I suspect WoTC will not take a definite stance/give a reasoning of their own unless it's their Forum that gets overrun and oveflown with such requests.
And seeings as they shut down their forums years ago....
I was genuinely unaware of this (never really lurked there), my apologies.
Then contact e-mail it is, I guess :P The fact remains that keep on discussing this here seems kind of pointless to me
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
It seems to me that the ideal solution would simply be to offer physical DNDBeyond gift cards at FLGS. I'm not sure the best model for it (individual unlock codes? dollars of store credit?), but it would grant the opportunity for a number of exciting possibilities:
1. You could more easily gift someone DNDBeyond.
2. It would open it up a bit to the 13-18 crowd and the unbanked, since the gift cards could be purchased with cash, so they wouldn't need a credit card.
2. It would give people a way to support their FLGS without having to purchase the same content twice or forsake DNDBeyond.
3. Shop owners would have the ability to experiment with digital/physical bundles, by trying things like "Buy a PHB with a DNDBeyond card, get 10% off both" promotions, without requiring specially packaged PHBs, granting DNDBeyond special treatment among licensees, or most of the other arguments against it. There'd still be the issue of producing and maintaining a stock of DnD Beyond gift cards, but that's a heck of a lot easier than maintaining a stock of prebundled, individually numbered books that you can only sell together.
I still believe discussing this HERE is quite pointless, considering how many times this has been raised.
Curse has relatively little power over this, and they are well aware there is anumber of people that would be very interested in such an option. People are not wrong, they are just barking up the wrong tree at this point.
Those who have the last word on all this are the people over at WoTC, and while Curse can (and I am sure they are) relay the information, I suspect WoTC will not take a definite stance/give a reasoning of their own unless it's their Forum that gets overrun and oveflown with such requests.
Just my 2 cents.
Wrong though. Wotc is just a producer. Curse is responsible of its own distribution. Also amazon is literally belonging to curse. Or curse belongs to them. It is entirely possibles and moderators here have said so often. No the only problem is the hierarchy of curse and amazon taking their checking if its worth doing or not.
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DM of two gaming groups. Likes to create stuff. Check out my homebrew --> Monsters --> Magical Items --> Races --> Subclasses If you like --> Upvote, If you wanna comment --> Comment
Play by Post Games --> One Shot Adventure - House of Artwood (DM) (Completed)
Someone in another thread said they'd like to see things set up so that they could pay ~$60 and get a hardcopy and the digital version as a bundle on Amazon... and it left me confused as to what they actually want.
Because the situation as-is happens to be that buying a hard copy on Amazon and getting the digital version here costs ~$60 (Xanathar's Guide to Everything, for example, is $29.97 on Amazon, and if I recall correctly $29.99 here).
Apparently just either being told "you get a discount because you bought the physical book" even if it isn't true is being valued, or the real request isn't price-related as much as it is number of clicks-related (i.e. only having to click "buy this thing" once, rather than twice).
I still believe discussing this HERE is quite pointless, considering how many times this has been raised.
Curse has relatively little power over this, and they are well aware there is anumber of people that would be very interested in such an option. People are not wrong, they are just barking up the wrong tree at this point.
Those who have the last word on all this are the people over at WoTC, and while Curse can (and I am sure they are) relay the information, I suspect WoTC will not take a definite stance/give a reasoning of their own unless it's their Forum that gets overrun and oveflown with such requests.
Just my 2 cents.
Wrong though. Wotc is just a producer. Curse is responsible of its own distribution. Also amazon is literally belonging to curse. Or curse belongs to them. It is entirely possibles and moderators here have said so often. No the only problem is the hierarchy of curse and amazon taking their checking if its worth doing or not.
Curse is owned by Amazon, that much is true, but I am afraid they have less control than you think on how any of these two entities can distribute the D&D product under the WotC license.
Just as an example, the Legendary Bundle is something that Curse had to deal with WotC to make it a thing, it's not like they just decided it would have been a neat idea (there is a series of posts on this buried somewhere in the forums). Based on that, I would be surprised they could just decide to tie a digital.come to the physical copies from Amazon without WotC involvement in the decision.
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
I still believe discussing this HERE is quite pointless, considering how many times this has been raised.
Curse has relatively little power over this, and they are well aware there is anumber of people that would be very interested in such an option. People are not wrong, they are just barking up the wrong tree at this point.
Those who have the last word on all this are the people over at WoTC, and while Curse can (and I am sure they are) relay the information, I suspect WoTC will not take a definite stance/give a reasoning of their own unless it's their Forum that gets overrun and oveflown with such requests.
Just my 2 cents.
Wrong though. Wotc is just a producer. Curse is responsible of its own distribution. Also amazon is literally belonging to curse. Or curse belongs to them. It is entirely possibles and moderators here have said so often. No the only problem is the hierarchy of curse and amazon taking their checking if its worth doing or not.
Speculation like this doesn't help. WotC has final say on all pricing/bundles/packages/products. If something isn't approved by them, it's back to the drawing board.
Apparently just either being told "you get a discount because you bought the physical book" even if it isn't true is being valued, or the real request isn't price-related as much as it is number of clicks-related (i.e. only having to click "buy this thing" once, rather than twice).
You'd be surprised at the value people place on not having to jump through additional hoops to get things. If people could buy a physical book off of Amazon or somewhere else and have a digital copy automatically unlocked here or, at the very least, get a redemption code to type in and active, as opposed to filling out two order forms from, what is ostensibly the same company (Amazon and its subsidiary Curse), they might even be willing to pay more for the privilege.....but not for too long before they go back to being happy that they are basically paying normal price but having to deal with less crap.
EDIT: Convenience fees are a great example of this. When I go to pay my car bill each month, I have three choices - call my bank and pay over the phone (incurring a $5 convenience fee for the transaction), mail them the bill (and maybe pay for the postage if I lose the free return envelope), or pay online for free. Until I got around to setting up my online banking, I was eating that $5 inconvenience fee over the phone for a few months because calling in and getting it taken care of was just easier that mailing in the payment.
Apparently just either being told "you get a discount because you bought the physical book" even if it isn't true is being valued, or the real request isn't price-related as much as it is number of clicks-related (i.e. only having to click "buy this thing" once, rather than twice).
You'd be surprised at the value people place on not having to jump through additional hoops to get things. If people could buy a physical book off of Amazon or somewhere else and have a digital copy automatically unlocked here or, at the very least, get a redemption code to type in and active, as opposed to filling out two order forms from, what is ostensibly the same company (Amazon and its subsidiary Curse), they might even be willing to pay more for the privilege.....but not for too long before they go back to being happy that they are basically paying normal price but having to deal with less crap.
If a couple of clicks is one of the conceivable reasons for people to complaint, the world is in a worse state than I thought...
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Apparently just either being told "you get a discount because you bought the physical book" even if it isn't true is being valued, or the real request isn't price-related as much as it is number of clicks-related (i.e. only having to click "buy this thing" once, rather than twice).
You'd be surprised at the value people place on not having to jump through additional hoops to get things. If people could buy a physical book off of Amazon or somewhere else and have a digital copy automatically unlocked here or, at the very least, get a redemption code to type in and active, as opposed to filling out two order forms from, what is ostensibly the same company (Amazon and its subsidiary Curse), they might even be willing to pay more for the privilege.....but not for too long before they go back to being happy that they are basically paying normal price but having to deal with less crap.
If a couple of clicks is one of the conceivable reasons for people to complaint, the world is in a worse state than I thought...
Or, conversely, the modern marvels of inter-connectivity have saved people wasted time and brain power that can be used towards even greater pursuits and it wholly makes sense that consumers in this modern economy would be slightly taken aback by the apparent decisions of a company that could partake in that inter-connectivity, yet choose not to do so, creating inconvenience in their lives.
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
You'd be surprised at the value people place on not having to jump through additional hoops to get things.
I think I am more surprised that a process of:
Buy book on Amazon, get code that has to be entered on D&D Beyond
Go to D&D Beyond and enter code
Is being treated as "not having to jump through additional hoops to get things" compared to a process of:
Buy book on Amazon.
Buy book on D&D Beyond.
When both require the same amount of effort on the first purchase (i.e. making an account for each site, entering you payment info, and such), but the second method requires less effort on subsequent purchases because the relevant information is stored in your account information, instead of having to enter a new code every single time.
Apparently just either being told "you get a discount because you bought the physical book" even if it isn't true is being valued, or the real request isn't price-related as much as it is number of clicks-related (i.e. only having to click "buy this thing" once, rather than twice).
You'd be surprised at the value people place on not having to jump through additional hoops to get things. If people could buy a physical book off of Amazon or somewhere else and have a digital copy automatically unlocked here or, at the very least, get a redemption code to type in and active, as opposed to filling out two order forms from, what is ostensibly the same company (Amazon and its subsidiary Curse), they might even be willing to pay more for the privilege.....but not for too long before they go back to being happy that they are basically paying normal price but having to deal with less crap.
If a couple of clicks is one of the conceivable reasons for people to complaint, the world is in a worse state than I thought...
Or, conversely, the modern marvels of inter-connectivity have saved people wasted time and brain power that can be used towards even greater pursuits and it wholly makes sense that consumers in this modern economy would be slightly taken aback by the apparent decisions of a company that could partake in that inter-connectivity, yet choose not to do so, creating inconvenience in their lives.
Wow. I am very, very impressed.
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"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
Apparently just either being told "you get a discount because you bought the physical book" even if it isn't true is being valued, or the real request isn't price-related as much as it is number of clicks-related (i.e. only having to click "buy this thing" once, rather than twice).
You'd be surprised at the value people place on not having to jump through additional hoops to get things. If people could buy a physical book off of Amazon or somewhere else and have a digital copy automatically unlocked here or, at the very least, get a redemption code to type in and active, as opposed to filling out two order forms from, what is ostensibly the same company (Amazon and its subsidiary Curse), they might even be willing to pay more for the privilege.....but not for too long before they go back to being happy that they are basically paying normal price but having to deal with less crap.
If a couple of clicks is one of the conceivable reasons for people to complaint, the world is in a worse state than I thought...
Or, conversely, the modern marvels of inter-connectivity have saved people wasted time and brain power that can be used towards even greater pursuits and it wholly makes sense that consumers in this modern economy would be slightly taken aback by the apparent decisions of a company that could partake in that inter-connectivity, yet choose not to do so, creating inconvenience in their lives.
Wow. I am very, very impressed.
That makes two of us...
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
The whole point of bundles is to help get everything at the same price or reduced price. Exemple legendary bundle here. If they would bundle hard copy and beyond. It wouldnt be 80... It would more likely be around 70 which is about 15% discount. The point of bundle is that. Now what people dont get is they also have to ship the hard copy and that makes it the same price. The why they never done it.
Arguably, doing it anyway would lead to an influx of customers with buy-in to the DDB product, who would then be more willing to partake in Beyond's subscription services, generating even more money over time.
Funny. I just responded to you in another thread where you said you don't find value in the subscription, but you think giving away copies would get people to subscribe..?
The whole point of bundles is to help get everything at the same price or reduced price. Exemple legendary bundle here. If they would bundle hard copy and beyond. It wouldnt be 80... It would more likely be around 70 which is about 15% discount. The point of bundle is that. Now what people dont get is they also have to ship the hard copy and that makes it the same price. The why they never done it.
Arguably, doing it anyway would lead to an influx of customers with buy-in to the DDB product, who would then be more willing to partake in Beyond's subscription services, generating even more money over time.
Funny. I just responded to you in another thread where you said you don't find value in the subscription, but you think giving away copies would get people to subscribe..?
Other people are not me. There have been plenty of folk petitioning for codes in books who would likely find value in the Master or DM tier subscription services. I can advocate for those people without being 100% interested in the same things they are. Humans are complex beings compromised of multiple motivations. My ideal subscription would actually be slightly more expensive and grant full access to all official content.
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
Yes, it would finally legitimize the actual legitimate complain that the IP is being duplicated in two mediums and charged separately.
You mean like the way I paid to see Wonder Woman in a movie theatre but Amazon.com wouldn't give me the Bluray for free?
I mean, I already paid for the content, so what's the problem?
Atleast a code in the blueray so i can see it for free on the movie theater.
I dont want to pay for something twice when i own the hard copy of the movie. ;)
I'm not sure why you would want to hang such a smugly facetious argument on that poor analogy. By the time a movie has made it to blueray, it's not really in theaters at that point for you to make such a demand. On top of that, many blueray DVDs now come with a "free" digital download of the movie, making the example even less helpful to your cause. Also, a person does not go to the movie theater to watch a movie with the understanding that they now own that content. It'd be like going to a live show and then complaining that the band is selling their merch afterwards.
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
Listen, we can come up with 20.000 analogies, more or less appropriate, more or less correct, at the end of the day we still have:
- People who are ok with the current business model of DDB, and accept the fact that paper and digital are two different mediums and are treated as such as two different and separated "copies" of the same content, and that Curse has no autonomous control over the pricing, but has to deal with what WotC allows; - People who think they are entitled to the digital content because they have the physical copy of the books, even though there is no way (and there will never be a safe way) to validate the purchase of a manual that has no unique code associated to it.
Do we, the community have access to the license agreement between WotC and Curse? No, and we never will Do we, the community made aware Curse of what each group thinks is good and positive and expected and requested? I think we did, several times, in 213897543 threads which all come down to the same thing: people "fighting", arguing, mods getting fed up (rightfully) and generally a bad atmosphere in said threads.
I believe this one can be closed already as well, and please, PLEASE, let's just stop making any new thread that comes up suggesting something or another on the pricing/physical+digital etc. a place where we always come up with the same or rinsed reasons pro or against one or the other point of view.
Sincerely, Someone who just wants to enjoy the game
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Other than some slanted phrasing choices, I agree. People who are okay with Curse's current business model should probably just avoid threads like these that will inevitably crop up from time to time, as they are satisfied with how things currently are and their participation in such threads only leads to silly arguments. Mods can handle things and Curse currently has their official answer to this sort of thing in their FAQ. If, seeing the continuous request for different service options, they end up changing their mind? Great. If not, then surely those asking will give up eventually, or not.
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
Other than some slanted phrasing choices, I agree. ...
I think it's no secret I am part of the first group I described (believe me, I tried to be as objective as possible on this subject), but I am glad you agree with my analysis.
I still think the "If, seeing the continuous request for different service options, they end up changing their mind? Great." is a flawed concept, as it is not just Curse having to change their mind (provided you were referring to them, as your message construction suggests), it's Curse having to find a way to deal with WotC on it, there's quite a difference there. If you meant WotC from the beginning with that phrase, then apologies for misinterpreting. In that case I fully agree (and will try to keep myself as far as possible from this kind of threads from now on).
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
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The fact remains that keep on discussing this here seems kind of pointless to me
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
It seems to me that the ideal solution would simply be to offer physical DNDBeyond gift cards at FLGS. I'm not sure the best model for it (individual unlock codes? dollars of store credit?), but it would grant the opportunity for a number of exciting possibilities:
1. You could more easily gift someone DNDBeyond.
2. It would open it up a bit to the 13-18 crowd and the unbanked, since the gift cards could be purchased with cash, so they wouldn't need a credit card.
2. It would give people a way to support their FLGS without having to purchase the same content twice or forsake DNDBeyond.
3. Shop owners would have the ability to experiment with digital/physical bundles, by trying things like "Buy a PHB with a DNDBeyond card, get 10% off both" promotions, without requiring specially packaged PHBs, granting DNDBeyond special treatment among licensees, or most of the other arguments against it. There'd still be the issue of producing and maintaining a stock of DnD Beyond gift cards, but that's a heck of a lot easier than maintaining a stock of prebundled, individually numbered books that you can only sell together.
DM of two gaming groups.
Likes to create stuff.
Check out my homebrew --> Monsters --> Magical Items --> Races --> Subclasses
If you like --> Upvote, If you wanna comment --> Comment
Play by Post Games
--> One Shot Adventure - House of Artwood (DM) (Completed)
Someone in another thread said they'd like to see things set up so that they could pay ~$60 and get a hardcopy and the digital version as a bundle on Amazon... and it left me confused as to what they actually want.
Because the situation as-is happens to be that buying a hard copy on Amazon and getting the digital version here costs ~$60 (Xanathar's Guide to Everything, for example, is $29.97 on Amazon, and if I recall correctly $29.99 here).
Apparently just either being told "you get a discount because you bought the physical book" even if it isn't true is being valued, or the real request isn't price-related as much as it is number of clicks-related (i.e. only having to click "buy this thing" once, rather than twice).
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
I think I am more surprised that a process of:
Is being treated as "not having to jump through additional hoops to get things" compared to a process of:
When both require the same amount of effort on the first purchase (i.e. making an account for each site, entering you payment info, and such), but the second method requires less effort on subsequent purchases because the relevant information is stored in your account information, instead of having to enter a new code every single time.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
DM for the Adventures in Erylia Podcast
Where five friends sit around the table and record themselves playing Dungeons and Dragons
I'm not stupid. I'm just unlucky when I'm thinking.
Listen, we can come up with 20.000 analogies, more or less appropriate, more or less correct, at the end of the day we still have:
- People who are ok with the current business model of DDB, and accept the fact that paper and digital are two different mediums and are treated as such as two different and separated "copies" of the same content, and that Curse has no autonomous control over the pricing, but has to deal with what WotC allows;
- People who think they are entitled to the digital content because they have the physical copy of the books, even though there is no way (and there will never be a safe way) to validate the purchase of a manual that has no unique code associated to it.
Do we, the community have access to the license agreement between WotC and Curse? No, and we never will
Do we, the community made aware Curse of what each group thinks is good and positive and expected and requested? I think we did, several times, in 213897543 threads which all come down to the same thing: people "fighting", arguing, mods getting fed up (rightfully) and generally a bad atmosphere in said threads.
I believe this one can be closed already as well, and please, PLEASE, let's just stop making any new thread that comes up suggesting something or another on the pricing/physical+digital etc. a place where we always come up with the same or rinsed reasons pro or against one or the other point of view.
Sincerely,
Someone who just wants to enjoy the game
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Other than some slanted phrasing choices, I agree. People who are okay with Curse's current business model should probably just avoid threads like these that will inevitably crop up from time to time, as they are satisfied with how things currently are and their participation in such threads only leads to silly arguments. Mods can handle things and Curse currently has their official answer to this sort of thing in their FAQ. If, seeing the continuous request for different service options, they end up changing their mind? Great. If not, then surely those asking will give up eventually, or not.
If you meant WotC from the beginning with that phrase, then apologies for misinterpreting. In that case I fully agree (and will try to keep myself as far as possible from this kind of threads from now on).
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games