Having an issue in my game with multiclassing and sneak attack.
Given the rules as I understand them to gain sneak attack: 1 way you get in with any advantage on an attack but you have to use the right weapons Ex: finesse weapons dagger, short sword, whip, or rapier or any ranged weapon. 2nd way when you surprise an enemy. 3rd way you attack an enemy when their actively engaged in combat with another of your alley when they're within 5ft. There's a discussion now that a familiar (a flying owl) who gave aid/help to their wizard/rogue then have advantage on his ranged attack but isn't a combatant/can't attack therefore does not give wizard/rogue sneak attack damage. The owls not actively (rolled no initiative) involved in the fight/engaging the enemy of it's alley.
What says the community? I ruled no sneak attack but would like some feedback.
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Sometimes a Nat 1 tells a better story than a Nat 20 ever could.
In short, whilst the familiar can't attack, it can take the help action to grant the owner advantage on their attack. It also counts as an allied creature in terms of sneak attack. Note that the familiar is likely to get attacked by the monsters.
You don’t need advantage on the attack roll if another enemy of the target is within 5 feet of it, that enemy isn’t incapacitated, and you don’t have disadvantage on the attack roll.
So, a familiar, assuming it is an enemy of that target, can grant sneak attack to the wizard/rogue. Whether it can attack or not is not a factor.
Keep in mind that it has to be a ranged weapon attack, spells don't count. So a more useful multi-class would be a Ranger Beast Master or a Druid with animal summons. You can also select the Swashbuckler Rogue subclass which allows you to get sneak attack as long as you there isn't another enemy with 5ft of you and you don't has disadvantage.
If you still want a familiar you I would recommend going with Warlock and select Pact of Chain, that way you can select Imp, Quasit, or Sprite as your familiar. Plus these three also can cast invisibility on themselves to make it easier for them to more around.
Since the Find Familiar spell says that familiars can't attack, I would agree that they shouldn't count as an enemy (doesn't have to be your ally) to the creature you're targeting with a sneak attack...
A familiar summoned by that spell always fights on its master's side and will do its best to oppose its master's enemies as commanded (including delivering touch spells, taking the Help action or using special actions granted by spells like Dragon's Breath.) If the spell allowed it to attack, it would do so if commanded.
Not considering a familiar an enemy of your enemy is going to have all sorts of silly side effects, like making it immune to opportunity attacks and allowing enemies to pass through its space.
It's fine if you want to change things for your game but officially familiars do count as enemies of the target and this has been cleared up by the very people who created the game. So if you're going to be changing things for your game, I do hope you inform your players before they choose rogues to play.
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I was not intending to change rules that's simply how I learned and play with familiars but this is my first time they've ever had sneak attack aid.
My apologies, my post was in reply to Brian_Avery, not yourself. I am sorry for any confusion caused.
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I should clarify, I mean for the purposes of determining if an enemy is within 5 feet of the creature you wish to sneak attack, since A familiar can't attack and therefore poses no threat to the creature.
A familiar is a threat since it can deliver spells or aid other creatures. Also, many targets would have no idea what a familiar is or that it can't attack. The requirement of having an enemy of the target within 5 feet represents a close distraction.
The rules only care about your target having an enemy within 5 feet that isn't incapacitated. A familiar is an enemy of the target. It doesn't matter that it can't make attacks.
...Given the rules as I understand them to gain sneak attack: 1 way you get in with any advantage on an attack but you have to use the right weapons Ex: finesse weapons dagger, short sword, whip, or rapier or any ranged weapon. 2nd way when you surprise an enemy. 3rd way you attack an enemy when their actively engaged in combat with another of your ally when they're within 5ft...
I think there are only two methods for a normal rogue to get their sneak bonus: advantage on the attack, or other enemy of target within 5ft (not incapacitated). Surprise is not a source of sneak attack; for the Assassin subclass surprise can be a source of advantage so that would roll it in with method 1. Also note that both these methods are reliant on the weapon used being finesse and/or ranged.
I won't engage too heavily with the familiar debate, just to say I vote it does add the sneak bonus. If a wizard has chosen to send their familiar into close range then I would assume it is always either for them to deliver a spell (a threat) or to create a diversion (like via the Help action). If the familiar hangs around there then it can grant sneak support, but I would also guarantee that on the next monster's turn that familiar is toast. Something small and weak is interfering with your combat effectiveness? Crush it.
i’m just saying that if i have an owl flutter in my face, i’m less likely to see the dagger going in my side. owl “helps” provide a distraction for the sneak attack.
If you wonder why owls and the invisible warlock pact of the chain familiars are the most popular ... this is because both can perform the help action to give the rogue advantage on the attack while not suffering opportunity attacks. The owl has fly by so they can't be subject to opportunity attacks while the invisible ones can't be opp attacked because they can't be seen.
As a rogue, the arcane trickster is a reasonable choice to obtain the find familiar spell. Also, the elven arcane trickster rogue/bladesinger wizard multiclass can be very good for a more magic heavy rogue.
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Having an issue in my game with multiclassing and sneak attack.
Given the rules as I understand them to gain sneak attack: 1 way you get in with any advantage on an attack but you have to use the right weapons Ex: finesse weapons dagger, short sword, whip, or rapier or any ranged weapon. 2nd way when you surprise an enemy. 3rd way you attack an enemy when their actively engaged in combat with another of your alley when they're within 5ft. There's a discussion now that a familiar (a flying owl) who gave aid/help to their wizard/rogue then have advantage on his ranged attack but isn't a combatant/can't attack therefore does not give wizard/rogue sneak attack damage. The owls not actively (rolled no initiative) involved in the fight/engaging the enemy of it's alley.
What says the community? I ruled no sneak attack but would like some feedback.
Sometimes a Nat 1 tells a better story than a Nat 20 ever could.
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D&D Beyond FoundersHere's some rulings on this for you:
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/12/02/two-familiar-questions/
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/11/25/can-a-familiar-use-help-to-grant-advantage-at-range/
In short, whilst the familiar can't attack, it can take the help action to grant the owner advantage on their attack. It also counts as an allied creature in terms of sneak attack. Note that the familiar is likely to get attacked by the monsters.
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The rule on Sneak Attack says:
So, a familiar, assuming it is an enemy of that target, can grant sneak attack to the wizard/rogue. Whether it can attack or not is not a factor.
Keep in mind that it has to be a ranged weapon attack, spells don't count. So a more useful multi-class would be a Ranger Beast Master or a Druid with animal summons. You can also select the Swashbuckler Rogue subclass which allows you to get sneak attack as long as you there isn't another enemy with 5ft of you and you don't has disadvantage.
If you still want a familiar you I would recommend going with Warlock and select Pact of Chain, that way you can select Imp, Quasit, or Sprite as your familiar. Plus these three also can cast invisibility on themselves to make it easier for them to more around.
The Forum Infestation (TM)
It's fine if you want to change things for your game but officially familiars do count as enemies of the target and this has been cleared up by the very people who created the game. So if you're going to be changing things for your game, I do hope you inform your players before they choose rogues to play.
Click ✨ HERE ✨ For My Youtube Videos featuring Guides, Tips & Tricks for using D&D Beyond.
Need help with Homebrew? Check out ✨ this FAQ/Guide thread ✨ by IamSposta.
I was not intending to change rules that's simply how I learned and play with familiars but this is my first time they've ever had sneak attack aid.
Consensus being although they can't attack, which I don't see how delivering a spell isn't attacking, they are able to give sneak attack.
Also they should always roll initiative as well regardless of be able to attack their actions are separate from their alley/owner.
Thanks guys.
P.s. thanks Brian hopefully I can use this in our game.
Sometimes a Nat 1 tells a better story than a Nat 20 ever could.
Click ✨ HERE ✨ For My Youtube Videos featuring Guides, Tips & Tricks for using D&D Beyond.
Need help with Homebrew? Check out ✨ this FAQ/Guide thread ✨ by IamSposta.
A familiar is a threat since it can deliver spells or aid other creatures. Also, many targets would have no idea what a familiar is or that it can't attack. The requirement of having an enemy of the target within 5 feet represents a close distraction.
The rules only care about your target having an enemy within 5 feet that isn't incapacitated. A familiar is an enemy of the target. It doesn't matter that it can't make attacks.
The Forum Infestation (TM)
i’m just saying that if i have an owl flutter in my face, i’m less likely to see the dagger going in my side. owl “helps” provide a distraction for the sneak attack.
Merry 1st lv halfling rogue
”Neverwinter” Johnson 1st lv human rogue
If you wonder why owls and the invisible warlock pact of the chain familiars are the most popular ... this is because both can perform the help action to give the rogue advantage on the attack while not suffering opportunity attacks. The owl has fly by so they can't be subject to opportunity attacks while the invisible ones can't be opp attacked because they can't be seen.
As a rogue, the arcane trickster is a reasonable choice to obtain the find familiar spell. Also, the elven arcane trickster rogue/bladesinger wizard multiclass can be very good for a more magic heavy rogue.