I want to start as Paladin (lvl3)then get in to warlock for celestial. I'm trying to build so I don't lose Paladin traits. The dm is fine but I know he's gonna probably take the traits away so I'm left with just warlock
Why would they take away your Paladin features? Unless your DM has some house rule on the subject that wasn’t mentioned, Loosing your Paladin Features should only happen if you either stop pursuing The Cause of Righteousness, or if you break the Oath you swear when you reach 3rd level as a Paladin. For example, if you swear an Oat of Vengeance, then as long as you continue to honor that Oath and adhere to the Tenets of Vengeance, and as long as you continue to stand for the righteous against the wicked, then you should keep your Paladin features.
If your DM does have some sort of house rules about loosing those features, then I have one question for you: Why oh why would you ever want to Multiclass like that knowing that your first three levels would be a complete waste of time? I am confused.
As everyone else says, losing your Paladin traits by becoming a warlock is only a problem if you somehow break the oath that you took when becoming a paladin. It's a bad rewrite from older additions that have paladins as followers of deities. Any more paladins are Warriors of ideals not really with any divine backing. And I think that paladins still possessing a Holy symbol is just a mechanical necessity with very little to do with current class expectations.
A devotion paladin might use the symbol of their sect or is coat of arms from Noble or royal family. But what kind of symbol would the vengeance paladin be expected to use?
So you're only real problem with this build is making sure you're patron doesn't make your paladin oath.
So you're only real problem with this build is making sure you're patron doesn't make [you break] your paladin oath.
That is a distinct possibility. There are some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap just to **** with players who multiclass Paladin with Warlock.
So you're only real problem with this build is making sure you're patron doesn't make [you break] your paladin oath.
That is a distinct possibility. There are some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap just to **** with players who multiclass Paladin with Warlock.
Given that a pure Paladin is a broken class at mid to high levels (yes, I am a 9th level Oath of the Ancients Half Elf in one campaign, and my saves are a joke), and MC'ing with Warlock is beyond broken, I am not surprised that DM's mess with players that try this crap. There are a few combos that make sense from an immersion combo (Celestial Warlock and a number of Paldin subclasses), but few others. I can visualize Oath of Conquest and a Fiend or Hexblade Warlock, but I would never let a char take that combo because it is too powerful, no matter what story the player presented to make it work.
Now, at 4th or 5th level, I don't see it as big a deal, since most MC classes don't come on-line until higher levels. But even still, I see no reason why a DM would not simply say "no Paladin/ Warlock combos".
So you're only real problem with this build is making sure you're patron doesn't make [you break] your paladin oath.
That is a distinct possibility. There are some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap just to **** with players who multiclass Paladin with Warlock.
That's not really anything you "build" a character against though. That's a roleplaying challenge, making hard choices. You can't protect a character from this with mechanical choices.
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Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
So you're only real problem with this build is making sure you're patron doesn't make [you break] your paladin oath.
That is a distinct possibility. There are some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap just to **** with players who multiclass Paladin with Warlock.
That's not really anything you "build" a character against though. That's a roleplaying challenge, making hard choices. You can't protect a character from this with mechanical choices.
You may not be able to protect a character with mechanical choices but you can create a buffer, if only a slight one by pairing your subclasses correctly. A redemption paladin with a demonic patron would make a very sticky situation but at the same time an ancients paladin with an arch fey patron would have an easier time maintaining balance. There are always risks but some paths are easier to walk than others.
So you're only real problem with this build is making sure you're patron doesn't make [you break] your paladin oath.
That is a distinct possibility. There are some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap just to **** with players who multiclass Paladin with Warlock.
That's not really anything you "build" a character against though. That's a roleplaying challenge, making hard choices. You can't protect a character from this with mechanical choices.
You may not be able to protect a character with mechanical choices but you can create a buffer, if only a slight one by pairing your subclasses correctly. A redemption paladin with a demonic patron would make a very sticky situation but at the same time an ancients paladin with an arch fey patron would have an easier time maintaining balance. There are always risks but some paths are easier to walk than others.
With "some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap" I don't think an easier path really matters. If your DM wants to pit your patron against your oath, they'll find a way.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
So you're only real problem with this build is making sure you're patron doesn't make [you break] your paladin oath.
That is a distinct possibility. There are some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap just to **** with players who multiclass Paladin with Warlock.
Given that a pure Paladin is a broken class at mid to high levels (yes, I am a 9th level Oath of the Ancients Half Elf in one campaign, and my saves are a joke), and MC'ing with Warlock is beyond broken, I am not surprised that DM's mess with players that try this crap. There are a few combos that make sense from an immersion combo (Celestial Warlock and a number of Paldin subclasses), but few others. I can visualize Oath of Conquest and a Fiend or Hexblade Warlock, but I would never let a char take that combo because it is too powerful, no matter what story the player presented to make it work.
Now, at 4th or 5th level, I don't see it as big a deal, since most MC classes don't come on-line until higher levels. But even still, I see no reason why a DM would not simply say "no Paladin/ Warlock combos".
Just to build on visualization:
Oath of Ancients and Archfey
Oath of the Open Sea and either Fathomless or Marid Genie
On the wilder side I could see
Oath of Redeption with the Undying (because there's still a kernel of a good soul in whatever the Undying became ... and this paladin has the vainglory conviction that they are the one to bring it back into the light)
Oath of the Watchers with Great Old One (because maybe among the horrors with a thousand eyes, there's a different point of view to the usual dominion of cosmic madness thing, this entity just wants to help and uplift, or maybe just troll its colleagues for he lulz aka "sometimes Hastur").
I want to start as Paladin (lvl3)then get in to warlock for celestial. I'm trying to build so I don't lose Paladin traits. The dm is fine but I know he's gonna probably take the traits away so I'm left with just warlock
Why would they take away your Paladin features? Unless your DM has some house rule on the subject that wasn’t mentioned, Loosing your Paladin Features should only happen if you either stop pursuing The Cause of Righteousness, or if you break the Oath you swear when you reach 3rd level as a Paladin. For example, if you swear an Oat of Vengeance, then as long as you continue to honor that Oath and adhere to the Tenets of Vengeance, and as long as you continue to stand for the righteous against the wicked, then you should keep your Paladin features.
If your DM does have some sort of house rules about loosing those features, then I have one question for you: Why oh why would you ever want to Multiclass like that knowing that your first three levels would be a complete waste of time? I am confused.
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What is there to try? What would cause you to lose those traits?
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
In older versions of D&D you lost your abilities if you multiclassed. That just isn't the rule in 5E.
As everyone else says, losing your Paladin traits by becoming a warlock is only a problem if you somehow break the oath that you took when becoming a paladin. It's a bad rewrite from older additions that have paladins as followers of deities. Any more paladins are Warriors of ideals not really with any divine backing. And I think that paladins still possessing a Holy symbol is just a mechanical necessity with very little to do with current class expectations.
A devotion paladin might use the symbol of their sect or is coat of arms from Noble or royal family. But what kind of symbol would the vengeance paladin be expected to use?
So you're only real problem with this build is making sure you're patron doesn't make your paladin oath.
That is a distinct possibility. There are some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap just to **** with players who multiclass Paladin with Warlock.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Given that a pure Paladin is a broken class at mid to high levels (yes, I am a 9th level Oath of the Ancients Half Elf in one campaign, and my saves are a joke), and MC'ing with Warlock is beyond broken, I am not surprised that DM's mess with players that try this crap. There are a few combos that make sense from an immersion combo (Celestial Warlock and a number of Paldin subclasses), but few others. I can visualize Oath of Conquest and a Fiend or Hexblade Warlock, but I would never let a char take that combo because it is too powerful, no matter what story the player presented to make it work.
Now, at 4th or 5th level, I don't see it as big a deal, since most MC classes don't come on-line until higher levels. But even still, I see no reason why a DM would not simply say "no Paladin/ Warlock combos".
That's not really anything you "build" a character against though. That's a roleplaying challenge, making hard choices. You can't protect a character from this with mechanical choices.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
You may not be able to protect a character with mechanical choices but you can create a buffer, if only a slight one by pairing your subclasses correctly. A redemption paladin with a demonic patron would make a very sticky situation but at the same time an ancients paladin with an arch fey patron would have an easier time maintaining balance. There are always risks but some paths are easier to walk than others.
With "some DMs out there who absolutely love to do that crap" I don't think an easier path really matters. If your DM wants to pit your patron against your oath, they'll find a way.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
Just to build on visualization:
Oath of Ancients and Archfey
Oath of the Open Sea and either Fathomless or Marid Genie
On the wilder side I could see
Oath of Redeption with the Undying (because there's still a kernel of a good soul in whatever the Undying became ... and this paladin has the vainglory conviction that they are the one to bring it back into the light)
Oath of the Watchers with Great Old One (because maybe among the horrors with a thousand eyes, there's a different point of view to the usual dominion of cosmic madness thing, this entity just wants to help and uplift, or maybe just troll its colleagues for he lulz aka "sometimes Hastur").
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.