So I'm running my first D&D adventure in years, so I'm a little rusty. the adventure Im running has some bad buys in town at a bar as well as quite a few more in the basement of a manor house at the edge of town. The bad guys tried to mess with the party and two of them croaked and two managed to get away. IF these guys are smart they will likely run to the tavern where their buddies are (four more in my scenario). But even with all six thugs, the party will likely slaughter them. As I read it the leader (in the manor at the edge of town) is highly self preservation motivated. Rallying all his forces into a pitched attack on the town/party doesn't seem to be in his character. My issue is if one of the thugs in town runs directly to the manner would guards be distributed more logically to protect the leader or would he just turn tail and run as soon as the first guard raises the alarm. As a DM how do you know when to apply what is written in the book vs. the changes to the bad guys 'satus quo' induced by your players?
Looking for advice prior to the game this Saturday night. anyone who has run a similar scenario I'd like to know how your players handled it - did they go all 'seven samurai' on the bad guys. Did they just let the bad guys get away?
I suppose it depends how smart we're talking. If I were that leader, I'd line the manor with traps and leave a skeleton crew to lure the PCs in. Better yet, line the manor with explosives and dead bodies to fake their own death while their gang gets away.
This is a purchased module? Which book? Its all context. You want to keep the story flowing, not necessarily get into the specifics of where a particular thug is.
If the thug was not important to the story at all then just wrap it up like he gets away, or if the players are stuck on him and he can't get away then they catch him in a safe house.
Whatever you like. If the leader is important to the story and you want to extend it to a large fight at his manor then sure go for it. I wouldnt get to elaborate unless he has some importance to plot.
Well, this is sort of a chess game ... you move, we move, you move, ...
First move appears to be two Bad Guys (BG) run to the other tavern.
Party does what? (1)Talks to the tavern owner and a guard about what happened? (2)Pays their bill and runs out into the street? (3)Runs after them without paying their bill and leaving a mess?
(my next move as BGs): Charismatic Leader BG goes back to the first tavern for a look with his buddies without giving an indication what his intentions are. However, Charismatic Leader BG may send one messenger to the Lords Mansion.
Party does what?
(1) Party doesn't see the BGs come in for a look. BGs have initiative.
(2) Party meets BGs in the street. An encounter occurs.
(3) Party sees BGs go into other tavern and a commotion breaks out in the tavern they left.
Meanwhile, what does the Lord do when he hears the news? What do the town guards do when an encounter begins in the street? How do the town guards respond to a commotion coming from the first tavern?
This can take several directions.
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Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
Unless the party is ridiculously powerful and they have solid evidence against him, i doubt he would run right off the bat. the manner is something he is familiar with. he can defend it and he wont be out in the open like he would be if he decided to make a run for it. if the manor has any walls/gates to it, then he can basically turn this into a mini siege scenario with his thugs manning key points and setting up traps/defenses ect if there is time. even if he only has a handful of low level thugs at his disposal, if he stays where he is he can create conditions that even the playing field. even something as simple as having people man the windows with long range weapons can be nasty, since they can use full and partial cover. have him barricade the openings too.
of course once the players are well embroiled in their siege and have compromised the security of the actual building, i imagine he would have some sort of bolt hole/escape plan in place so he can slip out the back door while everyone is busy.
also if this guy owns a manor and has people working for him, i imagine he likely has some sort of sway with the locals? Unless this is a situation where the players have solid proof of him breaking the law and other people in power want him gone, he would likely try and turn the local guards/fellow nobles/mayor, ect against the players and have said people chase them off.
if i were him my reaction would be something like this: step one, send a runner to go collect the other thugs for me and possibly alert the guards, if they can be swayed. even if they arrive late, they can flank the party. step two: use siege tactics to slow down the party and make them waste as many of their assets as possible just trying to get in. step three: if they get inside and it looks like a lost cause, trigger a trap or an ambush that can serve as a distraction while the boss makes a run for it.
Thanks for the replies and ideas folks. The module is from the starter set "the Lost Mine of Phandelver". The video is helpful (lots of good ideas I need to watch it again and take notes, but wow that guys speaks fast.
Thanks for the replies and ideas folks. The module is from the starter set "the Lost Mine of Phandelver". The video is helpful (lots of good ideas I need to watch it again and take notes, but wow that guys speaks fast.
Yes he does, and some folks watch him on faster speeds too! You can slow it down. His entire video series is collectively what I call “The best advice I can give any new DM.”
I always like to think about the bad guy's motivation first.
Is he about money? Status? Levels? Politics? Something more complicated?
That by the way is in order of how much a real threat the villain will be. Low level guys are about the money, the most dangerous villains are more complicated.
I would say, as Mog_Dracov says, focus on motivation. If this particular baddie is about money and is intelligent then he can just get out of dodge and come back later. if he's invested in the local economy and has businesses or political interests in the town/city then it may be possible to set up a series of safe-houses and have him not have all his eggs in one basket. If he's smart enough he may even be willing to sacrifice one that is underperforming while having it run by a skeleton crew of useless idiots he wanted to rid himself of and have the party roll the necessary checks to see if they can find evidence or clues that show that what's going on is bigger than they realized.
Don't be afraid to let the party not figure out there's more going on if the dice don't go in their favor in this hypothetical and have them deal with a more prepared baddie later.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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So I'm running my first D&D adventure in years, so I'm a little rusty. the adventure Im running has some bad buys in town at a bar as well as quite a few more in the basement of a manor house at the edge of town. The bad guys tried to mess with the party and two of them croaked and two managed to get away. IF these guys are smart they will likely run to the tavern where their buddies are (four more in my scenario). But even with all six thugs, the party will likely slaughter them. As I read it the leader (in the manor at the edge of town) is highly self preservation motivated. Rallying all his forces into a pitched attack on the town/party doesn't seem to be in his character. My issue is if one of the thugs in town runs directly to the manner would guards be distributed more logically to protect the leader or would he just turn tail and run as soon as the first guard raises the alarm. As a DM how do you know when to apply what is written in the book vs. the changes to the bad guys 'satus quo' induced by your players?
Looking for advice prior to the game this Saturday night. anyone who has run a similar scenario I'd like to know how your players handled it - did they go all 'seven samurai' on the bad guys. Did they just let the bad guys get away?
regards
I suppose it depends how smart we're talking. If I were that leader, I'd line the manor with traps and leave a skeleton crew to lure the PCs in. Better yet, line the manor with explosives and dead bodies to fake their own death while their gang gets away.
This is a purchased module? Which book? Its all context. You want to keep the story flowing, not necessarily get into the specifics of where a particular thug is.
If the thug was not important to the story at all then just wrap it up like he gets away, or if the players are stuck on him and he can't get away then they catch him in a safe house.
Whatever you like. If the leader is important to the story and you want to extend it to a large fight at his manor then sure go for it. I wouldnt get to elaborate unless he has some importance to plot.
Well, this is sort of a chess game ... you move, we move, you move, ...
First move appears to be two Bad Guys (BG) run to the other tavern.
Party does what? (1)Talks to the tavern owner and a guard about what happened? (2)Pays their bill and runs out into the street? (3)Runs after them without paying their bill and leaving a mess?
(my next move as BGs): Charismatic Leader BG goes back to the first tavern for a look with his buddies without giving an indication what his intentions are. However, Charismatic Leader BG may send one messenger to the Lords Mansion.
Party does what?
(1) Party doesn't see the BGs come in for a look. BGs have initiative.
(2) Party meets BGs in the street. An encounter occurs.
(3) Party sees BGs go into other tavern and a commotion breaks out in the tavern they left.
Meanwhile, what does the Lord do when he hears the news? What do the town guards do when an encounter begins in the street? How do the town guards respond to a commotion coming from the first tavern?
This can take several directions.
Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
Unless the party is ridiculously powerful and they have solid evidence against him, i doubt he would run right off the bat. the manner is something he is familiar with. he can defend it and he wont be out in the open like he would be if he decided to make a run for it. if the manor has any walls/gates to it, then he can basically turn this into a mini siege scenario with his thugs manning key points and setting up traps/defenses ect if there is time. even if he only has a handful of low level thugs at his disposal, if he stays where he is he can create conditions that even the playing field. even something as simple as having people man the windows with long range weapons can be nasty, since they can use full and partial cover. have him barricade the openings too.
of course once the players are well embroiled in their siege and have compromised the security of the actual building, i imagine he would have some sort of bolt hole/escape plan in place so he can slip out the back door while everyone is busy.
also if this guy owns a manor and has people working for him, i imagine he likely has some sort of sway with the locals? Unless this is a situation where the players have solid proof of him breaking the law and other people in power want him gone, he would likely try and turn the local guards/fellow nobles/mayor, ect against the players and have said people chase them off.
if i were him my reaction would be something like this: step one, send a runner to go collect the other thugs for me and possibly alert the guards, if they can be swayed. even if they arrive late, they can flank the party. step two: use siege tactics to slow down the party and make them waste as many of their assets as possible just trying to get in. step three: if they get inside and it looks like a lost cause, trigger a trap or an ambush that can serve as a distraction while the boss makes a run for it.
I’m sure you will find something useful in this video:
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Thanks for the replies and ideas folks. The module is from the starter set "the Lost Mine of Phandelver". The video is helpful (lots of good ideas I need to watch it again and take notes, but wow that guys speaks fast.
Yes he does, and some folks watch him on faster speeds too! You can slow it down. His entire video series is collectively what I call “The best advice I can give any new DM.”
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
I always like to think about the bad guy's motivation first.
Is he about money? Status? Levels? Politics? Something more complicated?
That by the way is in order of how much a real threat the villain will be. Low level guys are about the money, the most dangerous villains are more complicated.
If he is about money, he should run.
I would say, as Mog_Dracov says, focus on motivation. If this particular baddie is about money and is intelligent then he can just get out of dodge and come back later. if he's invested in the local economy and has businesses or political interests in the town/city then it may be possible to set up a series of safe-houses and have him not have all his eggs in one basket. If he's smart enough he may even be willing to sacrifice one that is underperforming while having it run by a skeleton crew of useless idiots he wanted to rid himself of and have the party roll the necessary checks to see if they can find evidence or clues that show that what's going on is bigger than they realized.
Don't be afraid to let the party not figure out there's more going on if the dice don't go in their favor in this hypothetical and have them deal with a more prepared baddie later.