5E seems to do a good job with gender equality. I don't see what the issue is.
The 70's/80's were a very different time.
I wasn’t around in the 70s and 80s (my friend was in the late 80s and she said things weren’t that bad at her school) but I agree that overall 5e has done a really good job with gender equality.
5E seems to do a good job with gender equality. I don't see what the issue is.
The 70's/80's were a very different time.
I wasn’t around in the 70s and 80s (my friend was in the late 80s and she said things weren’t that bad at her school) but I agree that overall 5e has done a really good job with gender equality.
I mean, mechanics wise there is no difference so technically it is perfect
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“I will take responsibility for what I have done. [...] If must fall, I will rise each time a better man.” ― Brandon Sanderson, Oathbringer.
5E seems to do a good job with gender equality. I don't see what the issue is.
The 70's/80's were a very different time.
I wasn’t around in the 70s and 80s (my friend was in the late 80s and she said things weren’t that bad at her school) but I agree that overall 5e has done a really good job with gender equality.
I mean, mechanics wise there is no difference so technically it is perfect
I may have mentioned this before earlier, if so, I apologize, but in 1E or 2E, females were limited to a STR of 18/50 vs. males max was 18/100. They don't do that anymore, so that's one change in mechanics from that era that have improved in terms of equality.
Seldarine801: I was reading thru some old Planescape stuff I bought on DTRPG and I read this one this that said that Aphrodite and Hanali Celanil lived on the same Outer Plane and shared a magical fountain of love called Evergold. I was wondering if that was still a thing in 5e and if so what their relationship was like.
Ah yes, from Planescape. I remember that now (thanks for the memory refresh). This goes back to what I said to Aphrodite not being a Realmspace deity, but there is no reason why they couldn't still interact. If they're sharing Evergold, chances are relationships between them are good.
Seldarine801: I was reading thru some old Planescape stuff I bought on DTRPG and I read this one this that said that Aphrodite and Hanali Celanil lived on the same Outer Plane and shared a magical fountain of love called Evergold. I was wondering if that was still a thing in 5e and if so what their relationship was like.
Wizards largely dropped all of the real-world pantheons from the game's cosmology when they switched to Third Edition. They created stats for the Greek and Norse deities in the 3.0 Deities and Demigods, but did not include them in any other publication.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
5E seems to do a good job with gender equality. I don't see what the issue is.
The 70's/80's were a very different time.
I wasn’t around in the 70s and 80s (my friend was in the late 80s and she said things weren’t that bad at her school) but I agree that overall 5e has done a really good job with gender equality.
I mean, mechanics wise there is no difference so technically it is perfect
I may have mentioned this before earlier, if so, I apologize, but in 1E or 2E, females were limited to a STR of 18/50 vs. males max was 18/100. They don't do that anymore, so that's one change in mechanics from that era that have improved in terms of equality.
Actually, only Half-Orc females could get a 18 STR. All other females couldn't even get an 18.
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
Actually, only Half-Orc females could get a 18 STR. All other females couldn't even get an 18.
Human females could also get 18 STR (the table that was quoted earlier didn't include humans) but if they had exceptional strength, were capped at 18/50 (same for half-orcs I believe).
Seldarine801: I was reading thru some old Planescape stuff I bought on DTRPG and I read this one this that said that Aphrodite and Hanali Celanil lived on the same Outer Plane and shared a magical fountain of love called Evergold. I was wondering if that was still a thing in 5e and if so what their relationship was like.
Wizards largely dropped all of the real-world pantheons from the game's cosmology when they switched to Third Edition. They created stats for the Greek and Norse deities in the 3.0 Deities and Demigods, but did not include them in any other publication.
Thank you. I wondered why I hadn’t seen anything about them in any of the 5e stuff.
that's one change in mechanics from that era that have improved in terms of equality.
It may have made the game world more equal, but changed nothing in terms of equality for players because players have never been restricted in any edition of the game. Whether having a more equal game world improves anything depends on your preference. Personally I find an unequal game world far more interesting to play in. It doesn't matter to me (as a player) whether it's a world dominated by men, women, elves, dwarves, or fairies. The setting is, and always has been, the DMs choice. It amazes me that, in a game based on escapist fantasy and with an animal kingdom of the most amazing sexual dimorphism to draw upon, anyone would prefer something so bland by comparison. Vive la difference!
that's one change in mechanics from that era that have improved in terms of equality.
It may have made the game world more equal, but changed nothing in terms of equality for players because players have never been restricted in any edition of the game. Whether having a more equal game world improves anything depends on your preference. Personally I find an unequal game world far more interesting to play in. It doesn't matter to me (as a player) whether it's a world dominated by men, women, elves, dwarves, or fairies. The setting is, and always has been, the DMs choice. It amazes me that, in a game based on escapist fantasy and with an animal kingdom of the most amazing sexual dimorphism to draw upon, anyone would prefer something so bland by comparison. Vive la difference!
There is a massive difference between inequalities existing in a world and them being treated as expected and normal both in world and objectively from outside. Dystopia can make for great settings, but it still needs to be recognized as dystopia. The theory is that we, as actual humans, are much higher order creatures than most if not all other animals, and frankly, should know better and treat each other, including any sentient non-human races that we happen to meet better and to even treat less sentient life with at least enough respect to deal with it humanely.
So have dystopian worlds, but just recognize them as such and make that something for the players to either treat as something their characters are fighting to overcome (good party), to survive against (neutral party) or as an escapist fantasy that, on a player level, is recognized as pure fantasy, as 'This would be so wrong in real life!' (evil party).
There is a massive difference between inequalities existing in a world and them being treated as expected and normal both in world and objectively from outside. Dystopia can make for great settings, but it still needs to be recognized as dystopia. The theory is that we, as actual humans, are much higher order creatures than most if not all other animals, and frankly, should know better and treat each other, including any sentient non-human races that we happen to meet better and to even treat less sentient life with at least enough respect to deal with it humanely.
So have dystopian worlds, but just recognize them as such and make that something for the players to either treat as something their characters are fighting to overcome (good party), to survive against (neutral party) or as an escapist fantasy that, on a player level, is recognized as pure fantasy, as 'This would be so wrong in real life!' (evil party).
The best dystopias arise, not from the inequalities within a world, but from hubristic attempts to eradicate them. I'm all for characters crusading to fix their 'imperfect' world. It's the best way to ensure things quickly go to hell. Animal Farm begins by declaring that all animals are equal.
There is a massive difference between inequalities existing in a world and them being treated as expected and normal both in world and objectively from outside. Dystopia can make for great settings, but it still needs to be recognized as dystopia. The theory is that we, as actual humans, are much higher order creatures than most if not all other animals, and frankly, should know better and treat each other, including any sentient non-human races that we happen to meet better and to even treat less sentient life with at least enough respect to deal with it humanely.
So have dystopian worlds, but just recognize them as such and make that something for the players to either treat as something their characters are fighting to overcome (good party), to survive against (neutral party) or as an escapist fantasy that, on a player level, is recognized as pure fantasy, as 'This would be so wrong in real life!' (evil party).
The best dystopias arise, not from the inequalities within a world, but from hubristic attempts to eradicate them. I'm all for characters crusading to fix their 'imperfect' world. It's the best way to ensure things quickly go to hell. Animal Farm begins by declaring that all animals are equal.
Animal Farm was an extremely simplistic take on a complex issue. Citing it for a political discussion is like citing Jurassic Park as a source of information on paleontology.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Animal Farm was an extremely simplistic take on a complex issue. Citing it for a political discussion is like citing Jurassic Park as a source of information on paleontology.
It is a rather good analogy of the Russian Revolution, though. The bigger issue is not said source material but rather the absolute fear of any level of socialism that is popular in so many nations today and is mirrored in someone quoting 'all animals are equal' out of context.
Which highlights the widespread lack of understanding that there's a difference between socialism and communism, much less what that difference is. But that discussion is majorly off topic and not appropriate for this forum.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
It starts with "all animals are equal" and is perverted into "but some are more equal than others" by the end. That's the point of the story. All distopias start by attempting to address perceived inequalities. They are all created by those who consider themselves lawful good.
maybe make a new thread.....we should prolly stay on topic so the mods dont get mad.
“I will take responsibility for what I have done. [...] If must fall, I will rise each time a better man.” ― Brandon Sanderson, Oathbringer.
5E seems to do a good job with gender equality. I don't see what the issue is.
The 70's/80's were a very different time.
I wasn’t around in the 70s and 80s (my friend was in the late 80s and she said things weren’t that bad at her school) but I agree that overall 5e has done a really good job with gender equality.
I mean, mechanics wise there is no difference so technically it is perfect
“I will take responsibility for what I have done. [...] If must fall, I will rise each time a better man.” ― Brandon Sanderson, Oathbringer.
I may have mentioned this before earlier, if so, I apologize, but in 1E or 2E, females were limited to a STR of 18/50 vs. males max was 18/100. They don't do that anymore, so that's one change in mechanics from that era that have improved in terms of equality.
Ah yes, from Planescape. I remember that now (thanks for the memory refresh). This goes back to what I said to Aphrodite not being a Realmspace deity, but there is no reason why they couldn't still interact. If they're sharing Evergold, chances are relationships between them are good.
Wizards largely dropped all of the real-world pantheons from the game's cosmology when they switched to Third Edition. They created stats for the Greek and Norse deities in the 3.0 Deities and Demigods, but did not include them in any other publication.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Actually, only Half-Orc females could get a 18 STR. All other females couldn't even get an 18.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
I think that WotC is getting better with this. There's a great amount of inclusiveness in Frostmaiden!!
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Human females could also get 18 STR (the table that was quoted earlier didn't include humans) but if they had exceptional strength, were capped at 18/50 (same for half-orcs I believe).
Thank you. I wondered why I hadn’t seen anything about them in any of the 5e stuff.
Cool 😊. Maybe I’ll check it out.
Given that the module isn't released until tomorrow, I'm curious about how you know that.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
It may have made the game world more equal, but changed nothing in terms of equality for players because players have never been restricted in any edition of the game. Whether having a more equal game world improves anything depends on your preference. Personally I find an unequal game world far more interesting to play in. It doesn't matter to me (as a player) whether it's a world dominated by men, women, elves, dwarves, or fairies. The setting is, and always has been, the DMs choice. It amazes me that, in a game based on escapist fantasy and with an animal kingdom of the most amazing sexual dimorphism to draw upon, anyone would prefer something so bland by comparison. Vive la difference!
That totally makes sense.
The best dystopias arise, not from the inequalities within a world, but from hubristic attempts to eradicate them. I'm all for characters crusading to fix their 'imperfect' world. It's the best way to ensure things quickly go to hell. Animal Farm begins by declaring that all animals are equal.
But some are more equal than others...
You forgot the second part of that quote.
Animal Farm was an extremely simplistic take on a complex issue. Citing it for a political discussion is like citing Jurassic Park as a source of information on paleontology.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Which highlights the widespread lack of understanding that there's a difference between socialism and communism, much less what that difference is. But that discussion is majorly off topic and not appropriate for this forum.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
It starts with "all animals are equal" and is perverted into "but some are more equal than others" by the end. That's the point of the story. All distopias start by attempting to address perceived inequalities. They are all created by those who consider themselves lawful good.