My group & I wrapped up a campaign mid-December, and will be starting another in the new year, complete with a new setting, and a new ( homebrew ) campaign world.
I've never had much problems coming up with new and ( hopefully novel ) setting worlds - but it's undeniably a lot of work.
I'm wondering what success other DMs might have had involving your players in a collaborative world-building process before?
If so, what scope of decisions have you left with the Players - do your Clerics design their own Gods? Does the backstory of a Character spark the creation of entire Nations and blocks of History in the world? Or do they only fill in the details of a major framework that you've already created?
How have you gone about this? Do you stop the play momentarily to ask the Player a ( relatively simple ) relevant question about the nature of the background world, when needed? Or is it a background offline discussion outside of game play?
What tools, or techniques have you employed?
I have kind of sneakily done this in the past - when I've taken facets of the Characters and used aspects of them to flesh out large parts of the campaign worlds ( e.g. a new Wargorged character caused me to flesh out a detailed history of a War the Party had only heard about as legend; a Pirate character caused me to add the naval history of the same war and how the remnants of defeated the human navies had - over time - become a series of Pirate clans over the centuries; etc. ).
I think how well this would fit a Party would depend on the types of Players you have. Some Players want to discover the world - so they don't want to help write any part of it, wanting it to be a surprise.
So - what has your experience been, and how have you gone about it?
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When I put my world, Lorimir, together I started with the history of the world before the players were involved. This was the stuff of legends and it helped give credence to the names of geographic locations. It helped flesh out how the races came to be in the world, and it helped create some interesting bits of information the players could learn as they traveled. I then fleshed out what the main story arcs were in the game that they were playing. How the arcs came to be, motivations, and how it impacted the world as it had grown since the races started to migrate around the world. This helped form cities, settlements, and locations where the races came to populate, as well as where some of the more powerful creatures would claim as their lairs, broods, and habitats. From there I stopped, the rest of what happened was up to the players and their choices.
The collaborative part was the players' backstories and musings about what they encountered or thought was actually happening. One player made a backstory about his mother trying to resurrect a diety. In this backstory there was a lot of information, 2 pages worth, and it led me to changing the landscape of part of the world. I couldn't pass up the information he gave me and it inspired a whole new story arc that, unfortunately, I've yet to have the players encounter. Another player's backstory involved a fight between his brother and him which, in turn, led to relocating an entire group of npcs. It wasn't a huge impact on my world, but it did give me more of an idea on where I wanted his people to have originated from. A couple of my players had similar backstories where they had been orphaned due to a battle. I was able to take their stories and link it to a near by city and create a desolate area that was being reclaimed as an outpost, they may eventually find themselves in the exact spot where their two people fought.
As to their musings and thoughts, this is where I have my most fun, because it's so organic and makes the players really feel like they have input. I had a villain who was going to be a recurring threat to them, I had it all planned out and was well on the way with the story. A couple of my players decided to elaborate on how this guy may do certain acts and had suffered certain things to make him do these acts. What was going to be a simple story of foiling a bad guy turned into a betrayal arc that had my table ready to strangle me as DM. Another player made a quip about finding an npc that she wanted to have a relationship with and subsequently not being able to go forward with the plan. I decided to make her prediction correct, but instead of being something just as sarcastic in return, I turned it into her personal story arc, travelling across the world and planes. I have another player who has lamented her background, she found out that her past has been stricken from all annuls of history. Every time she comes up with some idea as to why this might be, I toss that into the story, she is literally writing her own story as we go.
There are times where I'll ask the players outright what they think or what they want. The only issue I have with that one is the amount of foreshadowing it gives and it feels like it removes some of the dramatic impact. However, when I really do get stuck, writers block, or the players do something that I don't expect, I have no problem asking them what they think. The quirk about it that I've been trying to implement with it, to make it feel more natural, is instead of asking it as DM to Player, I try to have an npc talk to them in character. This way it feels more like the world they're in will be reacting to their input rather than the DM scripting events to meet their expectations.
Not sure if this helps but, if it does, good luck and have fun with this new adventure!
DMThac0! What a surprise you would be one to contribute. Usually you and I have such different approaches to the game ;) :D
Your approach is pretty much how I set up the last campaign - large historical stokes, filled in finer detail retroactively based on Player choices and ideas. I think that's a pretty good way to do it.
I didn't create world-to-match-the-stoyline ahead of time like that, since - as you know - I don't know the story ahead of time any more than my Players do, but I have quickly written in the parts of the world they are travelling towards so it's filled in when they get there.
I think I'm playing with the idea of giving the Players larger creative input, if they want it, for larger aspects of the world. For example, if I had a Player say "You know, it would be cool if Spelljammers were a thing in this world, and the Gith played a role as sky pirates", then - so long as that was logically consistent with the established canon, and that no one objected, I'd put that in. I'd still be the one creating the details of the Worlds that are part of the "sky pirates'" domains, their clans, factions, notable NPCs, conflicts, and a double handful of story hooks without the Players - since the fun part for the Players is discovering those things.
I don't know if my Players would even exercise that option - clearly that's a discussion point for our upcoming Session Zero - but I was wondering if anyone else had tried that sort of thing, and - if so - with what level of success.
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
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My group & I wrapped up a campaign mid-December, and will be starting another in the new year, complete with a new setting, and a new ( homebrew ) campaign world.
I've never had much problems coming up with new and ( hopefully novel ) setting worlds - but it's undeniably a lot of work.
I'm wondering what success other DMs might have had involving your players in a collaborative world-building process before?
If so, what scope of decisions have you left with the Players - do your Clerics design their own Gods? Does the backstory of a Character spark the creation of entire Nations and blocks of History in the world? Or do they only fill in the details of a major framework that you've already created?
How have you gone about this? Do you stop the play momentarily to ask the Player a ( relatively simple ) relevant question about the nature of the background world, when needed? Or is it a background offline discussion outside of game play?
What tools, or techniques have you employed?
I have kind of sneakily done this in the past - when I've taken facets of the Characters and used aspects of them to flesh out large parts of the campaign worlds ( e.g. a new Wargorged character caused me to flesh out a detailed history of a War the Party had only heard about as legend; a Pirate character caused me to add the naval history of the same war and how the remnants of defeated the human navies had - over time - become a series of Pirate clans over the centuries; etc. ).
I think how well this would fit a Party would depend on the types of Players you have. Some Players want to discover the world - so they don't want to help write any part of it, wanting it to be a surprise.
So - what has your experience been, and how have you gone about it?
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
When I put my world, Lorimir, together I started with the history of the world before the players were involved. This was the stuff of legends and it helped give credence to the names of geographic locations. It helped flesh out how the races came to be in the world, and it helped create some interesting bits of information the players could learn as they traveled. I then fleshed out what the main story arcs were in the game that they were playing. How the arcs came to be, motivations, and how it impacted the world as it had grown since the races started to migrate around the world. This helped form cities, settlements, and locations where the races came to populate, as well as where some of the more powerful creatures would claim as their lairs, broods, and habitats. From there I stopped, the rest of what happened was up to the players and their choices.
The collaborative part was the players' backstories and musings about what they encountered or thought was actually happening. One player made a backstory about his mother trying to resurrect a diety. In this backstory there was a lot of information, 2 pages worth, and it led me to changing the landscape of part of the world. I couldn't pass up the information he gave me and it inspired a whole new story arc that, unfortunately, I've yet to have the players encounter. Another player's backstory involved a fight between his brother and him which, in turn, led to relocating an entire group of npcs. It wasn't a huge impact on my world, but it did give me more of an idea on where I wanted his people to have originated from. A couple of my players had similar backstories where they had been orphaned due to a battle. I was able to take their stories and link it to a near by city and create a desolate area that was being reclaimed as an outpost, they may eventually find themselves in the exact spot where their two people fought.
As to their musings and thoughts, this is where I have my most fun, because it's so organic and makes the players really feel like they have input. I had a villain who was going to be a recurring threat to them, I had it all planned out and was well on the way with the story. A couple of my players decided to elaborate on how this guy may do certain acts and had suffered certain things to make him do these acts. What was going to be a simple story of foiling a bad guy turned into a betrayal arc that had my table ready to strangle me as DM. Another player made a quip about finding an npc that she wanted to have a relationship with and subsequently not being able to go forward with the plan. I decided to make her prediction correct, but instead of being something just as sarcastic in return, I turned it into her personal story arc, travelling across the world and planes. I have another player who has lamented her background, she found out that her past has been stricken from all annuls of history. Every time she comes up with some idea as to why this might be, I toss that into the story, she is literally writing her own story as we go.
There are times where I'll ask the players outright what they think or what they want. The only issue I have with that one is the amount of foreshadowing it gives and it feels like it removes some of the dramatic impact. However, when I really do get stuck, writers block, or the players do something that I don't expect, I have no problem asking them what they think. The quirk about it that I've been trying to implement with it, to make it feel more natural, is instead of asking it as DM to Player, I try to have an npc talk to them in character. This way it feels more like the world they're in will be reacting to their input rather than the DM scripting events to meet their expectations.
Not sure if this helps but, if it does, good luck and have fun with this new adventure!
DMThac0! What a surprise you would be one to contribute. Usually you and I have such different approaches to the game ;) :D
Your approach is pretty much how I set up the last campaign - large historical stokes, filled in finer detail retroactively based on Player choices and ideas. I think that's a pretty good way to do it.
I didn't create world-to-match-the-stoyline ahead of time like that, since - as you know - I don't know the story ahead of time any more than my Players do, but I have quickly written in the parts of the world they are travelling towards so it's filled in when they get there.
I think I'm playing with the idea of giving the Players larger creative input, if they want it, for larger aspects of the world. For example, if I had a Player say "You know, it would be cool if Spelljammers were a thing in this world, and the Gith played a role as sky pirates", then - so long as that was logically consistent with the established canon, and that no one objected, I'd put that in. I'd still be the one creating the details of the Worlds that are part of the "sky pirates'" domains, their clans, factions, notable NPCs, conflicts, and a double handful of story hooks without the Players - since the fun part for the Players is discovering those things.
I don't know if my Players would even exercise that option - clearly that's a discussion point for our upcoming Session Zero - but I was wondering if anyone else had tried that sort of thing, and - if so - with what level of success.
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.