So there been a growing appeal for people in wheelchairs or maybe prosthetic limbs and I just now saw a chronic pain themed subclass. But how would you add say Autism Spectrum as a mechanic? Or other mental disabilities? I'm not very good at stats but I mean if everyone is starting to discuss how to have a wheelchair bound PC or other physical disabilities we  need to discuss all disabilities. I am autistic  myself so I suppose I could help with the topic.

Personally I don't think things like that should be game-afied. If a player wants to have that be apart of their character then that is a discussion to have with their DM. Maybe there charisma score is really low and the player wants it to be because their character is autistic, but doing something mechanically seems like it would be in very poor taste.

Quote from ConalTheGreat >>

Personally I don't think things like that should be game-afied. If a player wants to have that be apart of their character then that is a discussion to have with their DM. Maybe there charisma score is really low and the player wants it to be because their character is autistic, but doing something mechanically seems like it would be in very poor taste.

 

 Well mechanics our not if talking about disabilities in game is growing popular we should discuss mental issues too

Quote from ConalTheGreat >>

Personally I don't think things like that should be game-afied. If a player wants to have that be apart of their character then that is a discussion to have with their DM. Maybe there charisma score is really low and the player wants it to be because their character is autistic, but doing something mechanically seems like it would be in very poor taste.

 

 Seconded.  I have yet so see someone successfully create rule mechanics for a mental disability that didn't read like an ablist joke.

Quote from OccultantNate >>

Quote from ConalTheGreat >>

Personally I don't think things like that should be game-afied. If a player wants to have that be apart of their character then that is a discussion to have with their DM. Maybe there charisma score is really low and the player wants it to be because their character is autistic, but doing something mechanically seems like it would be in very poor taste.

 

 Well mechanics our not if talking about disabilities in game is growing popular we should discuss mental issues too

 I meant in general. There are magic and magic items in the game that can handwave away physical problems, but mental stuff is a lot more difficult. I personally don't suffer from a physical or mental handicap of any sort and I'm very grateful for that. Like I said, making something mechanical for things like that seems in really terrible taste. 

How does one mechanically define things like Dissociate Personality Disorder, Autism, PTSD, or Alzheimers? These are not things that can just be waved away and most of them are on  a very wide spectrum, not fully understood or both. Implementing anything in the game to mechanically detriment or benefit a player would either show these thing in a binary light, which they are not. I mean no offence here, truly I don't, but doing anything that involves disabilities is a lot more complicated and a lot more personal an issue then should be mechanically defined in a game.

There’s exactly zero reason to mechanicize mental disabilities. Pretty much every character I’ve ever played has been autistic because that’s how I’ve played them. I guarantee my decades of lived experience do a much better job at informing roleplaying than a dumb game mechanic.

One problem you run into is that these sorts of disabilities are never universal. My experience is going to be very different from someone else’s in ways that simply cannot (and should not, even if they could) be modeled mechanically in a game like Dungeons & Dragons. If you want to play a character with a disability, just do your research. If you have a friend who’s willing to talk to you about it, talk to them. Then just play the character. If you don’t understand an experience well enough to roleplay it without game mechanics forcing you into certain things, you frankly shouldn’t be playing that kind of character.

Even were I to design a bespoke game with the intent of conveying my experience of autism to a neurotypical audience, which you can be sure would use game mechanics to do that, I’d only really be conveying my experience. There’s no such thing as a universal truth that’s applicable to every single person with this kind of disability. D&D character creation rules are universal, so it would just be really gross for them to pretend to able to model something like this.

Quote from ConalTheGreat >>

Quote from OccultantNate >>

Quote from ConalTheGreat >>

Personally I don't think things like that should be game-afied. If a player wants to have that be apart of their character then that is a discussion to have with their DM. Maybe there charisma score is really low and the player wants it to be because their character is autistic, but doing something mechanically seems like it would be in very poor taste.

 

 Well mechanics our not if talking about disabilities in game is growing popular we should discuss mental issues too

 I meant in general. There are magic and magic items in the game that can handwave away physical problems, but mental stuff is a lot more difficult. I personally don't suffer from a physical or mental handicap of any sort and I'm very grateful for that. Like I said, making something mechanical for things like that seems in really terrible taste. 

How does one mechanically define things like Dissociate Personality Disorder, Autism, PTSD, or Alzheimers? These are not things that can just be waved away and most of them are on  a very wide spectrum, not fully understood or both. Implementing anything in the game to mechanically detriment or benefit a player would either show these thing in a binary light, which they are not. I mean no offence here, truly I don't, but doing anything that involves disabilities is a lot more complicated and a lot more personal an issue then should be mechanically defined in a game.

I would say first, let's be very careful in this discussion.  Personality disorders are one thing.  Autism or the growingly acknowledged spectrum beyond the neurotypical are something else entirely.  Trauma related disorders something else.  And Alzheimers, dementia, and other cognitive impairments are different too.  Some appear in mental health diagnostic manuals.  Some are neuralgic conditions requiring cognitive or sensory integrative therapies, or not.  And others are degenerative diseases.

That said, to the original posters point, I'm uncomfortable creating in game mechanics to incorporate neurodiversity (what a lot of theorist and policy makers speak of when looking for enabling terms that don't box autism and its related spectrum into a disability box, baseline minds are collected as "neurotypical" and then the spectrum builds out in a lot of ways from there).  Here's why.  With the recent effort to make the game world more physically inclusive, what was being addressed was in game physical barriers to differently abled characters.  With neurodiversity I don't think there are such in game barriers that couldn't be reflected in pre-existing stats, if the player really wanted to play it out that way.  INT, WIS, CHR to their extremes on both ends could be explained through divergent neurotypology ... but they don't have to.  And "average" stats should up within this population as well, but we're talking about adventurers here and they strive to be exceptional.  There are many types of cognitive and intellectually or expressively talented people through history that could be said to sit on the neurodiversity spectrum, but also many who don't, just as they're many people who live perfectly normal lives without exceptional incident in all positions on the spectrum.  So the question then is,  what mechanical need is there to accommodate within a game that already allows and encourages a diverse performance of the interior of the "person" being played.  I'm sure there's a range of answers held by players who identify with the neurodiverse community that would be divided on the mechanics question, and am more curious what accommodations in game mechanics or setting design they'd ask for.  

On a personal note, while I don't identify with anything discussed so far, I will say most of the neurodiverse people I know I've met through the gaming community, and I include all of them in the category of best people I've played with (which is admittedly a big crowd, I've been fortunate to not have had many bad or poison player encounters in my games). 

Mental disabilities should not be made into a character creation mechanic, hard no. This isn't to discourage those who want to have a meaningful roleplay experience by playing a mentally disabled character and no player should be discouraged from playing D&D due to a having a disability.....however mental disabilities are too vast and varied to be able to work as a simple, tacked on mechanic. Even common disabilities like depression, anxiety or autism are far from a one size fits all sort of disorder as several variables can contribute to the level of severity or expression one can have with the disability or how one behaves with said disability. 

I concede the point that mechanically be awkward but still my thread is for more discussing  it in general with me off handedly suggesting mechanics 

Quote from OccultantNate >>

I concede the point that mechanically be awkward but still my thread is for more discussing  it in general with me off handedly suggesting mechanics 

Well, if I'm following your intent for the discussion, I'll turn the question back around to you.  In your experience, do you see either the game world or the way the game is played exclusionary; and if so, do you have like a three tips or even ten tips or notes on either how the game could be played with greater consideration?  I, like I hope most players, would like to feel I can sit down and play with anybody, and if there's something about the way I play I could adapt to improve that claim, and thereby play better, I'd sure welcome it.

Quote from MidnightPlat >>

Well, if I'm following your intent for the discussion, I'll turn the question back around to you.  In your experience, do you see either the game world or the way the game is played exclusionary; and if so, do you have like a three tips or even ten tips or notes on either how the game could be played with greater consideration?  I, like I hope most players, would like to feel I can sit down and play with anybody, and if there's something about the way I play I could adapt to improve that claim, and thereby play better, I'd sure welcome it.

 Well as I only know my own disability (autism) the points I have for playing with us are:

Literal Minded: We tend to take things literally and some like me can hardly ever unless we hear tone can tell difference between joking and taking it as actual comments.  

Explaining: I personally am really slow at times and things need to be clarified at times so always try to use the bluntest terms you can think of. 

Shutting Down: This is kind of individually thing but Autistic people can vary on how they cope with stress so. Some of us have a total freak out some others tend to just stop talking and kinda shell themselves inside. So these are just personal points but I met other people and these can apply to most of us in some shape.   

Quote from OccultantNate >>

Quote from MidnightPlat >>

Well, if I'm following your intent for the discussion, I'll turn the question back around to you.  In your experience, do you see either the game world or the way the game is played exclusionary; and if so, do you have like a three tips or even ten tips or notes on either how the game could be played with greater consideration?  I, like I hope most players, would like to feel I can sit down and play with anybody, and if there's something about the way I play I could adapt to improve that claim, and thereby play better, I'd sure welcome it.

 Well as I only know my own disability (autism) the points I have for playing with us are:

Literal Minded: We tend to take things literally and some like me can hardly ever unless we hear tone can tell difference between joking and taking it as actual comments.  

Explaining: I personally am really slow at times and things need to be clarified at times so always try to use the bluntest terms you can think of. 

Shutting Down: This is kind of individually thing but Autistic people can vary on how they cope with stress so. Some of us have a total freak out some others tend to just stop talking and kinda shell themselves inside. So these are just personal points but I met other people and these can apply to most of us in some shape.   

 That all sounds like things that can be done through RP.

Quote from OccultantNate >>

if everyone is starting to discuss how to have a wheelchair bound PC or other physical disabilities we  need to discuss all disabilities. I am autistic  myself so I suppose I could help with the topic.

 Articles, a video, forum posts, etc., are hardly an indicator of everyone wanting to discuss and/or include such things in all games. I'm with most of the posts here - leave it alone.

Being on the spectrum myself and knowing others who are I don't think you could even remotely have something like the spectrum as some mechanic or even a listed character trait.

For example, there have been harmful stereotypes in the past saying that, say, people on the spectrum are less empathetic than others or have issues in that area. Speaking of my experience, I have been told that I am quite empathetic by a number of people - and also generally haven't been told I lack empathy. However, the suggestion that I could did have an effect on me - it confuses me and also made me feel ashamed for say not acting perfectly empathetic all the time.

Imagine then if that was included as a trait or roleplay element that someone had to take part as say an autism spectrum mechanic. Not only would it not reflect my experience, it would also bring up those memories and feelings. I can imagine that for some on the spectrum, they'd have similar feelings.

There is also the issue of having different traits at different ages that a mechanic may not take account of. I used to relate to certain traits seen as part of the spectrum a lot more when I was younger (the 'taking things literally' trait, for example), but do not know. In that time my diagnosis hasn't changed, which does beg the question of whether that was part of my diagnosis or whether that was just an aspect of my younger self. I doubt that a mechanic would be able to accurately reflect that.

For the record, if someone wants to try and roleplay someone on the spectrum or a neurodivergent person while they themselves are not neurodivergent, I have nothing against that. But be careful to avoid stereotypes and to put the character's basic personhood first.

EDIT: also a note. While I've been open about it here, generally I'm not open about it for a wide variety of reasons (the relative anonymity here provides some protection). Keep that in mind as well if you want to represent a character on the spectrum - they may not want to be open about it.

Player Characters only suffer from Disabilities if the player wants them to.  If a player wants to have their character have a mental disability that's purely a matter of how they choose to represent the disability in their roleplaying.

If you feel that there needs to be game mechanics that cover your specific character you work that out with the DM.  It only applies to your character.  Any attempt to force other people to conform to your version and vision of how a mental disability works is just being rude. 

You can't create such a thing in D&D. The range is far too broad to put down in rules. If a player wants to have some sort of condition, they can RP it. 

The biggest kicker is if somebody out there thinks they can slap on a stat penalty to any mental condition. That's BS of the highest degree. 

If you want to play a character who is disabled in some way, I think the most practical method is to figure out which of the 6 stats pertains to the disability, whatever it is, and then just make that your dump stat -- that's the one you put the 8 or the 6 or whatever it is, into. If using point buy, buy it down to whatever you think is appropriate. I don't see the need to do any more, like assign arbitrary penalties.

I wouldn’t add mechanics for this either. The bulk of these things would be better represented through roleplay. Even IRL, a lot of (if not most) of the symptoms of many mental illnesses don’t mean that someone is any less Intelligent, Wise, or Charismatic.

DnD struggles with mechanics for non-combat encounters already.  If you want to add mechanics for this, I would suggest finding a system that already has decent non-combat mechanics.  There are entire systems devoted to playing characters with various disabilities.

If you want another system that can handle it... Champions could. Disadvantages -- physical limitations, psychological limitations, and the like, are tailor made for such things.