Kudos to whomever on the design team thought this subclass up. It's not even that the idea of a monk that can heal is super clever and original; it's the theme that I enjoy so much.
I wish to state that I agree, with the caveat that I really wish there were some more reliable ways to get the poisoned or incapacitated conditions on people to trigger the bonus damage on hands of harm. It's a very cool mechanic using underutilized tools in the arsenal and I love it.
It’s actually super easy to get the incapacitated condition as stunned grants it... So a level 5 Mercy Monk can do a lot of damage with great Ki efficiency:
I mean I feel you, but that's still not great and I'd rather not have to spend the ki. We really don't get much without constant short rests.
I’m curious as to what you are prioritising with you Ki over this?
Stunning Strike is amazing, one of the core reasons to play Monk really. So with that why would you not spend 1ki to make your bonus action 4x more powerful (especially when you’ll have advantage)!
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
D&D, Youth Work and the Priesthood sadly do not typically interact... I do what I can!
Obviously you can't be a main throughput healer like Life Cleric but you know, it's still good to have some in the bank when the time comes to yoyo for a while.
Obviously you can't be a main throughput healer like Life Cleric but you know, it's still good to have some in the bank when the time comes to yoyo for a while.
Ah, despite the intention I don’t think the healing is good or efficient enough to shift Monk from utility/damage support into healer - I’d more see the (1ki Martial Arts die + your Wisdom modifier) heal as an extra thing you can do to help people in a pinch...
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
D&D, Youth Work and the Priesthood sadly do not typically interact... I do what I can!
If they healed for one it'd still be usable, there's nearly no downside to going down and then getting up then going down. It's why action economy is such an important issue. 10 guys doing 1 damage kill you faster than 1 guy doing 10 damage after all
I’m not denying that it is a very useful thing to have... but probably not what I’d spend all my ki on.
I’m probably going to take Mercy rather than Kensei now on my spear fighting Eldritch Knight multiclass...
It’d be amazing to do a Booming Blade punch (which I’m 90% sure is fine RAW as long as I’m also holding a weapon) on a stunned target whilst also using Hands of Harm. Be amazing to crit with: 8d4+4 & 4d8 (then Monk disengage which if they follow is another 2d8... max 84 damage on one attack... just need to be lv5+)
Edit: would you rule that the Hands of Healing could be delivered through a familiar? (RAW obviously not...)
My personal solution: The grung race applies poisoned on touch if they fail a DC12 con save. It’s pretty cool, especially when you start multi-attacking.
That is inevitable when talking about mechanics, which let be fair the majority of class and subclass options are all about. Flavor is whatever you make it.
My main is a spear fighting sailor, he is not knowledgeable of things beyond the ways of the sea but has a love of freedom and adventure. He has been granted some magical powers by a god who saved him in a storm, but he doesn't know who that god is or why it saved him; these powers he has to figure out by trial and error because he doesn't know magic, but as he is starting to learn the identity of the god, he has been sent an aid to guide him (Hawk Familiar)... now the mechanics of that are: Mark of the Passage Human, Monk 2/ Eldritch Knight 3
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
D&D, Youth Work and the Priesthood sadly do not typically interact... I do what I can!
I made a grung way of mercy monk and it's great. I'm working on adding more poisons to my repitore but as of now every punch is a con save with hands of harm potential behind it
One reason why I really love way of mercy is the flurry of blows heal option. It's pretty much better in every way to the hands of mercy action, and there's nothing saying you can't use it on yourself. It's basically just spending a ki for free health, which, in a party where the monk is the best tank you got, is very helpful.
I like that this class path feels very balanced from the start. It gives a way to heal or harm with ki but it's not brokenly able to do big surges nor does it feel stronger or weaker than most of the monk paths out there. I specifically like that the poison aura affects all creatures as poison powder or murderous energy emanating from a monk would. It really works thematically with the monk being surrounded by enemies as we often like to imagine a martial artist. Generally monks in melee (Whom have no physical damage resist and lower AC compared to other tanks) die pretty quick if they try this, but the poison auras ability to impose disadvantage on statistically some of the enemies for a while is just the right amount of boon for the monk and the party to justify letting monk go kick arse in melee all by their lonesome.
"My personal solution: The grung race applies poisoned on touch if they fail a DC12 con save. It’s pretty cool, especially when you start multi-attacking."
I'd probably still choose Aarakocra, but the fact that any other race is even considered for a melee monk, is the best news I've ever heard from an optimization argument. Also it makes sense that a Grung adventurer would become a monk, so thank you for pointing out that this might let that race get some visibility rather than being buried and forgotten like most of the lesser known races out there.
It’s actually super easy to get the incapacitated condition as stunned grants it... So a level 5 Mercy Monk can do a lot of damage with great Ki efficiency:
"My personal solution: The grung race applies poisoned on touch if they fail a DC12 con save. It’s pretty cool, especially when you start multi-attacking."
I'd probably still choose Aarakocra, but the fact that any other race is even considered for a melee monk, is the best news I've ever heard from an optimization argument. Also it makes sense that a Grung adventurer would become a monk, so thank you for pointing out that this might let that race get some visibility rather than being buried and forgotten like most of the lesser known races out there.
i've actually got a kobold monk going into a game. It doesn't need strength really and it's suitable for solid damage in a small package. It also let's me consider wisdom ASI's earlier which suits my playstyle anyway to get my DC's higher earlier on. Specially if the DM says that I can pick up the Eldritch Claw tattoo which I'm waiting to hear back on.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Kudos to whomever on the design team thought this subclass up. It's not even that the idea of a monk that can heal is super clever and original; it's the theme that I enjoy so much.
"The Epic Level Handbook wasn't that bad, guys.
Guys, pls."
I wish to state that I agree, with the caveat that I really wish there were some more reliable ways to get the poisoned or incapacitated conditions on people to trigger the bonus damage on hands of harm. It's a very cool mechanic using underutilized tools in the arsenal and I love it.
2x 2h Spear Attack = 2d8 damage... with Stunning Strike 1Ki (hopefully once)
Then BA Hands of Harm 1ki (4d6 damage)
Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
I mean I feel you, but that's still not great and I'd rather not have to spend the ki. We really don't get much without constant short rests.
I’m curious as to what you are prioritising with you Ki over this?
Stunning Strike is amazing, one of the core reasons to play Monk really. So with that why would you not spend 1ki to make your bonus action 4x more powerful (especially when you’ll have advantage)!
In Way of Mercy? Healing.
Obviously you can't be a main throughput healer like Life Cleric but you know, it's still good to have some in the bank when the time comes to yoyo for a while.
Ah, despite the intention I don’t think the healing is good or efficient enough to shift Monk from utility/damage support into healer - I’d more see the (1ki Martial Arts die + your Wisdom modifier) heal as an extra thing you can do to help people in a pinch...
If they healed for one it'd still be usable, there's nearly no downside to going down and then getting up then going down. It's why action economy is such an important issue. 10 guys doing 1 damage kill you faster than 1 guy doing 10 damage after all
I’m not denying that it is a very useful thing to have... but probably not what I’d spend all my ki on.
I’m probably going to take Mercy rather than Kensei now on my spear fighting Eldritch Knight multiclass...
It’d be amazing to do a Booming Blade punch (which I’m 90% sure is fine RAW as long as I’m also holding a weapon) on a stunned target whilst also using Hands of Harm. Be amazing to crit with: 8d4+4 & 4d8 (then Monk disengage which if they follow is another 2d8... max 84 damage on one attack... just need to be lv5+)
Edit: would you rule that the Hands of Healing could be delivered through a familiar? (RAW obviously not...)
My personal solution: The grung race applies poisoned on touch if they fail a DC12 con save. It’s pretty cool, especially when you start multi-attacking.
Should I be surprised this turned into an optimization argument?
"The Epic Level Handbook wasn't that bad, guys.
Guys, pls."
That is inevitable when talking about mechanics, which let be fair the majority of class and subclass options are all about. Flavor is whatever you make it.
My main is a spear fighting sailor, he is not knowledgeable of things beyond the ways of the sea but has a love of freedom and adventure. He has been granted some magical powers by a god who saved him in a storm, but he doesn't know who that god is or why it saved him; these powers he has to figure out by trial and error because he doesn't know magic, but as he is starting to learn the identity of the god, he has been sent an aid to guide him (Hawk Familiar)... now the mechanics of that are: Mark of the Passage Human, Monk 2/ Eldritch Knight 3
I made a grung way of mercy monk and it's great. I'm working on adding more poisons to my repitore but as of now every punch is a con save with hands of harm potential behind it
It's the best race to use with that subclass. I know not everyone likes to optimize, but hot damn is it optimized.
One reason why I really love way of mercy is the flurry of blows heal option. It's pretty much better in every way to the hands of mercy action, and there's nothing saying you can't use it on yourself. It's basically just spending a ki for free health, which, in a party where the monk is the best tank you got, is very helpful.
I like that this class path feels very balanced from the start. It gives a way to heal or harm with ki but it's not brokenly able to do big surges nor does it feel stronger or weaker than most of the monk paths out there. I specifically like that the poison aura affects all creatures as poison powder or murderous energy emanating from a monk would. It really works thematically with the monk being surrounded by enemies as we often like to imagine a martial artist. Generally monks in melee (Whom have no physical damage resist and lower AC compared to other tanks) die pretty quick if they try this, but the poison auras ability to impose disadvantage on statistically some of the enemies for a while is just the right amount of boon for the monk and the party to justify letting monk go kick arse in melee all by their lonesome.
"My personal solution: The grung race applies poisoned on touch if they fail a DC12 con save. It’s pretty cool, especially when you start multi-attacking."
I'd probably still choose Aarakocra, but the fact that any other race is even considered for a melee monk, is the best news I've ever heard from an optimization argument. Also it makes sense that a Grung adventurer would become a monk, so thank you for pointing out that this might let that race get some visibility rather than being buried and forgotten like most of the lesser known races out there.
Why 4x more powerful ? I can't grok it...
Why the 4d6 With Hand of Harm ?
i've actually got a kobold monk going into a game. It doesn't need strength really and it's suitable for solid damage in a small package. It also let's me consider wisdom ASI's earlier which suits my playstyle anyway to get my DC's higher earlier on. Specially if the DM says that I can pick up the Eldritch Claw tattoo which I'm waiting to hear back on.