I'm just starting a campaign as DM, and have an artificer and an Ooze Cohort as 2 of the characters, and they are trying to work out if they can make a cannon which they can fire the ooze character out of within a specially crafted cannonball.
Now, I'm inclined to think that this activity would be awesome but also shouldn't be something they can do all the time. My logical answer to this would be for the artificer to take artillerist and then to craft some form of custom magical ammunition which would be expensive to make and consumable in nature, as well as heavy to carry, which would allow their desired result. I can't see it happening non-magically, as the cannon is tiny and the the ooze is small!
I've also been asked for some custom feats for the Ooze player, to make them feel more oozy!
The obstacles I'm facing are:
1: The artificer has expressed that they want to be an armorer. As such, for them to achieve both of their goals, I will need to make some homebrew rules.
2: The cannon is smaller than the ooze they want to fire
3: The "realistic" amount of damage the ooze would take by being fired out of a cannon!
I have an option which can give them the propensity to combine some feats and direct them towards completing their aims of firing the ooze out of the cannon; feats.
For the artificer, I am considering a custom feat which would be to allow them to take a second Artificer Specialist. At each level where they would gain the next stage of their specialist, they can choose which one to improve - meaning if they do so, they will never achieve the maximum level for either specialist, but could have cool armour and a portable cannon, as they want to do. Would this feat be game-breaking? It would mean that to take a cannon would prevent them from ever making perfect armour, and to make wands etc. into firearms it would prevent them from using armour modifications. I can't immediately see any dangerous combos, as they would only be nerfing themselves for higher levels by taking this.
For the Ooze I have some ideas for Feats, based on their desires and the weaknesses of the race/class:
Create Familiar - the Ooze player can use a chunk of itself to create a familiar as a miniature version of itself. It can communicate telepathically with the familiar, and can use a bonus action to control the familiar. If the Familiar starts or ends its turn over 100ft. from the Ooze then it dissolves into a puddle of acidic ooze (the Ooze class we're using has an ability to sling a glob of ooze to make an acid puddle so this is just a sentient version!). The familiar is a tiny creature with 5hp and the same AC & resistances as the Ooze, but does not benefit from any magic items the Ooze is using. It'll have a weak attack profile and limited abilities.
Eye can See! - the Ooze gains a single eye, which allows it to see normally. (the Ooze usually has blindsight for 60ft. and that's it!). If it splits, it can choose where the eye goes. If a section of the ooze which has the eye is slain, the eye is lost. The eye is re-grown during a long rest.
Miasmic Glow - You can produce dim light for up to 40ft., in a colour of your choice. You can change the brightness and colour of this light freely.
Reactive Grapple - if you are struck by an attack, you can use your reaction to grasp the attacker. You and the attacker make contested strength checks, and if you win then, if the attack was made with a weapon that can be disarmed, the attacker is disarmed, and if not, the attacker is grappled.
Mimicry - You gain the ability to shift your appearance to mimic inanimate objects of a similar size to yourself, such as crates, chests and the like. Whilst you remain motionless you are indistinguishable from what you are mimicking. Physical inspection (EG poking) reveals you as an Ooze.
Stealthy Crawl - when using your Living Terrain ability, you double your proficiency bonus for stealth checks, and can move up to 5ft. per turn without losing the benefits of Living Terrain.
I will keep thinking of more, I would appreciate peoples feedback on this so I don't introduce something that will be too powerful!
1: Artificer feat. Don't make a feat like that. It shifts the power cycle. Instead, let the player build it like a magic item. They would need to research the ooze, and take into account all the details you have mentioned here. (For flavor purposes, maybe you can say that the armorer wouldn't have proficiency in making these checks because they are an armorer. This would create incentive to switch, but still make the goal achievable for your PC.) Tell the player to research canons and how they work. If they actually do this, give them advantage on the intelligence checks to make the canon. Then, let the player homebrew the canon as a monster (with a speed, size, AC, hitpoints, etc.) See their draft, edit it as the DM, and let them use it. Also tell the player that it will cost an infusion to keep this cannon active. Check out the dungeon master's guide for making magic items, and check xanathar's for the costs. Any materials to make the canon can be bought through roleplay. Work with your players to determine the mechanics for this. They are the engineers, you are the overseer. Doing this will have the player take a stupid idea, research the stupid idea, make it, and use it in a very artificer like fashion. Or they drop the stupid idea entirely once they have to work for it. Still an artificer thing to do, and a win win for the DM!
2: Ooze. Is your player playing one of these things? Or is it an NPC? Because this is really weird. I also disagree with making feats here too. You can make racial ones, but wait this out until you actually determine what kind of ooze your PC is. They are already playing something kind of unorthadox.
First off, an Artificer doesn’t need to be an Artilerist to make a cannon. They would only need to be an Artilerist to get that subclass’s specific “Eldritch Cannon” which can only do the three things listed and would not be able to launch any creature anywhere as even if they tried using the Force Ballista version, the Ooze would simply Take 2d8 force damage and be launched no further than 5 feet. If you look at the rules for siege equipment in the DMG, cannons exist in D&D. Any Artificer (or other class PC with the correct tool proficiencies) could make a cannon. Why not suggest a design similar to one of those hydronic/pneumatic “cannons” they use to launch people like in the circus?
Why not also suggest they use downtime to create a cannon which is bigger on the inside like The TARDIS a Bag of Holding?
As for the damage to the Ooze from being shot out of a cannon, use the rules for falling onto a creature from Tasha’s under the “Natural Hazards” section. (Those make use of the falling rules.)
1: Artificer feat. Don't make a feat like that. It shifts the power cycle. Instead, let the player build it like a magic item. They would need to research the ooze, and take into account all the details you have mentioned here. (For flavor purposes, maybe you can say that the armorer wouldn't have proficiency in making these checks because they are an armorer. This would create incentive to switch, but still make the goal achievable for your PC.) Tell the player to research canons and how they work. If they actually do this, give them advantage on the intelligence checks to make the canon. Then, let the player homebrew the canon as a monster (with a speed, size, AC, hitpoints, etc.) See their draft, edit it as the DM, and let them use it. Also tell the player that it will cost an infusion to keep this cannon active. Check out the dungeon master's guide for making magic items, and check xanathar's for the costs. Any materials to make the canon can be bought through roleplay. Work with your players to determine the mechanics for this. They are the engineers, you are the overseer. Doing this will have the player take a stupid idea, research the stupid idea, make it, and use it in a very artificer like fashion. Or they drop the stupid idea entirely once they have to work for it. Still an artificer thing to do, and a win win for the DM!
2: Ooze. Is your player playing one of these things? Or is it an NPC? Because this is really weird. I also disagree with making feats here too. You can make racial ones, but wait this out until you actually determine what kind of ooze your PC is. They are already playing something kind of unorthadox.
I like this plan, and I also like how it reduces the amount of energy I have to put in, what with having a world to run as well :). I think I'll be using this instead of a feat. I also like the idea of using an infusion to keep it active, that's a good balancer.
The Ooze is a player character, playing the Ooze Cohort rules that I linked in the OP. Unless I missed something in the writeup, there aren't types of ooze for the cohorts, so I don't have to worry about their types. That said, you bringing up their types now makes me feel like I could make a set of traits for ooze types, if I can come up with relevant ones, which would let them pick a type of ooze for extra flavour. I know having an Ooze player is unorthodox, but I've looked through their race & class and it doesn't seem like it'll be overpowered (if anything, it'll be underpowered) so I couldn't see any major issues with it, besides fluff reasons, which I can explain away myself as I'm in charge of the world! muahahaha!
First off, an Artificer doesn’t need to be an Artilerist to make a cannon. They would only need to be an Artilerist to get that subclass’s specific “Eldritch Cannon” which can only do the three things listed and would not be able to launch any creature anywhere as even if they tried using the Force Ballista version, the Ooze would simply Take 2d8 force damage and be launched no further than 5 feet. If you look at the rules for siege equipment in the DMG, cannons exist in D&D. Any Artificer (or other class PC with the correct tool proficiencies) could make a cannon. Why not suggest a design similar to one of those hydronic/pneumatic “cannons” they use to launch people like in the circus?
Why not also suggest they use downtime to create a cannon which is bigger on the inside like The TARDIS a Bag of Holding?
As for the damage to the Ooze from being shot out of a cannon, use the rules for falling onto a creature from Tasha’s under the “Natural Hazards” section. (Those make use of the falling rules.)
I hope that helps.
I love the idea of a cannon that's bigger on the inside - I hope that they will work this out as an option for themselves, but I could always suggest it if they become stumped!
I would definitely be putting it onto them that firing anything out of a cannon will cause a lot of damage to the thing they are firing as well, and let them try to work out means by which to counteract this. I'm not sure whether they are looking to fire the ooze with a view to the ooze causing damage on impact, or just as a long-ranged delivery method for the Ooze to do some fighting, counteracting the Oozes movement speed of 20ft.!
Is this just a 2 player party, if so do whatever you want just realise you might need to adjust the challenge of encounters to suit. If they are part of a wider party then you are starting down the wack a mole route of allowing homebrew buffs for one, which then leads to buffs for another to balance, only the balance is off so you need to buff someone else some more and be feel you know it you have a binder 70 pages long of homebrew rules and are playing your own bespoke system.
I am not sure if you are a new DM or simply starting a new campaign, if a new DM I would always advise you not to stray from the PHB generally, maybe allowing the artificer as it is a standard class but generally not for the first campaign. It lets you play the basic version of the game, understand the balance and get a feel for how homebrewing changes might impact things.
I am a new DM but have played the game before, and I'm usually pretty hot on picking things up so running an artificer and an ooze character (their abilities seem tame) doesn't concern me overmuch.
My main concern is the feats and the extras. I don't want to squash my players creativity - the game is to create awesome stories, rather than to strictly adhere to the rules and complete tasks, after all.
I will be making it clear that any homebrew I implement (feats and gear) is subject to change and can be altered or removed entirely by me if I feel it needs it. I'd prefer not to remove it, but I will if it's affecting the others.
These 2 are part of a party of 5. I will extend the same sort of thing towards anyone else who wants to drive their characters in a different direction. - we have a Druid, a Wizard and a Monk.
So, I am no longer adding feats for the Artificer, but I have made some provisional feats for the Ooze Cohort (link in my opening post to their class & race). The Ooze player has also expressed an interest in being an Oblex, which is a variant of ooze which steals memories and can imitate people.
Here are the Feats for the Ooze (links to homebrewery):
We're starting at level 2 so there's 2 levels before they can even take a Feat, so this is all conjecture on future events for now, and as I've said, I can change it all or just say no when we get there!
I am a new DM but have played the game before, and I'm usually pretty hot on picking things up so running an artificer and an ooze character (their abilities seem tame) doesn't concern me overmuch.
My main concern is the feats and the extras. I don't want to squash my players creativity - the game is to create awesome stories, rather than to strictly adhere to the rules and complete tasks, after all.
I will be making it clear that any homebrew I implement (feats and gear) is subject to change and can be altered or removed entirely by me if I feel it needs it. I'd prefer not to remove it, but I will if it's affecting the others.
These 2 are part of a party of 5. I will extend the same sort of thing towards anyone else who wants to drive their characters in a different direction. - we have a Druid, a Wizard and a Monk.
So, I am no longer adding feats for the Artificer, but I have made some provisional feats for the Ooze Cohort (link in my opening post to their class & race). The Ooze player has also expressed an interest in being an Oblex, which is a variant of ooze which steals memories and can imitate people.
Here are the Feats for the Ooze (links to homebrewery):
We're starting at level 2 so there's 2 levels before they can even take a Feat, so this is all conjecture on future events for now, and as I've said, I can change it all or just say no when we get there!
I do agree the idea is to tell good stories but from personal experience I find heading down this path more often then not ends with you as a dm spending more time worrying about homebrew rules and effects then actually the fun bit which is coming up with the story.
Just be aware of how much of a time sink this becomes and don’t be afraid to say at some point, right all the homebrew are gone we are going back to RAW. Remember the rules have been play tested and balanced over many game sessions. I would say for the PHB classes there is enough there for players to have loads of fun wit without needing to let them start making all sorts of stuff up :).
Good luck and hope you all have fun
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Hi all,
I'm just starting a campaign as DM, and have an artificer and an Ooze Cohort as 2 of the characters, and they are trying to work out if they can make a cannon which they can fire the ooze character out of within a specially crafted cannonball.
Ooze Cohort rules, for reference:
https://www.gmbinder.com/share/-MRNPTyXhbepFS9ui4nG
Now, I'm inclined to think that this activity would be awesome but also shouldn't be something they can do all the time. My logical answer to this would be for the artificer to take artillerist and then to craft some form of custom magical ammunition which would be expensive to make and consumable in nature, as well as heavy to carry, which would allow their desired result. I can't see it happening non-magically, as the cannon is tiny and the the ooze is small!
I've also been asked for some custom feats for the Ooze player, to make them feel more oozy!
The obstacles I'm facing are:
1: The artificer has expressed that they want to be an armorer. As such, for them to achieve both of their goals, I will need to make some homebrew rules.
2: The cannon is smaller than the ooze they want to fire
3: The "realistic" amount of damage the ooze would take by being fired out of a cannon!
I have an option which can give them the propensity to combine some feats and direct them towards completing their aims of firing the ooze out of the cannon; feats.
For the Ooze I have some ideas for Feats, based on their desires and the weaknesses of the race/class:
I will keep thinking of more, I would appreciate peoples feedback on this so I don't introduce something that will be too powerful!
Make your Artificer work with any other class with 174 Multiclassing Feats for your Artificer Multiclass Character!
DM's Guild Releases on This Thread Or check them all out on DMs Guild!
DrivethruRPG Releases on This Thread - latest release: My Character is a Werewolf: balanced rules for Lycanthropy!
I have started discussing/reviewing 3rd party D&D content on Substack - stay tuned for semi-regular posts!
1: Artificer feat. Don't make a feat like that. It shifts the power cycle. Instead, let the player build it like a magic item. They would need to research the ooze, and take into account all the details you have mentioned here. (For flavor purposes, maybe you can say that the armorer wouldn't have proficiency in making these checks because they are an armorer. This would create incentive to switch, but still make the goal achievable for your PC.) Tell the player to research canons and how they work. If they actually do this, give them advantage on the intelligence checks to make the canon. Then, let the player homebrew the canon as a monster (with a speed, size, AC, hitpoints, etc.) See their draft, edit it as the DM, and let them use it. Also tell the player that it will cost an infusion to keep this cannon active. Check out the dungeon master's guide for making magic items, and check xanathar's for the costs. Any materials to make the canon can be bought through roleplay. Work with your players to determine the mechanics for this. They are the engineers, you are the overseer. Doing this will have the player take a stupid idea, research the stupid idea, make it, and use it in a very artificer like fashion. Or they drop the stupid idea entirely once they have to work for it. Still an artificer thing to do, and a win win for the DM!
2: Ooze. Is your player playing one of these things? Or is it an NPC? Because this is really weird. I also disagree with making feats here too. You can make racial ones, but wait this out until you actually determine what kind of ooze your PC is. They are already playing something kind of unorthadox.
My only good homebrews: Races, Subclasses.
An aspiring DM and Homebrewer. Ask me if you need anything.
I agree with WallineDungeonMaster.
If you look at the rules for siege equipment in the DMG, cannons exist in D&D. Any Artificer (or other class PC with the correct tool proficiencies) could make a cannon.
Why not suggest a design similar to one of those hydronic/pneumatic “cannons” they use to launch people like in the circus?
The TARDISa Bag of Holding?I hope that helps.
Creating Epic Boons on DDB
DDB Buyers' Guide
Hardcovers, DDB & You
Content Troubleshooting
Thankyou both for your help here, it sounds like I would have made a bit of an error with this one!
I like this plan, and I also like how it reduces the amount of energy I have to put in, what with having a world to run as well :). I think I'll be using this instead of a feat. I also like the idea of using an infusion to keep it active, that's a good balancer.
The Ooze is a player character, playing the Ooze Cohort rules that I linked in the OP. Unless I missed something in the writeup, there aren't types of ooze for the cohorts, so I don't have to worry about their types. That said, you bringing up their types now makes me feel like I could make a set of traits for ooze types, if I can come up with relevant ones, which would let them pick a type of ooze for extra flavour. I know having an Ooze player is unorthodox, but I've looked through their race & class and it doesn't seem like it'll be overpowered (if anything, it'll be underpowered) so I couldn't see any major issues with it, besides fluff reasons, which I can explain away myself as I'm in charge of the world! muahahaha!
I love the idea of a cannon that's bigger on the inside - I hope that they will work this out as an option for themselves, but I could always suggest it if they become stumped!
I would definitely be putting it onto them that firing anything out of a cannon will cause a lot of damage to the thing they are firing as well, and let them try to work out means by which to counteract this. I'm not sure whether they are looking to fire the ooze with a view to the ooze causing damage on impact, or just as a long-ranged delivery method for the Ooze to do some fighting, counteracting the Oozes movement speed of 20ft.!
Make your Artificer work with any other class with 174 Multiclassing Feats for your Artificer Multiclass Character!
DM's Guild Releases on This Thread Or check them all out on DMs Guild!
DrivethruRPG Releases on This Thread - latest release: My Character is a Werewolf: balanced rules for Lycanthropy!
I have started discussing/reviewing 3rd party D&D content on Substack - stay tuned for semi-regular posts!
Is this just a 2 player party, if so do whatever you want just realise you might need to adjust the challenge of encounters to suit. If they are part of a wider party then you are starting down the wack a mole route of allowing homebrew buffs for one, which then leads to buffs for another to balance, only the balance is off so you need to buff someone else some more and be feel you know it you have a binder 70 pages long of homebrew rules and are playing your own bespoke system.
I am not sure if you are a new DM or simply starting a new campaign, if a new DM I would always advise you not to stray from the PHB generally, maybe allowing the artificer as it is a standard class but generally not for the first campaign. It lets you play the basic version of the game, understand the balance and get a feel for how homebrewing changes might impact things.
But have fun and I hope your players have fun.
I am a new DM but have played the game before, and I'm usually pretty hot on picking things up so running an artificer and an ooze character (their abilities seem tame) doesn't concern me overmuch.
My main concern is the feats and the extras. I don't want to squash my players creativity - the game is to create awesome stories, rather than to strictly adhere to the rules and complete tasks, after all.
I will be making it clear that any homebrew I implement (feats and gear) is subject to change and can be altered or removed entirely by me if I feel it needs it. I'd prefer not to remove it, but I will if it's affecting the others.
These 2 are part of a party of 5. I will extend the same sort of thing towards anyone else who wants to drive their characters in a different direction. - we have a Druid, a Wizard and a Monk.
So, I am no longer adding feats for the Artificer, but I have made some provisional feats for the Ooze Cohort (link in my opening post to their class & race). The Ooze player has also expressed an interest in being an Oblex, which is a variant of ooze which steals memories and can imitate people.
Here are the Feats for the Ooze (links to homebrewery):
https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/Q9q20L-peAZX
We're starting at level 2 so there's 2 levels before they can even take a Feat, so this is all conjecture on future events for now, and as I've said, I can change it all or just say no when we get there!
Make your Artificer work with any other class with 174 Multiclassing Feats for your Artificer Multiclass Character!
DM's Guild Releases on This Thread Or check them all out on DMs Guild!
DrivethruRPG Releases on This Thread - latest release: My Character is a Werewolf: balanced rules for Lycanthropy!
I have started discussing/reviewing 3rd party D&D content on Substack - stay tuned for semi-regular posts!
I do agree the idea is to tell good stories but from personal experience I find heading down this path more often then not ends with you as a dm spending more time worrying about homebrew rules and effects then actually the fun bit which is coming up with the story.
Just be aware of how much of a time sink this becomes and don’t be afraid to say at some point, right all the homebrew are gone we are going back to RAW. Remember the rules have been play tested and balanced over many game sessions. I would say for the PHB classes there is enough there for players to have loads of fun wit without needing to let them start making all sorts of stuff up :).
Good luck and hope you all have fun