I found a thread created by craft778 titled "Copying Spell scrolls" and found the discussion interesting.
From the thread and RAW from SRD, PHB, XGtE and DMG there is a strong case to there being different sets of rules being applied depending on the source material (in-game source not talking about the books) used to copy.
Some form of documentation like a Spellbook
Spell Scroll
Leveling Up (no clear explanation)
RAW clearly defines costs of the first two methods and the third method suggests offscreen time and no material/cost/expenses.
This lead me to ask, "what other methods are out there"? What are your thoughts?
I can think of 3 other methods: being tutored, experimentation and being inspired (divine or otherwise).
My take on being tutored opens up to using less/more time than the stated 2 hours per spell level depending on how competent the tutor is to conveying the intricacies of the spell to your character. Gold cost is at DM's discretion. but I would like to think that it can vary from having no cost (tutor covering expenses) to a high gold price to cover materials used + tutor's labor.
Re: Experimentation - obviously it should take longer than 2 hrs and the 50 GP per spell level. What are your thoughts about this? When can this be done? How long and how much?
RE: Being inspired. Can be anywhere from a handout from relevant your lore relevant God to witnessing an act of nature (think of existing spells, lightning bolt, web etc.) No idea where to take this, it can even fall under experimentation. Love to hear/read your thoughts.
You are forgetting that you get spells when you level up as well. No gold cost, no downtime. The material cost is to cover the special paper and ink that is required to put a spell in your spell book. I don't really see a way around that. Even if you were to be gifted knowledge of a spell Wizards are still required to spend the components to write them down. This goes for if a wizard creates a spell too unless it is at a level up as previously mentioned.
Also, being totally honest, your DM can give you spells however they want. If that is via a scroll, a book, tutoring, or a wall carving. The big thing with the Wizard is that it should always cost the material components to put it into your spell book.
Anything outside the 3 you list (Book, Scroll, Level) would be homebrew up to the DM to implement, but here are my thoughts on how I would adjudicate it, if I were asked:
Tutoring: a wizard could be tutored by another wizard only, and only for a spell the other wizard knows (basically, borrowing that wizards spellbook). Cost and time would still apply to transcribe the information, plus any bargain made with the tutor (gold, an item or service, etc)
Experimentation: I'd allow this; but the wizard would need 1) the gold/time for each attempt to learn the spell, 2) in-game inspiration (so, you have to have seen the spell cast, or seen a natural event that is similar, etc), 3) would have to be able to cast the spell (on the spell list and an appropriate level) and 4) at the end of the period, I'd require an Intelligence (Arcana) check equal to 12+ the spells level (12 + 0 for a cantrip). If they succeed, they learn the spell. If they fail, they lose the spell, the gold, the time, and they roll on the spell scroll mishap table in the DMG and see what happens.
Divine Inspiration: I'd allow this when I want to (as a DM) when it fits to the story, limited to a single casting (like a spell scroll), but not for permanent learning, unless it was the reward for a divine quest or something. In this case, no knowledge or gold would be required to use it (if a one-off) or learn and transcribe (if permanent).
I usually assume that you could learn some spells when you level up from these 3 methods you explained. You were studying some things, analyzing some formulae and suddenly cracked the code, learning this new spell. It could by experimentation, by being tutored by someone else or even though divine inspiration, but at my tables we represent this on level ups.
I'm specifically trying to address the need/want for the Wizard to attain specific spells beyond what is gained at level up and the random roll for spell scroll loot. The thing with gaining spells upon level up is that most people will choose the brain dead obvious/staple spells such as Fireball, counterspell, polymorph etc.
I'm talking about flavor spells such as secret chest that would (in most part) not see game play. Unlike WIS and CHA based spell casters - I would argue that the Wizard is a GP/Gold based spellcaster and the setting of the game itself may further restrict the wizard's access to spells. A high magic setting game may have some low level spells available in the capital city shops but otherwise it'll be roll of he dice.
Why can't there be a downtime activity for Wizards to learn new spells without the need to level up?
I found a thread created by craft778 titled "Copying Spell scrolls" and found the discussion interesting.
From the thread and RAW from SRD, PHB, XGtE and DMG there is a strong case to there being different sets of rules being applied depending on the source material (in-game source not talking about the books) used to copy.
RAW clearly defines costs of the first two methods and the third method suggests offscreen time and no material/cost/expenses.
This lead me to ask, "what other methods are out there"? What are your thoughts?
I can think of 3 other methods: being tutored, experimentation and being inspired (divine or otherwise).
My take on being tutored opens up to using less/more time than the stated 2 hours per spell level depending on how competent the tutor is to conveying the intricacies of the spell to your character. Gold cost is at DM's discretion. but I would like to think that it can vary from having no cost (tutor covering expenses) to a high gold price to cover materials used + tutor's labor.
Re: Experimentation - obviously it should take longer than 2 hrs and the 50 GP per spell level. What are your thoughts about this? When can this be done? How long and how much?
RE: Being inspired. Can be anywhere from a handout from relevant your lore relevant God to witnessing an act of nature (think of existing spells, lightning bolt, web etc.) No idea where to take this, it can even fall under experimentation. Love to hear/read your thoughts.
You are forgetting that you get spells when you level up as well. No gold cost, no downtime. The material cost is to cover the special paper and ink that is required to put a spell in your spell book. I don't really see a way around that. Even if you were to be gifted knowledge of a spell Wizards are still required to spend the components to write them down. This goes for if a wizard creates a spell too unless it is at a level up as previously mentioned.
Also, being totally honest, your DM can give you spells however they want. If that is via a scroll, a book, tutoring, or a wall carving. The big thing with the Wizard is that it should always cost the material components to put it into your spell book.
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Anything outside the 3 you list (Book, Scroll, Level) would be homebrew up to the DM to implement, but here are my thoughts on how I would adjudicate it, if I were asked:
Tutoring: a wizard could be tutored by another wizard only, and only for a spell the other wizard knows (basically, borrowing that wizards spellbook). Cost and time would still apply to transcribe the information, plus any bargain made with the tutor (gold, an item or service, etc)
Experimentation: I'd allow this; but the wizard would need 1) the gold/time for each attempt to learn the spell, 2) in-game inspiration (so, you have to have seen the spell cast, or seen a natural event that is similar, etc), 3) would have to be able to cast the spell (on the spell list and an appropriate level) and 4) at the end of the period, I'd require an Intelligence (Arcana) check equal to 12+ the spells level (12 + 0 for a cantrip). If they succeed, they learn the spell. If they fail, they lose the spell, the gold, the time, and they roll on the spell scroll mishap table in the DMG and see what happens.
Divine Inspiration: I'd allow this when I want to (as a DM) when it fits to the story, limited to a single casting (like a spell scroll), but not for permanent learning, unless it was the reward for a divine quest or something. In this case, no knowledge or gold would be required to use it (if a one-off) or learn and transcribe (if permanent).
I usually assume that you could learn some spells when you level up from these 3 methods you explained. You were studying some things, analyzing some formulae and suddenly cracked the code, learning this new spell. It could by experimentation, by being tutored by someone else or even though divine inspiration, but at my tables we represent this on level ups.
Thanks for the replies.
I'm specifically trying to address the need/want for the Wizard to attain specific spells beyond what is gained at level up and the random roll for spell scroll loot. The thing with gaining spells upon level up is that most people will choose the brain dead obvious/staple spells such as Fireball, counterspell, polymorph etc.
I'm talking about flavor spells such as secret chest that would (in most part) not see game play. Unlike WIS and CHA based spell casters - I would argue that the Wizard is a GP/Gold based spellcaster and the setting of the game itself may further restrict the wizard's access to spells. A high magic setting game may have some low level spells available in the capital city shops but otherwise it'll be roll of he dice.
Why can't there be a downtime activity for Wizards to learn new spells without the need to level up?
There is...you find them and copy them into your spell book...anything else is homebrew by the DM