I don't see anything that has been calmed or relaxed due to their statements. Its very obvious that they are sticking to their guns and simply want to exploit this community that helped make them what they are today. To that I say, Hello Paizo :)
They loaded up a bunch of half-truths, mixed in some pretty obvious lies, and tried to act as part of the community by throwing in a nat 1 reference and referring to themselves as the stewards of the OGL.
This is what passes for a marketing response? They're asking for a chance? This is their chance, right now, and they're blowing it badly.
They clearly still don't even understand what they've done. It's not about the monster in the closet. It's about this line:
And third, we wanted to ensure that the OGL is for the content creator, the homebrewer, the aspiring designer, our players, and the community—not major corporations to use for their own commercial and promotional purpose.
I think we know who some of the "major corporations" are. Instead of competing on the merits of their brand and product, they're trying to tell the community that the hobby is better off, healthier, if they're handed a monopoly, which is clearly ridiculous. They're just trying to make sure all of their sheep stay nicely in their pen for fleecing.
Looks like the D&D virtual weekend for January might be suffering from WOTC issue around the OGL. Normally on a Friday of the weekend of the event almost all the games are completely sold out. Looks like this time only about half are sold out. It's winter so you'd think the weekend would be selling out.
Eh, even in the darkest days of 4e and the GSL, DnD never fell below being the #2 tabletop RPG in the world. If you're expecting this to kill them off, well, good luck with that.
Oh, you mean while OGL1.0a was still authorized, and people just ignored the GSL. This is closer to what TSR tried; remember TSR.
Exactly my point - even when there was a viable and easily accessible alternative to the GSL, 4e was nowhere close to dying. This time around, alternatives to OGL 2.0 will be months away if not more. Rumor's of WotC's death are greatly exaggerated.
Could we please define "major corporations?" Because I always thought that "major corporation" referred to groups who make billions of dollars. Y'know, like Hasbro.
Looks like the D&D virtual weekend for January might be suffering from WOTC issue around the OGL. Normally on a Friday of the weekend of the event almost all the games are completely sold out. Looks like this time only about half are sold out. It's winter so you'd think the weekend would be selling out.
Eh, even in the darkest days of 4e and the GSL, DnD never fell below being the #2 tabletop RPG in the world. If you're expecting this to kill them off, well, good luck with that.
Oh, you mean while OGL1.0a was still authorized, and people just ignored the GSL. This is closer to what TSR tried; remember TSR.
Exactly my point - even when there was a viable and easily accessible alternative to the GSL, 4e was nowhere close to dying. This time around, alternatives to OGL 2.0 will be months away if not more. Rumor's of WotC's death are greatly exaggerated.
Sure, but right now D&D is on the cusp of becoming a really, really popular IP with the movie and everything. But if they go through with this they, and D&D, will likely fall behind quarter after quarter (how's Hasbero's stock doing? oh my!) until it's making, well shit, what it was making back when all they had was 4e. imho
Did your parents not teach you that if you do something wrong, then it doesn't help to lie about it afterwards?
I apologize if this sounds condescending, but I'm not the one who thought it appropriate to include "nuh-uh, we didn't lose, we ALSO WON" in our official PR statement. I don't think I'm being any more condescending to you than you are to us.
You lost. You lost hard. You lost the confidence and good will of your entire community. I'm sorry if you don't have people to tell you how that affects your bottom line. I'm even more sorry if you do have people to tell you that, and you just choose to ignore them.
You had a beautiful bird in your hand, and you've gone and let it go so you could chase the ones in the bush. Except as soon as you took your first step, your pants fell down, you took a tumble, and we all got to see your butt. Please don't pretend that this is what you wanted to do all along.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When will Hasbro/WotC no longer think that D&D is under-monetized? When will they look at the numbers and say "That's enough money, we don't want more."?
They loaded up a bunch of half-truths, mixed in some pretty obvious lies, and tried to act as part of the community by throwing in a nat 1 reference and referring to themselves as the stewards of the OGL.
This is what passes for a marketing response? They're asking for a chance? This is their chance, right now, and they're blowing it badly.
They clearly still don't even understand what they've done. It's not about the monster in the closet. It's about this line:
And third, we wanted to ensure that the OGL is for the content creator, the homebrewer, the aspiring designer, our players, and the community—not major corporations to use for their own commercial and promotional purpose.
I think we know who some of the "major corporations" are. Instead of competing on the merits of their brand and product, they're trying to tell the community that the hobby is better off, healthier, if they're handed a monopoly, which is clearly ridiculous. They're just trying to make sure all of their sheep stay nicely in their pen for fleecing.
Right! Hasbro and WotC are the large corporations, and they ARE trying to use the OGL (OPEN Gaming License) for their own commercial and promotional purpose. Third parties are putting out great content. WotC has many ways to monetize without screwing the community that would continue to grow the brand. That, much like the real OGL would have been a win win. An Ammendum could have been added to accomplish their stated goals, but we all know the stated goals are complete BS.
(1) Our job is to be good stewards of the game
They have failed, again
(2) the OGL exists for the benefit of the fans.
The true OGL was made for the good of the game and was a huge part in making D&D so popular.
Did your parents not teach you that if you do something wrong, then it doesn't help to lie about it afterwards?
I apologize if this sounds condescending, but I'm not the one who thought it appropriate to include "nuh-uh, we didn't lose, we ALSO WON" in our official PR statement. I don't think I'm being any more condescending to you than you are to us.
You lost. You lost hard. You lost the confidence and good will of your entire community. I'm sorry if you don't have people to tell you how that affects your bottom line. I'm even more sorry if you do have people to tell you that, and you just choose to ignore them.
You had a beautiful bird in your hand, and you've gone and let it go so you could chase the ones in the bush. Except as soon as you took your first step, your pants fell down, you took a tumble, and we all got to see your butt. Please don't pretend that this is what you wanted to do all along.
Looks like the D&D virtual weekend for January might be suffering from WOTC issue around the OGL. Normally on a Friday of the weekend of the event almost all the games are completely sold out. Looks like this time only about half are sold out. It's winter so you'd think the weekend would be selling out.
Eh, even in the darkest days of 4e and the GSL, DnD never fell below being the #2 tabletop RPG in the world. If you're expecting this to kill them off, well, good luck with that.
Oh, you mean while OGL1.0a was still authorized, and people just ignored the GSL. This is closer to what TSR tried; remember TSR.
Exactly my point - even when there was a viable and easily accessible alternative to the GSL, 4e was nowhere close to dying. This time around, alternatives to OGL 2.0 will be months away if not more. Rumor's of WotC's death are greatly exaggerated.
4e was a failure, and previous content could still be used under the OGL, meaning people could still buy D&D-compatible content and play the game. In fact, the only major competitor spun off using the OGL and 3.5 to build their 1e system. This change is trying to eliminate the OGL, so no new D&D-compatible content unless you sell your soul for a ridiculous cut that is far above what is common. How you can't see the difference is amazing, but you do you.
Not good enough. You need to make OGL 1.0(a) irrevocable and no longer owned / managed by WotC or Hasbro or anyone that makes money off of it. It's clear that WotC and Hasbro cannot be trusted to be good stewards of OGL 1.0(a).
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Did your parents not teach you that if you do something wrong, then it doesn't help to lie about it afterwards?
I apologize if this sounds condescending, but I'm not the one who thought it appropriate to include "nuh-uh, we didn't lose, we ALSO WON" in our official PR statement. I don't think I'm being any more condescending to you than you are to us.
You lost. You lost hard. You lost the confidence and good will of your entire community. I'm sorry if you don't have people to tell you how that affects your bottom line. I'm even more sorry if you do have people to tell you that, and you just choose to ignore them.
You had a beautiful bird in your hand, and you've gone and let it go so you could chase the ones in the bush. Except as soon as you took your first step, your pants fell down, you took a tumble, and we all got to see your butt. Please don't pretend that this is what you wanted to do all along.
We saw their butt, and it turns out WotC is full of 💩.
Guys, it is very apparent that the folks over at Hasbro/WotC that are making decisions lack integrity. You guys are not even speaking the same language. All they understand is their precious stock value taking a hit which directly effects their stock options and bonuses, because at the end of the day that is where their hearts reside.
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"When truth presents itself, the wise person see the light, takes it in, and makes adjustments. The fool tries to adjust the truth so he does not have to adjust to it." ~ Henry Cloud #ORC #OpenDND
"What is, 'I somehow totally forgot about the Hadozee?"
You mean the mistake they corrected? The one that, if made by a third-party using OGL 1.0a, they would have had no ability to stop?
They would also have no responsibility for it either.
In theory they wouldn't. In practice, "D&D-compatible supplement includes {obscenity}/{ism}" is a headline waiting to happen, and in fact did happen with TSR.
In light of the statement that Hasbeen has released, let me be clear about one point: They can and will release any statement to try to make them look better, placate us, attempt to soothe by throwing out some candy here and there. First off, their proposed 2.0 is still crap. "We own our content that we create...." Well, no <careful word choice> crap! That was never the issue, here's the question, do you, Hasbro, intend to seize the option to use it without our say, sublicense it with or without our consent? Yeah, you do. My answer is, um, let me think, yeah, that's a hard NO from me.
Next, it is utter *crap* for them to say that they are attempting to block the use of 1.0(a) to be able to produce NFTs and such. Truth bomb, if Hasbro could figure out a way to do NFTs off of it, that was viable, they absolutely would/will, they just want to prevent YOU from doing the same.
Lastly, DO NOT BELIEVE A WORD until it's finalized. If there is language that doesn't stipulate that they won't do what they've attempted to do in 1.1 again, then they will try again. If they don't have language to prevent revisions at any time to their license at will by Hasbro, then they will. Simply put, Hasbro is a corporation, based in the U.S., as such they will act and operate like any other U.S. based company and attempt to grab any money they can and they are not a consumer friendly company, they are an investor friendly company. They will pacify their investors and make the consumer pay for it. So, believe nothing, unless it's in a binding, written format, and then watch them closely as they attempt to modify it later down the road.
My final thoughts on this is as follows; Hasbro, in an earlier post, I congratulated you on playing yourselves, that congratulations stands. You have attempted to squeeze out competitors, gouge them of moneys they earned by repeating the mistakes TSR made and later what was made with 4e. And once again you have made the very thing that you were trying to block and as such the ORCs will now rise for the horde of us that are now and will remain angry with you for what you've tried to do with the hobby we love and share.
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And another:
"First, we wanted the ability to prevent the use of D&D content from being included in hateful and discriminatory products."
1) Let's have a conversation about the numerous gay and queer 5e supplements you all have taken off of the DM's Guild over the years.
2) Hadozee.
We're not idiots.
I don't see anything that has been calmed or relaxed due to their statements. Its very obvious that they are sticking to their guns and simply want to exploit this community that helped make them what they are today. To that I say, Hello Paizo :)
Communication is the key.
They loaded up a bunch of half-truths, mixed in some pretty obvious lies, and tried to act as part of the community by throwing in a nat 1 reference and referring to themselves as the stewards of the OGL.
This is what passes for a marketing response? They're asking for a chance? This is their chance, right now, and they're blowing it badly.
They clearly still don't even understand what they've done. It's not about the monster in the closet. It's about this line:
I think we know who some of the "major corporations" are. Instead of competing on the merits of their brand and product, they're trying to tell the community that the hobby is better off, healthier, if they're handed a monopoly, which is clearly ridiculous. They're just trying to make sure all of their sheep stay nicely in their pen for fleecing.
Exactly my point - even when there was a viable and easily accessible alternative to the GSL, 4e was nowhere close to dying. This time around, alternatives to OGL 2.0 will be months away if not more. Rumor's of WotC's death are greatly exaggerated.
Could we please define "major corporations?" Because I always thought that "major corporation" referred to groups who make billions of dollars. Y'know, like Hasbro.
Sure, but right now D&D is on the cusp of becoming a really, really popular IP with the movie and everything. But if they go through with this they, and D&D, will likely fall behind quarter after quarter (how's Hasbero's stock doing? oh my!) until it's making, well shit, what it was making back when all they had was 4e. imho
Dear Hasbro/WotC execs,
Did your parents not teach you that if you do something wrong, then it doesn't help to lie about it afterwards?
I apologize if this sounds condescending, but I'm not the one who thought it appropriate to include "nuh-uh, we didn't lose, we ALSO WON" in our official PR statement. I don't think I'm being any more condescending to you than you are to us.
You lost. You lost hard. You lost the confidence and good will of your entire community. I'm sorry if you don't have people to tell you how that affects your bottom line. I'm even more sorry if you do have people to tell you that, and you just choose to ignore them.
You had a beautiful bird in your hand, and you've gone and let it go so you could chase the ones in the bush. Except as soon as you took your first step, your pants fell down, you took a tumble, and we all got to see your butt. Please don't pretend that this is what you wanted to do all along.
When will Hasbro/WotC no longer think that D&D is under-monetized? When will they look at the numbers and say "That's enough money, we don't want more."?
Right! Hasbro and WotC are the large corporations, and they ARE trying to use the OGL (OPEN Gaming License) for their own commercial and promotional purpose. Third parties are putting out great content. WotC has many ways to monetize without screwing the community that would continue to grow the brand. That, much like the real OGL would have been a win win. An Ammendum could have been added to accomplish their stated goals, but we all know the stated goals are complete BS.
They have failed, again
The true OGL was made for the good of the game and was a huge part in making D&D so popular.
oh nice Suszterpatt!!
very good and true! 😄
Peace be with you friend.
There are not trying at this point. I think the future looks a bit like this and we all know how that movie finished xD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sixCUcrusu4
I Cancelled my Master Tier Subscription January 12th 2023 because of "OGL" 1.1
#OpenDnD
Line item number 1 cracks me up.
I'll take "Pandering to the current sociopolitical climate for $500 Alex"
4e was a failure, and previous content could still be used under the OGL, meaning people could still buy D&D-compatible content and play the game. In fact, the only major competitor spun off using the OGL and 3.5 to build their 1e system. This change is trying to eliminate the OGL, so no new D&D-compatible content unless you sell your soul for a ridiculous cut that is far above what is common. How you can't see the difference is amazing, but you do you.
Not good enough. You need to make OGL 1.0(a) irrevocable and no longer owned / managed by WotC or Hasbro or anyone that makes money off of it. It's clear that WotC and Hasbro cannot be trusted to be good stewards of OGL 1.0(a).
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"What is, 'I somehow totally forgot about the Hadozee?"
We saw their butt, and it turns out WotC is full of 💩.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
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Content Troubleshooting
You mean the mistake they corrected? The one that, if made by a third-party using OGL 1.0a, they would have had no ability to stop?
They would also have no responsibility for it either.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Guys, it is very apparent that the folks over at Hasbro/WotC that are making decisions lack integrity. You guys are not even speaking the same language. All they understand is their precious stock value taking a hit which directly effects their stock options and bonuses, because at the end of the day that is where their hearts reside.
"When truth presents itself, the wise person see the light, takes it in, and makes adjustments. The fool tries to adjust the truth so he does not have to adjust to it." ~ Henry Cloud #ORC #OpenDND
In theory they wouldn't. In practice, "D&D-compatible supplement includes {obscenity}/{ism}" is a headline waiting to happen, and in fact did happen with TSR.
My fellow players, DMs, creators and aspirants,
In light of the statement that Hasbeen has released, let me be clear about one point: They can and will release any statement to try to make them look better, placate us, attempt to soothe by throwing out some candy here and there. First off, their proposed 2.0 is still crap. "We own our content that we create...." Well, no <careful word choice> crap! That was never the issue, here's the question, do you, Hasbro, intend to seize the option to use it without our say, sublicense it with or without our consent? Yeah, you do. My answer is, um, let me think, yeah, that's a hard NO from me.
Next, it is utter *crap* for them to say that they are attempting to block the use of 1.0(a) to be able to produce NFTs and such. Truth bomb, if Hasbro could figure out a way to do NFTs off of it, that was viable, they absolutely would/will, they just want to prevent YOU from doing the same.
Lastly, DO NOT BELIEVE A WORD until it's finalized. If there is language that doesn't stipulate that they won't do what they've attempted to do in 1.1 again, then they will try again. If they don't have language to prevent revisions at any time to their license at will by Hasbro, then they will. Simply put, Hasbro is a corporation, based in the U.S., as such they will act and operate like any other U.S. based company and attempt to grab any money they can and they are not a consumer friendly company, they are an investor friendly company. They will pacify their investors and make the consumer pay for it. So, believe nothing, unless it's in a binding, written format, and then watch them closely as they attempt to modify it later down the road.
My final thoughts on this is as follows; Hasbro, in an earlier post, I congratulated you on playing yourselves, that congratulations stands. You have attempted to squeeze out competitors, gouge them of moneys they earned by repeating the mistakes TSR made and later what was made with 4e. And once again you have made the very thing that you were trying to block and as such the ORCs will now rise for the horde of us that are now and will remain angry with you for what you've tried to do with the hobby we love and share.