I'm planning to do a homebrew mechanic for my warforged wizard. He really wants upgrades. So I'm designing some upgrades he can buy. Some of them will be original ideas, but a lot of them will be based on spells.
How much should it cost, for each level, to buy an upgrade that gives an extra spell, which is always prepared? E.g., how much for a cantrip, how much for level 1, level 2, etc.
These spells will use a different pool of resources to cast, not spell slots, but I will price that appropriately and separately. So you can either assume what things should cost if the spells will require slots to cast.
I'm thinking extra spells are pretty valuable. Maybe cantrips 200 gp. First level also 200 gp, since it's easier to get extra 1st level spells than cantrips, and they will require expending resources to cast. Second level I don't know 300 gp? Maybe it gets steeper from there. 3rd level 500 gp.
The resources he uses to cast them will basically have a gp cost. I'm thinking 20 gp to cast a 1st level spell. I don't want it to be so much that he never wants to do it. Then quite a steep increase, like 50 gp for 2nd level, 100 gp for 3rd level, etc.
Technically that could be easily done if you allowed him to simply buy spell scrolls - there would be no need for homebrew and/or making a feature to work like that if you gave him cantrip scrolls/repeat spell scrolls, as you would be giving him a "secondary" resource to work around.
But, do always consider how would this affect the rest of the party - is the wizard getting additional ways to cast spells something that might undermine the others' abilities?
Just ask him that, as a Fighter, it should be totally fair that you'd get a lv6 spellslot to cast Tenser's Transformation just as the wizard gets to buy additional spellslots. Fair game, amr? :evilesk:
Technically that could be easily done if you allowed him to simply buy spell scrolls - there would be no need for homebrew and/or making a feature to work like that if you gave him cantrip scrolls/repeat spell scrolls, as you would be giving him a "secondary" resource to work around.
But, do always consider how would this affect the rest of the party - is the wizard getting additional ways to cast spells something that might undermine the others' abilities?
This will be a little bit better than buying spell scrolls. A scroll can be used once or copied into your spellbook, but then it will still need to be prepared. This will have the "always prepared" property.
But I guess it's mostly an economics question. This will have a higher up-front cost and a lower per-use cost. For example, if I give him Levitate at 300 gp up front and 50 gp per use, if he uses it 6 times it's roughly the same as if I sold him 6 scrolls of Levitate at 100gp each. So yeah I think I can use this as a price guideline. Thanks!
If I was in a party and the DM allowed a spellcaster to buy permanent additional spell slots, I'd be asking to buy an additional attack.
I mean, I give my players magic items, and even make magic items available for purchase occasionally. I don't have any magic item that gives you an extra attack, but I do have magic items that are suitable for martial classes. Extra attack every turn seems overpowered compared to an extra spell you cast occasionally. But a magic item that gives you an additional use of Action Surge might be fair.
If I was in a party and the DM allowed a spellcaster to buy permanent additional spell slots, I'd be asking to buy an additional attack.
I mean, I give my players magic items, and even make magic items available for purchase occasionally. I don't have any magic item that gives you an extra attack, but I do have magic items that are suitable for martial classes. Extra attack every turn seems overpowered compared to an extra spell you cast occasionally. But a magic item that gives you an additional use of Action Surge might be fair.
But from what you stated, you're giving them additional spells (this is fine - give them all the prepared spells you want) but also spell slots.
A wizard casting fireball can hit every creature in a 20 foot radius for an average 28 damage. Let's say we're hitting 4 creatures - that's 112 damage, with saves for half. Those spells are limited in the number of spell slots that you can cast for a reason. Spell scrolls have high costs for the same reason. Spellcasters are supposed to be limited in how often they can do these things by their spellcasting feature. Essentially you are building in a feature that gives the spellcaster access to constantly produce scrolls.
If you set the gold cost to be too high, they'll never get used. Make them too cheap and they'll get used constantly. As the DM, you determine how much gold the players have at any one time, so effectively you're managing how often they can cast them, but unlike scrolls I'm assuming that the cost of the spell isn't paid until it's cast?
Why not just give them the ability to craft scrolls? That way they have to invest the money into it ahead of time. Otherwise it would make sense for the whole party to give your spellcaster all their money whilst on adventures, so that if they need 5 fireballs in a row then they have access to it. That might be the most powerful strategy, but not much fun for the rest of the group. Another option is to give them a magic item that casts the spells you want them to have access to using charges.
If I was in a party and the DM allowed a spellcaster to buy permanent additional spell slots, I'd be asking to buy an additional attack.
I mean, I give my players magic items, and even make magic items available for purchase occasionally. I don't have any magic item that gives you an extra attack, but I do have magic items that are suitable for martial classes. Extra attack every turn seems overpowered compared to an extra spell you cast occasionally. But a magic item that gives you an additional use of Action Surge might be fair.
But from what you stated, you're giving them additional spells (this is fine - give them all the prepared spells you want) but also spell slots.
The "spells" he buys as upgrades won't use slots. They'll use a different resource. It's basically spell ink, but re-skinned for this character as basically what you would call battery charge. So yeah, if you accumulate a lot of spell ink, maybe you can fire off 5 extra level 1 spells between long rests. I don't think it's game breaking. Higher level spells will cost such inordinate amounts of gp worth of spell ink to cast, so I'm not worried about them spamming more than 1 or 2 at most of them between long rests.
A wizard casting fireball can hit every creature in a 20 foot radius for an average 28 damage. Let's say we're hitting 4 creatures - that's 112 damage, with saves for half. Those spells are limited in the number of spell slots that you can cast for a reason. Spell scrolls have high costs for the same reason. Spellcasters are supposed to be limited in how often they can do these things by their spellcasting feature. Essentially you are building in a feature that gives the spellcaster access to constantly produce scrolls.
If you set the gold cost to be too high, they'll never get used. Make them too cheap and they'll get used constantly. As the DM, you determine how much gold the players have at any one time, so effectively you're managing how often they can cast them, but unlike scrolls I'm assuming that the cost of the spell isn't paid until it's cast?
I'm not really planning to give him fireball as an upgrade. When I say I might be basing some of them on spells, it doesn't mean I will give the player whatever spell he demands. I'm unlikely to give him many spells higher than 2nd level. I'm mostly looking for interesting effect spells that I can re-skin as a technological device.
Why not just give them the ability to craft scrolls? That way they have to invest the money into it ahead of time. Otherwise it would make sense for the whole party to give your spellcaster all their money whilst on adventures, so that if they need 5 fireballs in a row then they have access to it. That might be the most powerful strategy, but not much fun for the rest of the group. Another option is to give them a magic item that casts the spells you want them to have access to using charges.
I guess spell scrolls are a similar mechanic, except for mine bypasses the need for him to spend time to learn the spell and create scrolls. But I like my mechanic. I'm not asking for how I can use RAW for similar effect. I'm asking how to price what's essentially a homebrew magic item. Magic Items grant access to spells all the time.
But, thing is - with scrolls, you'll be able to give them that extra resource - so just give them already owned spells - that's their extra spell resource.
They can prepare the spell they already know, or they can leave the scroll which they don't need prepared - there's also the fact that on the late-time, it'll turn more useful afterwards and more economical, and that you don't have to make them pay for scrolls, you can drop them as loot. What's more, you can use scrolls on a way to keep things on check so that you can keep it all controlled - and know the resources they have and the stakes bound to them.
Extra attack every turn seems overpowered compared to an extra spell you cast occasionally. But a magic item that gives you an additional use of Action Surge might be fair.
Action Surge on a can? No.
Action Surge, aka an extra action, can be hell on some classes, but its hell incarnate for others.
Cue double fireball.
Why not just give them the ability to craft scrolls?
Scribes crying on the corner of the room.
The "spells" he buys as upgrades won't use slots. They'll use a different resource. It's basically spell ink, but re-skinned for this character as basically what you would call battery charge. So yeah, if you accumulate a lot of spell ink, maybe you can fire off 5 extra level 1 spells between long rests. I don't think it's game breaking. Higher level spells will cost such inordinate amounts of gp worth of spell ink to cast, so I'm not worried about them spamming more than 1 or 2 at most of them between long rests.
Addendum on Sorcery Points and how the Wizard would be quite much stepping on the Sorcerer's territory.
Magic Items grant access to spells all the time.
While yes, on a limit, with charges, with the chance of losing an item, and taking an attunement slot that could be used for other stuff - and you'd need to find the item.
While your idea would be a common thought running over which not only would step on other's territory, but also scale off from gold (which is scary), and quite much be... unsavory.
Because, on simple math - you said Levitate (a lv2) spell, would cost 300+50gp, which makes me assume 150*Level and 25*Level per use are the formulas. On higher levels and higher loots, you'll see people just devalue gold for free spell spamming.
Which also reminds me - you can do this just by getting a bag of holding and some glyphs of warding - glyph some spells, get them ready to cast in the bag, and since they're always inside an extraplanar space, they never move from where they were casted - bam, you now have an extra resource for spells! Do note it takes 1h+time of casting of spell and 200gp+the components to get a glyph, as well as two spellslots, one for glyph, one for spell.
I'm planning to do a homebrew mechanic for my warforged wizard. He really wants upgrades. So I'm designing some upgrades he can buy. Some of them will be original ideas, but a lot of them will be based on spells.
How much should it cost, for each level, to buy an upgrade that gives an extra spell, which is always prepared? E.g., how much for a cantrip, how much for level 1, level 2, etc.
These spells will use a different pool of resources to cast, not spell slots, but I will price that appropriately and separately. So you can either assume what things should cost if the spells will require slots to cast.
I'm thinking extra spells are pretty valuable. Maybe cantrips 200 gp. First level also 200 gp, since it's easier to get extra 1st level spells than cantrips, and they will require expending resources to cast. Second level I don't know 300 gp? Maybe it gets steeper from there. 3rd level 500 gp.
The resources he uses to cast them will basically have a gp cost. I'm thinking 20 gp to cast a 1st level spell. I don't want it to be so much that he never wants to do it. Then quite a steep increase, like 50 gp for 2nd level, 100 gp for 3rd level, etc.
Technically that could be easily done if you allowed him to simply buy spell scrolls - there would be no need for homebrew and/or making a feature to work like that if you gave him cantrip scrolls/repeat spell scrolls, as you would be giving him a "secondary" resource to work around.
But, do always consider how would this affect the rest of the party - is the wizard getting additional ways to cast spells something that might undermine the others' abilities?
My Homebrew Spells: Nichuro's Spellcasters Association
If I was in a party and the DM allowed a spellcaster to buy permanent additional spell slots, I'd be asking to buy an additional attack.
Just ask him that, as a Fighter, it should be totally fair that you'd get a lv6 spellslot to cast Tenser's Transformation just as the wizard gets to buy additional spellslots. Fair game, amr? :evilesk:
My Homebrew Spells: Nichuro's Spellcasters Association
This will be a little bit better than buying spell scrolls. A scroll can be used once or copied into your spellbook, but then it will still need to be prepared. This will have the "always prepared" property.
But I guess it's mostly an economics question. This will have a higher up-front cost and a lower per-use cost. For example, if I give him Levitate at 300 gp up front and 50 gp per use, if he uses it 6 times it's roughly the same as if I sold him 6 scrolls of Levitate at 100gp each. So yeah I think I can use this as a price guideline. Thanks!
I mean, I give my players magic items, and even make magic items available for purchase occasionally. I don't have any magic item that gives you an extra attack, but I do have magic items that are suitable for martial classes. Extra attack every turn seems overpowered compared to an extra spell you cast occasionally. But a magic item that gives you an additional use of Action Surge might be fair.
But from what you stated, you're giving them additional spells (this is fine - give them all the prepared spells you want) but also spell slots.
A wizard casting fireball can hit every creature in a 20 foot radius for an average 28 damage. Let's say we're hitting 4 creatures - that's 112 damage, with saves for half. Those spells are limited in the number of spell slots that you can cast for a reason. Spell scrolls have high costs for the same reason. Spellcasters are supposed to be limited in how often they can do these things by their spellcasting feature. Essentially you are building in a feature that gives the spellcaster access to constantly produce scrolls.
If you set the gold cost to be too high, they'll never get used. Make them too cheap and they'll get used constantly. As the DM, you determine how much gold the players have at any one time, so effectively you're managing how often they can cast them, but unlike scrolls I'm assuming that the cost of the spell isn't paid until it's cast?
Why not just give them the ability to craft scrolls? That way they have to invest the money into it ahead of time. Otherwise it would make sense for the whole party to give your spellcaster all their money whilst on adventures, so that if they need 5 fireballs in a row then they have access to it. That might be the most powerful strategy, but not much fun for the rest of the group. Another option is to give them a magic item that casts the spells you want them to have access to using charges.
The "spells" he buys as upgrades won't use slots. They'll use a different resource. It's basically spell ink, but re-skinned for this character as basically what you would call battery charge. So yeah, if you accumulate a lot of spell ink, maybe you can fire off 5 extra level 1 spells between long rests. I don't think it's game breaking. Higher level spells will cost such inordinate amounts of gp worth of spell ink to cast, so I'm not worried about them spamming more than 1 or 2 at most of them between long rests.
I'm not really planning to give him fireball as an upgrade. When I say I might be basing some of them on spells, it doesn't mean I will give the player whatever spell he demands. I'm unlikely to give him many spells higher than 2nd level. I'm mostly looking for interesting effect spells that I can re-skin as a technological device.
I guess spell scrolls are a similar mechanic, except for mine bypasses the need for him to spend time to learn the spell and create scrolls. But I like my mechanic. I'm not asking for how I can use RAW for similar effect. I'm asking how to price what's essentially a homebrew magic item. Magic Items grant access to spells all the time.
But, thing is - with scrolls, you'll be able to give them that extra resource - so just give them already owned spells - that's their extra spell resource.
They can prepare the spell they already know, or they can leave the scroll which they don't need prepared - there's also the fact that on the late-time, it'll turn more useful afterwards and more economical, and that you don't have to make them pay for scrolls, you can drop them as loot. What's more, you can use scrolls on a way to keep things on check so that you can keep it all controlled - and know the resources they have and the stakes bound to them.
Action Surge on a can? No.
Action Surge, aka an extra action, can be hell on some classes, but its hell incarnate for others.
Cue double fireball.
Scribes crying on the corner of the room.Addendum on Sorcery Points and how the Wizard would be quite much stepping on the Sorcerer's territory.
While yes, on a limit, with charges, with the chance of losing an item, and taking an attunement slot that could be used for other stuff - and you'd need to find the item.
While your idea would be a common thought running over which not only would step on other's territory, but also scale off from gold (which is scary), and quite much be... unsavory.
Because, on simple math - you said Levitate (a lv2) spell, would cost 300+50gp, which makes me assume 150*Level and 25*Level per use are the formulas. On higher levels and higher loots, you'll see people just devalue gold for free spell spamming.
My Homebrew Spells: Nichuro's Spellcasters Association
Which also reminds me - you can do this just by getting a bag of holding and some glyphs of warding - glyph some spells, get them ready to cast in the bag, and since they're always inside an extraplanar space, they never move from where they were casted - bam, you now have an extra resource for spells! Do note it takes 1h+time of casting of spell and 200gp+the components to get a glyph, as well as two spellslots, one for glyph, one for spell.
My Homebrew Spells: Nichuro's Spellcasters Association