 2014, Monk was THE martial controller class, now arguably all the other martial classes are better controllers and Monk is now more of a DPR class. It's not that Monk is bad now, it isn't. It's better than it was in 2014, but it doesn't really fulfill the same niche as it use to.
Well I don't love the new Stun, but at least you get to keep trying and still do damage if they save. Now as far as a creature volunteering to save. I think the intent for that is when it helps you. Like telekinesis: you don't want to save if it means keeping your from falling into a chasm.
I would rule that if the target is immune to stun, you get the damage rider instead of getting nothing. Though you could easily rule that a stun immune creature is also immune to whatever the monk is doing (hitting a pressure point etc) that would have resulted in a stun in the first place.
I agree with ThriKreenWarrior though - outright stun immunity is so rare (especially below CR 16) that it's really not a big deal no matter which way you rule.
I agree but have been playing with the below in my games which has gone down ok, I should also note my monks instead of the extra attacks get 2martial arts dice equal to their PB (PB2 = d4, pb3= d6 and so on) but this is also tied to a longer story for how I deal with two weapon fighting. Please excuse the writing im sure it could be better worded.
Once per turn when you hit a creature (upto one size bigger than you) with a monk weapon or Unarmed Strike, you can spend 1 Discipline Point to attempt a Stunning strike! The target takes 1 extra Martial arts die in force damage and must make a constitution Saving throw, on a failed save you can choose to forfeit the extra damage and cause the target to have the stunned condition until the end of your next turn.
You can spend extra DP upto a maximum of 3, for every extra DP spent you receive the following benefits.
one level increase in effected target size
1 extra martial art dice in extra force damage
+1 to save DC
If you score a critical hit you can attempt a stunning strike even if you already have during the turn and the first initial DP is free